MAC Vs. PC

[coryjohnson]

what do you use, mac or pc? and why if you feel like typing....

**EDIT**

Since some of us just seem to love to duke this never ending subject out,.. POTN will oblige your tendencies for judging a human beings personality and creative ability based on there choice of microprocessor.

Have at it folks.. show us how small and bigoted you are! Show us how thin skinned and shallow! Show us the superiority of the master OS user over the unclean masses.

[solinger]

PC because I always have and comfort is a strong reason for me. I have been putting thought into a Mac for a couple of years now though.

[jfrancho]

I use a PC. It was what I could afford.

[Ronald S. Jr.]

I could have gone mac, since my computer cost way more than one, but I've been using PC's for over a decade now, and it's what I'm used to. I didn't want my computing experience, or even my photography to suffer because I had no idea how to use a Mac. I'm not up for learning computers all over again. (so to speak)

[Sageg]

I voted my Mac because it is my computer of choice & what I use at home, but I have two pcs at work: desktop & laptop. The mac is probably the oldest of the lot, but works just perfectly!

[tjburns]

i come from a mac family, have always used them, plan on continuing the tradition. I love the OS, the stability...not to say that pc's havent come a long way, or have their own place in design/photgraphy. in fact, im one of the few die hard mac/apple fans that will readily admit that in our field, mac and pc are really running neck and neck as equals, both with strong points and weaknesses...imo being instability/vunerability to virus' for pc's and mass compatibility issues with mac... But virus's will come for the macs one day too. Sorry for the rant...but i felt like typing

[solinger]

i come from a mac family, have always used them, plan on continuing the tradition. I love the OS, the stability...not to say that pc's havent come a long way, or have their own place in design/photgraphy. in fact, im one of the few die hard mac/apple fans that will readily admit that in our field, mac and pc are really running neck and neck as equals, both with strong points and weaknesses...imo being instability/vunerability to virus' for pc's and mass compatibility issues with mac... But virus's will come for the macs one day too. Sorry for the rant...but i felt like typing

This is what makes me think that I should just go ahead and get a mac. I know lots and lots of PC users that complain about their rig. Not one Mac user I have every heard has complained about their system. Maybe that such and such software was not available. Seems like a good way to go.

[Duder]

I just bought a mac recently, so both.

[Xpri]

It depends on what I need to do, but mainly Macs. We have 5 running at present in the house as the old ones are recycled to the kids for doing homework etc.

[Citizensmith]

PC. I started off on Macs but got to know PCs better. I can build a PC from parts and know the OS well so comfort is definitely a factor. I'm also big into computer games and that is somewhere where Macs really suck the hind tit.

[Woolburr]

My first real computer was considered a super computer because it had two 5-1/4" drives. Got a family discount for buying IBM....haven't seen anything better come along. Work bought tons of Macs...only thing they were good for was playing Tetris.

[felix21685]

PC..
why because I'm a gamer..not so many games that everyone plays online on mac these days..

and plus i can build my custom machine ..for pretty darn cheap..

even though pc's have more hardware issues usually i'm still better off with a pc machine..

[kevin_c]

A PC - Because that's what I have!! Yes, I'd love a Mac of some sort, but can't justify to 'her indoors' the expense - At least a new lens I can 'hide-away' in my camera bag, An Apple Mac sort of 'sticks-out' :-)

[Coco-Puffs]

PC. I like to make/break things and there are more parts available to build your own PC. also I didn't feel like donating Bill Gates another few hundred dollars for Office Mac.

[tommy_london]

Macs for me - 12 inch powerbook and old G4 tower at home and a 20 inch imac at work. My background is design so all through my education I used macs. I have owned a PC, many years ago, and still use them sometimes but when I have the choice I choose a mac.

[vjack]

I was a mac person but now use pcs because that is what I need to use at work all day. No choice there because much of the specialized software I need to use is pc-only. Since I often work at home, I thought it made more sense to stick with pcs there too. I'd love to buy a new mac for home, but when I think about how much it would cost to buy mac versions of my most often used software, it clearly isn't worth it. Bottom line: I have too much invested in pc software and hardware to go mac anytime soon (especially when I could buy lenses instead).

[Raymate]

Mac for me, been using them for over 15 years, started life as a "graphic designer" but for the last six year have been an Apple engineer.

Have used Mac and PC but I find the MacOS10 does what I want without crashing out on me when I need it most.

My most used machine is my 17" PowerBook, when I need power I turn to my Dual at home.

R :)

[LMP]

I use both, thinking of getting another (faster) mac later in the year.

[Master-9]

The Mac, always have and always will....
It is the tool for the creative person, because it makes it easier to express youself in many ways :-)

[spencer87]

Mac. I love my Powerbook G4 (main computer right now) and will be buying a desktop later this year.

[Pekka]

This question comes up now and then - we have a great search tool you know :)

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=78602
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=127667
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=93204
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=124165
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=105107
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=41485
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=34016

[Pekka]

The Mac, always have and always will....
It is the tool for the creative person, because it makes it easier to express youself in many ways :-)

Can't resist to ask: Do you mean to say that I can not express myself on Photoshop in my PC like I would with Photoshop on Mac? Or do you mean I write better with Firefox on Mac than with Firefox on PC? Or that I do better music with Nuendo on Mac than with Nuendo on PC?

[Ronald S. Jr.]

:lol: There's always a smartass.

[René Damkot]

Mac all the way

[GS Rider]

Made the switch to Mac about 4 years ago and have never regretted it, in fact over the last 12 months - 3 friends have nade the switch after having a look at my iMac and iBook. The ease of use is brilliant.

[Wsman2]

Mac-addict here (practically since "birth"). I live on the other side of the freeway from Apple HQ (literally), but that doesn't mean I get to hear anything before everyone else. The only place the public is allowed on that campus is the Company Store. 8)

[ronosmena]

I use both, I have a dual core pc and a g5 mac, I use one for different reason, mac i use for extra large graphic files such as 1 *.psd (2-3 gig size) for applications and minor editing PC works fine, with the dual core PC with 4 gig of ram, it runs flawlessly, I never had a problem so far.

[NordieBoy]

PC running Linux.
No crashes.
Does what I need.

Every time I see a windows machine it's got a problem :rolleyes:

Even if I got a Mac it would be getting Linux installed on it.

[CyberDyneSystems]

PC

Because I am an uncreative do nothing that can't think outside the box. I can only operate in straight lines and my thought process is boring and logical.

I am obtuse,. greater than 90 degrees, rounded at the edges.. "dull"
And only the rigid emprical stringent bass ackwards environment of the PC gives me the lack of freedom I require to be so uncreative.

[toyguru]

I hope that I don't get in trouble for this answer :o , but I use a PC with MacOSX on the PC. Wanted to build my own and loved the Mac stability so I combined both so I didn't have to choose camps. I've been using PC's for over 10 years and just toyed with Macs because one of my friends has one.

I've been using my MacPCOSX for about 6 months now and LOVE it!! I guess I'm the type that likes to have his cake and eat it too!!:lol:

[NordieBoy]

I can only operate in straight lines.....rounded at the edges...
Oh those straight lines. :cool:

[jfrancho]

The results are interesting, though not a large enough sample to be that accurate. I would have expected a more even split.

[DavidEB]

CDS's comment made me grin. years ago the mac was the only reasonable choice for graphics, but the PC has almost caught up. the stereotype persists.

my reasons for using a mac, in brief:
1) internet security
2) fewer incompatabilities, no DDL clashes, no windows registry, plug-and-play really works on mac ("plug-and-pray" on PC)
3) built-in color management
4) requires less of my effort to keep things working. less intrusive to my life
5) considering costs of add-on software, cost ofmy time, etc... I believe mac has lower total cost of ownership despite higher initial cost
6) elegance, beauty, grace, same as I seek in my photos.

[Citizensmith]

CDS's comment made me grin. years ago the mac was the only reasonable choice for graphics, but the PC has almost caught up. the stereotype persists.

my reasons for using a mac, in brief:
1) internet security
2) fewer incompatabilities, no DDL clashes, no windows registry, plug-and-play really works on mac ("plug-and-pray" on PC)
3) built-in color management
4) requires less of my effort to keep things working. less intrusive to my life
5) considering costs of add-on software, cost ofmy time, etc... I believe mac has lower total cost of ownership despite higher initial cost
6) elegance, beauty, grace, same as I seek in my photos.

Good to see you still have a few stereotypes of your own as well. :) But hey, stereotypes are good, they save time.

[Wsman2]

In case anyone has never seen it: MacWindows (http://macwindows.com/).

Also, Microsoft recently decided to keep the project going for Virtual PC (http://www.microsoft.com/mac/products/virtualpc/virtualpc.aspx?pid=virtualpc) for Mac.

[JDrex05]

I was born and raised on windows (started with windows 3.1) so even if somehow macs became vastly superior I would have trouble switching because im VERY familiar and comfortable with Windows on a PC.

[jfrancho]

I'm a Windows guy, too. I remember my best friends dad had a pc with windows way back in the '80s - it might have been 2.0 - who knows. But I also know how to use a MAC. It really isn't any harder than learning the latest version of Windows. It's just a computer, they generally work the same. Remember when Win95 came out? That wasn't too hard to figure out. Same thing.

[GS Rider]

there's certainly a higher proportion of mac users here than in the general population, but that is due to the nature of this forum, with people doing a high proportion of publishing / editing.

[DavidEB]

Citizensmith -- my views are based on my own direct experience. I said in my post I'd be brief but if needed I could provide details for hours supporting each of the issues I raised. Only thing is, that would be a wasting my time on PCs again, and I'm past that.

