i need help with DIY wedding

[jameslincs]

hi, i am getting married 8th april 2006 in newark, nottinghamshire, UK
but i am on a really low budget, the lowest quote from a local professional was £600,
so i decided to buy a camera with that money and try to get a friend to do it.

i know nothing about photos, but learning fast,
i know you all think im mad.

please could anyone help!
what lense do i need, (i have a 18-55 usm)
my camera is eos 350d canon
should i get 55-200mm lense? (usm?)
what type of trypod (if any)
do i need blue filters
should i get adoby photo shop?

is anyone near newark on that date?
free food and drink LOL (but seriously come over)

any help would be great.:)
i was thinking of selling the camera afterwards but enjoy it so
will keep it, (if Kathleen (the bride) lets me live)

PLEASE HELP:cry:
Thanks
James
jimandkat83@hotmail.com

might post any pics i get to let you know how it went
(depends if the're too embarrising)

[sapearl]

Madness? Well........ that's a different topic for another thread....;) Do you have any local colleges or universities with design, photography or art departments? Many times these are filled with budding young photographers, just starting out, looking for weekend work. Canvas those locales.

Every now and then I receive a request like yours... I feel bad for the client, but there are certain fixed costs I can't ignore. Try this suggestion though. But keep in mind that you usually get what you pay for in wedding photography.

Was it your intention to temporarily "give" the new camera to the potential shooter.? If so, make sure he/has at least a couple of months practice. But if you're going to have another pro/amateur do the job, pardon me for asking but I'm not really sure why you bought the camera... they will typically want to use their own familiar gear. Anyway, congratulations and good luck.

hi, i am getting married 8th april 2006 in newark, nottinghamshire, UK
but i am on a really low budget, the lowest quote from a local professional was £600,
so i decided to buy a camera with that money and try to get a friend to do it.

jimandkat83@hotmail.com

might post any pics i get to let you know how it went
(depends if the're too embarrising)

[ROY]

James you are mad!!!:rolleyes:
Do you want 'pub night out, type snap shots or something for your bride to remember her one off day?
Try this idea :- check local camera clubs- on line - you can see their pics, approach and ask for some one to do it, Usually more than willing even if its for a hot pie and bovril.
or Try this:- local camera shops someone there might help or know who can.
If going it alone go to book shop get wedding photography book copy out a list of must have shots(cheaper than buying book) however - for absolute basics you will need to try and borrow a tripod - a must for nice natural low light bride at window shots etc, and a flash gun (bounce it off low ceilings, the light that is not the flashgun).
I wish you and yours all the best.

[jameslincs]

ok, good advice, thanks

btw i know i sound like a plonker, the kind of idiot who would try
to perform an operation on himself

well i guess i am (a plonker that is)
but if you dont push your self then what can you acheive?

i am going to go to someones wedding, i figuer if i just go
to a registry office then someone will just let me take a few shots
this will be a good test, right?

then i just have to teach a friend what to do,
i will get a tripod then, thanks for that

what about the 55-200 lens, will the 'usm' make much difference?

[Tapeman]

Ask all or your guests to take photos for you. Also you can put disposable cameras on all of the tables at the reception, ask your guests to use them & leave them on the table when they go. (If you are having one.)

[tim]

Return the camera and find a photography student/enthuiast to do it for you.

[sapearl]

James, as much as I applaud your "yankee ingenuity", I echo Tim's sentiments. There really is too much to learn that could go wrong and all in too short a time.

You may be an easy going guy fully capable of rolling with the punches, but TRUST ME, if these pictures get screwed up, your wife will NEVER forgive you. And even if she makes you think that you have been forgiven, she will never let you forget it. And if not her, then her mother - you see, there really is no escape.

All photographic advice aside, this is one of those forces of nature that you just don't mess with. Tim is offering excellent advice. And if you can't find one of those folks, ask the guy at the local camera store who he may know that could help you out.

Return the camera and find a photography student/enthuiast to do it for you.

[richardj7]

James, I don't want to sound mean, but I have no sympathy for that kind of thinking (i.e. buying a camera, learning it yourself, teaching someone else - the blind leading the blind kind of situation). And, taking a student, local photo club enthusiast or a non-professional to capture that day is playing with fire.

Most girls, from a very young age dream of the day they will get married. They imagine it thousands of time, over and over again. They meticulously choose a dress, shoes, accessories, and flowers. They want their wedding to really be the best. It's a one-time event. They want to remember it a long time, because it passes so quickly. Second marriages never have the same impact, unless the first one was a flop, and they have a second chance to make it better. For most blokes, it's simply a formality, a project, more of a social event, than anything else. A lot would probably choose not to make such a fuss of it, if they could get away with it.

Just observe how much thought and energy future brides put in the preparations, making sure of all the details. Photos act like reminders of that wonderful day. It's a moment frozen in time that will be relished by parents, friends, children, and grandchildren. The only lasting souvenir of that day. I know for a fact that a lot of couples do consider their day ruined, if the photos were ruined.

Work overtime, borrow, bribe someone, get a weekend job, but get the money to pay an experienced wedding photographer. Please!

[jameslincs]

i know what you mean,
im 25 and this is my first (and only) wedding
i want it to go well to.
(the whole do is 4hours long max)

which is better, 25 proffessional shots or
125 ok shots, some of wich will be good
and a camera and basic skills that we can use throughout
the marrage, children (if any) etc..

what is image stablizer? can anyone recommend any good books. (short ones lol)

cheers James


Hi guys, I am the blushing bride, thanks for thinking of me in your comments!
we really have a tight budget and considered everything, we saw lots of professional photographers and the one I considered the best, was £2000 for their cheapest package! James is very good at technical stuff and we have found a friend who is into photography so it can't be that bad can it? One proffessional lot of pics we saw the group shots were awful, everyone was cut up and you could really only see the people on the front row, also there were pics of the bride and groom infront of the church and they looked like they had been superimposed!he was within our budget at £300 ish for 35 pics, but i think we could do better?:p
and we get the camera for future use (well I hope we can do better!!) Kathleen

[tim]

How about a professional for the ceremony and the formal photos, and find a friend who already has a camera to get the lots of ok shots? Even if you hire someone who's only starting out and will work cheap you'll get a lot better results than a friend who's learning and doesn't have much experience with your camera.

This is "recipe for disaster" material, you are more than likely to regret this decision later.

[jameslincs]

hi Tim
we we did think of that, but with such a short wedding, we may as well get a professional for the whole thing.

also their is some pride in taking photos,

i have just been reading you comments and advice on wedding lenses, im writing it all down.

do you know how we can stop faces being cut up in group shots?

[tim]

What do you mean by cut up? For group shots just elevate the photographer so they can see everyones faces (use a ladder, a balcony, etc), put a flash on the camera (more power is bettter, 550/580EX), and shoot. Make sure your friend gets and reads a few wedding photography books before he does it for you, i've recommended a few in the past, if you can't find them with search I can link to them again for you. This thread (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=75678) might also be helpful.

A single 24-70 F2.8 type lens and a flash is all you really need, and for someone with no experience shooting their first wedding it's probably better they didn't have to worry about equipment and concentrated on getting the shots. If someone takes it seriously it can be a bit stressful, and if they don't take it seriously they shouldn't be doing.

Looks like you're set on your course, I wish you good luck, and i'll have my fingers crossed for you.

[jameslincs]

Sigma 24 - 70 F2.8 EX DG DF Canon fit - zoom lens (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Sigma-24-70-F2-8-EX-DG-DF-Canon-fit-zoom-lens_W0QQitemZ7584266971QQcategoryZ4687QQssPageNam eZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)http://pics.ebaystatic.com/aw/pics/uk/s.gif</IMG> Canon fit - Zoom - auto focus - manual - fast - mint

this lens is on ebay right now,
£220 ish

is it the one you mean?

should i get the 55-200mm usm lens? £150

:D

[tim]

Yep - I tend to buy my lenses new from B&H, see here (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home;jsessionid=Dd27b9qhL9!756075845?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=350973&is=REG&addedTroughType=search).

Edit - nope on the 55-200, like I said i'd skip the zoom and use the one lens. I could do an average wedding with one 20D, one 24-70 F2.8, and one flash, though I can do better with all my equipment.

