NEW 5D RUMOUR !!

[I Simonius]

i want it to fly me to the moon.

don't we all?;):p

I just hope that it will have everything that D3 has plus a little more.

I hope Noink keeps up the pressure, in fact I hpe they really pile it on, I wouldn't ever switch but it should give canon the boot up the posterior it needs in 'prosumer' FF camera design - i.e. the 5D mark 2 specifically, (as opposed to the whole DSLR range);)

[I Simonius]

anyone believe they might just offer a 21MP version?

[Yohan Pamudji]

No.

[wernersl]

anyone believe they might just offer a 21MP version?
sure. (assuming the year is now 2011)

[BestVisuals]

Fuji does the dual-pixel arrangment, but forget anyone else using it...they have a firm patent lock on the technology. They're not about to share.

Interestingly, people believe the Fuji 6MP dual-pixel camera is a 12MP camera - it's not! The camera uses one or the other pixel at each location, but not both. The camera may interpolate to a 12MP image, but it's no different than doing it in Photoshop.

Fuji has the system with two different types of sensor pickups..
It works well.

[BestVisuals]

I don't see Canon using a third-party CCD...they're heavily invested in CMOS.

1) D30 was the first "affordable APSC DSLR". The 5D is the first "affordable FF DSLR". Both came out at roughly the same price tag. The D60 was significantly cheaper then the D30. Canon has significantly dropped the price of the 5D. Add the extreme pressure from Nikon and my bet would be that the 5D2 will come out at roughly 2200$.
2)The 5D shared the same sensor production line with the 1D2N. 5D2 will probably share the same production line with the 1D3, thus the same pixel size. I should be around 15MP
3) It MIGHT feature then new VGA Sony LCDs that nikon is using.
4) It will NOT be weather-sealed :(
5) It will have a few more AF points then the 40D and probably a few firmware features enabled compared to the 40D (such as AF microadjustment) and ISO6400

That's as far as logic can take us. Beyond that my crystal ball gets fuzzy.

[wernersl]

agreed, but i believe that reference to sony's vga lcd is just the review screen and NOT the sensor, therefore, who knows what they will do. i doubt that they would use sony's screen, however, i think we will probably see a higher rez and easier to see screen one of these days (crossing fingers). i ultimately dont care about the screen rez...i just want to be able to SEE my histogram on screen when i am outside under bright light. problem is you just cant see that damn screen when there is anything more than a night-light in the room! <--a little exageration on my part :). oh well; enter: hoodman accessories!

[Sprout Crumble]

A full VGA would be nice, especially as the screens are now hitting 3" and pixels are starting to become noticeable.

[wernersl]

yeah...it would. but again...just make it visible during daylight and i would be happy.

[I Simonius]

http://www.warehouseexpress.com/?/photo/digicameras/Canon.html#5d

Not long now folks!;)

[I Simonius]

Suprise announcement at PhotoPlus Expo from October 18 to 20.?

;)

[metalsaber]

We could only hope. I would like a "FIRM" date as to when it is being launched so I can plan accordingly.

[Punisher77]

We could only hope. I would like a "FIRM" date as to when it is being launched so I can plan accordingly.

You'll never get that out of Canon. ;)

[I Simonius]

You'll never get that out of Canon. ;)

oh I don't know - they did announce the 1Dsmk3 ahead of time - also some lenses...so it just might happen...;)

[VTSHEP1]

Suprise announcement at PhotoPlus Expo from October 18 to 20.?

;)

I was at Photoplus, asked a rep about the 5Dmk2, he said, "no time soon" which is no help whatsoever.

[scokar]

I was at Photoplus, asked a rep about the 5Dmk2, he said, "no time soon" which is no help whatsoever.

or: "no time ... soon" :)

[SunTsu]

I was at Photoplus, asked a rep about the 5Dmk2, he said, "no time soon" which is no help whatsoever.

That's interesting. If he's telling the truth, that certainly makes for interesting thought as to why they would hold off on updating it for so long.

[drogos]

because they don't care about You having the most updated equipment for fair price. They have to stick to their marketing strategy....if the sales are satisfying what's the point in itroducing of a new costly line of product .

[I Simonius]

or: "no time ... soon" :)

that's more like it!:D

because they don't care about You having the most updated equipment for fair price. They have to stick to their marketing strategy....if the sales are satisfying what's the point in itroducing of a new costly line of product .


OK it may not be 'soon' (i.e. before Xmas) but the price has dropped so much it has to be in the pipeline

I reckon we are definiteluy on for FEB , maybe they are making refinements to beat any forthcoming Noink offering - which will be good for us!

[metalsaber]

You'll never get that out of Canon. ;)

I realize that. If it was announced, they probably feel sales of the current model would dry up.

I would love to get a 5D, but would rather get the new version that is released.

[Punisher77]

I realize that. If it was announced, they probably feel sales of the current model would dry up.

Yeah, I wonder about that sometimes. Companies like Intel and AMD make their plans for the next year or two quite open. It's like a pre-emptive strike against the other company. I wonder if it would ever come to that with Canon/Nikon.

Nikon announces the D3 so Canon announces the D3 killer which won't be available for 6 months but the announcement alone is enough to hurt Nikon sales.

[fi20100]

Then again, I think it's a pretty good PR that Canon usually have their cameras out in the stores pretty quick after they are announced, while for Nikon there's usually a long delay between announcement and actually having cameras in the store.

[I Simonius]

I realize that. If it was announced, they probably feel sales of the current model would dry up.

I would love to get a 5D, but would rather get the new version that is released.

It'll be a lot more expensive than the 5D is now;)

[metalsaber]

It'll be a lot more expensive than the 5D is now;)

I'm quite sure of that. Though I would wonder how much more expensive.

[Rubi Jane]

I picked up a 5D this week. I sort of forced myself into it when my 20D got severely splashed during an outing. Although I think the 20D will be fine with enough "drying time" I needed a body for a shoot this evening so the lil' devil in me said..."get a 5D" ;)

Now watch them announce the 5DMkII Nov 1st.

[rang]

I just got off the phone with a fellow photog who has struck up a pretty good conversation with a Canon manager. When he broached the subject about a possible next gen 5D coming up in Feb. The animated conversation became a palpable "pregnant pause".

Makes ya wonder...

They probably aren't allowed to utter anything let alone yes or no....hmmm...

[gdl357]

It'll be a lot more expensive than the 5D is now;)


I would spend 1K more for technology of THE PRESENT YEAR...

