Hoya Pro1 filter v Pro1 Digital

[yeleek]

Is it worth getting the Pro1 digital as appose to the std Pro1 polarizing filter?

I don't plan to have a 350d for ever and hope to go to FF in the next 12 months or so.

Any thoughts?

Thanks

Ben

[Tsmith]

I own both and can't tell any difference at all other than the digital one being a little cheaper.

[yeleek]

Strange over here the digital ones are more expensive....

I've never used one before - are they difficult to use? I understand you have to 'rotate' them for the desired effect.

[vjack]

If you are looking to save a little money, you might consider Kenko. My understanding is that they are the same thing as Hoya but cost less.

[keenasmustard]

I've been curious about whether there was a discernable difference between the "Digital" version and the original version. Thanks for putting that curiosity to rest Bluedog. I remember reading in another forum that they all believed that the "Digital" branding is just hype to suck us digital users in. I found this on 2filter's website: "Hoya's Pro1 D Circular Polarizer has successfully corrected the color difference often found between a DSLR's camera viewfinder and the resulting picture."

The Pro1 Digital is the one I went for and so far, I'm really happy with it with one exception. Yeleek you are right: you rotate the front ring of the filter to achieve the desired effect. Scottes made a really good point in this thread:http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=125563
that some slim line filters have "knurling" (little ridges that make it easier to turn) on the front of the front ring.
This reminds me about the *one* thing I like about my slim, thread-less CPL is that it's the knurling for turning it is on the same plane as the glass, not on the side of the filter like most CPLs. This means that I can leave the hood on and reach inside the hood and use a fingertip to turn the CPL. OK, this isn't a big deal but it is a little nice to be able to leave the hood on at all times.

I'm not sure which brands have this feature, but it would definately make life easier. I went out on a shoot yesterday and found I had to remove the hood like he mentioned and it drove me nuts. Someone with longer fingers might not have as much trouble.

Which lenses are you thinking of using the polariser for?

[keenasmustard]

Kenko: ah you lucky person yeleek.. you're in the UK. Vjack is right, you have Kenko available to you. Still an issue I have not been able to clarify for sure, but some have said that the Kenko Pro1 is exactly the same as the Hoya, but Hoya is renamed for a different market (of which USA is a part). The Hoya are much more expensive. Some have said that the Hoya is made in Japan and Kenko made in China. If that doesn't matter at all to you, then go for the Kenko. There are several members in here who swear by theirs.

[vjack]

I bought a Kenko CPL on eBay from HK. Seems good quality, but I haven't had an excuse to use it yet.

[yeleek]

Thanks for the replies :)

At the moment just after a filter for my Tamron 28-75. Meant to get one last year, but never got round to it. Took some photos the other day and the sky came out far too light and with little cloud definition. Reminded me to get one ;-)

If there isn't anything in it then i may just get what ever is cheaper online (UK).

[CoolToolGuy]

I asked B&H about the difference, and they told me that the 'Digital' Pro-1 was multi-coated on the inside surface to combat sensor flare, and the 'Super HMC' Pro-1 is multi-coated on both surfaces. I'm not sure why you wouldn't want the coating on the outside, but that's what they told me. :confused:

Have Fun,

[Tsmith]

I asked B&H about the difference, and they told me that the 'Digital' Pro-1 was multi-coated on the inside surface to combat sensor flare, and the 'Super HMC' Pro-1 is multi-coated on both surfaces. I'm not sure why you wouldn't want the coating on the outside, but that's what they told me. :confused:

Have Fun,

Not too sure I buy that answer ... the guy who owns 2filter.com probably knows for sure if this is correct. I haven't got time to call right now, but he knows filters.

[Wilt]

I finally found a list of 'features' for the Hoya Digital Pro 1

The Pro1 Digital filter series is the top of the line filter for digital cameras. The Hoya Pro1 Digital filter series key features:

Digital Multi Coated (DMC) - These filters greatly reduce lens flare and ghosting caused by reflections
Black Almite Frame (BAF) - A black matte aluminum satin finish almite frame for reducing reflections
Black Rimmed Glass (BRG) - Black rimmed glass reduces light reflection around the filter edge
Low Profile Frame (LPF) - Ultra thin filter frames to help avoid vignetting on super wide angle lenses
Knurling Edge Frame (KEF) - Equipped with a knurling edge for easy attachment and removal
UV Protected Case (UVC) - Filter cases are UV protected to further lengthen the life of filters

<yawn>

[CoolToolGuy]