[dsze]

James,

Take out a small loan or a cash advance on a credit card and hire a budding photographer. (note that I am NOT a financial advisor of any kind). You'll be glad you did 5 years down the road, when you pullout that wedding album, or decide to hang one on the wall as a surprise for your wife. Like you said, you only get one chance to do this. Do it right.

[jameslincs]

i have been looking at the book recommended on amazon.
looks good, thats great advice.

this thred is about helping me try, not talking me out of it,
even thought that is the ovious thing to do

i have a 18 - 55mm lens
the 24-70mm lens looks great, but is it worth the £220?
what about usm and IS, is it available?
and is it worth it in your opinion?

[smittymike19]

james, i hate to sound like a pessimist, but you need to get a pro. these pics will last a lifetime and in 25 years you wont even remember taht you spent 2000 on a photographer, but youll certainly remember the bad pics that happen. when i got married 5 years ago we spent over 5k on the photographer and i never looked back. we certainly were not as well of as we are now, so it was painful, but when i look back, i couldnt be happier with our decision. granted it wouldnt be bad if your friend had a wedding or three under his belt, but i wouldnt want my pics to be his maiden voyage. spend all of this tiem you are spending on figuring out photography and get a part time job instead, youll make the 2k in no time. actually if you return the camera, youll only have to make 1400.

i for one have been working on my skills for a year straight. i mean ALOT of time for that year too, and i still have a lot of questions. when you ask if you should buy photoshop, it sounds as if you think you can pick up a "learn photoshop in 24 hours " book and nail it in a day. i think if you take a poll around here, its gonna take a little more time than that. i hope im not sounding too sarcastic, but being a great wedding photographer doesnt happen in a month. some of the guys you looked at have probably been doing it for years and you said that many of them still stunk, so that should give you an idea of how hard it can be.

the other thing is this: on your only wedding day, do you want to spend the short time you have celebrating sitting around while your photographer clods around? i know by the time my photographer was done on our wedding day, i was more than fed up with waiting for the pictures to be over. i cant imagine waiting for an amateur trying to do it. your short day will become even shorter.
good luck in whatever you choose, just remember we tried! :)

[smittymike19]

oh and now you are going to buy a lens too? what about a memory card big enough to handle the wedding? and you probably want an external flash if you dont want snap shotish pics. you may not need one, but lord help you if it rains that day and you have low available light. sound like you are getting closer and closer to taht 2000 you are trying to avoid.

[sapearl]

Definitely 25 pro shots that will be the memorable images of the day, as opposed to 125 mudane shots that won't exemplify the beauty and uniqueness of a very special event.

This is your WEDDING DAY, not p&s snapshots taken at some soccer match. Believe me, there will be plenty of time later on with the kids to sharpen your skills at all those school events and birthday parties. Been there done that (2 grown daughters).



which is better, 25 proffessional shots or
125 ok shots, some of wich will be good
and a camera and basic skills that we can use throughout
the marrage, children (if any) etc..

what is image stablizer? can anyone recommend any good books. (short ones lol)

cheers James

[sapearl]

Have you taken any pictures yet with the new camera? How do they look? How do they compare to samples you've seen on this forum of other things besides just wedding work? This should give you some inkling of what you're getting yourself into. Is there a birthday party or someone's anniversary that you can practice on that will give you a good feel for technique?

You've got a lot to learn in a very short period of time. It's fine to read the books and info in this forum, but the real "doing" is in the pictures you take and the quality of the finished product. What you are attempting is extremely formidable, but not totally impossible. Good luck - and ps. you've got a very understanding bride ;) .

i have been looking at the book recommended on amazon.
looks good, thats great advice.

this thred is about helping me try, not talking me out of it,
even thought that is the ovious thing to do

i have a 18 - 55mm lens
the 24-70mm lens looks great, but is it worth the £220?
what about usm and IS, is it available?
and is it worth it in your opinion?

[dsze]

Smittymike is right. To get the gear that you'll need for your friend to do this wedding properly (if he did know how) is going to cost you at least $2000....probably a lot more. I bring $8-10K of gear to a wedding, and I don't have the latest-greatest equipment.

I know you don't want this thread to be a 'talk you out of it' discussion, but anything else would be unprofessional, I think. For a short wedding, you can easily book a photography student for MUCH less than what you are about to spend on kit. Do you really want to spend all this time, money and energy looking for gear, buying it, testing, it learning photography and then teaching your friend and then stressing on the wedding day because your worried about the photos? Keep in mind that there is a reason that many seasoned professional refuse to shoot weddings.

Ok, thats my last comment. I'll spend no more time trying to talk you out of this. ;) I promise. If you do go through with this, then I do wish you (and your friend) the best of luck.

[CyberPet]

Contact a media school and see if you can find a photo student that can shoot for free or for prints... better than letting your friend use your camera. Your friend needs practice or you'll end up with some sad photo's and you'll regret it for the rest of your life (and your future wife will let you know that too - I promise).

[Phil V]

James
You have mail.

[jameslincs]

thanks for the support?
this is like the time i said "we dont need a real gas man" all over again:D

i have a 2gb 20mb/sec memory card (ebay £98)

the flash is 380ex i think but would have to check

all this stuff can be resold if needs be after wedding
i have a willing friend and its kinda fun finding all this stuff out.
(between you and me i might keep taking pics as a hobby)

i hope i will be able to post end results and impress you all. :oops:
well, never say never!

the help from tim has been great and phil emailed with an offer to
come and take the pics

kathleen and i arnt too uptight about the pics, really no stress:rolleyes:

does anyone have any tips for great shots, the stepladder idea is great.
i will try to upload some of my current pics to this site for your judgment

ttfn

[dsze]

does anyone have any tips for great shots,
ttfn

James,

Seriously. You're asking for tips to take great photos, to tell to your friend, who's shooting YOUR WEDDING! :eek: Ok, but I promised not to make any more negative comments. So, if you are really this intent on following through with this, here are a few suggestions:

1. Get your friend a volunteer assistant to help with moving gear around, rounding up the correct people for pictures, working on the poses and reading light while your friend is getting camera settings and lenses ready. This makes a huge difference.

2. Don't shoot on full auto. Learn to shoot in manual or at least learn the difference between Av & Tv and then teach your friend. A wedding shot on full auto will not be what you're expecting; snapshot-ish at best.

3. Learn to use fill-flash, even outside, and even in intense natural light. fill-flash makes a big difference in the quality of the images. And get a diffuser for inside stuff.

4. Get at least one really fast lens, like the 50 1.8.

Good luck,

[tim]

FYI I take 8GB of memory to a wedding, and I usually fill it... 850 or so RAW images. If you shoot RAW you'll get about 210 images on 2GB, JPG I guess around 500 but without the RAW safety net.

That's a great offer from Phil too :)

[dsze]

...agreed with Tim. I take about 5GB of cards to a wedding, and I dump 1/2 of that during the reception dinner onto a laptop, so I end up with almost 8GB of shots as well. You should have your friend shoot RAW, which will eat up memory fast.

[jameslincs]

hey hey!
this is good advice (i hope!)

glad you came round, and not a minute too soon:D

i have been thinking a test is a good idea,
can you think of the 3 most difficult wedding photos to get right.

what are the really tough ones?

then i will go and try to get them, i will show you them and you can
see what you think, also if you pros can post your version of the
same 3 shots to compare.

what you think? are you up to it?

may the bestman win :lol: lol (bestman, Wedding, get it) lol


cheers
ps sorry for late reply, comp playing up

[tim]

can you think of the 3 most difficult wedding photos to get right.

1. Shots with the bride in them.
2. Shots with the groom in them.
3. Shots of guests.

[CyberPet]

Tree most difficult shots? Uhm... that's not gonna fly. Try getting the white gown not blown out and the black tux not all a black mess. It's more to this than just posing a few people.

[dsze]

Tree most difficult shots? Uhm... that's not gonna fly. Try getting the white gown not blown out and the black tux not all a black mess. It's more to this than just posing a few people.