[I Simonius]

I would spend 1K more for technology of THE PRESENT YEAR...

Me too - can't wait in fact. But it looks like we'll have to - til Feb;)

I just hope they give it more than a bump to 15MP and go for the 18MP!

[EOSAddict]

Me too - can't wait in fact. But it looks like we'll have to - til Feb;)

I just hope they give it more than a bump to 15MP and go for the 18MP!

Dream on ;)

Sealed envelope: 15.8MP

[I Simonius]

Dream on ;)

Sealed envelope: 15.8MP

I think there's TWO envelopes behind thier back, one with 15 and the other with 18 in

It will depend ofn what they percieve Noink to have in the pipeline - and I bet they know ( person on the inside I bet) - problem is - they can't tell us yet!

Actually the reason I want 18 MP is because I want the same definition for landscapes you get form the 30/40D cameras but on FF

The 5D really lets me down in the resolution department for landscapes (at large size)

[drogos]

I think there's TWO envelopes behind thier back, one with 15 and the other with 18 in

It will depend ofn what they percieve Noink to have in the pipeline - and I bet they know ( person on the inside I bet) - problem is - they can't tell us yet!

Actually the reason I want 18 MP is because I want the same definition for landscapes you get form the 30/40D cameras but on FF

The 5D really lets me down in the resolution department for landscapes (at large size)

I, on the other hand would rather keep the same resolution since huge pixel pitch is one of the reasons 5D's IQ is so unique. But than they can decrease the distance between single photo diods (as they did in Mark III) to keep them as big as possible and still squize out 14/15 mpix ...i really hope that will be the case ... little bit more serious body and controls is in my opinion the most important call for 5D.

[AdamJL]

I, on the other hand would rather keep the same resolution since huge pixel pitch is one of the reasons 5D's IQ is so unique. But than they can decrease the distance between single photo diods (as they did in Mark III) to keep them as big as possible and still squize out 14/15 mpix ...i really hope that will be the case ... little bit more serious body and controls is in my opinion the most important call for 5D.

You run for President, you've got my vote. I agree whole-heartedly.
Update the body with decent weather sealing especially.
And an MLU button

[wernersl]

You run for President, you've got my vote. I agree whole-heartedly.
Update the body with decent weather sealing especially.
And an MLU button
but where would that leave the fancy print button? seriously though...im with you and drogos on the resolution issue. weather sealing would be a nice touch.

[datadump]

i'd just be happy with same 12MP, 40D feature set... and as a bonus, get rid of that silly print button and replace it for a "soft' key customizable to whatever.

[I Simonius]

i'd just be happy with same 12MP, 40D feature set... and as a bonus, get rid of that silly print button and replace it for a "soft' key customizable to whatever.

Well you're morew easily pleased than me th:D;):pen!

[Unity Gain]

i'd just be happy with same 12MP, 40D feature set... and as a bonus, get rid of that silly print button and replace it for a "soft' key customizable to whatever.

I totally agree. That would make me really happy too. I really dig the 40d and would love a FF version of it with just a few extra megapixels. NO print button and no pop-up flash

[Meaty0]

I totally agree. That would make me really happy too. I really dig the 40d and would love a FF version of it with just a few extra megapixels. NO print button and no pop-up flash

I think you just described the 5D MkII:D

[NathanJK]

I hope a replacement comes in feb...that might mean a used 5d for me at the beginning of next summer! I'd be most pleased if that was the case :grin:

[I Simonius]

I think you just described the 5D MkII:D

I REALLY hope not - i.e. I would like something worth upgrading to, not just a minor revamp to keep pace with Noink;)

[Meaty0]

I REALLY hope not - i.e. I would like something worth upgrading to, not just a minor revamp to keep pace with Noink;)

Sad to say that I think that's all it's going to be...a minor tinker:evil:

[I Simonius]

Sad to say that I think that's all it's going to be...a minor tinker:evil:

That would be a real shame considering what they could do to the 5Dmk2 sales if they really produced a top specced camera;):cool:

[AdamJL]

I totally agree. That would make me really happy too. I really dig the 40d and would love a FF version of it with just a few extra megapixels. NO print button and no pop-up flash

I'd buy that.. so long as it's got 1-series weather sealing! The UK has a lot of rain.

[wernersl]

I'd buy that.. so long as it's got 1-series weather sealing! The UK has a lot of rain.
so would i. but then again you could always just go get a 1d xx

[gpx4]

Sad to say goodbye to Canon.:)

Sad to say that I think that's all it's going to be...a minor tinker:evil:

[AdamJL]

so would i. but then again you could always just go get a 1d xx

Too big, too heavy :confused: ;)

[wernersl]

start lifting weights!

[I Simonius]

so would i. but then again you could always just go get a 1d xx

Too big, too heavy :confused: ;)

yup

That's the whole point, IDs3 is too big and heavy what the 5D offers is quality without the wheight

[freddyco]

I am thinking that Nikon's recent crushing blow has got Canon redesigning the 5D2 a second time. I personally do not mind Canon's predictable upgrade habits, but I think Nikon did what it had to do by raising the stakes and bringing surprise into the picture. Now it's up to Canon to use it's massive R&D resources to show the same kind of surprise innovation, or they will lose at least some market share in 2008 and 2009.

So I predict 5D2 will cost less than 5D, keep 12.1 megapixel, and add the 40d type features. There is no user value to upping the megapixels, so I hope they get over that and focus on features and some of the 1Ds data transfer innovations.

If Canon actually raises the price, like other recent new models, then 5D should come pretty close to meeting the Nikon D3 features minus weather proofing and the roughly 10 fps performance.

It will be interesting to watch next year. I think it will tell us a lot about the state of innovation at Canon right now. Nikon is our best friend when it comes to getting more exciting new features from Canon!

[I Simonius]

I am thinking that Nikon's recent crushing blow has got Canon redesigning the 5D2 a second time. Nikon is our best friend when it comes to getting more exciting new features from Canon!

