Hockey Shots - Midget AAA - Critique Pls

[ShannonG]

I've captured some shots of recent hockey games at the local arena. They don't seem to be a clear as I would like them. Can someone give me some ideas as to why?

First I'm using a monopod.

Second, I'm using a 85 mm f/1.8 lense and a Signma 70-200mm f/2.8 telephoto with a Canon 1D mark II camera. I'm keeping the flash off and using 1600 iso for the pics and 320 shutter with f/1.8 or 2.2 max apperature. I'm doing some sharpening in PS CS2 and use a noise reducer.

Here is some examples....

http://kllegion87.com/www/en/kllegion87_ver1/images/20051001/21_Legion87s_20051001_130_025.jpg
http://kllegion87.com/www/en/kllegion87_ver1/images/20051001/21_Legion87s_20051001_113_011.jpg

[DwightMcCann]

I agree that they aren't very clear and should be with that combination ... I don't see anything that looks crisp, especially in that second iamge, so I wonder if you aren't focussed badly ... are you using AF? I think you also might want to underexpose a touch more so you don't lose all the detail in that sprayed ice since the faces seem well lighted rather than shadowy. One last observation is that you have a lot of extraneous stuff in the images ... Exclusive Computers and sleepy teammates don't do anything for the images. Well, I guess I wasn't kind on this critique but that 1D Mark II should do better by you.

[ShannonG]

thanks for your critique Dwight and I definately agree with you. I am in AF + Al Servo mode when i do take my pics so maybe it's just me --to shakey? Or, could it possibly be the glass that I'm shooting into? :rolleyes:

[DwightMcCann]

Shannon, were you aware that there's a setting for how fast the AF responds? I can't remember the number offhand, but be sure you set it to fastest ... which I think is 5. I'm not sure what else to suggest.

[jr#8]

Shannon you said your shooting thru the glass? If so that will do it. Try another location if possible. Bet theyll be better by far. Plus I dont like the name going thru the image, IMO.

[Spearin]

I like to keep the aperature wide open and on priority so that I can as fast a shutter speed as possible. That arena actually seems well lit compared to where I shoot (which is absolutely horrid... and is the University's rink!).

The ice looks good, white balance wise, but the white jerseys seem a little magenta to me.

[GMosher]

Talk with the coaches/officials and see if they'll allow you penalty box access(there usually isn't glass there in minor rinks etc)
You'll have to sign a waiver no doubt, and make sure you offer that piece of info when you approach them. I'm hoping to try some hockey this week!:)

[BugEyes]

With those settings it sounds like it was a very poorly lit arena. At ISO 1600 and wide open a good arena give more than sufficient light.
For postprocessing, work on a curve that will make the faces come out of the shadows and the ice keep some features. Kind of an inverse contrast curve, you can also cheat with the shadow/highlights tool in PS.

[gmen]

1/320s is probably a tadge slow to achieve critical sharpness - you'll definitely see some motion blur - that's only to be expected with a fast moving sport like ice hockey in low light.

Shooting at (or close to) f/1.8 also means you're working with a very shallow DOF, so again you'll have to nail the focus on the right point on the subject matter to get a good result - can be tough to do.

Having said that, 85mm seems a little bit short for hockey which means you might find yourself cropping your pic heavily in post-production, again leading to perceived unsharpness.

One idea is to shoot at ISO3200 and use your longer glass. As long as the light is pretty consistent across the rink you should be able to set your exposure manually. Given the figures you've already quoted, you might achieve 1/320s or 1/400s at f/2.8 for example. As long as you're not underexposing, the noise at ISO3200 shouldn't be too intrusive... also you'll be cropping tighter in camera (crank the zoom out to 200mm) so there will be less need to crop after the event. However, you will still have to accept some motion blur.

The alternative is to stick the 85mm, use ISO3200 and to increase your shutter speed to 1/500s. Obviously you'll just have to wait for the action to come to you to ensure you are filling the frame... but the end result will be much improved as you'll be reducing the motion blur.

Hope that helps a little.

---- Gavin

[gmen]

Shannon, were you aware that there's a setting for how fast the AF responds? I can't remember the number offhand, but be sure you set it to fastest ... which I think is 5. I'm not sure what else to suggest.Dwight...

Just a thought on the AF settings, it can be efficacious to set your AI Servo Tracking Sensitivity to Slow or Moderately Slow (CF20-1 or CF 20-2).

The reasoning behind this is that it can prevent the AF from 'hunting' too much if a player briefly comes between you and your subject matter (a very likely scenario in ice hockey and other team sports). The camera will have less work to do to lock back on the target than if the sensitivity is set to fast.

Hmmm. It seems to work.

---- Gavin

[ShannonG]

Hi everyone and thanks so much for all your valuable information.

I agree that shooting from the plexi glass does make a difference and I would love to shoot in the penalty box, but my husband (a hockey player) says I'm crazy to risk getting myself hurt or to damage my camera. I really want to and will try harder to convince him.... In the meantime, i've situated myself hanging over the side rail towards the players box where there is no glass but only can get clear shots at centre ice.

In regards to custom settings in Al Servo, I've changed the sensitivity to 'fastest' -- thinking this would be better. I will try the slower or moderate setting at the next shoot. Gavin, your logic is good!

Unfortunately, that last shoot I did I thought I finally had some reasonable shots, but when i tried to load the raw file, my media card became corrupt. lol... gotta laugh... The good news is we are also a very busy computer store and my images can be saved but i have to wait my turn -- customers are always first...lol

Again, I'm grateful for all the advice and hope to post much better images in the near future. I am soooo lucky i have found you guys...and gals! tks. :D

ShannonG

[DavidEB]

Shannon - I shoot from the penalty box. wear a helmet. don't stand close enough to the edge of the box that your camera protrudes (so players won't hit it). hard shots won't come your way often (slap shots will always be aimed away from you, and most passes are slower and lower), so even if you get hit it won't hurt much. with the shorter focal lengths (under 100mm) you'll be taking shots when the players are near you, and that's when you are most likely to get hurt. Keep to the longer end of your zoom.

In your top shot, it looks like your focus point is on the boards not the goalie.

you can do it... >>> click me <<< (http://www.pbase.com/davideb/image/44078697)

[ShannonG]

here's another shot at this......

I've slowed down my Al-servo to 'moderate' rather than 'fastest' in the custom functions and i think this makes a difference. I'm still trying to convince my husband that I will be safe in the penalty box taking shots.

what do u think?

http://kllegion87.com/www/en/kllegion87_ver1/images/6000x800_128.jpg

http://kllegion87.com/www/en/kllegion87_ver1/images/20051029/217.jpg
http://kllegion87.com/www/en/kllegion87_ver1/images/20051029/126.jpg

[RadAL]

can't you go up more in the stands and get a good zoom to zoom in ? that would eliminate the glass, and the hassle of going into the penalty box, its a win win situation.

[ShannonG]

the plexi glass is high up even at stand level. My only other alternative is the penalty box....ahhhh

[symes]

I think these are as goos as it gets from behind glass...hard to get them any crisper...

Just tell him you will wear a helmet...

Cheers,

[DwightMcCann]

Get in the damn penalty box and tell the troops that are in there to protect you for Heavens sake! That's about all us men are good for anyway.