Do I charge?

[rammy]

Hi,

Reposted from "Talk about..." :

My company wants to use some of my images in their product brochure but I don't really know where to start with regards to costs, releases etc. This could be my first sale :D and I don't want to be over zealous as I may get more work.

Can you help with how much I should charge per image (GBP - there will be 5 in total) and what releases I need, and they need to, sign. Because these are building and cityscape shots, do I need property releases?

Some numbers: They will make a few hundred brochures and none of the images will cover a full page, they will be reduced to fill "gutter spaces" around the text. I have PP'd all of them so some time to charge there?

EDIT: I've read some threads and people seem to suggest I do it for the credit. The Marketing Manager (my job is Senior Developer - Software) likes my hobby images and asked to me to do shots of the city. Chairman also likes them and mentioned payment but I'm not sure what I should charge, if at all? Should I just ask for a credit at the end of the brochure?

I have also done poster sized prints, but that was for friends and haven't charged them anything, not even printing costs. My company would also like poster prints of other images to hang around the office, I guess I could charge printing and framing costs for that and a nominal charge for the post processing time?

Thanks for any guidance, two samples included.

[harryb49]

Some pros would tell you to consider the cost of your equipment, your time, the number of times the pictures will be used, how large an audience, etc.

I would suggest that you NOT just ask for credit. You have purchased your equipment, developed your skill, and obviously have some images that they need. Perhaps you can ask what they have paid for images like that in the past and adjust for your level of experience.

If there is no previous purchases then I'd suggest you negotiate with them on a friendly, personal level and see if they have a price range in mind then set your prices within that range.

[rammy]

Hi Harry, thanks for the advice.

From what I gather then, I should charge something for the use of my equipment and printing costs. The thing is I don't consider myself a Pro and so what experience do I have to bring? This would be the first time I do something "commercial", all my stuff so far has been for family, friends and work colleagues.

The company purchases stock CD's and have a design agency that does their PR stuff. Neither the company nor the design agency had the images they were looking for so Marketing Manager, who I am friendly with and has seen my gallery, asked me to do a shoot.

If I was to ask for some kind of a payment, it would have to go through my PAYE scheme at work as I do not have my own company. Tax wise, would I still be paying the higher bracket on any "bonus" they pay me? If I had company of my own, would I be able to pay lower tax on my own company account?

Also, property releases, when do you need to get the building owner to sign a release? When image is taken on their property or when the image is to be used in a publication?

Thanks,
Ram

[harryb49]

I don't know the laws in England and therefore am not a good resource for you in that arena.

You state that you have only done photos for your family, yet your examples of the architechure show a good "eye" for lines, composition, etc. That is what you bring as your personal value.

Their past practice will help you in setting a price for your work. Find out the average amount they pay for stock photos. In essense you seem to be indicating that this has been their normal method of acquiring the photos they need. Since that resource does not have what they need, and you do, then you are replacing that supply source for them. Doesn't it seem logical to charge something akin to what they have paid in the past for similar work?

Again, I don't know anything about the laws in England-- but it may depend on how your company pays you. In other words, if they add it to your normal pay then your taxes will be taken out at your current rate, and if they pay you for it as a "contractor" your laws may require that you declare it and pay the appropriate percentage.

For my own work I have obtained the appropriate licenses, IRS identification, etc which allows me to deduct for the equipment I buy, the miles I drive to do a job, etc. In the first years this more than offset my income and I actually paid less income tax. In more recent years I have made a profit on my business and still kept the amount lower by lawfully deducting appropriate expenses from my business. But, again, this may NOT be applicable in England.

Property releases, in the U.S., are required if you will be using the image of the property for any commercial endeavor. It doesn't matter what perspective you use nor where your feet were located when the photo was taken. The issue here is that you are taking a photo of their building. They may be gracious and allow you to use the image and not pay them anything. Their benefit derives from having the photo of their building used in the product brochure and the expanded attention that derives from many people seeing the building. In essence it is free advertising for them.

There is a website that has a calculator to help price photos. I have never used it.
http://photographersindex.com/price-adv-calc.htm

As always it is your judgement that is the final authority on what price to set.

I hope the sale goes well for you and helps boost your career in photography.

Take care,
Harry

[Bruce Hamilton]

My company wants to use some of my images in their product brochure ... This could be my first sale and I don't want to be over zealous as I may get more work...

Just remember... the quality of your work got you this job, and that same quality will get you more work. Charge the going rate.

[SonyaL]

I am not a pro but I can tell you this those pictures will make that company money off their brochure so if they are making money so should you.


Sonya

[LBaldwin]

Yes, you should charge. The rule of thumb is USAGE. What do they want them for? How many times do they plan to use them and more importantly io tf they are using them for stock make sure that you get everything in writing. No handshakes or nudge nudge wink wink. There are several software programs that could give you an approx price. But to claim your are not a pro but want to get paid that makes you a pro.

Les

[gmen]

For a guide price have a look at:

http://www.londonfreelance.org/feesguide/phpubrat.html

Good luck.

---- Gavin

[PIXI_666]

Rammy
To be honest, if you are using your work's time, it's generally that they are paying you anyway because your using their time. BUT if it's in your own time using your own equipment then im sure charging a nice amount would be OK.
I do this for my work ALL the time, so much that they have added it into my job description, but being Govt they have kindly not even offered me a payrise....typical isn't it?
Del

[PIXI_666]

I also thought i would mention, i take all their photo's they are published and money is made - i get nothing! Half the time not even my name is printed in there....if you get paid for doing these photo's then i applaud you :)

[lakiluno]

I hope your not using your own equipment when you take these photos for work PIXI?

Leo

[rammy]

Thanks very much for guidance, I'm thinking a little more about this now ;)

The main reason I asked intially is because I was only too happy to do the photography and only because some kind of payment was mentioned, that I thought to raise it here for guidance.

Well I have had printed, 12 posters to send to friends in the states (no charge :D )and the Marketing Manager wants to see me next week to discuss payment. I thought I would also discuss poster pricing with them at that time too as they would like quite a few. So, it balances out in the end I guess and I'm happy :-) I'll let you know how it went after the meeting.

Harry, thanks for info, great help!
Bruce, Sonya, lBaldwin thanks and I'll sure think of a good price
Thanks Gavin, the link is useful
PIXI, I work fulltime in a completely different role so don't really use any work time expect "lunch time meetings". I've got my fingers crossed anyway, for me and you also, I'm starting to think that getting something for your time is worthy.

Here are a couple of panoramic posters I have had blowen up and sent to friends in the states. I may have posted one of these on the forum before. I'll go and do St Pauls again as the sky is bland.

[taramcg]

I can see why they are intersted in you. Both images are fantastic and I LOVE that second image. I'm sure you will sell many more.