I do hope you're right about their redesigning it again but I hope you're wrong about keeping the 12MP

I am(tentatively) optomistic that the wait is due to their needing to clear completely the backlog of 1Dsmk2's so they can release the 5D with an 18MP sensor:cool:

[wernersl]

i highly doubt that the 5d will be an 18mp camera (unless they want to charge over 5k for it). that is a little too close to the dsIII resolution. in fact i would hope that it was NOT that high. im thinking 14mp sounds good with 14 bit digic III. i just dont see the point in re-creating the dsII and calling it a 5ds or 5dII. but instead of beating a dead horse i will keep shooting with my 5d (and still loving it) and see what happens next year. FWIW i wouldnt even consider dumping my 5 regardless of what gets released!

i hear ya about the size weight issue and that is why i would love to see a 3D! but then again i would probably put a grip on it anyway so kind of defeats the purpose! Might as well just get a 1. Oh well.

[I Simonius]

i just dont see the point in re-creating the dsII and calling it a 5ds or 5dII.

I do!
A 1Ds2 without the wheight is exactly what I want!;):D

[I Simonius]

start lifting weights!

It's not muscle but stamina you need, and muscles that are immune to cramping, if you're carrying it out all day walking

[wernersl]

imho if you are already carrying a 4lb (1.8kg) rig (assuming 5d and 70-2004LIS) then whats another 1.4lb (.63kg) (assuming same lens with 1ds2)? plus you can stick a hand strap on the ds2 without much weight addition whereas to add a handstrap to the 5d you need one that will screw into the tripod mount (adds weight) or add a batt grip which negates the weight savings all together. my point? imho again, a 4lb weight hanging from my neck gets more tiring than a 5.4lb rig in my hand secured by a strap. actually i think i am going to get a batt grip for my 5 so that i can be more comfortable with it. dont like the small body of the 5 much. i also dont have little hands so i guess that is why it is uncomfortable for me. again...we shall see what happens next year!

[AdamJL]

imho if you are already carrying a 4lb (1.8kg) rig (assuming 5d and 70-2004LIS) then whats another 1.4lb (.63kg) (assuming same lens with 1ds2)?

Lol, you've not tried carrying the 1Ds II around have you. It's another beast entirely from the 5D.
And for people like me who travel a lot, the 5D is the perfect combo for size/space/performance

[wernersl]

Lol, you've not tried carrying the 1Ds II around have you. It's another beast entirely from the 5D.
And for people like me who travel a lot, the 5D is the perfect combo for size/space/performance
understandable. i have carried a 5/20/30 with grip and it is more comfortable for me than without it. that is why i said it works for ME! anyway...i think we are entering dead horse territory with this one.

[I Simonius]

imho if you are already carrying a 4lb (1.8kg) rig (assuming 5d and 70-2004LIS) then whats another 1.4lb (.63kg)

non monsieur, I use the f4 zoom for the very reasonoif wheight and assure you that those one or two pounds between lenses and cameras soon add up after a days carrying.. especially with a 54 yr old back that has taken a lot of knocks ;)

Put it tis way- if money were no object, then I would still go for an 18MP 5Dmk2 rather than the 1Dsmk2, just because of the wheight even if they were priced that same
(mindyou they'd both have to be weatherproofed;-))

[wernersl]

understood. i guess i would be saying the same thing at that age :)

[ab11bc49]

I am thinking that Nikon's recent crushing blow has got Canon redesigning the 5D2 a second time. I personally do not mind Canon's predictable upgrade habits,

So what are Canon's preditable upgrade habits? And do they normally lower the price of the older models? I am looking to buy my first EOS and do not know if it is better to do it now or closer to the holidays.

[I Simonius]

So what are Canon's preditable upgrade habits? And do they normally lower the price of the older models? I am looking to buy my first EOS and do not know if it is better to do it now or closer to the holidays.

The 5D may go a little lower in price but not much, if you want it now, get it now;)

The next itteration will be at just belowthe price point that that first 5D came in at originally, if other camera upgrades are anything to go by. i.e. it will be about £1000 more than the 5DMk1 is is now.

Part of the reason they're holding out so lomg maybe that they actually haven't got much to upgrade it with. Maybe they were thinking of a small MP increase (15MP) but have had to have a retrhink as that would be pretty unimpressive and are waiting to see how the market pans out with Noinks offering

[wernersl]

the only thing i really feel i am missing from my 5 is the 1 series af. imho thats one area that noink really stole the show, by integrating the 51 point system in the d3 AND d300. that would be my major wish list item for 5d2

[I Simonius]

the only thing i really feel i am missing from my 5 is the 1 series af. imho thats one area that noink really stole the show, by integrating the 51 point system in the d3 AND d300. that would be my major wish list item for 5d2

Now tha's talking!

BMy biggest bugbear with the 5D AF is when using it in portrait orientation for ...portraits,... there is no cross type AF point at the eye level, so it's focus recompose, focus recompose:evil:

[wernersl]

and at large apertures that could mean a throw-away shot

[I Simonius]

and at large apertures that could mean a throw-away shot

frequently! exactly the problem:cry:

[wernersl]

frequently! exactly the problem:cry:
then here here...we agree on a necessity of a new 5d!

[Chandler.]

Do you guys think it's time for something other than the diamond pattern for the AF? I think a grid pattern would be awesome. (Of course, a 1-series AF setup would also be awesome.)

[datadump]

i never understood the diamond pattern AF..... like if u compose your image with "rule of thirds"... the diamond pattern isnt really conducive to this pattern... why not have focus points around the intersections of "rule of thirds" grid? or something....

[wernersl]

actually...the diamond af system puts a focus point in each zone of the ROT. (except the 4 outer corners). Then again...even the 1 series lacks corner coverage as well.

[datadump]

neat... for some reason it doesnt seem like it when i look thru the VF... is that image to scale?

[wernersl]

i took those directly from dpreview site. left is of 5d right is of 1d2

[drogos]

i never understood the diamond pattern AF..... like if u compose your image with "rule of thirds"... the diamond pattern isnt really conducive to this pattern... why not have focus points around the intersections of "rule of thirds" grid? or something....
yeah i would really need only 4 af points ..exactly where You have described ...i don't remember using center point for a long time ...so 4 selectable af points + closest subject covering THE WHOLE frame ...wow !!!! keep on dreaming !!!!

[I Simonius]

then here here...we agree on a necessity of a new 5d!

sure do;)

Do you guys think it's time for something other than the diamond pattern for the AF? I think a grid pattern would be awesome. (Of course, a 1-series AF setup would also be awesome.)

Nope diamond's fine by me, just better quality of them

i never understood the diamond pattern AF..... like if u compose your image with "rule of thirds"... the diamond pattern isnt really conducive to this pattern... why not have focus points around the intersections of "rule of thirds" grid? or something....

it's pretty close

yeah i would really need only 4 af points ..exactly where You have described ...i don't remember using center point for a long time ...so 4 selectable af points + closest subject covering THE WHOLE frame ...wow !!!! keep on dreaming !!!!