[DavidEB]

speak of the devil...

quoting from >>>this post<<< (photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=132255)
*sigh* i had the best little ... pics this summer, but a virus forced me to format my hard drive
--- clearly a PC user.

[DavidW]

All this Mac versus Windows (I think that term is more precise than "PC") advocacy - I prefer simply to say "whichever does the job better for you", a systems analysis type approach. I use Windows on all but one of my computers, and FreeBSD on the other. That's what suits how we use our computers.

All but one user is using Microsoft Office and an email program - arguably the definitive version of Office is for Windows. We also use some software targeted at British schools that is only available for Windows. I use Pocket PC, which I think is superior to other PDA operating systems for the use I make of it, and with Pocket PC being a Microsoft product, it's far easier to make use of a Pocket PC with Windows computers. I'm the only one that makes any real use of Adobe Creative Suite 2 - that's available equally for Windows and Mac, so we bought the Windows version of CS2.


The FreeBSD box does various tasks - at the moment it's a RADIUS server for the wireless network, a Samba server, a backup for my hosting account (using rsync over ssh in the cron table) and a network protocol analyser using Ethereal. One of the jobs on my "to do" list is to rebuild it with FreeBSD 6.0 (I could upgrade from 5.4, but it's a good opportunity for a rebuild), at which point I'll also install Apache, PHP and MySQL to use it as a development web server.

Why FreeBSD? Mainly this is because my hosting provider uses FreeBSD, and it's easier to keep everything under the same operating system. (Yes - there's just as much advocacy argument between Linux and BSD, also between the various Linux distributions and between the various flavours of BSD).


So far as the "virus forced me to format my hard drive" goes, that's arguably a combination of bad backup strategy and a failure to make effective use of anti-virus software. Anti-virus software isn't 100%, but anti-virus software that's kept on automatic update (as often as hourly with some products - Kaspersky often issue eight or more sets of signatures a day) normally catches on to new viruses 'in the wild' within six hours or so.

That could happen on a Mac - there are Mac viruses - though it's true that more viruses target Windows, not least because there are more Windows machines. There are also arguments that the Windows kernel and core code is more vulnerable than Mac OS X, but like all UNIX based system, OS X is not immune to the kind of flaws that allow viruses to do their dirty work. Windows Vista will fix some of the problems prevalent in the Windows XP world - I believe it won't be the default for users to have Administrator privileges (as I believe is typically the case for XP Home). None of my regular user accounts on Windows 2000 or XP have Administrator privileges.



David

[Citizensmith]

speak of the devil...

quoting from >>>this post<<< (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=132255)

--- clearly a PC user.

Oh no, a PC user had a problem, therefore the entire Windows empire must be built on nothing. Obviously no Mac user ever has ever had any kind of trouble at all ever. Side note, anyone with a nice new Powerbook G4 making funny noises? Apple says there isn't a problem so it must be too much beer.

So as another perspective, this is a free market economy. Why is Apple a margianlized OS reliant on an MP3 player for a revival? It's not like they don't have a penchant for advertising.

[Citizensmith]

That could happen on a Mac - there are Mac viruses

Depends how specific you get. There are trojans, and assorted malware but no actual viruses in the limited sense of the word. Its like computer games, why write one for a Mac when there is a more limited audience.

And before I get jumped on I actually think Macs are the equal of Windows or Linux machines. Hardware is hardware and really shouldn't be considered as each line has its good and bad points. I currently use PCs having used Macs a while back (never touched OSX) and prefer them because of the wider range of software and wider usability. I'll accept the fact that security has been reliant on the end user as compensation for that.

[Blackbird]

I switched over to Macs just over 2 years ago and never regretted it. I'm currently using a 12inch 1Ghz Powerbook but hope to get a 2nd gen Intel iMac towards the end of the year. I love OS X and the stability of it.

[Bosman]

I switched to Mac three and a half years ago and have never looked back.
It is simply amazing!
By the way where are all the people who switched to Windows?:lol:

Until you have tried OSX you really don't know what you are missing.

[jfrancho]

By the way where are all the people who switched to Windows?There was one four posts up...

[CyberDyneSystems]

Me..

...my lineage is Commodore,. Apple IIe, Mac, ... a dry spell where booze, weed, muscle cars (never mixed!) and girls (those mix nicely) = no computers.. then came back with some small use of a 386 on windows and DOS,. then a 486 75Mhz with Windows 3.1,.. then my first home built, a Pentium 100 with a WHOPPING 16 MB of ram.. (way way costly) 512MB hard drive.. and Windows 3.1 PCDOS,. and Win95 dual boot.. (took me a while to warm up to Win95)

I went PC becuase
1> I liked building my own affordable PC.
2. The industries I was invloved in required PC (read Autocad)

Aperure,. if it really rocked.. might be able to pull me to Mac,. but I can still get a much better hardware value with AMD right now.. so I'm pretty sur emy next PC will be AMD Opteron.

[epolevne]

I use a PC at work (actually a computer programmer for PC software), but have a Mac laptop. I got tired of having to follow security bulletins just to feel comfortable with my family browsing around the internet. As a nerd I also enjoy the Unix underpinnings of Mac OS X.

I'm curious, can anyone name a single real Mac OS X virus?

[Citizensmith]

By the way where are all the people who switched to Windows?:lol:

This is a poll, the results may help to answer your question. :)

I'm 100% with CDS. All my desktops computers are home built. I can get exactly the computer I want at an affordable price. I also play computer games. Now thats 2 areas where Macs are way back in the stone age.

[Citizensmith]

I'm curious, can anyone name a single real Mac OS X virus?

We already covered that.

[NordieBoy]

speak of the devil...

quoting from >>>this post<<< (photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=132255)

--- clearly a PC user.
Who can't remove a virus the easy way.

[blue_max]

You guys found the answer yet? I keep looking for the definitive answer, but it seems as elusive as ever. :lol: Perhaps when there is no debate, we will all be worse off.

Graham

[joekr]

I switched back. I had a powermac G5 1.6 w/ 1.5 gig of ram and I was bogging down hard when I opened 20 - 30 shot in elements at a time. Went back to a Dual core 3800 AMD system w/ a gig of ram and a GEFORCE6600 256MB and teh machine screams (and I now get to play some games again)

I loved the mac, but could not justify the cost of the new Powermacs. I used to be a windows admin so I know how to take care of the box so that adaware/spyware/virus problems are not an issue...

Now the new dual core laptops from Apple are another issue....I'll be starting school up in the next 6 months and maybe then I'll think about getting a laptop...

[Rocket850]

I use a PC at work because I have to. I use a Mac at home because I want to. Most people on this thread that have answered PC have never used a Mac and most people who answered Mac "have" used a PC.
Therefore, if you really want an answer to which are better you need to ask the Mac user, like me ;)

Unless you use dedicated windows software or are a gamer, the Mac OS is great to use, actually fun and a real pleasure to use. I've never had that feeling running XP Prof.

I also like the idea that my computer manufacturer also makes the software. Two things that XP can't do is Fast User Switching and Exposé. That alone is reason enough to jump to the Mac. And let’s face it, Mac's just look cooler. When was the last time Dell was ever recognized for it's achievement in design? Apple is always winning awards for their designs. Until recently, PC’s were fabricated from bent sheet metal while Apple was using titanium in some of there machines.

I always hear from friends that Macs cost more, but when I ask them which models they looked at, they say well, I didn’t look but that’s what I’ve heard. When you compare apples to “Apples”, and features to features, price is not an issue. And the better OS makes it a no brainier.

Microsoft is hoping to make Vista more like Tiger (Mac OS), trouble is, Leopard will soon be released after that so they never really catch up.

The Mac isn't perfect, I'll grant you that, but in the last 18 years I've owned 5 of them and have never had to reload the OS because I was having problems.

[blue_max]

I switched back. I had a powermac G5 1.6 w/ 1.5 gig of ram and I was bogging down hard when I opened 20 - 30 shot in elements at a time. Went back to a Dual core 3800 AMD system w/ a gig of ram and a GEFORCE6600 256MB and teh machine screams (and I now get to play some games again)

I loved the mac, but could not justify the cost of the new Powermacs. I used to be a windows admin so I know how to take care of the box so that adaware/spyware/virus problems are not an issue...

Now the new dual core laptops from Apple are another issue....I'll be starting school up in the next 6 months and maybe then I'll think about getting a laptop...

How far out of date is the Dual core 3800 AMD system, compared to the 1.6 G5? Compare it to a dual 2.7 and you may make a more favourable comparision.

I'm not in touch with pc's but it sounds like the amd system is rather more current - so the comparision is completely pointless.

Graham

[Citizensmith]

I use a PC at work because I have to. I use a Mac at home because I want to. Most people on this thread that have answered PC have never used a Mac and most people who answered Mac "have" used a PC.
Therefore, if you really want an answer to which are better you need to ask the Mac user, like me ;)

Actually it seems a lot of us have used Macs as well. I'd take Windows or Linux (Suse is what I normally use, Knoppix has its uses too) over Mac as I prefer the extra versatility offered.

[joekr]

I have no doubts the 2.7 is at least equivelant to 3800 dual core. My main issue was cost and the experience I have as a Windows admin that brought me back. 2k for a a desktop was not feasible right now for me. For 740 dollars in new hardware at newegg (I all ready had 2 x 250 gig sata drives in the Mac I transferred to the PC) I then reinstalled the Mac OS on the original 80 gig sata drive and the rest is history...