I finally found a list of 'features' for the Hoya Digital Pro 1

The Pro1 Digital filter series is the top of the line filter for digital cameras. The Hoya Pro1 Digital filter series key features:

Digital Multi Coated (DMC) - These filters greatly reduce lens flare and ghosting caused by reflections
Black Almite Frame (BAF) - A black matte aluminum satin finish almite frame for reducing reflections
Black Rimmed Glass (BRG) - Black rimmed glass reduces light reflection around the filter edge
Low Profile Frame (LPF) - Ultra thin filter frames to help avoid vignetting on super wide angle lenses
Knurling Edge Frame (KEF) - Equipped with a knurling edge for easy attachment and removal
UV Protected Case (UVC) - Filter cases are UV protected to further lengthen the life of filters

<yawn>
I'm curious how that compares to the Super HMC version. Can you find that or tell us where you found the info on the digital version?Have Fun,

[keenasmustard]

the 'Digital' Pro-1 was multi-coated on the inside surface to combat sensor flare
Sorry to add to the confusion, but am I wrong in saying that the multi-coating on the inside isn't anything new that they've just brought out for digital?

Here's something else to think about:
You're not shooting wide angle, so you don't need to worry about the consideration of getting a "slim" style polarizer for your lens. The Pro1 is a slim design, made for ultra-wide lenses. You could use the regular Hoya and save some cash. Also, several people have commented that the B+W filters are easier to clean than Hoyas. You could go for B+W's regular width multi coated filter and still pay less than the Pro1. Here's some price comparisons from B&H in $US, just to show the comparison:
B+W 67mm Circular Polarizer (MRC) Multi-Resistant Coating Glass Filter= $114.95
Hoya 67mm Circular Polarizing Pro 1 Digital Multi-Coated Glass Filter= $139.50
Hoya 67mm Circular Polarizer (HMC) Multi-Coated Glass Filter= $85.50

Hope that helps a bit.

[Tsmith]

You can find the info on Hoya's web site:

http://www.thkphoto.com/digital/dp-02.html

http://www.thkphoto.com/digital/pro1d-04.html

Notice in the below illustration the Super HMC CP is coated on the inside or rear.

http://www.thkphoto.com/products/hoya/images/011fig1.jpg

[keenasmustard]

I'm curious how that compares to the Super HMC version.
Excellent question.
As far as I'm able to tell, it goes like this:
Hoya 67mm Circular Polarizer Glass Filter ($53.95): No multi-coating, regular thickness (not advisable for ultra-wide angle), can use lens cap.

Hoya 67mm Circular Polarizer (HMC) Multi-Coated Glass Filter ($85.50): Multi-coating, regular thickness (not advisable for ultra-wide angle), can use lens cap.

Hoya 67mm Circular Polarizer (S-HMC) Super Multi-Coated Glass Filter - Thin ($94.50): Multi-Coating (possibly more layers), thin (advisable for ultra-wide angle), no front thread, so must use provided slip-on cap.

Hoya 67mm Circular Polarizing Pro 1 Digital Multi-Coated Glass Filter ($139.50): Multi-Coating, thin (advisable for ultra-wide angle), front thread, can use normal lens cap.

Hoya 67mm Super HMC (Multicoated) Circular Polarizing Pro 1 Glass Filter ($157.50): Multi-Coating (possibly more layers), front thread, can use normal lens cap.

"• The Hoya Super-HMC PRO 1 low-profile frame is a slim 5 mm, making it the same size as a regular Hoya filter frame (yeah, but aren't the Pro1 Digital & the slim range 5mm too?!
• Standard Hoya circular polarizer frames are 7.5 mm thick where other manufacturers are as much as 10 mm thick
• Another advantage to the Super-HMC PRO 1 Circular Polarizer is it has normal front filter threads meaning a normal clip-on style lens cap may be used The regular Pro1 Digital has this too.
• The Super-HMC PRO 1 Circular Polarizer has a 6 layer Hoya multi-coating, the most used in the industry, applied to the front surface of the filter to greatly reduce the chance of lens flare or ghosting caused by reflections."
All of that above was taken from B&H, with my edits of course.
I also found this link: http://www.intro2020.co.uk/pdf/Hoya.pdf to the Hoya brochures. Check out page 4 onwards give a blurb about the Pro1 Digital. Then go to page 17. It goes into depth about their different coatings etc and then down the bottom of the page gives a rather vague paragraph about the Pro1. No specific clarification between Pro1 and the Super HMC Pro1. I'm just assuming they have less layers in the Digital Pro 1. The Super HMC Pro1 could just have everything rolled into one: Super multicoating, thin but with a front thread.