5 points for me please, and a cuppa of Chat'noof jupap:D;)

fact is I use centre point 85.333333 % of the time, the only other point I would use is anyone of those four, so the grid's OK for me, but for those slow focussing super fast lenses (85L) I really need them all to be cross-type AF

[freddyco]

So what are Canon's preditable upgrade habits? And do they normally lower the price of the older models? I am looking to buy my first EOS and do not know if it is better to do it now or closer to the holidays.

Lately, the upgrade path is a simple bump of 2 in mp, and the latest features that started with 400d and 1d mkiii. anti-dust feature, digic III, 14-bit conversion. Not stuff that necessarily makes a difference in your final image.

I kind of feel that DSLR quality reached a level 3 years ago where quality is close enough to film. Instead of replacing your DSLR every two years to get all the cutting edge bells and whistles and more megapixels, these days you can take any DSLR produced after around 2004 and keep it for a decade (depending on how much you use it). Chances are, your final images will look similar. Obviously specific professionals will benefit from the endless stream of rather limited new features and gimmicks, but the majority of buyers will not.

regarding the AF on 5D.... maybe, just maybe the only thing that will make me upgrade. Case in point, a birthday party yesterday, picking up the 5D, turn on flash, set to idiot mode, and point and shoot as fast as possible. It focused on the front of the box, not the cutie!

http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w40/freddyco/aIMG_4604.jpg

[metalsaber]

i highly doubt that the 5d will be an 18mp camera (unless they want to charge over 5k for it). that is a little too close to the dsIII resolution. in fact i would hope that it was NOT that high. im thinking 14mp sounds good with 14 bit digic III. i just dont see the point in re-creating the dsII and calling it a 5ds or 5dII. but instead of beating a dead horse i will keep shooting with my 5d (and still loving it) and see what happens next year. FWIW i wouldnt even consider dumping my 5 regardless of what gets released!

i hear ya about the size weight issue and that is why i would love to see a 3D! but then again i would probably put a grip on it anyway so kind of defeats the purpose! Might as well just get a 1. Oh well.



I seriously doubt it will be 18mp. I want something affordable. I do believe it will be more than 12mp. So probably 14 or 16mp.

[Chandler.]

I seriously doubt it will be 18mp. I want something affordable. I do believe it will be more than 12mp. So probably 14 or 16mp.

I don't want to deal with the file sizes that 18MP will produce. I would be happy with just 12MP and weathersealing. No other upgrades.

[Yohan Pamudji]

actually...the diamond af system puts a focus point in each zone of the ROT. (except the 4 outer corners). Then again...even the 1 series lacks corner coverage as well.

The 5D layout you grabbed from DPR doesn't show the actual AF point coverage compared to the viewfinder/image. The sample image above it on that page (http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos5d/page4.asp) shows the proper spread, and as you can see there are no points near the intersections points of the rule of thirds grids. That's why the current diamond layout is terrible on the 5D.

Broken record time again, so bear with me :rolleyes: I just can't help it! All I want is an 11-point layout, with 9 in a rectangular grid where the corner points are at the rule of thirds intersections, and 1 more on either end of the rectangle. Get rid of this diamond junk. 11 points in this layout with all of them cross-type--that's plenty for me and would completely satisfy my desire for a better-than-xxD AF system in the 5D line. Until they put in an even faster and more accurate AF system that is :)

[Yohan Pamudji]

regarding the AF on 5D.... maybe, just maybe the only thing that will make me upgrade. Case in point, a birthday party yesterday, picking up the 5D, turn on flash, set to idiot mode, and point and shoot as fast as possible. It focused on the front of the box, not the cutie!

Sorry freddyco, but that's not the camera's fault.

[wernersl]

I don't want to deal with the file sizes that 18MP will produce. I would be happy with just 12MP and weathersealing. No other upgrades.
not even an af upgrade?

[wernersl]

Sorry freddyco, but that's not the camera's fault.
agreed

[wernersl]

The 5D layout you grabbed from DPR doesn't show the actual AF point coverage compared to the viewfinder/image. The sample image above it on that page (http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos5d/page4.asp) shows the proper spread, and as you can see there are no points near the intersections points of the rule of thirds grids. That's why the current diamond layout is terrible on the 5D.

Broken record time again, so bear with me :rolleyes: I just can't help it! All I want is an 11-point layout, with 9 in a rectangular grid where the corner points are at the rule of thirds intersections, and 1 more on either end of the rectangle. Get rid of this diamond junk. 11 points in this layout with all of them cross-type--that's plenty for me and would completely satisfy my desire for a better-than-xxD AF system in the 5D line. Until they put in an even faster and more accurate AF system that is :)
thanks for pointing that out. my bad. i like the idea of an 11 point system...but could use some assist points around each. that would be dreamy.

[I Simonius]

I seriously doubt it will be 18mp. I want something affordable.

however many MPs it has it will stay at the same price point I'm sure;)

I don't want to deal with the file sizes that 18MP will produce. I would be happy with just 12MP and weathersealing. No other upgrades.

18MP file sizes are good IMO!:D

[freddyco]

Sorry freddyco, but that's not the camera's fault.

No need for you to add yourself to the rude POTN group. As I said, I grabbed the camera at the last second and pressed the trigger as soon as possible to catch the moment. Obviously with a couple seconds to work, I could have have hit the right focus. But you are indeed wrong simply because a camera with a more intelligent AF could do better. That is in fact why the paparazzi crowd buys 1D MK III's. So I call your bluff.

[freddyco]

I don't want to deal with the file sizes that 18MP will produce. I would be happy with just 12MP and weathersealing. No other upgrades.

Just had a thought, if Nikon D3 is a $5,000 camera at 12mp, then Canon might do well by introducing 5Dv2 with 16mp or more at the current price point. Undercutting Nikon on price and offering more MP would be a good move to capture consumers who want to move to full frame.

[AdamJL]

I don't want to deal with the file sizes that 18MP will produce. I would be happy with just 12MP and weathersealing. No other upgrades.

+ 1

[radiohead]

+2

Although I'm less bothered about weather-sealing than I am a better LCD than the 40D (Nikon and Sony have raised the bar here, so there's no excuse for Canon to not match them here), improved noise performance and the ability to get usable ISO6400. Basically match what I'm seeing out of the D3.