A real pain in the ass to migrate everything over, but the new machine FLIES! I'm fairly happy, but the elegance/ease of use factor is gone in XP.

Like I said, the new Intel powerbook looks like a nice machine and when I get back in school, I might very well pop for one (plus it would match my new Aluminum portfolio! :) )

[OUTDOOR_ADS]

My first post........

After scanning and reading the posts with great interest without participating for a while now I would like to begin by saying this is one of the friendliest most informative forums I have seen in quite some time. Since this is a Forum for Photography I will be sure to pull that into the equation somewhere below so please don’t skip to the end.

I see this debate in one form or another in almost every forum I have visited over the years. Unfortunately the debate always seems to center around a few misconceptions or skewed one direction or the other in the way it was started.

The question should be OSX, Windows, or Linux (you pick the distribution)? Hardware playing fields are now "almost" equal with the exception of the custom built CAD, Video Editing, Hacking, or Gaming machines which really fall into an untouchable category all to themselves.

Misconceptions:

1. My “OS” doesn’t crash – All operating systems crash; the time between crashes is directly proportional to who configured the system and has that configuration been maintained as hardware has been added and software has been added/updated or removed.
2. My “OS” is more secure – Again the security of an operating system on any given machine is directly proportional to the skill, knowledge, and resourcefulness of the person configuring the security. No knowledge of security usually means no security.
3. OSX has no known viruses – The “average” home OSX user has no antivirus software on their computer….. so how would they know anyway…… OSX has a BSD core; there are BSD viruses and thousands of “script kiddies” modifying them on a daily basis around the world. Beware Mac users; you are a target even if you don’t know it, so take precautions as your market share rises.
4. The best machines for graphics are Mac’s – This was not true even when it was; the best graphics machines were designed to run CAD/CAM and Rendering applications and used graphics cards costing thousands. Unfortunately they were priced considerably out of the standard “graphics house” budget thus Mac’s won the majority share of graphics computing early on in the Mac VS PC “war”.

As with anything the real question should be: Will my chosen tool perform the task given it, in a way I feel comfortable with. The outcome of this question will always be skewed by what we read in the press, what our office, friends, and family use, and most of all by glossy photographs provided by a great photographer jumping thru hoops for a “slick” marketing director from a major Ad Agency.

A little background: I currently manage 400+ computers and the corporate networks of three Hollywood Entertainment Companies, most of which run mixed (Windows, Mac, Unix/Linux) environments. My specialty is computer and corporate network security: No computer or Operating System is 100% secure, given time, determination, skill, and persistence any system can be cracked, H4K3D, or “penetrated/crashed”; and some much easier than others. My first career was as a Professional Commercial/Fashion Photographer with “computers & H4K1N6” as a hobby, now I find myself as a Professional Security Expert (H4K3R) with photography as a hobby. Seems to me life was much more interesting the other way around.

[Rocket850]

My first post........

After “trolling” for some time in this forum I would like to begin by saying this is one of the friendliest most informative forums I have seen in quite some time. Since this is a Forum for Photography I will be sure to pull that into the equation somewhere below so please don’t skip to the end.

I see this debate in one form or another in almost every forum I have visited over the years. Unfortunately the debate always seems to center around a few misconceptions or skewed one direction or the other in the way it was started.

The question should be OSX, Windows, or Linux (you pick the distribution)? Hardware playing fields are now "almost" equal with the exception of the custom built CAD, Video Editing, Hacking, or Gaming machines which really fall into an untouchable category all to themselves.

Misconceptions:

1. My “OS” doesn’t crash – All operating systems crash; the time between crashes is directly proportional to who configured the system and has that configuration been maintained as hardware has been added and software has been added/updated or removed.
2. My “OS” is more secure – Again the security of an operating system on any given machine is directly proportional to the skill, knowledge, and resourcefulness of the person configuring the security. No knowledge of security usually means no security.
3. OSX has no known viruses – The “average” home OSX user has no antivirus software on their computer….. so how would they know anyway…… OSX has a BSD core; there are BSD viruses and thousands of “script kiddies” modifying them on a daily basis around the world. Beware Mac users; you are a target even if you don’t know it, so take precautions as your market share rises.
4. The best machines for graphics are Mac’s – This was not true even when it was; the best graphics machines were designed to run CAD/CAM and Rendering applications and used graphics cards costing thousands. Unfortunately they were priced considerably out of the standard “graphics house” budget thus Mac’s won the majority share of graphics computing early on in the Mac VS PC “war”.

As with anything the real question should be: Will my chosen tool perform the task given it, in a way I feel comfortable with. The outcome of this question will always be skewed by what we read in the press, what our office, friends, and family use, and most of all by glossy photographs provided by a great photographer jumping thru hoops for a “slick” marketing director from a major Ad Agency.

A little background: I currently manage 400+ computers and the corporate networks of three Hollywood Entertainment Companies, most of which run mixed (Windows, Mac, Unix/Linux) environments. My specialty is computer and corporate network security: No computer or Operating System is 100% secure, given time, determination, skill, and persistence any system can be cracked, H4K3D, or “penetrated/crashed”; and some much easier than others. My first career was as a Professional Commercial/Fashion Photographer with “computers & H4K1N6” as a hobby, now I find myself as a Professional Security Expert (H4K3R) with photography as a hobby. Seems to me life was much more interesting the other way around.
Welcome Outdoor_ADS,
I'll agree with most of what you said but one thing you didn't mention was the OS. Does your expertise pertain to using these different platforms or does it come from networking? (I'm asking in a nice way :) even though it may not sound like it) What's been your experience with Tiger? What do you think of Spring Loaded folders and Burnable Folders?
People will say they prefer Windows even though they haven't got a clue what the Mac OS can do.
It boils down to "to each there own", I just want people to know there are other choices.

By the way, I like your room. Looks like your running a media server. Is that a film projector on the wall? Are those speakers surrounding your plasma? If so, you need to upgrade :)) Home theater is a big hobby of mine :)

Jay

[OUTDOOR_ADS]

Thanks for the welcome,

OSX/Tiger is probably my favorite for just trolling around right now; very nice GUI and I especially like the dashboard widgets. Windows Vista is really starting to shake out and look very nice as well although I’m sure there will be a lot of confusion from users as they adopt just like when Apple made the switch from OS 9 to OSX (I still have designers that absolutely refuse to upgrade from OS 9 even with the return of spring loaded folders). I do love the new search features and schemes of both OSX and Vista, users will benefit from the organizational enhancements in either OS. I use each of the platforms on a daily basis for one thing or another and truly love the variety, but if you forced me to chose just one it would have to be Windows for the shear amount of available software and extreme high end performance hardware.

The PC connected to the plasma screen you see in my home office is running Windows XP Pro SP2, Windows 2000, and the image in the picture is the current beta of Vista with a few “tweaks”. The same PC is running OSX/Intel in Virtual PC along with new versions of RedHat, Gentoo and SUSE. To the left in the pic is a complete mixed server testing network complete with mail and ftp for pre-testing systems, servers, desktops, and applications in a controlled environment on its own dedicated T1.

Those are speakers on the wall but they drive only the ambient music in the room, the real noise comes from twin Gamepod chairs that are out of view. As for the “film projector” on the wall if you are referring to the item between the posters it’s actually one of the very few working “Hero” Proton Packs from the first Ghostbusters movie, along with the Ray’s Goggles, and Venkman’s Ghost Detector, and below that is an unused (un-filmed) Gozer Door from the miniature set used in the explosion scene. Being in the industry allows me to trade services for toys from time to time with people that either make props or use props. My collection was much larger until a couple of months ago when I sold of a few pieces to by what you see in my signature, next time I get a break I will shoot a few and post a couple of the really “cherry” pieces.

[Big_B]

My first post........

After “trolling” for some time in this forum .....

I do hope you mean trawling..... ;)

Welcome to the forum :)

[OUTDOOR_ADS]

I do hope you mean trawling..... ;)

Welcome to the forum :)

Thanks for the welcome,

“Lurking” I suppose is the proper neutral term these days and “Trolling” is used by most with a negative connotation. For most of my friends “Trolling” a group still means the ability to glean information from the edges of a community without participating in the social structure of the community until you feel you can add to the community without being a disruption.

I should have said "I have been scanning/reading the posts with great interest without participating for a while now". Thank you for the response, I have edited my original post to reflect this.

[Citizensmith]

Outdoor_Ads - An excellent point well made, and welcome to the forum.

Forget all the photography stuff though, Ghostbusters collectibles, now thats cool. :)

Instead of all the endless and repeated Mac Vs Windows stuff maybe we could get an topic going on which Linux build is best.

[Citizensmith]

H4K3R

So whats the difference between that and a Haxzor

[Rocket850]

Actually it seems a lot of us have used Macs as well. I'd take Windows or Linux (Suse is what I normally use, Knoppix has its uses too) over Mac as I prefer the extra versatility offered.
Out of curiosity then, what did you like or didn't like about the Mac OS? Which version did you use? How long did you use it for?

[OUTDOOR_ADS]

So whats the difference between that and a Haxzor

Great question,


A "HaXz0r" is a term used mostly by gamers that "Mod" a game to augment their playing ability. I have even seen some of them using "a leet HaXz0r" in their own community mimicking the older term "Elite". Most are purely script kiddies finding their cheats by searching the net. Some are full fledged programers scripting their way to a dominant position in the game community.

“H4K3R” or Hacker as it was meant to replace, is/was used by “Black/grey/white hat” hackers in an effort to avoid having posts pulled up in a search queries by people outside their community. To me anyone that enjoys exploring the details of a programmable system for the purpose of expanding the capabilities, or bending its parameters can be classified as a Hacker. The code of conduct you follow while using this talent and knowledge is how you become Black, Grey, or White.

