Why do you use a mac?

[bonzaisushi]

grrrrr, i know you guys are irritated with a buncha thread kinda like this.... but ive spent a couple weeks reading reviews, doing my research and i cant find another pc that i like like a mac.... im moving to australia here in a few months and need to get a laptop STAT, i just noticed that they are selling the 17" Macbook pro right now..... if i go with that Will aperture be ok for general photo editing? and throwing borders on programs? making images pretty so i can post them?:D the only think keeping me back is the photoshop compatibilty issue........ So please apple people turn me from the pc!!!!! by giving me encouragement and advice.... PC people, try and sway me back to something else if you think i should......


This laptop will be with me everywhere, and photoediting is a MUST, i might touch on video editing in the future, gaming isnt to important.


Soo fill my brain with your knowledge!!! thanks!

[Mikelangelo]

I've been waiting for this new 17" macbook pro since apple announced the Intel processor switch!! I've got the original 17" laptop that I've had for 3 years now. It's still running very well for photo editing/retouching, etc. The only reason I'm in no hurry for the new one is because Adobe products won't run native on it. (they'll run...but you won't notice a huge speed boost until Adobe updates them.)

BUT... if I had a timeline and wanted a single machine...this would be it because you can dual-boot into XP now. It's still in early stages, so I'm hoping all the software bugs will be worked out when I do buy it. But with a 100 GB 7200 rpm HD, a 256 MB video card, 8X dual layer DVD and an increase in performance supposedly up to 4-5x faster... I can't wait to get my paws on it.

This laptop was announced in time for the NAB (National Association of Broadcasters or something), the biggest media Tech event around. Apple is marketing this laptop to pro video editors. If it can handle Hi-def video well... photography should be a cake-walk (kinda'.) You should be very happy with this machine. As long as the big screen is what you want. (it's a little big for planes...but I LOVE my current one)

Hope that helps... shoot... I almost convinced myself to order one today... sigh...

[bonzaisushi]

I had my order and every thing totall of 3300 dollars just sittin in the checkout.... and im just not sure if i should push the button...... its the macbook pro 17 with 2 gigs of ram and aperture.......

[tripletaker]

It will be good. If you want it, get it. You won't regret it.

[Mathiau]

laptops dont have aperture ?

but $3300? what kind of specs are you getting on that that seems VERY VERY over priced for a 17" laptop.

you can get a intel core duo 2ghz (dual cores) / 2g of ram /100g HD / DVD burner - 15.1" screen Acer for $1500.

Also if this thing is going tobe traveling with your every where you may want to consider a smaller, lighter laptop...
most anylaptop on the market will let you photoshop pictures.

the main thing is lots of ram - 1-2G's and be sure to get a 7200 RPM laptop harddrive as well, this will give a very nice boost in over all performance.

Just t show price comparison

Dell Inspiron E1705 17" - i basically maxed out the laptop

Intel® Core™ Duo Processor T2500 (2GHz/667MHz FSB) (the price diff to go to 2.1 is not worth it)
Genuine Windows® XP Professional
17 inch UltraSharp™ Wide Screen UXGA Display with TrueLife™
256MB NVIDA® GeForce™ Go 7800
2GB Shared Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM
100GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive
8x CD/DVD burner (DVD+/-RW) with double-layer DVD+R write capability
Intel PRO/Wireless 3945 802.11a/g Mini Card (54Mbps)
Dell Wireless 350 Bluetooth Internal(2.0 + Enhanced Data Rate)

Currently this can be bought for $2,598 and you can game all you want! if not knock of $180 for a lesser video card.....

[bonzaisushi]

laptops dont have aperture ?

but $3300? what kind of specs are you getting on that that seems VERY VERY over priced for a 17" laptop.

you can get a intel core duo 2ghz (dual cores) / 2g of ram /100g HD / DVD burner - 15.1" screen Acer for $1500.

im talking abot the photo oragnizer/ RAw editor/ semi editior made by apple called Aperture..... i dont hear much on this site about it.... i know its not a direct replacement for photoshop... but i just want a nice program that will last me till cs3.


i will start looking at other laptops, but after using a mac last yer a 12 inch g4 i was amazed at how simple and streamline everything felt compared to windows..... ill take a look at that acer. Thanks:)

[Mathiau]

Apple's 17" Mac PRo - same specs...... roughly

2.16GHz Intel Core Duo
2GB 667 DDR2 - 2x1GB SO-DIMMs
100GB Serial ATA drive @ 7200 rpm
SuperDrive 8x (DVD+R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)

Integrated graphics

$3099


This is why i always didnt like apple - such mediocor selections for hardware customization.

Yes OS X is a better O/S then XP in many ways - for me it is the hardware behind the O/S that matters more so then the O/S's its self.

sorry, i had thought you were refering to like camera aperature :D

Okay i spec the dell to have integrated graphics and a core duo 2.1 and the price is

$2,655

still $500 less then apple.

Sure OS X is great and all, but worth $500 more.... people say XP cost's alot!