Oh, and better AF a la 40D as well.

Oh, and keep it at £1700 or less.

[wernersl]

No need for you to add yourself to the rude POTN group. As I said, I grabbed the camera at the last second and pressed the trigger as soon as possible to catch the moment. Obviously with a couple seconds to work, I could have have hit the right focus. But you are indeed wrong simply because a camera with a more intelligent AF could do better. That is in fact why the paparazzi crowd buys 1D MK III's. So I call your bluff.
i dont think anyone was being rude. if you cant hack the truth then i think you are in the wrong place. i think that comment was actually well stated. he wasnt criticizing you in a derogatory way. just pointing out the fact that just because the focus was not where you wanted it was not necessarily the camera's fault. i assume that because the camera was in the 'do the work for me' mode it also had all focus points selected. considering there were a lot of contrasty areas on the wraping paper the camera decided to focus there for best accuracy. there are a number of variables that could have come into play there, but he was right to say that it was NOT the cameras fault. it did what it was told to do by acheiving good af (maybe not where YOU wanted it, but then again you didnt shoot in any type of manual settings so you really had no control anyway) and producing a balanced exposure.

actually...there are many more reasons the pap uses 1dx cameras. first...they dont even have the 'do all the work for me' mode so right off the bat you lose that argument. anyway...they also rattle off TONS of shots hoping that one is a keeper. how many did you fire? did you not take notice as to where focus was achieved? anyway...im done. BTW...i didnt see a "bluff" to call. have a nice day.:rolleyes:


FWIW...for a snapshot, that isnt so far outta whack that it cant be used. even if it were to be printed it would probably never see anything larger than a 4x6. either way...still nice that you were able to catch the memory at all.

[AdamJL]

+2

Although I'm less bothered about weather-sealing than I am a better LCD than the 40D (Nikon and Sony have raised the bar here, so there's no excuse for Canon to not match them here), improved noise performance and the ability to get usable ISO6400. Basically match what I'm seeing out of the D3.

Oh, and better AF a la 40D as well.

Oh, and keep it at £1700 or less.

To be honest, that doesn't sound like + 2 at all
That's an entirely different spec ;)

[wernersl]

To be honest, that doesn't sound like + 2 at all
That's an entirely different spec ;)
maybe +2 partial with an addition of spec xyz? just guessing

[VTSHEP1]

-1

I am hoping for a bump well beyond 12MP as I have started to enlarge and print my pics (only for my own home decorations at the moment). Using top of the line printers i have hit a ceiling and dont want to have to stitch photos to go larger. I agree the AF system would be great to upgrade, i honestly have never experienced anything more than the 9 point AF, i definitely would love more, less focus and recomposing...

18MP, bring it! File storage is so cheap these days hard drives are door stops.

[AdamJL]

File storage is so cheap these days hard drives are door stops.

Lol, that's literally true.
I've got three unused hard drives on my desk (2 x 120, 1 x 300) and I basically use them to keep my computer case from shutting when I need it open :D

[datadump]

Lol, that's literally true.
I've got three unused hard drives on my desk (2 x 120, 1 x 300) and I basically use them to keep my computer case from shutting when I need it open :D

i dont think HD storage is an issue these days -- its the dang post processing that having huge files bites. . it just takes longer to do stuff in photoshop etc..more cpu power, more ram etc..

[wernersl]

mmmm hmmm hmmm (grunting) MORE POWER

[I Simonius]

18MP, bring it! File storage is so cheap these days hard drives are door stops.

At last someone on my side!;):D

[gdl357]

At last someone on my side!;):D

Are you willing to pay $4799.00 for the new 5D if it were 18MP?

[wernersl]

hell no. would rather just get a ds2

[jdizzle]

I'd be happy for 14-16 mp for the next 5D. It would drop the price of 1Ds MK II a whole lot and into reach for alot of people who want a 1Ds. I personally love my current 5D and all I would be buying it for is the extra resolution. I bet the next 5D II will be much better built than the current 5D and I'm praying that the price will be just about where it was when it first released. :) ;)

[I Simonius]

Are you willing to pay $4799.00 for the new 5D if it were 18MP?

Willing? - I expect to pay £2000 ($4178 ), after the original price I expect it will arrive in the shops at (£2500=$5223), goes down after a few months

So yes I am willing to pay what I originally paid for the Mk1-definitely, provided it does have 18MP;) - not otherwise

[metalsaber]

however many MPs it has it will stay at the same price point I'm sure;)



18MP file sizes are good IMO!:D

Do you really believe they would sell a 12MP version at the same price as a 18MP version?

I doubt it. However if a 18MP camera was affordable, I wouldn't complain.

[Punisher77]

Willing? - I expect to pay £2000 ($4178 ), after the original price I expect it will arrive in the shops at (£2500=$5223), goes down after a few months

So yes I am willing to pay what I originally paid for the Mk1-definitely, provided it does have 18MP;) - not otherwise

I'm guessing it'll be closer to £1350 or $2700 USD.

[I Simonius]

Do you really believe they would sell a 12MP version at the same price as a 18MP version?

I doubt it. However if a 18MP camera was affordable, I wouldn't complain.

You could as easily ask whether they would sell a 21MP camera at the same price as a 17MP camera or a 10 at the same price as a 6 MP camera

At some point of course they will , the question is only when;)

[BrantG]

Ok assuming we aren't talking years later, at this moment in time, would canon sell the new "5D" with a 12, 14, 16, or 18MP for the same price? Doubtful.

[datadump]

I_Simonios --- you LIVE here in this forum , in this rumour 5D topic page.. heheheh

[wernersl]

if the new 5 magically has all the upgrades people are asking for then the price will be higher than the original.

[I Simonius]

Ok assuming we aren't talking years later, at this moment in time, would canon sell the new "5D" with a 12, 14, 16, or 18MP for the same price? Doubtful.

They will have had a price point set by the marketing dudes and will no doubt themselves be having pretty muc the same conversation as we do here.

The point will be.. what do they need to do to the camera to make it sell at the established price point? Do they nned to put in a 15 or an 18MP sensor and what wou;ld each option cost them? As they alreadu have a set up for the 18MP sensor there is a slim chance we might just get one;):cool:

[I Simonius]

I_Simonios --- you LIVE here in this forum , in this rumour 5D topic page.. heheheh

eager little beaver aren't I?;):D

[mantra]

does somebody know when will be out

i read that it should be out the same time nikon start to sell their new camera , true?