To relate this to the Toppic at hand I would like to add that the dominant platforms for hacking are Unix and Windows but the Mac OS is growing in popularity by leaps and bounds.

[Citizensmith]

Out of curiosity then, what did you like or didn't like about the Mac OS? Which version did you use? How long did you use it for?

As I'd mentioned a few posts up I've never personally much used OSX. My very limited experience with it was trying to help someone use the iphoto viewer thing which managed to lock up her laptop at random intervals. From my own personal use both a ways back at university and on a personal machine my one huge memory is stupid mice (which is mostly resolved) and the annoying ding noise as the machine crashed again and again. Basically, my Mac experience is as negative and frustrating as many peoples Windows experience.

I realise that its much easier to find windows problems, but that is because there are a whole heck of a lot more windows based systems out there. A computer is a computer. They break, they crash. People just need to get one they like and be happy. What we don't need is all the people acting like OSX/Mac is some kind or religon and stabbing at some odd W95 issue while pointing out the latest little OSX tweak that nobody will actually ever use is better than (their) sex.

Of course maybe it is a religon, maybe there is some subliminal feature in the OS that people haven't caught on to yet. Maybe Steve Jobs is getting NSA pay checks :)

[Citizensmith]

A "HaXz0r" is a term used mostly by gamers that "Mod" a game to augment their playing ability. I have even seen some of them using "a leet HaXz0r" in their own community mimicking the older term "Elite". Most are purely script kiddies finding their cheats by searching the net. Some are full fledged programers scripting their way to a dominant position in the game community.


So basically the difference between a wannabee who just uses one of the myriad sites to get the latest no-cd crack, and the person who actually wrote the crack.

Damn, that makes me a wannabe haxzor. :)
Although I should point out I own the games I crack, I just don't want to screw around finding the CDs or installing SafeDisk.
Well I own most of them.

[jfrancho]

I often wonder if owning a MAC triggers some change in the brain that affects their behavior so that all they can do is blast Windows users and talk about how great their MAC is. It's very similar to owning a bitchin' Camaro - pretty soon out come the gold chains and they're doing burnouts at every light.

[Citizensmith]

I often wonder if owning a MAC triggers some change in the brain that affects their behavior so that all they can do is blast Windows users and talk about how great their MAC is. It's very similar to owning a bitchin' Camaro - pretty soon out come the gold chains and they're doing burnouts at every light.

Probably like us being mean to all those dark ages no hopers still using nik0n. :D

[OUTDOOR_ADS]

Probably like us being mean to all those dark ages no hopers still using nik0n. :D


Now that’s not only funny but it’s easily the best comparison I’ve ever read! Each to his/her own "Tool" and let the best marketing department win!

[Rocket850]

As I'd mentioned a few posts up I've never personally much used OSX.
You stated a few posts back "Actually it seems a lot of us have used Macs as well.
Yet never used OSX? You make my point then :)

like I said before. Every Mac user I know is very failure with Windows and we are able to make a choice based on that. To each there own but people need to keep an open mind :)

[ayotnoms]

My work uses the Windows platform but I use a Mac for photography.

I have to admit, the pre-OSX machines would drive me crazy at times because of how finicky they were but I haven't had any problems with the Mac I bought in 2003. That said, I wouldn't use the Mac for some applications such as MS Excel. It's just too cumbersome compared to what can be done on the PC.

Choose the right tool for the job, I say...

Cheers

[Bosman]

I think this says it all....

killer reason (http://news.com.com/Windows+chief+fields+readers+questions/2008-1082_3-6032310.html?tag=nl)

The number one reason to buy upcoming Vista?

This from Microsoft talking here folks. This is the main feature for upgrading from XP??

Really now, think about it, how sad is this.

[Citizensmith]

You stated a few posts back "Actually it seems a lot of us have used Macs as well.
Yet never used OSX? You make my point then :)

like I said before. Every Mac user I know is very failure with Windows and we are able to make a choice based on that. To each there own but people need to keep an open mind :)

1) I have used OSX, just once, and it had issues. I mentioned that.
2) In what way would not having used OSX mean I have no experience with Macs. I was using Macs way back in 1990. I stayed with Mac for many generations until I finally got fed up with OS8 and was having much better luck with the PCs at work.

As for the open mind statement. The issue I have is not with the one specific OS or another, more with the "Keep and open mind that Macs are better and PC users just haven't figured it out yet" attitude that is common with Mac users. Mac users, on average, are anything but open minded.

[Rocket850]

1)
As for the open mind statement. The issue I have is not with the one specific OS or another, more with the "Keep and open mind that Macs are better and PC users just haven't figured it out yet" attitude that is common with Mac users. Mac users, on average, are anything but open minded.
Most Mac users form there opinions because they know both OS X and Windows. And yes, I have used XP more than once so I feel I'm qualified to make that statement.
PC's are all over the place and there is no getting away from it, so we learn to use them. I feel like I'm going back in time when I do, but I (we) put up with it. :)

Jay

[NickC]

Mac users, on average, are anything but open minded.

That's a closed-minded statement. Pot.Kettle.Black.

I don't mean to fan the flames, but goodness, if you profess open-mindedness, why do you write such a condescending generality?

[Pekka]

I think this says it all....

killer reason (http://news.com.com/Windows+chief+fields+readers+questions/2008-1082_3-6032310.html?tag=nl)

The number one reason to buy upcoming Vista?

This from Microsoft talking here folks. This is the main feature for upgrading from XP??

Really now, think about it, how sad is this.

A question: do you KNOW that you do not have any backdoors, viruses or trojans on your Mac? Can you be absolutely sure that there is enough Mac programmers and virus companies to spend their time finding the baddies? Popularity is a curse when it comes to viruses but it is a blessing when it comes to finding them - there is an army of people doing just that. Most malware is all about advertising - which would you rather choose as target: 5% of the world, or 95% of the world?

[Bosman]

A question: do you KNOW that you do not have any backdoors, viruses or trojans on your Mac? Can you be absolutely sure that there is enough Mac programmers and virus companies to spend their time finding the baddies? Popularity is a curse when it comes to viruses but it is a blessing when it comes to finding them - there is an army of people doing just that. Most malware is all about advertising - which would you rather choose as target: 5% of the world, or 95% of the world?

That really doesn't answer the point I was making.....

but from what I read clicky (http://www.jmusheneaux.com/index06.htm)
it is about the "code" that causes the vulnerability not market share. I mean com'on a hacker that could "crack' OSX or creat a virus would be elevated to "god" like status amoung hackers. Let's be realistic, OSX is just a better OS all the way around. I'll be realistic also, if someone is using windows and has $$$ invested in software I can't expect them to change. But arguing over which is superior is no contest.

To your question yes OSX is secure and i have absolutely no worries or concerns about viruses, trojan horses or spyware, it just doesn't exist in the wild on OSX!

[jfrancho]

a hacker that could "crack' OSX or creat a virus would be elevated to "god" like statusNo, that person would be labeled as a clever prick. Why do many MAC users sound like weird religious fanatics?

I actually want a MAC. I use a Windows machine for various other reasons, but ideally for photography I'd be willing to go for one. I wouldn't however want to use one at work for developing n-tier enterprise computing solutions as a MAC just really isn't up to that task. In that realm, Windows rules as the desktop environment. Bottom line, MACs and Windows are equally suited as digital photographic environments, each with it's own advantages and drawbacks. It just seems that one user base seems so insecure that they must continually bash the others. MAC Zealots: Give us a break, stop embarassing yourselves!

[Rocket850]

It just seems that one user base seems so insecure that they must continually bash the others. MAC Zealots: Give us a break, stop embarassing yourselves!
Insecure?
embarrassing yourselves?
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Based on your knowledge about Macs, I'm curious as to what OS X features you liked or didn't like? What do you think of Spring loaded Folders, Fast User Switching, Exposé? Have you done any digital video editing with iMove and idvd?
When people find something cool to use they just want to share the experience and hope others will give it a try. It gets old when your constantly belittled by someone who doesn't know any better.
I can afford a few toys and when I buy something, I go into it with an open mind. In fact, when I decided to get my first DSLR, my mind was made up on nikon. Why? Cause I always wanted to own a "Nikon". But after doing the research, Canon seemed a better fit form me.
Now if someone asks me to recommend a camera, I'll say canon.
Why? It just seems that one user base seems so insecure that they must continually bash the others. Canon Zealots: Give us a break, stop embarassing yourselves!

[jfrancho]

A small part of our user base is not exclusively Windows based, for various reasons, and cross platform compatiblity testing of certain web based applications has to be conducted on MACs, Sparcs, Linux, etc., so I do have some limited hands on access to OSX. I couldn't care less about movie editing or fast user switching, Spring folders are cool, as is the general desktop "experience". The #1 reason I desire a MAC is color management, #2 is ease of security, #3 HW build quality. It took quite a bit of research to build a quality Windows system, quite a bit to get color management nailed down, and a modicum of effort to maintain security. I can afford few toys (note the syntax there) and I needed a reasonable compromise in one machine and those are the tradeoffs. If I could afford it all, I'd go get a preconfigured Dell XPS or something and top line MAC.

[jfrancho]

It just seems that one user base seems so insecure that they must continually bash the others. Canon Zealots: Give us a break, stop embarassing yourselves!Umm, this is a Canon forum, isn't it? :D

[Rocket850]

Umm, this is a Canon forum, isn't it? :D
You are correct my friend :lol:

[CyberDyneSystems]

While no fan of Mac evangelists,. (they seem to do more to push people away from switching than anything else)

I am also a die hard Windows Security critic,. and have no problem agreeing that saying Windows security issues are caused only by popularity is a bit of a cop out.

