Using 580ex With Other Brand Wireless Receivers/Strobes?

[sapearl]

Can I use the wireless MASTER function on my 580ex to transmit a "fire" signal to other brand wireless receivers controlling non-Canon strobes?

In dark reception halls I currently use two Metz strobes in conjunction with a Quantum radio slave and my medium format camera. The Quantum's transmitter unit is connected to the main Metz, which is on the camera. A second Metz unit is across the hall, on a light stand, connected the Quantum receiver unit. When I snap the picture, both strobes fire simultaneously.

Since my Metz's are still very functional I'd like to make use of some of them and the Quantum radio slave (receiver) rather than purchase another Canon flash. But in perusing the 580 instruction manual this looks like a lost cause: Canon doesn't speak Quantum/Metz. I don't see how I can set the Canon wireless to send a signal that will be "understood" by the Quantum receiver. An optical trigger is out of the question - used to use that but got tired of having the guests trigger my flash.

Does Canon make a "receiver" unit that I could plug the remote Metz into? Thanks in advance.

Stu Pearl
Cleveland, Ohio

[Wilt]

Why not plug the Metz into your Canon via the 3000C with 3102 M3 module, then plug the Quantum transmitter into the PC connector, and the second Metz into the Quantum receiver.

Or plug the Metz into the Quantum tranmistter which is then plugged into the PC connector, and the second Metz into the Quantum receiver.

First scenario has benefit of in-finder flash status indication and it also puts camera into flash synch speed.

[sapearl]

Those are good suggestions Wilt and give me something to think about.

I don't own the 3000C with the 3102 M3 module though. But if I did it that way, it sounds like the 580 would be out of the loop, and I don't believe I'd be getting the full ETTL benefit from the Metz. Maybe I'm just not envisioning the whole setup very well....

Why not plug the Metz into your Canon via the 3000C with 3102 M3 module, then plug the Quantum transmitter into the PC connector, and the second Metz into the Quantum receiver.

Or plug the Metz into the Quantum tranmistter which is then plugged into the PC connector, and the second Metz into the Quantum receiver.

First scenario has benefit of in-finder flash status indication and it also puts camera into flash synch speed.

[10102668]

I thought many strobes can be triggered simply by light

[sapearl]

If the strobe as a built-in photoelectric "trigger" another strobe will set it off. Most strobes are not built this way. There are also a lot of aftermarket photoelectric slave switches that can be connected to multiple flashes to trigger them in that manner.

The problem with the above method though is other photographer's flashes. This is really evident at a wedding reception where everyone wants to get shots of the bride and groom with their point and shoots. I don't mind other guests getting pictures except that in no time at all, the batteries of your slave flash would be drained :cry: .

I thought many strobes can be triggered simply by light

[Wilt]

I don't own the 3000C with the 3102 M3 module though. But if I did it that way, it sounds like the 580 would be out of the loop, and I don't believe I'd be getting the full ETTL benefit from the Metz. ...

Right, you're merely reusing both Metz' that you have come to love (same as me!) and not undertaking expense of a new flash unit, and you're using them with the Canon leaving flash in Auto mode (where Metz is so well respected to deliver ACCURATE and CONSISTENT flash exposure in Auto!) 3000C and 3102 is a small fraction of the cost of buying a 580EX!

The alternative, with a 580EX in the configuration (get rid of Metz, 3000C, 3102), still lets you use second Metz on Quantum radio control, and that unit is under Auto control (...no flexibility to alter f/stop on camera without the Auto on remote Metz being at wrong aperture!) On the other hand, the 580EX will introduce you to the world of common complaint about Canon ETTL flash and underexposure, so you will have to learn Canon flash ideosyncracies with the 580EX.

A different alternative is to use Metz 54MZ4 (like me) and have it under ETTL control, but accurate and not needing to use FEC like the Canon flashes. And the 54MZ is compatible with Metz wireless.

[Wilt]

Another alternative...
Use your 580EX under ETTL; plug your Quantum radio transmitter into the PC socket; have both Metz flashes connected to Quantum receivers, with the flashes on Auto; Leave your f/stop fixed to an aperture so that the Metzs give you ratio'd lighting proportional to the 580EX output. Your 580EX light is ETTL controlled to give good exposure (fill light intensity from the camera) while one Metz behaves like off-camera key light (with higher output) and the other Metz behaves like an additional off-camera fill light.

[sapearl]

Wilt, I appreciate you taking the time to try and logic this out for me. And yes, nothing against the Canon strobes (yet) but I have enjoyed using four Metz strobes for more than 20 years - extremely consistent and reliable. It's kind of hard to consider leaving something that's worked so well.

Perhaps it's late and the brain is a litte fuzzy..... I follow your recommendations for setting up the 580 - makes sense below. I understand having both Metzs plugged into the Quantum receiver. Here's where I'm confuzed: plug the Quantum radio transmitter into the PC socket? Where is that?

On my 'blad the PC cord from the transmitter plugs into the PC connection on the lens (no PC connection on the Canon lens). Then the flash cable from the Metz plugs into the transmitter. Is there a PC connection on the Canon somewhere that I'm missing?

Another alternative...
Use your 580EX under ETTL; plug your Quantum radio transmitter into the PC socket; have both Metz flashes connected to Quantum receivers, with the flashes on Auto; Leave your f/stop fixed to an aperture so that the Metzs give you ratio'd lighting proportional to the 580EX output. Your 580EX light is ETTL controlled to give good exposure (fill light intensity from the camera) while one Metz behaves like off-camera key light (with higher output) and the other Metz behaves like an additional off-camera fill light.

[Wilt]

>> Here's where I'm confuzed: plug the Quantum radio transmitter into the PC socket? Where is that?<<

I may have erred in my assumption, that you would have a 20D and not the 300/350 (a.k.a. Rebel) At the left side of the body under the rubber cover is the PC socket. 300/350 have to use hotshoe-to-PC adapter.

[sapearl]

You're a genius Wilt - I should have paid closer attention to the manual (still working through the 179 pages). :oops: I've got the 5D but the PC connection is in the same place you'd indicated on the other models. For some reason I thought that was only for the video and other cables and didn't explore under the rubber covers.

It looks like my problem is solved then. Of course I'm assuming that when the 580ex fires, the camera sends out a simultaneous "fire" command to whatever cable is attached to that PC connection. And THAT cable will be connected to the Quantum transmitter unit. This should work fine - again, many thanks.

Stu Pearl
Cleveland, Ohio

>> Here's where I'm confuzed: plug the Quantum radio transmitter into the PC socket? Where is that?<<

I may have erred in my assumption, that you would have a 20D and not the 300/350 (a.k.a. Rebel) At the left side of the body under the rubber cover is the PC socket. 300/350 have to use hotshoe-to-PC adapter.

[Wilt]

My pleasure being able to help. I enjoy the challenge of "how do I get this mess to do THAT?!?!" especially when it was not designed to do that!

I use my Metz 45 on TTL control of my Bronica ETRSi. It was designed for flash automation, but I figured out how to use the metering prism on Auto for ambient light, and have the TTL control of the flash output so that the flash is a user-set ratio'd synchro-sun fill light used with AE exposure with the metering prism. Fully auto everthing with a medium format camera.
Then, like you, flash on light stand under radio control, outputting thru a softbox under thyristor control (even though the normal flash sensor's line of vision is impeded by the softbox), and having that all under Auto control for ratio'd dual lighted flash at the reception even on the dance floor.