[radiohead]

To be honest, that doesn't sound like + 2 at all
That's an entirely different spec ;)

I think they're all givens to be honest, aside from the MP issue.

If Canon stick the very average LCD from the 40D in and do nothing more then they're dim.

[wernersl]

nope...thats why its a rumor thread

[I Simonius]

i read that it should be out the same time nikon start to sell their new camera , true?

gotta be around that time;)

[mantra]

gotta be around that time;)

i hope the new canon will be very hard-bitten (war trained) to sweep the new nikons up :D:D:D:D

[wernersl]

i wouldnt count on it until next year guys.

[gdl357]

i wouldnt count on it until next year guys.

I say it may be here sooner to get a piece of the X-Mas pie.

I do want a new camera for then.

[wernersl]

i think the fact that they introduced 3 bodies this year kills it for the 7D release.

[I Simonius]

"Nikon D2X allows bracketing in 2 to 9 steps, in 1/3, 1/2, and 1 stop increments."

That's something I really hope they're putting in the next 5D wider auto bracket options!;)

[wernersl]

that would be nice.

[VTSHEP1]

I say it may be here sooner to get a piece of the X-Mas pie.

I do want a new camera for then.

That would be great, but historically they have never announced a camera any other time then February-ish or September-ish

[wernersl]

ok...had to make changes to my avatar in anticipation of the new release next feb. like it?

[AdamJL]

I_Simonios --- you LIVE here in this forum , in this rumour 5D topic page.. heheheh

It's his thread.. he likes to keep it going, and close down the competition ;) :D

[I Simonius]

It's his thread.. he likes to keep it going, and close down the competition ;) :D

no way maan!:eek:, Im just .. like .. really excitable... er.. man;):lol:

ps.It is part of my fiendish plan to keep updating the first post with attributes that are most likely as discussion reveals, so the more it gets discussed tthe more Im happy and Imkinds hoping , somehwere, someone , who knows someone somehwerre will be keeping a beady eye on all this....

you never know...;-)

[angryhampster]

The next 5D needs to come out very soon. I want to by an original one when the price drops. :lol:

[datadump]

The next 5D needs to come out very soon. I want to by an original one when the price drops. :lol:

yeah thats similar to my plans...

if (the "5dmark2" is way beyond my pricepoint 3000+)
{
then i'll opt to wait and see how low 5D becomes and snatch a new one before it is out of stock..
}
else if (the "5dmark2" is within reach ($1800-2500)
{
then i'll buy the new puppy.
}
else
{
die.
}

[scokar]

yeah thats similar to my plans...
else
{
die.
}

rather harsh :)

[Danny Nicole]

No way 5D to go bigger then 16mpx. It would affect 1Ds sales if it gets closer to 21. I prefer much more of a 13mpx current sensor improved in DR compartiment but as I see thinks going on with 1D(s)3 there won't be, so i'm not dreaming.
For shure there will be a 40D like with FF sensor. Any other model could be possible due to 2008 fall. I would be looking more to a EOS3 style body, that means a FF with AF from a 1Ds2 series and a proper metering system. That would be awsome. Something like a EOS 3D :D isn't that funny (Nikon's D3 rival to be a 3D) :D

[I Simonius]

yeah thats similar to my plans...

if (the "5dmark2" is way beyond my pricepoint 3000+)
{
then i'll opt to wait and see how low 5D becomes and snatch a new one before it is out of stock..
}
else if (the "5dmark2" is within reach ($1800-2500)
{
then i'll buy the new puppy.
}
else
{
die.
}

:lol:

The old 5D secondhand will dramatically ditch in price as the upgraders try to dump thiers to get the new model, that will be the time to buy as the 'best' ones will be for sale at that time IMO. Unless you mean trying to get a new copy before stocks are depleted?

I will keep mine as a back up,(you'll be sorry to hear as it has to be the best preserved camera in the world and I know you'd love to get your hands on it...:p)) but I won't be buying the new one unless it goes 18MP, which the general consensus seeems to be that it won't so .. no upgrade for me anyway.. bwahhh..:cry:

[wernersl]

out of curiosity...why is it so important to you to have 18mpx sensor anyway. are you a massive cropper? i dont see why a 5.2mp increase would be that important. there are other features that surely need improvement beofre it needs a rez increase!
just wondering. :confused:

[_aravena]

^Yeah...

what I love most is this thread had all this excitement and what not over a year ago and there still is nothing.

[wernersl]

chirp chirp chirp (crickets)

[_aravena]

^I thought the chirping was from birds. :rolleyes: :lol:

[wernersl]

bah...whatever. :)

[VTSHEP1]

out of curiosity...why is it so important to you to have 18mpx sensor anyway. are you a massive cropper? i dont see why a 5.2mp increase would be that important. there are other features that surely need improvement beofre it needs a rez increase!
just wondering. :confused:

In the absence of I Simonius....I can say that i want a larger MP because I print images in large sizes (3 foot wide and up for landscape). Stitching is a royal pain when you dont know photoshop well and not possible when parts of the scene have motion. Also when selling digital files, you do get a higher price for higher resolution files, check any of the stock sites.

I always try to get the image correct in the camera and not rely on photoshop so i rarely crop massively.

[_aravena]

^Megapixel believer!!! *gasp*

I have a 24x20 of a 4mp pixel picture. Don't we have a stickie of the pixel myth

[darktiger]

Hopefully it will have the highlight priority system the 40D has...

[wernersl]

In the absence of I Simonius....I can say that i want a larger MP because I print images in large sizes (3 foot wide and up for landscape). Stitching is a royal pain when you dont know photoshop well and not possible when parts of the scene have motion. Also when selling digital files, you do get a higher price for higher resolution files, check any of the stock sites.

I always try to get the image correct in the camera and not rely on photoshop so i rarely crop massively.
first...i missed the post where I Simonius made you his bi*ch therefore answering FOR him. second...i think its time to start learning photoshop. anyway...would this be YOUR answer I Sim?

[wernersl]

^Megapixel believer!!! *gasp*

I have a 24x20 of a 4mp pixel picture. Don't we have a stickie of the pixel myth
heres a good place to start reading.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/08/technology/08pogue.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

[wernersl]

id rather see similar rez as the current 5d with larger photo sites on the sensor...that alone could reduce noise and increase the detail that IS resolved.