He'll find out soon enough. ;) You might add to Tim's list, a crowd of 10 guests snapping their P&S's and bumping into you while you're trying to get the formals. Seriously, if you want a test, set up something white (like the dress) and something black like the tux, pack on some gear, and set a timer for 5 minutes. In those 5 minutes try to get 3 good shots inside, in at least 3 different poses or compositions and then do the same thing outside. 3 good shots includes not blowing out the white or putting the black all on the left side, and paying attention to backgrounds and depth of field. The 5 minutes will help simulate the stress of the wedding day, for the photog. If you can do this, then try teaching your friend to do this, and then post the results for us and you might start getting some more serious tips.

[tim]

...a crowd of 10 guests snapping their P&S's and bumping into you while you're trying to get the formals...

I shoo people away, nicely, people milling around or using cameras spoil the photos by distracting the people in the photos.

[CyberPet]

Ok, you guys gonna laugh... but I'm voice handicapped, so I can't speak, nor yell. I can whisper though and I tell you.... I can scare anyone away with a "stare". Honest to gawd, I scare people! :D :D :D :D

[smittymike19]

Ok, you guys gonna laugh... but I'm voice handicapped, so I can't speak, nor yell. I can whisper though and I tell you.... I can scare anyone away with a "stare". Honest to gawd, I scare people! :D :D :D :D
i dunno you look too nice to scare anyone. thoughg most women do have that mean streak and watch out! I never heard of "voice handicapped", sorry to hear.:(

[dsze]

I shoo people away, nicely, people milling around or using cameras spoil the photos by distracting the people in the photos.

...absolutely they do.. However, that is easier said that done; shooing 75 year old grandma, the brides best friends and favorite aunt Helga aren't earning you any points with the bride or mother of. There's a balance there, as I'm sure you know. I'm not so sure just anyone just learning to use DSLR can find and execute that balance at a wedding.

James, I know I said I wouldn't be negative anymore and I really am not trying to sound so pessimistic. I'm just finding it difficult to advise someone to go through with this, especially when, in then end, you aren't going to save much if any money at all... and you almost certainly won't have the photos you desire. This is your wedding James. Anyway, learn, read books, look at other pro's images and practice. Give the camera to your friend and have him do some practice shots... post them here if you are still happy with this idea and I will give the best suggestions for improvement that I can offer.

[sapearl]

James, I wish you the best of luck and certainly hope things work out. There are some wonderful folks in this forum with more optimism than myself who have given you some excellent suggestions. But after doing weddings for more than 30 years I tend to be realistic.

Many people think that digital photography is the magic bullet for image capture. Computers are powerful and more user friendly than ever. Software can cure a number of ills, memory cards have eliminated the cost of film, and you can blast away 100 or more shots to get that one picture that may be adequate. But it still takes a craftsman to create truly beautiful images.

Yours is not an impossible task - I just put it in the category of the man who finds himself in a legal predicament, asks around for advice on buying a good law book, reads it, and then tries to teach a friend to defend him court, for that April court date. :oops:

[quote=dsze
James, I know I said I wouldn't be negative anymore and I really am not trying to sound so pessimistic. I'm just finding it difficult to advise someone to go through with this, especially when, in then end, you aren't going to save much if any money at all... and you almost certainly won't have the photos you desire.[/quote]

[tim]

...absolutely they do.. However, that is easier said that done; shooing 75 year old grandma, the brides best friends and favorite aunt Helga aren't earning you any points with the bride or mother of. There's a balance there, as I'm sure you know. I'm not so sure just anyone just learning to use DSLR can find and execute that balance at a wedding.

Yep. Sometimes I ask people to wait until after i've taken the photo before they take it, and to try to stand still so they don't distract the group. It doesn't work as well though, if people are there someone in the group doesn't follow my instructions and ends up looking like an idiot.

[jameslincs]

hi, i am half way through that book, great stuff :)

it seems the main things to worry about are

1, directing the people
2, lighting
3, holding the camera still and stright
4, focus
5, other photo takers
6, putting people in the frame
7, correct zoom

man thats alot, i guess the pics will be photojurnilesam in style then,
i think thats the posh word for "slap dash" lol

i have a plan to tackle each step, this thred is really big, and you all have been really helpful, very soon i will post pics so you can see things so far.

i admit some things need time to improve, but as long as its good enough, right.

i think its good to try new stuff that scares you, today why dont you try something new, fix the car yourself, download some music for the first time, volinteer to play piano to a crowd (even if you cant play now)
Yes its crazy and you wont be perfect but have fun.

see you soon :cool:

[tim]

Proper photojournalism is an art form, one that i'm not even going to call myself a beginner at. I call them "candids".

There is a lot going on at a wedding, that's why we all said hire a pro who's done it before!

[dsze]

hi, i am half way through that book, great stuff :)

it seems the main things to worry about are

1, directing the people
2, lighting
3, holding the camera still and stright
4, focus
5, other photo takers
6, putting people in the frame
7, correct zoom

man thats alot, i guess the pics will be photojurnilesam in style then,
i think thats the posh word for "slap dash" lol
i think its good to try new stuff that scares you, today why dont you try something new, fix the car yourself, download some music for the first time, volinteer to play piano to a crowd (even if you cant play now)
Yes its crazy and you wont be perfect but have fun.

see you soon :cool:

Yes, those are some of the main things to worry about. You disregarded the whole discussion on not blowing out the dress)right), but keeping the tux from going all black (left). Exposure really isn't on that list, except maybe fitting into lighting. ...so what about the times that lighting won't handle the situation or isn't permitted? Are you familiar enough with how shutter speed, aperture and ISO interact to judge a situation and slam together a setting in under 5 seconds that will give you a good exposure?

As far as your trying something new comment goes; I completely appreciate your attitude. That sort of thinking is great and I completely respect your being adventurous. Just keep in mind that you won't get a second go at this. This is a do or die type of adventure :) Lets see some pics!

Oh, and I think there could be many photographers who would take great offense at your calling PhotoJournalism, "slap-dash" photography. You might want to re-think that one.

[smittymike19]

you need to take some practice shots and show us so we can help. taking your advice i am going base jumping today, now i never did it before but im just gonna get a parachute and jump off a building...ill let you know how i make out. lol

[dsze]

=taking your advice i am going base jumping today, now i never did it before but im just gonna get a parachute and jump off a building...ill let you know how i make out. lol

:D .....hilarious! Way to be adventurous! Excellent comparison, smittymike.

[JohnnyG]

My advice is hire a professional. I've done a lot of photography but one area I won't touch is wedding photography. The shots are far too important to mess up and believe me, the bride will not understand why certain shots aren't the best they can be. Hopefully this will be your only wedding so do it right!

[CyberPet]

I just wonder, how is it impossible to find a photographer for less than a 350D plus some good glass? You might look in wrong area. There's some great photographers that takes brilliant images, that doesn't charge an arm and a leg.

[sapearl]

James, Petra really does make a very good point. Earlier in this thread several of us made a number of suggestions for finding a good photographer.

Have you tried those avenues at all, or have you just decided to turn your wedding day into a do-it-yourself project? I don't want to be mean, but after 26 years of marriage to a wonderful lady, IMHO I feel that you're embarking upon this new journey with a bit of a cavalier attitude. Did you take any of our suggestions for finding a photographer?

I just wonder, how is it impossible to find a photographer for less than a 350D plus some good glass? You might look in wrong area. There's some great photographers that takes brilliant images, that doesn't charge an arm and a leg.

[CyberPet]

Especially since just the body with the crappy kitlens cost £599 and you need a flash (cheapest one, 430EX gets you up another £259) and a better lens, at least the Tamron 28-75/2.8 and that's another £279. A total of £1,137 Sterling.... which means that you still have nothing more than a camera, a good lens and a flash, but NO SKILLS.... isn't those £600 woth more than that? You don't just buy the prints from this guy/gal, you buy the knowledge.

[dsze]

Especially since just the body with the crappy kitlens cost £599 and you need a flash (cheapest one, 430EX gets you up another £259) and a better lens, at least the Tamron 28-75/2.8 and that's another £279. A total of £1,137 Sterling.... which means that you still have nothing more than a camera, a good lens and a flash, but NO SKILLS.... isn't those £600 woth more than that? You don't just buy the prints from this guy/gal, you buy the knowledge.