Windows is a leaking seive of issues,. security etc.. MS seems to have totally lost control of it's own OS' security,. and the issues it faces were installed by MS by it's own greed and desire for control. If Mac and Windows environment are compared solely on this level... Mac wins. No question in my mind.

Again,. it's all about compromise. To get a Mac that will dust the floor with a good AMD or Pentium 4 rig will cost at least twice as much. It's that simple.

Mac owners have operated under a false illusion for years that certain apps like Photoshop are "Mac" apps and run faster on there machines. Dollar for Dollar this has not been true since the year Pentim II broke the Giga Hertz barrier and AMD introduced the Athlon.

-Factoid- Adobe Premier has run faster under AMD than any other processor since the first Athlon was released..

So now that I have pissed off and will draw the fire from both the Mac and Windows camps.. :) :) :)

It's all about compromise,. just like everything else. No system has all areas beat,. so we allways need to decide which aspects and which advantages are more important to ourselves.

that's all,. just seperate the myth from the reality if you dare,. reality,. Mac is more secure,. reality,. Mac's are NOT faster on a dollar per dollar spent basis. They haven't been for some time.

[fatrat]

Dual, Dual core opterons is the go!!!
You can’t beat that!!!
I don’t want to be limited by hardware, software, speed and peripherals!!!

So I choose PC

By the way windows are getting very robust now because it is attacked so much.

Just think if Mac OSX ever becomes popular and starts to be attacked by the masses, Apple won’t know what has hit them!!

[Rocket850]

Dual, Dual core opterons is the go!!!
You can’t beat that!!!
I don’t want to be limited by hardware, software, speed and peripherals!!!

So I choose PC

By the way windows are getting very robust now because it is attacked so much.

Just think if Mac OSX ever becomes popular and starts to be attacked by the masses, Apple won’t know what has hit them!!
So which hardware peripherals can't you run a Mac? Software wise, there are some software titles that are not Mac compatible but I could say the same thing about Windows.

Yes, that's a good reason to buy Windows, because it gets attacked so much :)

XP is boring, plain and simple...I'm writing this post on a PC running XP, have been for years (some version of windows)

As for me, I would rather be with a company that innovates...not duplicates. What you fail to realize is that Apple has a far more advanced operating system, always have. When I got my first Mac in 1988, I was manipulating photos I scanned in, while my friend, who just bought a Tandy, was trying to figure out the DOS command line. I laughed my ass off when I seen that.

* Macs have a more refined OS
* Macs come with better software
* Macs were first to include Firewire, USB and other niceties
* Macs last longer
* No viruses, spyware...
* Cooler looking
* Windows crowd have a "Lemming" mentality

Yes, the list could go on and on but I better stop before this computer locks up :)

[usukshooter]

I've been using PCs since before they days of windows, before computers were common household ideas (my dad worked for a computer company and yes, I was very young). But off and on throughout my life I've been forced to work on Macs too and I just never really liked the interface.

[blue_max]

Why not go down to PC World and ask them to recommend one. They know nothing about computers and particularly macs. I'll bet you come out with a computer that will do what you want it to.

The only way to decide is to list your priorities, much like buying a lens. If you need wide angle and that is the most important thing to you, then a telephoto, no matter how good is not going to be right for you.

You could buy every computer mentioned here and still be unhappy if it had different priorities (eg too expensive, not expandable, not fast enough etc).

It's a moving target anyway. Computer's change rapidly, as do your requirements.

Graham

[CyberDyneSystems]

Mac OS on a dual boot with Dual Opterons.. yum. Best of both worlds.

[Citizensmith]

I never said I was open minded about this. I had a string of bad experiences with Macs over many years. I have not had bad windows experiences, partially because I know a lot more about computers now. My personal opinion is also that the computers are all pretty much equal. I feel I have absolutely zero to gain from using a Mac so why bother.

What I do take issue with is the "You are open minded only if you agree with me" attitude of all the Mac Zealots that to be honest a few people of here have done nothing but accentuate. Unwaivering worship of the cult of Jobs does not make you openminded. :)

[Pekka]

* Macs have a more refined OS

Actually it is simpler because it runs only on dedicated hardware. :)

* Macs come with better software

Better than what? I buy my software so that I can use what I choose.

* Macs were first to include Firewire, USB and other niceties

And they are all available in PC, like Intel CPU, AMD CPU, PCI, PCI-E and SATA are PC technology which are now coming to Macs.

* Macs last longer

I still use my dual PII 600 for all tasks. I think I bought it early 2000. It has now XP, GIgabit LAN with 6 SATA disks (acts as fileserver) and runs LCD nicely.

* No viruses, spyware...

http://www.macvirus.org/

* Cooler looking

Debatable. Mac is a box just like PC. Windows XP looks like crap, but Vista should fix that. It is true Microsoft has not good UI designers.

* Windows crowd have a "Lemming" mentality

Mac users seem to have a need to put people on categories. I really would like to hear do you think that yours truly is a Lemming because I use computers with Windows XP Pro in them? Can my Lemming status be reverted because I run this site on Red Hat Enterprise? Or that am I really acceptable as human being and credible artist only if buy a Mac?

And I repeat these questions seriously: Do you mean to say that I can not express myself on Photoshop in my PC like I would with Photoshop on Mac? Or do you mean I write better with Firefox on Mac than with Firefox on PC? Or that I do better music with Nuendo on Mac than with Nuendo on PC?

I have nothing against Mac existing and selling computers and OS. As I have said I would like to put OS-X on my PC if it were possible. But all the evangelism and computer user racism and categorizing what some Mac users do has got me very reserved about whole idea of actually ever buying a Mac.

[blue_max]

This subject really drags you out of semi-retirement every time Pekka!

It's such a pointless debate as no-one concedes an inch.

I wonder if anyone has actually benefited from a single word that has been written.

Graham

[Citizensmith]

But all the evangelism and computer user racism and categorizing what some Mac users do has got me very reserved about whole idea of actually ever buying a Mac.

I couldn't agree more. The attitude of a lot of Mac users is something I want to avoid any association with and is a reason I don't own any Apple products. It's not the only brand name I avoid, but avoid it I do. Anyway, Creative make much better MP3 players, just not as well marketed. :)

[Citizensmith]

I wonder if anyone has actually benefited from a single word that has been written.

Probably not, but it does hold a certain amount of entertainment and makes a change from discussions on the new 35D and whether its worth getting a Mk1 50 1.8 for it.

Fortunately the majority of topics here are useful and interesting, I've learnt plenty here. Topics like this are the sorbet that clears the palette before we get into actual real questions.

[Bosman]

I'm glad you guys like Windows so much, hope it is worth waiting for. LOL (http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=29368)

[Bosman]

I couldn't agree more. The attitude of a lot of Mac users is something I want to avoid any association with and is a reason I don't own any Apple products. It's not the only brand name I avoid, but avoid it I do. Anyway, Creative make much better MP3 players, just not as well marketed. :)


Creative? make MP3 players?

I don't get it? Is that a joke?
There is only one iPod!!!

[jfrancho]

And only one proprietery format for them.

[blue_max]

Probably not, but it does hold a certain amount of entertainment and makes a change from discussions on the new 35D and whether its worth getting a Mk1 50 1.8 for it.

Fortunately the majority of topics here are useful and interesting, I've learnt plenty here. Topics like this are the sorbet that clears the palette before we get into actual real questions.

It sways rather violently from dead serious to humerous, but I am not sure of the intention of either camp.

I have tried each and every route and been branded a "insert your own word here, but suffice to say it's because I use a mac and quite like it".

You do get drawn in and linched within a couple of posts :lol:

Like I care if you pc guys are missing out. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Graham

[Citizensmith]

Creative? make MP3 players?

I don't get it? Is that a joke?
There is only one iPod!!!


Apple know Creative make MP3 players, Creative own the patent on the menu system Apple use on the Ipods.

And the Creative Nano is smaller, cheaper, and has an FM radio compared to its more chic (and scratch attracting) cousin. :)

[Citizensmith]

You do get drawn in and linched within a couple of posts :lol:


Fine with me, they are Mac users so I know they are wrong. :)

[Moppie]

But all the evangelism and computer user racism and categorizing what some Mac users do has got me very reserved about whole idea of actually ever buying a Mac.



It always saddens me that such attitudes can still exist, and what makes it worse is people can develop such attitudes over something as meaningless as a manufactored product.



If Marjuiana is a gateway drug to Heroin,
And religion is the opiate of the masses,
Then maybe brand loyalty is the the gateway drug to religion?


Or prehap its a pointer to some very basic human desire to belong to a group, and hold the values of that group above all others.
Sort of a Tribal mentality, something breed into us since prehistoric times that is able to re-apear in even people who otherwise apear very intelligent and quite well educated?



Im just glad its limited to a discussion on differnt PC platforms, something that is a minor topic here.



EDIT, I borrowed CDS's keyboard.

[CyberDyneSystems]

EDIT, I borrowed CDS's keyboard.

Thus the very deep, poignant and philosophical post? :lol:

[Rocket850]

I've been using PCs since before they days of windows, before computers were common household ideas (my dad worked for a computer company and yes, I was very young). But off and on throughout my life I've been forced to work on Macs too and I just never really liked the interface.
I'm glad to hear that you got the opportunity to try a Mac out. If it didn't work out for you then so be it. But hey...you tried it :)

[Rocket850]

Mac OS on a dual boot with Dual Opterons.. yum. Best of both worlds.
Interesting :) is this what your doing? I'd like to hear more :lol:

[Rocket850]

Actually it is simpler because it runs only on dedicated hardware. :)



Better than what? I buy my software so that I can use what I choose.