Bluedog, if you could ask the guy at 2filter these questions, it would be awesome. Hoya makes it so darn confusing!! I'm about to go away so good luck with everything guys!

[keenasmustard]

Notice in the below illustration the Super HMC CP is coated on the inside or rear.
Did you find anything that stated that the Pro1 Digital wasn't coated on the inside? Maybe this is the holy grail of info? :confused:

[Tsmith]

Dang I'm getting a headache now > :confused:

Maybe only the Super HMC in the illustration is coated on the inside. Found this at 2filter.com:

Hoya Super HMC UV Filters
Solid glass camera filters anti reflective coated optics
Six MC coatings on each side, 99.7% of the light passes
The coatings are so good , at certain angles you almost can not see the filter glass
Mounted in Aluminum black anodized finished filter rings double threaded front and back
FYI, please note Super HMC Circular Polarizers have no front threads, and come with a lens cap
Solid Hoya Optical Glass

No mention about the Super HMC Circular Polarizers coating here though just the UV

Hoya Super Pro 1 HMC Filters
Solid special 1 mm thick glass filters anti reflective coated optics
Six MC coatings on each side, 99.7% of the light passes
The coatings are so good , at certain angles you almost can not see the filter glass
Mounted in 3 mm high aluminum black anodized finished filter rings double threaded front and back
including the Hoya Pro 1 Circular Polarizers
Solid Hoya Optical Glass

Hoya Pro-1 Digital UV and Clear Filters
DMC coatings on both sides
Filter rings only 3 mm high, front threads,
Made for today's new ultra wide zoom lenses

No mention about the Pro-1 Digital Circular Polarizers coating here though just the UV > I'd imagine it being a Pro-1 too it'd most likely be coated both sides.

[CoolToolGuy]

Sorry to add to the confusion, but am I wrong in saying that the multi-coating on the inside isn't anything new that they've just brought out for digital?

Here's something else to think about:
You're not shooting wide angle, so you don't need to worry about the consideration of getting a "slim" style polarizer for your lens.

First point - not as I understand it. In the film days the light you had to worry about was stray light entering the lens and causing flare. With the dawn of digital, an additional concern became light reflecting off of the shiny surface of the sensor and causing flare internally. I don't know how big a problem this really is, but that is the theory. I believe the coatings are sprayed on, so before digital there would be no reason to coat both sides unless they were dipped. Now, however, they get to charge more for coating both surfaces.

Second point - wide angle lenses may be the most obvious need for a thin filter, but any EF-S lens could potentially benefit from a thin filter if you are stacking them (UV & C-POL or such). Granted, all of the EF-S are wide angles but the 60mm macro, but Canon designs them to be able to accept 1 filter before vignetting. With an EF lens and a crop factor body you may get away with a stack, but any EF lens on a 5D may benefit from the thinness of a Pro-1 or other thin filter if you are stacking.

Have Fun,

[jrsforums]

I would suggest you contact Filter Connection (2filter.com) and ask them. I did about 6 months ago and they quickly responded. I do not have a copy, but, as I remember, The Pro1 had Super HMC (SMC) coatings with a scratch resistant coating and the Digital Pro1 had a HMC coating. The net was the Super Pro! was the superior filter.

John

[yeleek]

Wow... Thanks to all who have replied. Tho I'm still not sure what the 'groups' recommendation would be for use on a Tamron 28-75? Am I aiming at too high a spec? Others here tho have mentioned in the past to buy the best quality filter you can afford (or are prepared to pay for)

Someone mentioned to me before about B+W being better than Hoya. Not sure if thats correct or not..... The only place I could find in the UK tho that sells them is here:
http://www.robertwhite.co.uk/bwfilters.htm#LabelPol
Wasn't 100% sure what i wanted either - would it be Käsemann Circular Polariser MRC 67?

Thanks again

Ben

[Tsmith]

Tho I'm still not sure what the 'groups' recommendation would be for use on a Tamron 28-75?

With that Lens, which I have you can get away with a regular type Circular Polarizer. Just make sure whatever brand you choose that its Multicoated to handle any Flare.

[BrianEE93]

I bought a Kenko CPL on eBay from HK. Seems good quality, but I haven't had an excuse to use it yet.

I think I might try this one (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7582495610&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1) for my Sigma 24-70. I just wish I knew that it was equalivalent to a Hoya Pro1 D.