My thoughts exactly. It seems to me that saving money really isn't the objective here. Its obvious that purchasing the appropriate equipment (without skills) is not going to be less expensive than a descent photographer. I think (perhaps incorrectly) that James just wants to be a photographer and wants this camera kit after the wedding for his own sake.... how can we possibly blame him there? :) This guy is thinking...planning ahead for married life! ;) He's securing the camera gear now! ....just kidding James; no doubt everyone here just wants you to end up with wedding prints that you'll be happy with.

[sapearl]

Actually, you may have hit the proverbial nail right on the head, and I think that Click and Clack would agree with me.

I think that James is really a lot smarter than we give him credit for - he's probably always wanted a nice digital camera, in addition to good wedding pix of course. And as us married guys on the forum know, once you tie the knot, somehow all that stuff on the "guys wish list" gets to play second banana to drapes, bedspreads, washing machines, etc. ...... you get the "picture". So he's just covering his bases now before the bank closes. :lol: Now that's what I call photorealism.

I think (perhaps incorrectly) that James just wants to be a photographer and wants this camera kit after the wedding for his own sake.... how can we possibly blame him there? :) This guy is thinking...planning ahead for married life! ;) He's securing the camera gear now! ....just kidding James; no doubt everyone here just wants you to end up with wedding prints that you'll be happy with.

[CyberPet]

LOL, that's true Daniel. Although the marriage might be very short if he's considering getting a camera and do some DIY just to get what he wants.... normally it's the BRIDE who book the wedding photographer. So I'm not sure we've seen the last of James' photo equipment wishes here. ;)

PS, good idea is to register at some good camera shop and hire a photographer for the wedding pictures. Then both the bride and the groom will be happy. :D :D :D

[sapearl]

Petra, I think yours is the best suggestion yet! Each gets what they want and the event is "professionaly" documented.


PS, good idea is to register at some good camera shop and hire a photographer for the wedding pictures. Then both the bride and the groom will be happy. :D :D :D

[lostdoggy]

Here is some better advise. Statistically marriage don't last for ever more like a few years. So buy the camera and enjoy shooting pictures and when you saved enough money for a real wedding spend it on more lenses. And then shoot some more picture. Marriage is over rated. Just imagine the cost of an average wedding will buy some really nice camera equipment. About 2 camera body and most of those L lenses and a bag to put it all in. Meanwhile a wedding will cost you a ton of money and when the divorce rolls around it'll cost you even more money and don't forget the emotional rollercoaster she will put you through. She is always right and you're always wrong. For Pete sake you're only 25, what is your rush???

[MALI]

For Pete sake you're only 25, what is your rush???

He is just trying something new.:) The boy is adventureous; so let him be.

He will soon try getting a divorce 'cuz he took some crappy trial pix at his trial wedding.:)

Sorry to digress. I couldn't resist.

MALI

[jameslincs]

hi, i hope you get these pics

[jameslincs]

its a pic of me and my cat Willow

Kathleen has asked me not to put her on site,
you can see her at www.gym1.co.uk (http://www.gym1.co.uk) if you want

Question, one pic i have Kathleen has a dark coat on, you cant make out the coller, its all black, why is this and what can i do,

also raw uses lots more memory but i cant seem to edit it in photoshop.
but i am still learning. so will prob solve this soon.

see, im not dogging any issue, just taking my time getting things right.

see ya.
ps. wedding is 4 ever :D

[tim]

James, you've use WAY to strong a level of compression, attachments can be up to 100kb on POTN and yours are only 33kB.

You need photoshop CS or CS2 to open RAW files, and the latest version of camera raw from adobe.com

[CyberPet]

Looks like the wedding is going to be a blast ;)

[PIXI_666]

I feel bad that you were called MAD James hahaha, it really was a good idea, but i think because msot of us have done weddings, and i have also just been through my OWN - we know what is a better solution, so your not stupid....i think it was a good idea, but it was great you came here and asked first!

I agree with what people have said, i went through a rough trot finding a photographer for my wedding. I had in my mind "BUT I know what i want - why cant i take the photos haha" im gla di didnt coz i aws stressed enough as it was, posing and having my camera set up would have SUCKED!!

A student that is learning photography is a great idea, they know what they are doing and they need the experience - but look at their work first! Or even a small home business, maybe put an add in your local pape r"Looking for amateur photographer for wedding" you will get a FLOCK of answrrs back trust me!!! If i saw that in my pape rid be there with bells on! The more experienc ei get the better!

So go to a uni or somewhere like that in your area, and ask around, put up flyrers and advertise in a paper etc. these are just SOME idea's that might help you out?

For me, i had a friend of the family who was a photographer once, in the end he cancelled with me becaus ehe had to go to hospital a week before the wedding (He cancelled that week too eeek couldnt be helped!!) So we found a guy who was in a local paper close to us, it was a home business but he was a pro just wanting some xtra cash on the side while he was a stay at home dad.

He was GREAT!!!!!!!!! And a weeks notice - well that just says it all, talk about a life saver haha!

Anywya i really hope you find someone and soon! I am sure it will be fine, and usually the amateur's charge less because they want experience and pics for their portfolio, this way you can both talk abotu what they can offer you, and at least you might have some more input because they are only learning?

Let us know how u go!
Del

[dsze]

hi, i hope you get these pics

James, honestly my 4 year could take these. I'd put money on that. These are just snapshots. There's nothing wrong with them as snapshots (besides the compression you applied), but they are NOT wedding quality, in my opinion. Seriously ask yourself and ask your bride to be, whether or not this is how you want your wedding photos to look. Take a look at some wedding sites and compare what could be, to these types of shots. Are these really what you're going to be happy with in 5 years? But, I did say that if you posted pics I would help. So, here we go:

#1 looks like it has blown highlights on the face, VERY distracting background, very odd composition cutting off half the chest and way too much space over the head and to both sides, white balance is off and skin looks orangy-yellow, and its out of focus.

#2 Focus & composition are better, but why cut off the ears to show so much chest? The exposure and the white balance are slightly better, but still this is an uninteresting photograph to me. The depth of field looks too shallow and the image just doesn't have any 'pop' to it.

You asked about the Black collar. Simple answer is that you've under exposed it. The histogram is all the way to the left (as opposed to all the way to the right on your forehead in the pic above). So, now you can perhaps imagine the difficulty of getting a black tux standing right next to a white dress and keeping both ends of the histogram from clipping.

You also asked about RAW. Yes, it eats up memory quick, but you'd be crazy to shoot jpgs at a wedding IMO, unless you are VERY good. This is why we said that you'll need at least 5GB, probably more like 8GB of memory to do a wedding. Photoshop CS, can open the RAW files and thats where the processing flow begins.

[CyberPet]

Btw, anyone suspecting there's a few legs being pulled here? I'm starting to thing it's a bit of a troll. :D

[JohnnyG]

Btw, anyone suspecting there's a few legs being pulled here? I'm starting to thing it's a bit of a troll. :D

I was definitely thinking the same thing this morning. It seems that all suggestions are ignored yet there are still requests for them!

I think it's a sham!!!

[sapearl]

Like I said earlier, I suspect the "main goal" was to aquire a nice dSLR prior to all the other usual marriage necessities. The notion of learning wedding photography was also a likely consideration, but perhaps not the MAIN goal? :confused: .

And yes, numerous constructive suggestions seem to be ignored. Oh well, it's his funeral, ..... er, I mean wedding. Still, best wishes in spite of the challenges.

Btw, anyone suspecting there's a few legs being pulled here? I'm starting to thing it's a bit of a troll. :D

[madferrit]

Ask all or your guests to take photos for you. Also you can put disposable cameras on all of the tables at the reception, ask your guests to use them & leave them on the table when they go. (If you are having one.)

I've seen the disposable camera idea at a wedding and it worked really well. The fact the camera is there on each table, where as a photographer can't be in all places at the same time. Its a cheap, good way to capture many moments on the day.

[dsze]

Yes, CyberPet, I suspected the same thing long ago, but I tried to stay positive. Maybe I'm too optimistic and I've been had. Fact is, those posted pics are a joke, James. If you're serious about this, you'll have to post something that even slightly resembles a quality portrait. Until then, I think we are all about done trying to 'save' you from yourself.