So you admit

And they are all available in PC, like Intel CPU, AMD CPU, PCI, PCI-E and SATA are PC technology which are now coming to Macs.



I still use my dual PII 600 for all tasks. I think I bought it early 2000. It has now XP, GIgabit LAN with 6 SATA disks (acts as fileserver) and runs LCD nicely.



http://www.macvirus.org/



Debatable. Mac is a box just like PC. Windows XP looks like crap, but Vista should fix that. It is true Microsoft has not good UI designers.



Mac users seem to have a need to put people on categories. I really would like to hear do you think that yours truly is a Lemming because I use computers with Windows XP Pro in them? Can my Lemming status be reverted because I run this site on Red Hat Enterprise? Or that am I really acceptable as human being and credible artist only if buy a Mac?

And I repeat these questions seriously: Do you mean to say that I can not express myself on Photoshop in my PC like I would with Photoshop on Mac? Or do you mean I write better with Firefox on Mac than with Firefox on PC? Or that I do better music with Nuendo on Mac than with Nuendo on PC?

I have nothing against Mac existing and selling computers and OS. As I have said I would like to put OS-X on my PC if it were possible. But all the evangelism and computer user racism and categorizing what some Mac users do has got me very reserved about whole idea of actually ever buying a Mac.
Actually it is simpler because it runs only on dedicated hardware. :)
What are you talking about??? I can go to Best Buy and buy a hard drive, go home and stick it in the computer and away I go. And guess what? I have a HP printer, Epson scanner, Linksys wireless modem, Belkin USB hub, Monsoon computer speakers, Wacom tablet, ATA external hard drive, all connected to my Mac...imagine that :) and Mac has real plug and play.

Better than what? I buy my software so that I can use what I choose.
Then I guess your purchase price goes up then? iMove, idvd for digital video works great. very cool animated menus that are included. iphoto is better than the Windows counter part. You can "one click order" calendars, postcards, hard and soft cover books, upload pics to a web page, send pics to e-mail program, create slide shows and burn to DVD and the list goes on. You can do all these things and more without leaving iPhoto.
And don't forget the OS which has great features. Do you have multiple users on your computer? Do they each have there own Wallpaper, music library, photo library and so on? With me and my wife it's like having two separate computers. With a click of the mouse, the computer flips over to her side. takes about 1 second.

And they are all available in PC, like Intel CPU, AMD CPU, PCI, PCI-E and SATA are PC technology which are now coming to Macs.
Those technologies were not always standard equipment. Apple never offered USB and Firewire as an option, they just included it and that was one reason there cost were higher.

I still use my dual PII 600 for all tasks. I think I bought it early 2000. It has now XP, GIgabit LAN with 6 SATA disks (acts as fileserver) and runs LCD nicely.
Congrats :) it's nice having new computer equipment but I would rather spend the extra cash on photography...for the time being that is. :)

http://www.macvirus.org/
http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1916535,00.asp
I guess we will have to see...If someone wants to create viruses bad enough I suppose they will succeed...But you know it will never get as bad as it is for Windows. That is Microsoft's number one issue with Vista, keeping it secure.

Debatable. Mac is a box just like PC. Windows XP looks like crap, but Vista should fix that. It is true Microsoft has not good UI designers.
Oh come on now! :lol: Macs look cooler and you know it. Thats why all these PC manufacturer try and copy them. Remember the stupid plastic colored plates that the Compaq owners could slap on the front of their machines? That was hilarious! The flat panel imac was/is a cool concept. A 20" flat panel display mounted on an articulating arm...won design awards. Don't forget the Cube, very cool looking. You would drop the CD's in like a toaster...didn't sell well though, too expensive. The new iMacs? Whole computer built into the display.
Which computers are shown more in movies? You would think Apple had 95% of market share. They do this because they are cooler looking..and you know it!:lol: Vista will make advancements in the "boring dept." but when that comes out, Leopard will soon follow, so the great divide will continue :)

Mac users seem to have a need to put people on categories. I really would like to hear do you think that yours truly is a Lemming because I use computers with Windows XP Pro in them? Can my Lemming status be reverted because I run this site on Red Hat Enterprise? Or that am I really acceptable as human being and credible artist only if buy a Mac?
Your right...some Mac users do themselves nor the Mac any favors by the things they say. My Lemming remark was a joke and should of used more :lol: :lol: :lol:
Hey, I use XP Pro at work...Red Hat?...cool, I'm all for people trying different things. That's how I ended being a Canon Zealot!

And I repeat these questions seriously: Do you mean to say that I can not express myself on Photoshop in my PC like I would with Photoshop on Mac? Or do you mean I write better with Firefox on Mac than with Firefox on PC? Or that I do better music with Nuendo on Mac than with Nuendo on PC?
I have Photoshop on XP and OS X...and can still screw up a photo on either. I'm not sure your writing skills would improve no mater which platform you used. Just kidding. I use Firefox on XP and OS X...Safari (OS X's browser) is better than both of those. I've never used Nuendo so I wont comment on that.
I have nothing against Mac existing and selling computers and OS. As I have said I would like to put OS-X on my PC if it were possible. But all the evangelism and computer user racism and categorizing what some Mac users do has got me very reserved about whole idea of actually ever buying a Mac.
Swap Mac with Windows and I agree 100%...well said!

[Citizensmith]

Yeah Macs are all very cute if you happen to be into white creamy looking whatevers. I enjoy case modding though and nothing I, or my friends have made has ever looked like a Mac. :) Having an "ah isn't it sweet" case does not translate to cool.

Anyway, your mini-mac may look nice next to, umm, whatever mini-mac are actually used for, but it doesn't come anywhere close to the ulitmate coolness, the very pinacle of the computer case mountain, that is the Mini-itx Falcon case mod. :)

http://www.mini-itx.com/projects/falcon-itx/

It is uber.

[fatrat]

So which hardware peripherals can't you run a Mac? Software wise, there are some software titles that are not Mac compatible but I could say the same thing about Windows.

Yes, that's a good reason to buy Windows, because it gets attacked so much :)

XP is boring, plain and simple...I'm writing this post on a PC running XP, have been for years (some version of windows)

As for me, I would rather be with a company that innovates...not duplicates. What you fail to realize is that Apple has a far more advanced operating system, always have. When I got my first Mac in 1988, I was manipulating photos I scanned in, while my friend, who just bought a Tandy, was trying to figure out the DOS command line. I laughed my ass off when I seen that.

* Macs have a more refined OS
* Macs come with better software
* Macs were first to include Firewire, USB and other niceties
* Macs last longer
* No viruses, spyware...
* Cooler looking
* Windows crowd have a "Lemming" mentality

Yes, the list could go on and on but I better stop before this computer locks up :)

* Firstly intel invented USB and it was on th PC first.
* What are other niceties?
* If Tiger is the most advanced OS if you cant do something so simple like uninstall programs properly

* what dont work on a Mac that i have on PC?
well where do i start, just a quick couple..My Logitech G7 Laser mouse,

My Blue tooth Logitec DiNovo Keyboard,

my 2x Nvidia 6800 Ultra's @ SLI, how much choice of graphics cards have you got with Mac?

My digital HDTV card i use with Media centre( try digital tv recording and timeshifting with the media centre clone, front row)

my current games i am playing( call of duty 2, Civ 4, Age of empires III)

Would i be able to use 3D studio max 8 or AutoCAD 2006 on the Mac?
If not creative people should be on the PC because you can get all Adobes and macromedia's products on the PC + the best CAD and 3D App mentioned above.
Also there is nothing thats on a Mac that any PC owner would need!? why would you bother using a inferior final cut pro? when you can use premier pro that has dynamic intergration with all other Adobe and macromedia products?
In premier Pro 2 you can share the same Cache with After effects 7 and not have to switch from final cut and then re-render or cache again in after effects wasting a whole lot of time and the Fact high end Pc's are faster makes it even more time you are wasting if you are using a Mac to for video editing with after effects.
or if you dont like premier u can use Avid, but why when premier intergrates with adobe products so much better.
What about motion and aperture> ? those apps are cant be used properly in 90% of Macs the recommended specs ( u dont want to go below recommended) are dual 2.0ghz G5s and 2 gigs Ram!!! So only pro Mac users can use these products anyway? Lightroom beta from Adobe runs on a old g4 mac laptop fast so it will fly on the PC and motion is a worthless app anyway


*I mean what the friggin hell would i do if a had a Mac? Surf the net and use Apps i can already get on PC?

* PC was first to get PCI X, PCI E, PCI E x16, SATA, SATA 2 onboard SATA Raid, SLI. Im sure sometime this centry the Mac will get ALL those.

* AMD X2 or Opteron blows the doors Off any Crappy intel CPU!!? Can you get that in your Mac? No your left with Crappy intel stuff!! Oh you can buy a HDD and some RAM and a printer and so on for a Mac!?
Who gives a toss, its still fixed hardware. the Best mac book Pro is already out of date!! its 1.8Ghz, i can get a 2.1Ghz intel Duo on a PC laptop with a 17" screen with res. of 1920x1200!! thats the same Res. as a 23" Cinema Display.
Also can i add 4 DVD writers to my Mac? not even a powermac G5 can use 4 DVD writers and i am going to add another 2 soon? so how would i do that on my Mac? can i upgrade my CPU?