[I Simonius]

out of curiosity...why is it so important to you to have 18mpx sensor anyway. are you a massive cropper? i dont see why a 5.2mp increase would be that important. there are other features that surely need improvement beofre it needs a rez increase!
just wondering. :confused:

Cropper?, that's what zooms are for. No I rearely crop much. Have you used a 1Ds Mk2? you can see the difference. An 18MP sensor with better photosites i.e. not just more MP but more better MPs would be stunnin g.

In the absence of I Simonius....I can say that i want a larger MP because I print images in large sizes (3 foot wide and up for landscape). Stitching is a royal pain when you dont know photoshop well and not possible when parts of the scene have motion. Also when selling digital files, you do get a higher price for higher resolution files, check any of the stock sites.

I always try to get the image correct in the camera and not rely on photoshop so i rarely crop massively.

You, sorry, I, can tell the difference between uprezzed pics and not at large print sizes, so yes I want high rez for huge prints

^Megapixel believer!!! *gasp*

I have a 24x20 of a 4mp pixel picture. Don't we have a stickie of the pixel myth

If you want to believe the myth of the MP myth, then you stick with a 4MP camera old bean:p
er... if you believe that what did you spend ona 5D (in your sig)? Don't answer it's rhetorical;)


first...i missed the post where I Simonius made you his bi*ch therefore answering FOR him. second...i think its time to start learning photoshop. anyway...would this be YOUR answer I Sim?

now now, no need for rudeness;)

I already do know photoshop and it has no bearing on my desire for 18Mps

I have always said I want it because I want a 1DsMk2 camera but am not prepared to carry that much wheight around.

id rather see similar rez as the current 5d with larger photo sites on the sensor...that alone could reduce noise and increase the detail that IS resolved.


current technology can provide improved photosites still at 18MP

I was reading about it but can't find the link

So the new 5D could have 18MP and even better photosites than it has now - in other words it could be an incredible camera

[Meaty0]

So the new 5D could have 18MP and even better photosites than it has now - in other words it could be an incredible camera

It WILL be an incredible camera compared to the 20D I have now.

[gdl357]

^Megapixel believer!!! *gasp*

I have a 24x20 of a 4mp pixel picture. Don't we have a stickie of the pixel myth

Could you imagine how it would look when shot with a 18MP camera? If you think a 4MP shot looks the same as a 12MP shot at that large size then you need glasses. Try sticking with the "Myth" when cameras are 30MP. Will you still go around saying your 4MP is of the same IQ ???

The 5D can't stay at 12.8MP forever when all the other cameras of lower price range like the XTI at 10MP slowly creep up.

No one needs 400HP in their Muscle Car, but it's good to have under the pedal. I would love to have a 18MP 5D.

BTW wernersl, Bypassing the forum filter can get you in trouble. It's there for a reason. use it *****. I know, your really scared now. HA.

[_aravena]

Having use to race, not everything is about brute strength and power. I never said 4mp is the same as 18, but will 12 and 18 be that different at 20x24 or other sizes. There is a limit. But if I can lay out a 4x6's and you tell me the pixels, I'll give up.

If you want to believe the myth of the MP myth, then you stick with a 4MP camera old bean:p
er... if you believe that what did you spend ona 5D (in your sig)? Don't answer it's rhetorical;)

Old bean? It was a Rebel XT shot on JPEG...

And you're right, I don't need to answer. You made yourself sound stupid. What 5D?? And who says I'd have got it for the pixels.

[gdl357]

Having use to race, not everything is about brute strength and power. I never said 4mp is the same as 18, but will 12 and 18 be that different at 20x24 or other sizes. There is a limit. But if I can lay out a 4x6's and you tell me the pixels, I'll give up.

The point is, if Canon would like to give us 18MP at roughly the same price if not less, why would you argue with them and ask to still have the 5d V2 include that 3 YO sensor ???

Its not only the MP that is being upgraded. The sensor technology and added extras like better light sensitivity and less noise are included with the upgrade. You only see MP part of it, which is the smallest piece of the cake.

[wernersl]

BTW wernersl, Bypassing the forum filter can get you in trouble. It's there for a reason. use it *****. I know, your really scared now. HA.
omg im freakin out!!!! :rolleyes:
**** **** damn bitch!

[wernersl]

now now, no need for rudeness;)

I already do know photoshop and it has no bearing on my desire for 18Mps


well...it was sorta necessary to jump down his throat. more fun that way:) the photoshop comment wasnt directed at you anyway.
i can understand your desire for the increased rez. i feel i should fight it because i just dont want to deal with the file size. that means new computer more storage, etc. realistically i dont see my self making the jump on the new upgrade unless they reform the af system. for me...im gonna start searching for a 1d2(n).

[I Simonius]

It WILL be an incredible camera compared to the 20D I have now.

you're gonna love it!;-)

Having use to race, not everything is about brute strength and power. I never said 4mp is the same as 18, but will 12 and 18 be that different at 20x24 or other sizes. There is a limit. But if I can lay out a 4x6's and you tell me the pixels, I'll give up.

Old bean? It was a Rebel XT shot on JPEG...

And you're right, I don't need to answer. You made yourself sound stupid. What 5D?? And who says I'd have got it for the pixels.

So you have a rebel, ok, I must have read the wrong posters sig ( must stop looking at the screen sideways!;)) and whether you got it for the pixels or not why would you be looking toget a 5Dmk 1 or 2 if you're happy with your rebel; and relax i didn't say you did have a 4MP camera just that if you can't tell the difference then that's all you need.

It was your arguement that more Mps improving IQ was a myth ( i.e. you quoted it), my challenge was that if you truly believe that then why are you looking to get a 5D (if you're not, why are you posting in this thread?)

Fairly obviusly no one would try to tell te difference with 4x6 prints. If you want that size prints then save your monewy and use use a 4MP camera. Hands up all the 5D owners, and prospective 5Dmk2 owners who are only going to print 4x6!

More MPs do make a difference, (provided you do more than shoot for 4x6 prints:rolleyes:)obviously the person who wrote that review was just jealours that he ( or she) couldn't afford a hiigher MP camera:p I for one can certainly tell the difference for the uses I put it to, otherwise I wouldn't be so interested:rolleyes:

Why would Canon make a 21 MP !ds if 18MP 1Ds was all you needed i.e. 4MP made no difference? Every little helps!

We know better photosites make better pics but all other things being equal then more MPs are going to be noticable for a large enough proportion of those who would be inclined to buy such a camera.