[jameslincs]

Oh you guys!
as if i would make it up.

anyway i have been following your advice, i have bought books recommended, lens suggested, extra memory etc.. am testing new lighting, trying white and black clothes, learning photoshop (slowly)

the advice about giving up (which is good advice) is not in the plan.
when will you get that? ;)

i am real, here is a pic of my bro Edward and sis Anna.

I took these pics as a b-day gift to our mum, (extra gift)
:D
(ps. she liked them!)

how can i make them better?
what is a histogram? how do you read one?

[jameslincs]

Oh and by the way, all my friends seem to be getting maried too, and having kids to and many want photos doing, today i took a pic of my grandad for my dad,

oh and cyberpet, you are wise, so far camera cost aprox £1400
but much more fun than getting in professional! LOL

[dsze]

What is a histogram and how do you read one? ....and this wedding is when?

Ok, these look better, slightly. Still not what I'd want my wedding photos to look like. They have a yellow tint, background is distracting, smiles are forced and unnatural, focus and exposure look better, why are they in landscape orientation?

[tim]

I have to agree with dsze, the earlier photos were bad, and the latest are not much better, nowhere near acceptable. The things that I immediately pick out as bad:
- The corner of the room is on an angle.
- The yellow background is terrible.
- The pictures aren't properly in focus (hard to judge on small photos but the 2nd especially is OOF.
- The colored cushion in the first is distracting.
- The blue sofa is distracting.
- The smiles are forced.
- There's horrible shadows under their chins from the direct, undiffused flash.
- 10 seconds in photoshop would get rid of marks on their faces.
- The guys clothes aren't arranged well.
- They shouldn't be sitting back as it's not flattering
- The light on the wall is brighter on the right than the left

James, I wouldn't let anyone see these photos if I took them, let alone give them away as gifts. I don't mean to get you down with this post, just to point out the huge number of difficulties and issue you need to think about to get a picture that's anywhere approaching professional standards.

[dsze]

...agreed with Tim. You have many issues to work out with just a single subject seated in what appears to be a relatively controlled environment. This is NOT the case at weddings. Most of the control is out of your hands and you have to be able to make settings and shoot in an instant. But, I'm done trying to talk you out of this. You are not one of my students who needs constant repition. You're a big boy and you can make your own big decisions.... So, do this James. Do this and post your progress along the way and especially....post the results. Maybe you'll be the next great wedding photog and we will all look like fools for doubting you. ...on the other hand, ;)

[CyberPet]

James, but you're still not shooting your own wedding, right? So you need someone else to pull the trigger? What's the use of you playing around if you're not taking the images???

This just baffels me... I know you want the camera and all the toys, but you *really* think it'll look great ON YOUR WEDDING DAY??

[dsze]

Let him do it Petra! I really am getting excited about seeing the images from this wedding!

[kawter2]

Let him do it Petra! I really am getting excited about seeing the images from this wedding!


What is the worst thing that can happen,. It could turn out like some of the images I have seen from prodomonant POTN wedding photographers


BTW why be an ass about it???

(edited to remove image)

[dsze]

Excuse me? We have been trying for 5 pages to talk this guy out of it. Have you not read the previous 5 pages? Perhaps you don't like that image of mine, and it's not my favorite, but their reflection in that piano was very important to them and I've sold several copies of that image. So, why are you feeling the need to jump into this thread and be an a** about it?

[kawter2]

whoa did i hit a nerve daniel?

[dsze]

Yes. I wouldn't hotlink to your images without permission. Thats the nerve you hit. How about I do a search for an image of yours that I don't particularly care for and ridicule it in a hi-jacked thread... cool?

[kawter2]

Image un hotlinked

My point daniel is you guys are being an ass to a dude that has $0 FOR HIS OWN FREAKING WEDDING TRYING TO FIGURE A WAY TO PRESERVE HIS OWN MEMORIES..

The guy has shown examples of decent exposure, and would just like some tips on how not to screw his OWN day up.. You guys ridicule him and ridicule him for 5 pages

YET

you have the nerve to ridicule him for wanting to take pics of his wedding or have a friend take a pic of his wedding, when you SELL images like the one I posted above..



Moral of the story., don't throw stones in glass houses


.

[tim]

kawter that's not on at all. You seem to be constantly grumpy and offening many people, if you don't have anything positive to say I suggest you take a break from posting until you do. I like dsze's image even though it's not perfect.

[kawter2]

positive and productive are 2 diferent things.. Im not blowing smoke up your or anyone elses rear..

As i said before

It isn't an off day.. it is the message we are sending in this wedding forum, and as a "Wedding Photographer" it disturbs me.

The "Wedding Industry" is being inundated with people that go and get a digital rebel and now they are Wedding Photographers.. I think this forum is contributing to that side more than it is contributing to the "art", "respect" and "professionalism" and advancement of Wedding Photography..




By that rationale I don't like the double standard that exists here.. you as well as many other members can become experts after 3-5 weddings w/ mediocre results... Then have the nerve to advise people as the house Wedding Pros..

THEN ON TOP OF THAT BAG ON THIS GUY FOR TRYING TO FIGURE OUT A WAY TO GET SOME DECENT SNAPSHOTS AT HIS OWN WEDDING???






.

[dsze]

NO, its far from perfect. I'm the first to admit that. But, it is what the clients wanted and I delivered and its paid for a new CF card. ;) ...and I believe the thread I posted that in was open to critique and helpful advice to improve. So, you went there and picked out your least favorite image and decided you'd hi-jack a thread in order to ridicule someone else image from an unrelated thread??? I'm not understanding that Eric. are all of your images considered perfection? Do you still make money from the ones that aren't great? Who are you exactly to criticize me for selling that print?

As for your comment about helping James save some money; you can't be serious? Are you telling me that he can't find a photog. to shoot his wedding for less that he'd pay for gear????? Surely, you know better than that.

[CyberPet]

If it was snapshots on his own wedding I wouldn't care so much, but this is apparently going to be *the* photo's from the wedding. Honestly, you're better off doing a competition - "bring your camera, take all the pictures and win a toaster!"

Oh, and just out of curiosity, when are you becoming a pro, after x amount of years? x amount of schooling? x amouht of shoots?

I for one has never claimed to be a pro, I don't live on weddings... but I do it because I like taking photo's and I hope I'm good enough to give the B/G a good end result. If they aren't happy, then I should stop.

[kawter2]

If it was snapshots on his own wedding I wouldn't care so much, but this is apparently going to be *the* photo's from the wedding. Honestly, you're better off doing a competition - "bring your camera, take all the pictures and win a toaster!"

Oh, and just out of curiosity, when are you becoming a pro, after x amount of years? x amount of schooling? x amouht of shoots?

I for one has never claimed to be a pro, I don't live on weddings... but I do it because I like taking photo's and I hope I'm good enough to give the B/G a good end result. If they aren't happy, then I should stop.


IT IS HIS OWWWWWNNN WEDDING!!!!

he isn't foooling ANYONE!


The only problem with an amature doing *the* photo's from the wedding,is that they are/might be expecting something diferent and you have the possibility to ruin that day...

BUT THIS IS HIS OWN WEDDING..


did i mention it is his own wedding?

[dsze]

No, Eric I am not the world's greatest photographer and will probably still struggle with weddings for many to come. But I love doing it, my clients leave very happy and I make a little pocket change on the side. So, when exactly will I be qualified to post in a wedding forum and give advice?

[cameron]

So, when exactly will I be qualified to post in a wedding forum and give advice?

My answer - when your images speak louder than your advice. ;)

[CyberPet]

SNAPSHOTS IS THE KEY WORD, if it was just him wanting to take SNAPSHOTS on his own wedding fine, but having a PRO PHOTOGRAPHER taking the official images it's another story... geesh man, you need to have some pepto bismol!!

If you are a pro, and you seem to claim you are, you sure aren't helping much at all by being rude to everyone. If you think this isn't the forum for you, go and become a member at http://digitalweddingchat.com/ and you don't have to deal with people like us. Well... almost.

[tim]

Kawter, everyone knows it's his own wedding and we've been trying to persuade him not to for at least a week, but since he's determined the least we can do is help him improve. The photos will still be poor, but better than they would've otherwise been.

I don't claim to be a professional, a great photographer, or to know all that much, but I do share what i've learned to help other people considering doing wedding photography. People like the photos I take enough to pay me reasonably well to take them, so I keep taking them, it's that simple.