What is he amjority of the software you own right now, as that will also matter, if you already own a MAC, then likely your software base is already all MAC software

[bonzaisushi]

software, i really own none, games i have few. pretty much the only sofware i own is adobe elements, cs2 and xp.

[Mathiau]

k, then for that route i would rather get the dell, save $500 and keep my compatible software - get that system with the 256mb 7800 GO and play your games as well and over all hardware wise have a much better laptop then the apple.

[Rumjungle]

That extra $500 can also be spent on a sexy new widescreen LCD for image editing. I'm with Mathiau...if you're not getting more, then don't pay more.

[chinabuddie]

i just recently bought a new laptop.

Dell E1505 (same version as the guy above me except mine is the 15.4")
2ghz intel core duo processor
2gb of ram
80gb 7200 rpm harddrive
15.4" dell widescreen with truevision
dvd/cdrw burner
bluetooth
integrated iwireless card

after dell coupons
$1500.

[bonzaisushi]

That is quite abit cheaper heh.... you guys are making me second guess.... my degree is studio arts so i will be doing some graphic design as well.... and i always hear oh you should get a mac if your going into that. Is that more of a status thing?

[Rumjungle]

Well, it's the most popular platform among graphic designers but I just don't see why. Perhaps I like the flexibility of a PC or the fact that I don't want my machine dumbed down for me. I must say, however, that I like the look and feel of the Apple laptops by far. They just exude quality.

[Riken]

Just to stir the pot a bit... you could always buy an intel Mac and use bootcamp to run Windows on it as well as OSX.

I prefer Macs. Every time I use windows I feel like I've gone 10 rounds with a gorilla by the end of it. It's always a struggle to get anything to work right.

[Mathiau]

That is quite abit cheaper heh.... you guys are making me second guess.... my degree is studio arts so i will be doing some graphic design as well.... and i always hear oh you should get a mac if your going into that. Is that more of a status thing?

Yes - MAC's "where" the standard - but now with them using the same hardware as PC's the only gain on them is the oprating system and a purdy looking case and limited options.

MAC and Windows each have equivilent software - some people say macs are easier to use, less problems - yet i read just as many people who mac's freeze up and crash as frequently as people say Windows does. You have your image editing apps for MAC - but you also have them for Windows..... so that is a mut point these days as well.

Personally my Windows XP systems run flawless - i dont see why so many people say they have so much trouble with it, personally i think it is their computer habits, not the O/S, but of course people wont admit to that, it is always the O/S's fault

Now, if you have been using Apple based computer most of your life, of course you will be used to OS , and if using windows based - used to windows - Humans dont like change, they like familiarity so changing or trying something new is not always a pleasent experience.

Last time i tried OS 10.1? Panther i think - i thought it was a complete unorganized mess lacking alot.

[JCR]

I had a big mac once, too much grease and it was pink inside. Looked good on the outside tho :D

Buy whatever you like best, personally I would get a pc, but wadda I know ;)

[JeffsJeep04]

I used to be a hard core mac hater...same hardware specs, more expensive....all that jazz. Then I started actually using them a little. Steve jobs has some real pride in his computers. You are getting the top of the line stuff inside, not just padded numbers. After having the hard drive wipe itself 3 times too many on my dell inspiron (which was loaded at the time..), I got a powerbook. Haven't looked back since.

If nothing else, that $500 is small potatoes to what you could get selling them used in about 3 years. My 15" powerbook is ~2.5 years old. It's still worth around $1200-1300. Anyone that can get that from a dell of the same age?

[peatoire]

If you are thinking about buying an Intel based mac take note of this:
If it is not a universal binary application like Photoshop CS2 it will run through a transparent process called rosetta on the Mac, the performance hit is very substantial. I upgraded from 866Mhz to a mac mini 1.66Ghz and photoshop was slower on the Intel mac. developers are quickly bringing software up to date, some charging some not but Adobe are not upgrading CS2 apps. You will ahve to wait until CS3 which may not be around until next year

[bonzaisushi]

If you are thinking about buying an Intel based mac take note of this:
If it is not a universal binary application like Photoshop CS2 it will run through a transparent process called rosetta on the Mac, the performance hit is very substantial. I upgraded from 866Mhz to a mac mini 1.66Ghz and photoshop was slower on the Intel mac. developers are quickly bringing software up to date, some charging some not but Adobe are not upgrading CS2 apps. You will ahve to wait until CS3 which may not be around until next year

see ya this is one reason im not so happy. but will boot camp be able to run cs2 for the time being?



thanks for the mac encouragement, i needed that as i was starting to lean towards the dell but im still unsure.

[Mathiau]

bootcamp is still in BETA and is not supported yet by apple - basically you install it, but if anything goes wrong, tuff poo for you!

advanage of PC currently for you:

1. Cheaper for same hardware
2. Compatibility with your software you already own
3. Save more money cause you dont have to buy new software for the MAC OS and you could buy another lense of LCD with the $500 you save buying a PC based laptop.