* mac last longer? now i heard it all? WTF? your PC will need upgrading well before it dies? what are you on about i still have a original Pentium but what the hell am i gonna do with it.

Macs look cooler? Pigs ringer there are like a million 3rd Party PC cases, you dont have to have the same boring sheep white or grey Mac!! your mac is just like everyones elses, you have no creative options, Hello!! i like black cases with see through side!? can i get a mac like that! if someone wants a ugly beige PC thats up to them, at least they have the choice.

Also get your facts straight because Mac OSX has several time the vulnerabilities of windows. But your not going to get on the news if you attck macs are you? because you not going to wipe out thousands of business computers and get on the news? are you? No one would bother trying to exploit the Mac because no one cares!! who would bother writing a exploit for 4% of the computer market!
As i said if Mac OSX ever becomes popular there will be exploits but that will never happen

Here (http://www.us-cert.gov/cas/bulletins/SB2005.html)

Also Mac gui looks like it was designed for kindergarden kids, thats why no one takes it serious!!

Also Apple are shown in a lot of movies because they pay for it you fool, it's called product placement and it shows how desperate they are!!

[Pekka]

What are you talking about??? I can go to Best Buy and buy a hard drive, go home and stick it in the computer and away I go. And guess what? I have a HP printer, Epson scanner, Linksys wireless modem, Belkin USB hub, Monsoon computer speakers, Wacom tablet, ATA external hard drive, all connected to my Mac...imagine that :) and Mac has real plug and play.

Computer = motherboard. Mac OS runs only on Mac motherboards.

Those technologies were not always standard equipment. Apple never offered USB and Firewire as an option, they just included it and that was one reason there cost were higher.

Check what e.g. what http://www.asus.com/products4.aspx?l1=3&l2=14&l3=0&model=454&modelmenu=1 has on board and how much it costs. Mac pricing has trademark extra, it's not rationally priced.

Oh come on now! :lol: Macs look cooler and you know it. Thats why all these PC manufacturer try and copy them. Remember the stupid plastic colored plates that the Compaq owners could slap on the front of their machines? That was hilarious! The flat panel imac was/is a cool concept. A 20" flat panel display mounted on an articulating arm...won design awards. Don't forget the Cube, very cool looking. You would drop the CD's in like a toaster...didn't sell well though, too expensive. The new iMacs? Whole computer built into the display.

You should check what is available for PC, from wooden cases to illuminated keyboards. It has changed a lot in last couple of years.

Which computers are shown more in movies? You would think Apple had 95% of market share. They do this because they are cooler looking..and you know it!:lol: Vista will make advancements in the "boring dept." but when that comes out, Leopard will soon follow, so the great divide will continue :)

Product placement is paid advertisement, who pays most gets the product in. Nothing to do with product itself.

[Rocket850]

Yeah Macs are all very cute if you happen to be into white creamy looking whatevers. I enjoy case modding though and nothing I, or my friends have made has ever looked like a Mac. :) Having an "ah isn't it sweet" case does not translate to cool.

Anyway, your mini-mac may look nice next to, umm, whatever mini-mac are actually used for, but it doesn't come anywhere close to the ulitmate coolness, the very pinacle of the computer case mountain, that is the Mini-itx Falcon case mod. :)

http://www.mini-itx.com/projects/falcon-itx/

It is uber.
They're not all creamy white...the original iMacs were multi color; they had a translucent computer years ago and titanium laptops. Fit 'n finish are far better on Apple products. The towers for several generations required no tools to take the covers off. Apple is always winning designs awards, never heard of Dell winning anything for its bent sheet metal.
In order for PC users to have a "cool look" you need to go third party. :)

[usukshooter]

They're not all creamy white...the original iMacs were multi color; they had a translucent computer years ago and titanium laptops. Fit 'n finish are far better on Apple products. The towers for several generations required no tools to take the covers off. Apple is always winning designs awards, never heard of Dell winning anything for its bent sheet metal.
In order for PC users to have a "cool look" you need to go third party. :)

And most PC users I know go third party anyways because they build their own. Thinking about it, I don't know anyone who hasn't build their own PC which is what I like about PCs, I like having that kind of control. Mac users don't seem to do that kind of thing really because like you say, they come "ready made"... but I'm just not a fan of that.

Although I honestly don't understand the whole "looking cool" anyways... my computers get shoved under my desk and only get looked at when pressing a button on them... I really don't care what it looks like, as long as it works.

Which is another thing, it seems to me like apple care more about looking cool then functionality. I know the interface is probably just a matter of preference but I always hated how some macs have only one button on the case (power button)... what moron decided it would be a good idea to put things like the eject button on the keyboard to make the computer case look sleeker? Sure, it might be closer but if you're ejecting something you have to reach to put something in or take something out anyway! People are creatures of habit and I'm used to hitting the eject button on the case, not the keyboard... I hate reaching over and then remembered it's on the keyboard. All in the name of it looking "cooler". Eff that.

And what idiot decided to make a sleeker looking one button mouse? Whoever did should be shot. Those things drive me up the wall. I know, I know, there's ways around using the right click (but like I said, creatures of habit...) and you can use a regular mouse (I didn't have that choice at school though). But you won't see PC companies making that kind of crap in the first place. So why does Apple? Oh that's right, because it looks "cooler". Puh-lease! :rolleyes::lol:

Now don't get me wrong, I own an ipod and use itunes and I love them both. I don't just go around bashing one side and worshipping another. But I just never like apples approach on macs.... I guess it just mostly comes down to what you're used to though.

[Rocket850]

I don't just go around bashing one side and worshipping another. But I just never like apples approach on macs.... I guess it just mostly comes down to what you're used to though.
You would NEVER consider bashing...:rolleyes:

So, what Mac OS have you used?

All you PC users crack me up :lol::lol::lol:

[Rocket850]

Although I honestly don't understand the whole "looking cool" anyways... my computers get shoved under my desk and only get looked at when pressing a button on them... I really don't care what it looks like, as long as it works.
If I owned a PC I would keep it under the desk also.

I know the interface is probably just a matter of preference but I always hated how some Macs have only one button on the case (power button)... what moron decided it would be a good idea to put things like the eject button on the keyboard to make the computer case look sleeker? Sure, it might be closer but if you're ejecting something you have to reach to put something in or take something out anyway! People are creatures of habit and I'm used to hitting the eject button on the case, not the keyboard... I hate reaching over and then remembered it's on the keyboard. All in the name of it looking "cooler". Eff that.
Interface a matter of preference? You never used OS X, so how would you know?:rolleyes:
How many power buttons do you need?:( The eject button on the keyboard confuses you? Interesting :rolleyes:
And what idiot decided to make a sleeker looking one button mouse? Whoever did should be shot.
What idiot would use a mouse? I use a trackball and Wacom tablet

Do you always criticize thing you know very little about? I'm referring to the Mac of course

I probably know XP better than you do...

and why did you buy an iPod?

[tripletaker]

I've used PCs for all my life and a year ago bought a PowerBook because a lot of my teachers used them and recommended them for my upcoming design/visual/video/film/multimedia classes. The learning curve was pretty easy for me to learn. In Windows I had so many viruses and spyware that I even had to buy a totally new computer one time. With a Mac, I haven't had a single problem with spyware or viruses. In regards to the OS, I find OSX to be quite elegant. I don't know how to do cool stuff to computer so I always had the original Windows computer. But OSX just looks good. In regards to performance, I find OSX pretty fast. I find that for a Windows computer after a year, they just get slow and you have to reformat over and over again. Maybe, if you're very computer literate this isn't a problem, for the regular user, it is. Macs just provide stability to your system. After 30 full days of no restarts, it still works perfectly.

In my personal experience regrading photography and Macs, I see no advantage on Mac v. PC. Although I love iPhoto 6 and the organization it provides, I'm sure on the Windows side there are equivalent programs. Also Photoshop seems to run at the same speed on both machines. In my opinon, it's just a matter of taste and what you're used to and whether you want to try a new thing.

[usukshooter]

If I owned a PC I would keep it under the desk also.


Interface a matter of preference? You never used OS X, so how would you know?:rolleyes:
How many power buttons do you need?:( The eject button on the keyboard confuses you? Interesting :rolleyes:

What idiot would use a mouse? I use a trackball and Wacom tablet

Do you always criticize thing you know very little about? I'm referring to the Mac of course

I probably know XP better than you do...

and why did you buy an iPod?

Screw you, I was trying to actually be objective and not just say "pcs rule, macs suck!" and you make cocky and unnecessary shots like this. Why do I bother.

So I happen to have a different opinion then you... don't like it? Too bad, that's your problem not mine.

FYI, I have used OS X - for a solid 9 months. Off and on throughout my life I've probably used macs in general combined for a total of well over a year. Yes, I named some of the little things I don't like about macs.... but I also listed some other things I like about apples other products. And believe me, there's plenty of things I don't like about windows too. So what? Every single thing in life has it's advantages and disadvantages and it's just a matter of personal preference, just like choosing between Canon and another brand. My personal preference is PCs. Big deal. Get over it.

And btw, I never said the eject button on the keyboard confused me... I said it annoyed me.

So if all you're going to do is assume things about me that aren't true, put words in my mouth and look down on me just because I use a PC... you can just eff right off.

[Citizensmith]

What idiot would use a mouse? I use a trackball and Wacom tablet


I mean come on, do we even need to start on what a dumb statement that is. I think you got a little over excited or something.

[CyberDyneSystems]

Normally when a thread gets to this level of name calling,. it would be locked or removed.