[tim]

cameron, kawter, would you like to post links to your websites so we can see what you do?

[kawter2]

If you are a pro, and you seem to claim you are, you sure aren't helping much at all by being rude to everyone. If you think this isn't the forum for you, go and become a member at http://digitalweddingchat.com/ and you don't have to deal with people like us. Well... almost.


im a member of DWF and didn't even know this forum existed until about 3 days ago (not POTN, the wedding forum that is)


and to be honest it made me ill at the direction it was going


.
Trust me I'm just as pissed with people playing photographer role too, but I just couldn't understand how the same people that are getting mediocre results would spend 5 pages of bashing this guy for something regarding his own day..

.

[CyberDyneSystems]

I think it may be time for some of you to take a break from this thread.

Maybe not return,. or at least cool off before attempting to post more.

Everyone has good valid points here,. but if people don't agree with others,. than forcing the issue further never seems help.

I hope all involved can simply walk away rather than allow themselves to be drawn in further.

[dsze]

Petra & Tim... thanks, but I take full responsibility for the image Eric linked to. I shot it and processed it. Maybe it sucks. Maybe I shouldn't have ever posted it here in the first place...I wasn't considering the fact that I could only post my best images when I posted it. I think the best thing to do with this thread now is to just walk away. James knows what he's doing and he's going to do it regardless. Eric is a great photographer and has many outstanding images posted here. I've seen his website and he's a stand-up photographer. He's just a little edgy for some reason... Maybe lets just move on to a new thread and let Eric be the true pro that he is, and coach James to perfection in exactly how he should train his friend to shoot his wedding by April.

[CyberPet]

kawter2, so what are you called on DWC? I don't recall reading this type of behaviour there.

[kawter2]

kawter2, so what are you called on DWC? I don't recall reading this type of behaviour there.


It is DWF and my name is kawter


http://digitalweddingforum.com

[dsze]

DWF & DWC are two different forums & its predominant. ;)

[sapearl]

Whoah, whoah..... too much stress here guys. This is supposed to be an enjoyable forum where we pass along knowledge, give shooting tips, share experiences like...... you want to know what real stress is?

True story: Real stress is when the bride wants shots with her mom, dad, and mom's "former" best friend. I say former, because said best friend slept with dad, which resulted in one very messy divorce. Then former best friend married dad, and decided to come for wedding pictures.

Of course all parties are in the same room at the church at the same time, with yours truly playing referee. Bride still wants shots of all individuals; mom threatens to burn all photos with other woman and does not want to cooperate. Mom is about 2" from my face - I can actually feel the heat radiating from her eyeballs. (Does Photoshop have a 9 inch paint roller for REALLY red eye reduction?) I point out to mom that she cannot burn the photos until I take the photos, and that she can do anything she wants with them, if it's ok with her daughter, AFTER I receive my check. I stood my ground, acted bored with the whole thing, and she finally cooled down.

Dad was smart and just stood there with eyes wide open and mouth shut tight... a much smarter move than what he used on his wife's best friend.:o

Moral of the story: we don't have to unnecessarily stress ourselves here; it will come looking for us on the wedding day, when we least expect it, in the most bizarre forms. But we're tough, and we can handle it, because WE ARE WEDDING PHOTOGRAPHERS!!:wink:

I think it may be time for some of you to take a break from this thread.

Maybe not return,. or at least cool off before attempting to post more.

Everyone has good valid points here,. but if people don't agree with others,. than forcing the issue further never seems help.

I hope all involved can simply walk away rather than allow themselves to be drawn in further.

[Sean Joyce]

Buying a camera doesn't make someone a good photographer - even the best camera can be used to take really average to bad pics, in the wrong hands (and likewise, a bad camera can capture some good stuff in the right hands). Shooting a wedding is something that should be done by someone whose knowledge and ability of photography transcends the camera alone - you need a 'light artist' who has a flare for emotion. Pay the 600 pounds, or brace yourself for some pretty average snapshots.

Sean Joyce

[kawter2]

ok this was posted in the wrong thread


**mesage removed**

[PIXI_666]

So, has there been a resolution to this thread?
James, how are things going? What is your "Friend" is he/she part of the wedding at all, and how much experience do they have at the moment? Have you seen any of their photo's?

I think maybe, if your really determined to get your mate to do the photo's for your wedding, you should really be giving him/her the equipment to start practicing with.

I really hope this works out for you...there is SO much to elarn about photography, and you only have until April to learn it all - i would be very stressed out! It has taken me a SERIOUS 5 years (I can't exactly count my days of high school serious - i was too busy drinking LOL but still enjoyed photography) to get where i am today, and that is a few weddins under my belt, a lot of community work, and i am still learning SO SO SO much about photography.

Let us know how your going thoguh - we all do care...:)

Del

[jameslincs]

hello again, no need to fight.

while the critisem is harsh its good.
i take what you say,

i went today to the venue to scout good backgrounds,

i will try to improve (lots)

Will is my mate, he is learning too, we are learning togther at same speed.

also a good point is that you guys are experts, the pics look good to normal people. but i take your point and they could be better.

i see the Histogram is the graph thing but what does it mean?

ps. the loud background stuff can be croped out etc in photoshop,

i can resize pic and make B and W (Wow!)

Cheers

[sapearl]

Naw, we're not really fighting - just getting to know each other better on the playground ;) .

The short answer for Histogram: it depicts the tonal range of an image. It should have a good distribution of light and dark values, from left to right across the graph. The left side of the graph represents shadows, midtones are in the middle and highlights are on the right.

DPReview has some links to a good explanation and I believe there are some excellent posts on this site - just can't recall exactly where they are; do a search.

And yes, you can certainly crop out the loud "background stuff" in photoshop, but the better the image you capture up front with your camera, the fewer things you have to FIX later on. Nothing, and I mean NOTHING, not photoshop, paintshop pro or any of the other graphics packages will replace GOOD SOLID well composed, well exposed photographic images done properly, in the first place. Why make more work for yourself? Think about your shots BEFORE making those shots. Your brain is the best viewfinder you have.

And that's been my main gripe as I migrate from the analog to digital world of photography myself. So many people do not truly appreciate what really goes into a well crafted image. I include myself in this category when I took my first pictures back in the '60's (remember that group called the Beatles?). Everything is so quick, easy and cheap (no film purchasing/processing cost) with digital that many take the attitude that Photoshop is the do-all, cure-all fix-all, for a lack of technique or knowledge in snapping the picture. It is a pleasure to see the enthusiasm of those - like James - embracing the excitement of trying something new. But there is no easy quick fix for a lack of knowledge and experience.

hello again, no need to fight.

while the critisem is harsh its good.
i take what you say,


i see the Histogram is the graph thing but what does it mean?

ps. the loud background stuff can be croped out etc in photoshop,

i can resize pic and make B and W (Wow!)

Cheers

[kawter2]

think of a histogram as a graphic equalizer on a stereo

if there is a LOT of highs on the audio, the 5k might have a lot of lights lit up. those lights light up in relation to the decibels/volume/loudness of a certain freq, and they are represented on the eq with lights



same thing for a histogram.. it is a graphic equalizer for an image, the left is darks and the right is lights.. the higher the mountain the "more" predominant that specific tonal range is

[CyberPet]

I just wonder if you are going to take the shots or your friend, and if so, why isn't your friend playing with the camera, but you?

[sapearl]

Likely his poor "friend" has not had a chance to try out the new camera since James is enjoying it so much :lol: .

I just wonder if you are going to take the shots or your friend, and if so, why isn't your friend playing with the camera, but you?

[RobKirkwood]

Hi James & Kathleen,
I've only just seen these messages, so forgive me for not chiming in before now.

This is an important day for you both - and you really need to be enjoying it, rather than rushing around doing and organising other stuff!

Now... my wife and I are considering branching into wedding photography, and we're based in Gedling, Nottingham. We have need of building a portfolio, so maybe there's something we can do that would benefit all of us?

If you want to follow this up, send me a Private Message via the forum and we can discuss.

Best wishes,
Rob

[sapearl]

Sounds like opportunity is knocking, James. Check it out.... maybe this is one of those things that was meant to be? Could be a win/win situation for all involved.

