PDA

View Full Version : Projects bids or not???


proimages
27th of April 2011 (Wed), 16:01
When your asked to sit in on production meetings and help with the creative process..
Is that a bid or consulting?

thanks!!
cheers
Darrin

PhotosGuy
27th of April 2011 (Wed), 22:24
Sounds like consulting to me.

Is that a bid...? Did you ask for the job? Discuss prices? Get a signed contract? If not, then maybe you should ask them what your status is?

proimages
27th of April 2011 (Wed), 22:54
Not even at that stage..
I keep being asked (3 this week) to DP or produce projects or do special effects 3D..
they want me to sit in on production meetings and go over shots, then cut a bid..some have no budget at all and are straight wasting my time..typically they never have storyboards, the script isn't clear, even the number of shots isn't clear or the idea of the shots.( low budget productions).

I always say pay for storyboards ideas and concepts, you'll save money!! and the attitude starts..like I'm the only one that makes these requests.

Dilemma: if I'm going to creatively solve the problems seems like I'm consulting and should be paid to create the bid/budget?
or I'm giving up hours and ideas gambling that I make the cut to get the gig..thin ice on that aspect?

wondering if others have to deal with similar scenario..and how?

I'm trying to enforce a new path that my minutes are not up for grabs, I've been too helpful over the years. And paid for it!!
Getting past clients, specially bro deals on the new plan has been very difficult..

cheers
Darrin

TopHatMoments
28th of April 2011 (Thu), 08:28
Make a contract on a percentage of the sales. If there not willing to pay up front, they have no faith in themselves.

If you think they might make it, then it's a gamble for you.
If on the other hand them seem like a melting snowball, well it's a waste of time and effort on your part.

That's the problem with the free gime market. 1 out of 40 or 45 make it up and less than half that are around the following year.

The grupy crowd wanting to live a dream without investing in it, because they think they are that good. All that while they work their day job for money expecting someone to make them famous for free

PhotosGuy
28th of April 2011 (Thu), 09:09
Dilemma: if I'm going to creatively solve the problems seems like I'm consulting and should be paid to create the bid/budget?
or I'm giving up hours and ideas gambling that I make the cut to get the gig..thin ice on that aspect? If I had a contract & the job, then I'd have figured the consulting into it. In your place, I'd charge them a 1/2-day rate for my time. If they won't pay it, then the next time they ask for free help, I'd tell them, "Sorry, but I have a paying job in that time slot."
some have no budget at all and are straight wasting my time One of my first questions is, "What's your budget for this?" Then I know if I want to get involved in it.
I always say pay for storyboards ideas and concepts, you'll save money!! and the attitude starts..like I'm the only one that makes these requests. Without some sort of clear direction & layout, I'd insist that a rep from the firm be on set to approve the shots. Then re-shoots because they nit-pick the shots would be billed in addition to the original shoot.

I understand that you're trying to get your foot into the door, but sometimes it's to your advantage to fire the PITA clients. ;)

AZGeorge
28th of April 2011 (Thu), 11:13
With so many inquiries you have already done some things right and are sitting in the driver's seat so starting charging enough to separate the potential customers from the time stealing dabblers.

When you know the request is serious you want to get into the process as early as possible so should accept the invitation to participate without worry about billing since your involvement gives you an inside track

For other than known serious opportunities, you want to be paid from minute one. You might start by treating questionable requests as if they were consulting jobs but applying a serious discount. "That sounds exciting. I'll get a contract to you by close of business today and, because (excuse tailored for potential customer) it will include a (50% or thereabouts) discount for the first ten (or similar figure) hours."

If you set the base consulting rate high enough you can do very well even if a customer wants to squeeze you for a continued discount as they continue picking your brain.

proimages
28th of April 2011 (Thu), 12:30
Make a contract on a percentage of the sales.

Thanks TP I always like to hear your advice!!
I'd did this on last deal, after one year if they didn't sell the project I became a 50/50 owner.
Now I have to try and sell the pilot..


If you think they might make it, then it's a gamble for you.


I'm pretty over gambling, least with other peoples ideas..sans $$ or out side a craps table



The grupy crowd wanting to live a dream without investing in it, because they think they are that good. All that while they work their day job for money expecting someone to make them famous for free

agree!! LA is the capital..I have no idea what list i'm on ; )
some how small groups are making projects, no argument..some make it over the top!!

I can take things to the next level for sure..but have 6 of my projects own to shoot no time or $$..maybe up to 8 now(someone suggest another good one on POTN) of course I have to eat..so OPM is necessary. catch 22

what kills me is I keeping hearing the same f'ing quote every time..
why are you so being so negative about our project, we have six/seven pros volunteering to make this happen..

no matter what I expect to pay everyone and make a budget so that happens why I'm sitting still..catch 22

they can afford to take a month off, drive across town daily(in LA that's 30 miles RT)
work 20 hours in a day..for a film festival..not me..
I have no idea how that works..figure they come from money..

side note: over my 20 plus years..most my big issues involve people with millions all the broke ass bands and musicians paid the bills..

cheers
Darrin

proimages
28th of April 2011 (Thu), 13:02
"Sorry, but I have a paying job in that time slot."


we're you listening to my conversation : )


I'd insist that a rep from the firm be on

Hey if a firm was involved I'd be much more interested!! I'm dealing with sports and music videos..for now

cheers
Darrin

proimages
28th of April 2011 (Thu), 13:18
When you know the request is serious you want to get into the process as early as possible so should accept the invitation to participate without worry about billing since your involvement gives you an inside track


Most of these are low end, high hope type deals..one request was to DP a stop motion project - I don't think they had any idea of the time involved- I heard the word 'low' and was like see ya!! Glad I didn't drive to the meeting..I'd like to network - with out the work part!!

The music video stuff I've been working on recently was a little different and have no issues with $$ daily..

I'm trying to part ways from that low end, high hope crowd so I can produce work that's more along where I want to go personally..looking to position myself between low end and big boy's ..the road less traveled!!

I don't expect it to be easy..

I'm just a matte box, rails, follow focus, and ND filter set away from my upcoming road trip!!..grrrr never ends

cheers
D