Since some of us just seem to love to duke this never ending subject out,.. POTN will oblige your tendencies for judging a human being's personality and creative ability based on there choice of microprocessor.

Have at it folks.. show us how small and bigoted you can be! Show us how thin skinned and shallow! Show us the superiority of the master OS user over the unclean masses. why judge based on color, religion or ancestry when you can judge based on susceptibility to marketing?

This is now the -=OFFICIAL=- thread to show your true colors

[Citizensmith]

In Windows I had so many viruses and spyware that I even had to buy a totally new computer one time.

And this is a nice example of blame transfer.

First, everyone knows that there are viruses for the PC. Get some antivirus software and don't go to Russian pron sites and you can avoid them.

Second, in what way does a software problem mean you need a new computer. Sure you need to grab a restore disc or similar but I'm not actually aware of any viruses that cause physical damage to a computer. Maybe you are refering to that virus that shuts your fridge off and makes your girlfriend dump you.

Buying a new computer because you had a virus is refered to as PEBKAC. :)

I was going to say that a definite advantage of Mac is that a child could use it. Seeing as my 3-year old has no problem playing games on a PC though (www.pbskids.org) though that doesn't work. Macs are designed so someone with the intellect of a yoghurt could use them. And I mean that as a good thing. :)

As for Mac case design. I have one word on that subject. Metrosexual. If thats you then fine, I mean they are nice cases. But if you want anything aside from a pretty white/silver/pastel box, such as maybe something rack mount (do apple make any servers?), a gaming case with a bit of personality, or anything weatherized/ruggedized then the apple store isn't the place to go.

[Citizensmith]

Since some of us just seem to love to duke this never ending subject out,.. POTN will oblige your tendencies for judging a human being's personality and creative ability based on there choice of microprocessor.

Have at it folks.. show us how small and bigoted you can be! Show us how thin skinned and shallow! Show us the superiority of the master OS user over the unclean masses. why judge based on color, religion or ancestry when you can judge based on susceptibility to marketing?

This is now the -=OFFICIAL=- thread to show your true colors

The thread has been upgraded. All hail the power of CDS.

Seriously though, Ubuntu or Suse. Those Red Hat people are wierd. :)

Oh yeah, and Jobs can't even give his OS away free. Not sure who has heard much about the $100 laptop project, but Apple offered the use of their OS free. They were declined in favor of Linux. The offer was declined exactly because of how proprietary the OS is. Can't wait for the new Switch commercials. OSX, we can't even give it away. :)

[Rocket850]

Screw you, I was trying to actually be objective and not just say "pcs rule, macs suck!"

So I happen to have a different opinion then you... don't like it? Too bad, that's your problem not mine.

... you can just eff right off.
:lol: Gotta love some of you Windows users :lol:

[Rocket850]

I mean come on, do we even need to start on what a dumb statement that is. I think you got a little over excited or something.
Yep...need to use more smiles from now on...it was meant tongue and cheek


So...boxers or briefs?...i'm ready to rumble over this one:lol::lol:

[Citizensmith]

So...boxers or briefs?...i'm ready to rumble over this one:lol::lol:

I dunno, I always thought Mac users went for something with frills and lace. :D

This is an official OS topic now so we best stay on track. :)

[Rocket850]

I dunno, I always thought Mac users went for something with frills and lace. :D

Sure...makes them easier to use ;)

[Big_B]

Screw you...

:lol: Gotta love some of you Windows users :lol:

As CDS said, these threads are normally closed pretty quickly. Play nicely or this one will be joining them pretty quickly.

Big_B
Moderator

[Citizensmith]

Seeing as this is now the official system bashing thread and to try and get back to topic

At work I purchase and use a number of ruggedized PCs. When you need it, a laptop you can use in the rain is exceedingly useful. So why don't Apple make such a system. As I mentioned before, what about a rackmount, a tablet, a PDA.

If they ever want to move beyond a marginalized system they will need to pick up markertshare. That would be a lot easier if they made something other than a limited range of home and business PCs.

[NickC]

As I mentioned before, what about a rackmount, a tablet, a PDA.

http://www.apple.com/xserve/ -- The rackmount has been out for awhile.

About the PDA, they've done that with the Newton, and abandoned the market. It's a dying (or at least static) market and it would be dubious to try to enter it this late in the game.

As for the tablet, well, there's a patent granted but who knows if it will end up as a product:

http://www.macobserver.com/article/2005/05/10.18.shtml

[Citizensmith]

About the PDA, they've done that with the Newton, and abandoned the market. It's a dying (or at least static) market and it would be dubious to try to enter it this late in the game.

And it has nothing to do with the Newton being a really sucky product that nobody wanted, and that was a long time ago. The market is static, but it is moving towards cross over devices so it certainly isnt dying.

At least they do have a single server offering. They'll need a fair bit more than that though if they expect to get taken seriously. Having said that they probably expect it more to just be a hub for small apple networks rather than huge web server farms and such so 1 is probably enough.

A patent is out for tablets? Be interesting to see what they are thinking of whenever it happens as it obviously cant be a patent on any of the existing tablet ideas.

[OUTDOOR_ADS]

CDS, thanks for letting this continue......

I’ve been watching this degrade for a couple of days now and would like to set the record straight with a little more information for Mac OSX users. Most long time Unix, Linux, and Windows users will understand this from the progression of threats they have experienced over the years and especially over the last 2 years.

Viruses and Spyware will ALWAYS be the last to hit your machine! Any electronic device controlled by any type of operating system WILL contain some type of vulnerability. To some, finding this “hole” is a full blown sport, no malicious intent, not looking for profit and in no way trying to infringe on anyone’s information. In this is the problem; once the vulnerability is found this information is usually posted somewhere on the net. For proof of vulnerabilities take a moment and search Google there are many that apply to OSX and some from other Linux/Unix distributions that can be readily modified to apply. At the current time there are plenty of “known” hacks for OSX (any flavor) I will not give details as that usually takes the “fun” out of this type of subject and separates those that are really interested in the products they use and those that just go for what some marketing guru tells them to buy via slick ad campaigns.

I wanted to make sure my example “worked” before I posted this so I’m sorry if I’m late to the table.

Today’s Lesson: Need into a Mac – and don’t have the password, no problem!


Search Google for “Lepton’s Crack” (can be compiled to run on OS X)
Search for either of the following – Apple Developer Tools from 10.2 or Xcode Tools from 10.3 for the GCC compiler, either can be found by searching Google.
For those of you that know your Mac you now have the tools at your disposal to “crack” both Mac NT4 shares and SHA1 password hashes on a Mac running OSX.
This works (I tested this on the latest updated OSX v10.4.4) on passwords up to 255 characters although I only tested it with a 25 character password. There are at least 4 sites with complete instructions on this and many other known hacks for those with the time and inclination to really search the net for the infomation.

So how dose this apply to *There are no known Mac Viruses, well here is an example chain of events.


A developer working on an application stumbles on a simple vulnerability in the basic code of OSX; the developer details the vulnerability in the developer forums usually looking for someone at Apple to help with a quick fix.
In an effort to see just how far a system can be compromised a “hacker” takes this knowledge and applies it to a physical hack “keystroking” or “scripting” his/her way thru it step by step. If successful he/she then documents his exploit in the hacking/security bug forums.
The ever vigilant network administrator will take this information and develop a tool “script” that can be used to check the vulnerability within the confines of a lab environment and occasionally even in a “Live” environment depending on the threat. In an effort to make this information available to other network or computer administrators the “scrip” will then be posted to a security administration group with a complete description of its use.
This is when viruses are developed; all the pieces of the puzzle are now available, the Vulnerability and complete description, the exploit testing script and its description, and of course the standard software development tools. For the most part there are two types of virus writers; the ones that treat it as purely a game and release the virus into the wild and to the antivirus companies at the same time (the one that spreads the farthest and infects the most systems wins – age group: 12-25), and the ones that are purely profit motivated (the ones that are looking for email address databases to sell to spammers, online banking information, corporate financial information, product development information, and personal identity information – age group: 17-35)
Viruses by design are looking for the easiest way to infect and or collect the absolute most amount of information available in the shortest amount of time. Mac’s until recently have been mainly used in graphics and video editing environments and very rarely contain “useful” or worth while data to the average virus writer. Be aware this is not the case anymore, as the home use of Mac’s steadily increases (iTunes is currently guaranteeing that) so will the potential for massive virus attacks. Many Mac users will be totally unprepared for the speed at which these attacks develop and mature once they start, this will hold doubly true for Apple as well. Microsoft and the UNIX community are already VERY experienced in what is now know as the 0-day virus (a virus that has appeared within 24 hours of a vulnerability and generally the most frightening type) were Apple has almost no experience in handling this type of threat.

IMHO today there is no such thing as a superior personal computer; the hardware playing field is now level for the most part. Contrary to popular opinion there is NO perfect Operating System and none on the horizon; however there are many levels of User Knowledge. Never mistake the machine for the person controlling it, because thats what really decides whos system is better not the name on the "box".

[Moppie]

This is now the -=OFFICIAL=- thread to show your true colors



A good idea, but its seems everyone has been over whelmed with a bout of rationality. :D :D :lol:

[fatrat]

Mac owners watch brokeback mountain and carry handbags

[usukshooter]

As CDS said, these threads are normally closed pretty quickly. Play nicely or this one will be joining them pretty quickly.

Big_B
Moderator
If the moderators allow arrogant patronizing but not a little "screw you" from someone who is sick of being patronized for a difference of opinion then I'm sure I want to be here to begin with.