Hi James & Kathleen,

Now... my wife and I are considering branching into wedding photography, and we're based in Gedling, Nottingham. We have need of building a portfolio, so maybe there's something we can do that would benefit all of us?

If you want to follow this up, send me a Private Message via the forum and we can discuss.

Best wishes,
Rob

[jameslincs]

hi again,

Will is using camers too,

check these out
one pic is a group (taken by Will as i am in the shot)
and a pic of Sarah (another sis)

taken in busy London Starbucks with no tripod or flash.
(i know not a wedding but still tough conditions)

i put it in B&W as i thought it looked cool.

Thanks for great offer Rob, i will let you know asap.

Thank you for advice on Histogram
I knew you lot were really all great

im trying to get exposure right at mo (taking pics of black and white coats for defination)

loads a fun!!!!!!!!!!!

:D

[tim]

James, you have to learn to use fill flash. The shadows on that first pictures are terrible, unacceptable. It's also not very sharp. The second picture is ok :)

[CyberPet]

In case James missed this post... a great offer!!!

Good Kharma Rob!



Hi James & Kathleen,
I've only just seen these messages, so forgive me for not chiming in before now.

This is an important day for you both - and you really need to be enjoying it, rather than rushing around doing and organising other stuff!

Now... my wife and I are considering branching into wedding photography, and we're based in Gedling, Nottingham. We have need of building a portfolio, so maybe there's something we can do that would benefit all of us?

If you want to follow this up, send me a Private Message via the forum and we can discuss.

Best wishes,
Rob

[jameslincs]

hi
once again Tim comes through with the info i'm looking for.
Thanks Tim.
Thanks also to Kawter2
i think you sticking up for me, thats nice, thank you.

i havent seen the photo you were talking about but i know anyone can take a bad picture, even the pros, its the good shots that are tough.

Sapearl, you do make me think.
after much sole searching maybe your right, did i buy this camera as a reaction to the wedding, and why would i do that.
When i look at Kathleen i know im in love, things are great, and no matter how short lived people tell me it is, i feel great, I hope she never changes!

But..
What if your right, what if she looks at me thinking "soon we will be married, then i can change him"

Will i loose my freedom or gain support to be even more free?

Cyberpet, You have really creative ideas, you should work in advertising or something.
can you think of any creative ideas that Will can use on the wedding day with the camera, poses, good shots, etc..
not ideas that include a pro or dispoasble cameras, or giving a toaster away to the guests or any other way around what we are trying to do. (even thought i respect and like your thoughts)

A Whlie ago Kat and I went on a holiday, not planed, we just went, got in car and drove, ended up at a port, and took ferry to france (6am) drove, had snales in paris, kept going until benedorm (spain), we slept in car, B&B's etc, had fun!

Yes people said book with Thompson Travel, that were mad etc, but its not life and death, (just Life)

Question: if we take bad photos will we really DIE?
(wait, dont answer that. LOL)

Finally, We know that we are just playing, William and i wont ever be professionals, you have nothing to fear, I guess we are basically faking it.

When i learnt to drive, all the Taxi owners were still in business.

Its your skill, timing, experience, calmness, people skills, etc that make you lot great.
your willingness to help is heart warming

I have contacted Rob about coming to the Wedding, Phil v also offered help, if we can work something out thats great. i just want to be careful that no one is also faking it, as it may offend guests, and small children will be there, whoes photos cant be put online. (you all know how over protective parents are these days)

Cheers James

[Maureen Souza]

James there is an old saying, my hubby likes to quote: "You can't eat a whole elephant in one meal".

Take Rob up on his generous offer and be thankful he extended it. I don't think he is out to do anything more than help you out and work on his personal portfolio as well. You will both benefit.

[InspiredGraphix]

Question: if we take bad photos will we really DIE?
(wait, dont answer that. LOL)

Finally, We know that we are just playing, William and i wont ever be professionals, you have nothing to fear, I guess we are basically faking it.

When i learnt to drive, all the Taxi owners were still in business.

Its your skill, timing, experience, calmness, people skills, etc that make you lot great.
your willingness to help is heart warming


Cheers James

This has to be the best post in this entire thread. Wether this guy is going to be happy with the results or not i am not sure, and if his Wife will bring it up in every fight they have - probably. But one thing is for certain, he knows exactly what he is doing (literally, not photographically).

There have apparently been two extremely generous offers from fellow POTN members, and I congratulate Rob and Phil V for being such great people. If it wasn't so cold over there i might have considered offering myself.

James, I do hope that you will take Rob and Phil V, or at least one of them, up on their offer, as I am sure you will be pleased that you did. I would like to congratulate you on your enthusiasm and willingness to learn, and think that your friend should still play an integral role in your wedding - even if it is not as the primary or even secondary photographer.

Congratulations to you and your soon to be wife, and i wish you a very happy life together. Enjoy your digital camera and capture many happy memories that will live on forever.

Rob

[carl1645]

James, Give Richard Lake from Mansfield a call, you'll find him on the web, I think he trades as Simplicity photos. He is a pro and does packages as far as I am aware in your price range, quite nice ones to. Tell him Carl from Class 1 has sent you.

[Phil V]

James
You really need to make a decision, you don't want both Rob and me there (both with our wives). I sent you some low res samples you never got back in touch.

[RobKirkwood]

James
You really need to make a decision, you don't want both Rob and me there (both with our wives). I sent you some low res samples you never got back in touch.
You've met my wife then :lol: (I am so dead if she reads this!)

I've only just read through all the messages in this thread, and didn't realise you'd already made an offer - I owe you an apology for seeming to trample all over that.

I agree about decision ...I'm certainly not interested in being part of some huge wedding shoot-a-thon.

[CyberPet]

James, I don't feel you take this serious. But that's your battle to fight. I only know, as a female, how important the wedding was for me and how important it was that *everything* was right. And I wasn't even close to any of the Bridezillas you see. But I love photography so to me it was important that my wedding pictures came out perfect.

I don't know what your future wife say about this endevour, but I hope she supports you and understands that you did turn down a great offer from Rob and Phil.

As for ideas for posing and such, I think your buddy, who's apprently going to shoot this wedding has signed up on this forum, to learn. You know what they say about "hearsay" it starts with one word and ends up with another... and if we relay help and ideas for *you* it doesn't help *him* much, unless he's on top of things.

Good luck!

[Phil V]

hi
I have contacted Rob about coming to the Wedding, Phil v also offered help, if we can work something out thats great. i just want to be careful that no one is also faking it, as it may offend guests, and small children will be there, whoes photos cant be put online. (you all know how over protective parents are these days)

Cheers James
James
It appears that either Rob or myself would be happy to help you out.
Unfortunately there's no-one that can write a sentence or two that'll give your friend inspiration, or a couple of dozen poses, or some inspirational ideas.

Every wedding is different, has it's own issues and it's own magic. I'm not about to suggest that only a pro with 20 years experience can capture this - however when you're familiar with all the technical stuff (exposure, focus, composition, balancing flash) and you can manage all the soft skills, then it means that you only have to concentrate on capturing the magic of THIS particular wedding.

With all due respect, if all of those things aren't automatic, then you end up with a bunch of photo's of people. From feedback from genuine paying customers I know that I'm capable of capturing the magic rather than just providing a record of who was there.
Best mans speech 55735

55736watching the best man

[tim]

Looks like you have two people willing to help you out with your wedding now James, both very generous offers. You might even end up with two sets of two photographers! I'd say you'd be lucky to have either or both of them :)

[simatbirch]

This guy's a wind up merchant!

[jameslincs]

Out of Phill and Rob

We perfer Rob
(sorry Phill, Thanks for help)

He is closer etc..

[CyberPet]

Is that a confirmed booking? CONGRATULATIONS!!!! :D

[kawter2]

SWEET..


NOW LOCK THIS THREAD!@!!

[sapearl]

No, too soon..... not until after we see pix of the handsome groom and stunning bride in all their finery. Of course, that means we have to wait until April.

SWEET..


NOW LOCK THIS THREAD!@!!

[kawter2]

that is for a diferent thread

[sapearl]

We can name that one: "When the Honeymoon is Over."

that is for a diferent thread

[jameslincs]

sure,
i'm happy to post pics taken by Will
but its upto Rob if he wants to post any of his,
no one wants extra pressure impressing you lot.