There is of course a trade off between MP count and image gathering quality of individual photosites, but that is a purely hypothetical discussion for most of us , because we have noidea whahat technology is in the pipeline tochage the behaviour of photosites, (except that we know of course that canon are prototyping 50MP sensors) until it actually arrives in the shape of a new camera

Thee may indeed arrive a time when MP count stops ncreasing, i.e.there may be a point beyond which it becomes detrimental to IQ rather than contributing to it, but were not there yet. When that does happen though there will no doubt be some light gathering technology other than pixels that will creep into the equation

anyway that's why I argue for 18MP over 15, it's not a big enough jump for me to upgrade, even if they do put, funkier photosites, WS, and dust removal in it

[I Simonius]

well...it was sorta necessary to jump down his throat. more fun that way:) the photoshop comment wasnt directed at you anyway.
i can understand your desire for the increased rez. i feel i should fight it because i just dont want to deal with the file size. that means new computer more storage, etc. realistically i dont see my self making the jump on the new upgrade unless they reform the af system. for me...im gonna start searching for a 1d2(n).

I'l suffer the file size happily!;)

[Chandler.]

Hey Simonius, what filesizes do you usually get with the 5D at large, fine JPEG, and with RAW?

[I Simonius]

Hey Simonius, what filesizes do you usually get with the 5D at large, fine JPEG, and with RAW?

I only shoot RAW - they are about 12-15mb

[wernersl]

you're gonna love it!;-)

anyway that's why I argue for 18MP over 15, it's not a big enough jump for me to upgrade, even if they do put, funkier photosites, WS, and dust removal in it



Thanks for answering, although, i know one of your earlier arguments was for weather-sealing, and every little bit helps with resolution...so why would you not upgrade if "I argue for 18MP over 15, it's not a big enough jump for me to upgrade, even if they do put, funkier photosites, WS, and dust removal in it". i would think that a 3.2MP gain, better photosites, better high iso performance and ws would constitute a worthy upgrade. again...15 IS better than 12.8! (just relating to your argument).
oh...and what if all that is introduced at a lower price point than the original pp of the 5D?

[I Simonius]

Thanks for answering, although, i know one of your earlier arguments was for weather-sealing, and every little bit helps with resolution...so why would you not upgrade if "I argue for 18MP over 15, it's not a big enough jump for me to upgrade, even if they do put, funkier photosites, WS, and dust removal in it". i would think that a 3.2MP gain, better photosites, better high iso performance and ws would constitute a worthy upgrade. again...15 IS better than 12.8! (just relating to your argument).
oh...and what if all that is introduced at a lower price point than the original pp of the 5D?

you're right of course but I was saying that just i case canon was listening and thinking to themsleves.. "blimey this I_Simonius bloke is harsd to please we;d better give him 18MP if we want him to upgrade";):D

[VTSHEP1]

well...it was sorta necessary to jump down his throat. more fun that way:) the photoshop comment wasnt directed at you anyway.
i can understand your desire for the increased rez. i feel i should fight it because i just dont want to deal with the file size. that means new computer more storage, etc. realistically i dont see my self making the jump on the new upgrade unless they reform the af system. for me...im gonna start searching for a 1d2(n).

I appreciated the mature way that you handled yourself with those posts:) I made a conscious choice not to learn the depths of photoshop unless its for cursory changes to the image appearance. I appreciate the great things image manipulation does, but for my collection i have chosen to not follow this path for a couple of reasons. I have a lucrative day job that is not related to photography so photoshop is not a requirement for me, nor do i want it to be, as i enjoy shooting much more than sitting behind a PC.

And your right, rez does matter (although not the only factor of course and definitely not by itself) Your reason for not wanting it is to deal with higher rez is the file size. The larger file size does suck up hard drives which is less of an issue to me than the processing power needed in camera to deal with them.

If Canon sits on the same sensor Nikon will surely wiz by...

[BestVisuals]

Sorry, folks, pixels beyond a minimum just don't really matter. I have 30x40's printed from my 8MP camera, sent to the lab at 72dpi, that are phenomenal. No pixelation, no loss of detail, incredible.

Camera makers pack more and more pixels into newer cameras because it sells cameras. Consumers think more pixels is better. Indeed, it gives you more cropping room, but that's about all.

To provide a pixel for each dot on a print, assuming 300dpi, you'd have to have a camera:

1.08GIGAPIXELS to make a 30x40
54MP to make a 20x30
43MP to make a 20x24
28.8MP to make a 16x20

...yet we're making fabulous prints in these sizes without cameras that have this many pixels.

I want a 5D due to its FF capabilities. I'd like some ultra-wides that you can use with FF cameras. The larger sensors can facilitate better low-light capabilities as well (larger sensors). While 13MP would be nice, I'll bet my mortgage payment you can't see the difference in a 20x24 between my 20D and a 5D. In a 20x24, my 20D (8MP) provides about 20% of the data (80% is interpolated by the printer) and a 5D (13MP) provides about 1/3 of the data (2/3 is interpolated). Big difference...not!

[VTSHEP1]

Sorry, folks, pixels beyond a minimum just don't really matter. I have 30x40's printed from my 8MP camera, sent to the lab at 72dpi, that are phenomenal. No pixelation, no loss of detail, incredible.

Camera makers pack more and more pixels into newer cameras because it sells cameras. Consumers think more pixels is better. Indeed, it gives you more cropping room, but that's about all.

To provide a pixel for each dot on a print, assuming 300dpi, you'd have to have a camera:

1.08GIGAPIXELS to make a 30x40
54MP to make a 20x30
43MP to make a 20x24
28.8MP to make a 16x20

...yet we're making fabulous prints in these sizes without cameras that have this many pixels.

I want a 5D due to its FF capabilities. I'd like some ultra-wides that you can use with FF cameras. The larger sensors can facilitate better low-light capabilities as well (larger sensors). While 13MP would be nice, I'll bet my mortgage payment you can't see the difference in a 20x24 between my 20D and a 5D. In a 20x24, my 20D (8MP) provides about 20% of the data (80% is interpolated by the printer) and a 5D (13MP) provides about 1/3 of the data (2/3 is interpolated). Big difference...not!

I didn’t check the math behind any of the numbers you threw up, but your logic makes a solid argument. I always assumed that using your example interpolating 80% versus interpolating 66% would make a perceivable difference at larger sizes as long as all other variables (pixel size, etc) of both sensors were the same.