A big Thank you to all from me and Kathleen

consider this thred locked

until April, when we meet again!

[PIXI_666]

Great to see someone offering their assistance, and liek u said it's a win/win situation, you get the experience and James & Kathleen don't have to stress over the photo's so much on the day!

James, as much as the photo's you are posting are OK, the only problem is, they are so candid. Group shots need to be thought out and positioned properly - instead of standing and smiling, other things need to be tried out.

If your still wanting to do the photo's with your friend - check out some wedding photographer sites.

I think the offer the other guy gave you is a bloody good one tho so id be going for it!!
Del

[PIXI_666]

OK i obviously didnt read this enough hahaha
Looks like its sorted :) hooray!

Del

[ephereal]

you guys are one lucky couple!

all the best on your day :)

[RobKirkwood]

OK, I promised myself I wasn't going to post anymore to this thread - but I sense there are many questions unanswered, so I'll give you some bullet points and you can fill in some of the blanks...

My wife Ann and I are meeting up with James and Kathleen in a week or so's time at the venue to discuss everything.

We own and run "Visible Form" which is a proper VAT registered UK business - this has been my full-time employment for many years. Originally set up to produce multimedia, over the past couple of years we've primarily been shooting images and video for use in other companies' business-to-business multimedia and training packages ...and in recognition of this we decided to re-focus (haha) on photography.

I took my first photograph some 45 years ago on a naff plastic camera thing that had no lens in the viewfinder - I was hooked!

Buying Canon digital kit in 2005 was a revelation - and I would never have even considered doing weddings before.

Ann took early retirement from teaching last summer. We've been talking about the pair of us branching into doing weddings since September - but the biggest problem is always how do you get the work when you've got no previous work to show? We could go on a course, we could hire models, or we could even cajole friends and family ...but so far, we've never pushed ourselves beyond this question.

Yes we do have a portfolio, but it's business and commercial related.

We have also done wedding videos - did so for our daughter a few years back, and will do so again for our son this September ...we can show video, obviously - but it's not the same role as wedding photographer.

So, this seemed like a great opportunity for all of us.

There are other nice things about it too - Ann and I first met in Newark some 31 years ago!

We will post some images, and your comments will, of course, be very welcome.

Thanks,
Rob

[CyberPet]

Rob, I'm so happy for you and Ann. You two will do great. You won't have the stress of being the Bride and Groom at the same time as responsible for the photography, you can only concentrate on the photos, and James and Kathleen can concentrate on their wedding day and having fun! A definately win/win situation for all of you!!

Good luck and I love to see the result in a few months!!! :D

[Phil V]

I'm glad you and Rob have worked something out, good luck on the day - and leave the photography to him.

[scattashot]

I believe it is a bad idea to short change on the photographs for your wedding. In the years to come it will be one of the most obvious memories that you will retain. to reduce the risk of spoilt pictures have a couple shots done on chroma key that you can then interchange the background. At least you will have a few showable shots

[CyberPet]

In the sake of interest, did you book Rob and Ann, James??

[sapearl]

I was of the opinion this was a "done deal" but then again that's an assumption on my part. Did I miss something here?

In the sake of interest, did you book Rob and Ann, James??

[CyberPet]

sapearl, No I understood it as James and his future wife were going to meet with Rob and Ann and then come to some type of agreement. Was just curious to hear from James again, to see if this was sorted or not, or if he's still going to risk his marriage to shoot his own wedding. :D

[exile]

James,

hope your wedding went well and you had a good honeymoon. How did the photographs turn out?

[sapearl]

Yes, we are all eager to hear about the excitement - details! Details! :lol: :lol:

[PIXI_666]

I forgot about this thread...but now i want to see some photo's too hahahaha!

[RobKirkwood]

Only thing I can clear up is that Ann and I did not shoot James & Kathleen's wedding day - we did meet up with them during February, but there was not sufficient common ground for us to go ahead and shoot it.

...and we solved our missing wedding portfolio problem a different way.

Rob

[clengster_77]

me too! i almost forgot this :) james can you show us some pics now?

best regards
cleng

[RinkRat]

I just found this thread, and I am soooooo curious to see how they came out.

Although, I have the feeling he will not be back to post pictures.

[exile]

I'm not sure that James still visits the site. Would an email to ask him how things turned out be appropriate?

[sapearl]

Could very well be the case..... I suppose a diplomatically worded short personal note might not be out of order; perhaps from someone he knows in this forum, or a person with prior contact.

I'm not sure that James still visits the site. Would an email to ask him how things turned out be appropriate?

[Davinor]

So - I'm not the only one that is curious?

David

[sapearl]

James attracted quite a following - many of us are wondering how things turned out, hopefully for the best.

Has anybody sent him a private email?

So - I'm not the only one that is curious?

David

[imager67]

I can understand the motivation to find an affordable solution to documenting your wedding. However, If you want to enjoy one moment of the event forget about the responsibility of photographing the wedding. If your attention is wrapped up in technical mumbo jumbo and stress over the who, how, and what of the photography your wedding day will be a total waste! I've seen it happen more than a few times. Focus on your bride and family, I am sure that there will be more than enough snap shooting going on. Someone there for sure will have a camcorder or something and if not so be it. "Be there now" is the motto for the day. Purchasing a camera that you have never used and expecting not to be totally consumed with the function of the thing is just unrealistic. Take the advice given above and call the schools, the newspaper, or camera stores to see if anyone there is trying to build a portfolio. A newspaper shooter would be my first choice.

[WhatEyeSee]

wow - a lot of energy went into this thread!! This is great - you guys didn't give up you were really concerned for their memories - what dedication!!

I couldn't help but to keep thinking 'TROLL" when I was reading this LONG forum. Maybe not since they met up w/Rob & Ann.

Maybe James and Kat are still honeymooning...and havn't had the time or energy to post. I too got sucked into this thread and now wish to see some pics.

[jameslincs]

sent to sapearl on 21 -4- 06

hi, the wedding went great,
Rob dropped out, he decided he wanted to be paid after all. we thought it wasent fair on him because if we paid we would have expected more from him than he could give as it would have been his first wedding.
however Will sitll came with my 350 and we got over 400 photos, mostley shot in auto but the results are good. we got about 170 good shots,
everyone is happy with them, inc Kathleen
also Kathleen got "bride of the Week" on Lincs FM (local radio station)
and did an interview on air (which she loved)
and Jemma (the local paper photographer)
came too, (for free) and took loads of great shots
we gave her a meal ofcourse and she stayed all day (she got about 300) pics ontop of Wills. but i havent seen them yet as we havent been able to meet up, the ones i saw on her camera on the day looked really good.

all in all we got really lucky, some of the guests said it was the most photographed wedding theve seen.
but i'm glad because its not oftern we get the whole familly together.

i cant remember how to post onto the fourums but if you set one up and send me the link i will post a few of wills shots for you to see.

its nice to hear from you again, hope your well
cheers
James
jimandkat83@hotmail.com
ps. you can ofcourse copy this email into the post if you want to, to let others know what happened. ;0)

[jameslincs]

Hello everyone
i remember now how to post stuff

am a little nervous about it because we like the shots but your critical eye will no doute find errors

all i can say is that the shots are a little rough maybe, but as a memory of the day they are perfect!

i'm a little rough too (as in not yet perfect, not drunk, LOL)

oh wait i have to shrink them to fit, back in a mo... :D

[Davinor]

Hi James
The bottom line is - are YOU happy with them, nothing else really matters

David
PS - Glad you both had a good day

[jameslincs]

yep, were happy!!!
these shots are just a mixture

Will took some shots twice, and a good job too because some came out blured etc, it would have been really easy to have loads of really rubbish shots, and though these arent professional, Will did do really well under the conditions (he's a Butcher by day)

Kats twin Sis, Kat, Me, My Bro Edd

72661

Kat with her dad and my mum and dad (they only meet once before today in the 4 years we have been together)
72662

[jameslincs]

me in a crowd, thats my sister behind me.

72664

Kathleen waiting for the late Taxi, it was cold so she is wareing my jacket (i just froze) ;)
72665

[jameslincs]

the traditional rings shot

72667

us near newark castle (very windy)

72668