[peatoire]

Yeah, I think it's early stages to be running PS cs2 through windows on a mac and expecting it to be very quick and without bugs.
One thing to note though, the native apps are blisteringly quick. So when all apps are Universal binary or fully Intel based, coupled with that dual boot, Apple will a weapon for sure.

[bonzaisushi]

bootcamp is still in BETA and is not supported yet by apple - basically you install it, but if anything goes wrong, tuff poo for you!

advanage of PC currently for you:

1. Cheaper for same hardware
2. Compatibility with your software you already own
3. Save more money cause you dont have to buy new software for the MAC OS and you could buy another lense of LCD with the $500 you save buying a PC based laptop.


your like the angel or devil on my shoulder and your doing a damn good job :lol:

[Sageg]

I have a mac at home (20" intel) because I have a pc at work & need a computer that works the way I want it to. :P Not as fast as it will be once Photoshop is native, but I can wait for CS3. Yes, I realize it will not be until next year.

Lightroom is free for macs right now (still in beta version). It is pretty darn cool. Adobe's equivalent of aperture.

[stupot]

Macs are amazing! To be honest if you have $3000 to spend on a laptop then you're not so bothered about cost and you might as well not compromise and go with your initial instinct, the mac - which is what the vast majority of the design industry will recommend. i use a 15" powerbook and i'm studying architecture. was a big decision to go the mac route after using pc's but im glad i bought into the mac system. software is much easier to come by (in my department) not many people use pc's. the uni uses macs. most designers use them. go with your instinct:) you know you want one.

[peatoire]

Agreed Sarah, Lightroom is very cool and Binary too. It seemed pretty quick and I'm sure it will only get quicker. I must admit I've really got stuck in to the Adobe RAW plug in and the Photoshop functionality so I ended up sending my mac mini back and buying a refurb 2Ghz Dual proc. G5 which I love (aleit a bit on the noisy side)
I think the pc/mac topic will be hotly debated for years to come as ultimately it's a matter of personal preference on operating systems. For me it was the fact I work in the graphics industry and work on macs all the time so I don't mind paying more for something I enjoy more.

[Double Negative]

If you do media work, the Mac is the way to go. End of story.

[bonzaisushi]

:) If you do media work, the Mac is the way to go. End of story.

[Mathiau]

Why is the MAC the way to go - reasons why will help in them making better buying decisions.

Hardware wise - MAC has no advantage over PC and cost more and options are very limited

Software - if he already owns the software he uses why drop another $1000US or so for new software ?

MAC OS X + is a great O/S - so is XP (for me at least)

PhotoShop - not properly coded yet - do you want to run potentially "non" stable, or possibly slow software for a year until it becomes properly supported?

The other progream - lightroom - Beta - again, no final - working on a nice big pic and CRASHHHHHHH programs dies, then what.......

Any media work you do, i can do as well on a PC. And ilikely have more options for software for Windows then there is for a MAC - i like variety, i know Apple does a fantastic job of more or less including any tools you will need, Final Cut and such, but sometimes some people just dont like the way software is designed or made.

As for being inductry standard PC and MAC are cross compatible with most all image formats, the reason the MAC is / was standard in the industry was because of smart moves made years ago by Job's - becuse of specific programs that save files in a specific format, to which a PC does not have a program to open.

I hope Apples see's the potential for OS X on x86 hardware - i would love to have the option to use both on one computer - - but i wont buy an apple until i can build one myself from the ground up with new hardware and lots of options.

[Double Negative]

Why? For starters, it just works. No dealing with drivers. No viruses. Windows, whether you like to admit or not - is a joke. A bad one. The stability of the Unix core of Mac OS X is leaps and bounds more secure, more stabile and more extensible than Windows ever will be. I won't even get into the UI.

Why is Lightroom such a big discussion? It's a beta. 'Nuf said.

Apple makes some decent software (Aperture notwithstanding, but come on - it's v1.1) but there are a LOT of third-party apps to get the job done. As long as I have Photoshop, I'm good to go. It runs perfectly well on the non-Intel Macs. It even runs on the Intel Macs via Rosetta - but I wouldn't recommend it for more than the casual user. We'll have to wait until CS3 unfortunately, but that's the way it goes.

What hardware options are limited on the Mac? It comes with everything. There's no compatibility worries and driver hassles. If you need to upgrade your video card, you can. If you need a SCSI or other RAID card, they're available.

[bonzaisushi]

NICE this is what i needed.... i freaken love you guys.

[JCR]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6553260189868317794
:D

[bonzaisushi]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6553260189868317794
:D


:lol:

[Mathiau]

Why? For starters, it just works. No dealing with drivers. No viruses. Windows, whether you like to admit or not - is a joke. A bad one. The stability of the Unix core of Mac OS X is leaps and bounds more secure, more stabile and more extensible than Windows ever will be. I won't even get into the UI.


I agree OS X is a great OS and now apple IS oging to get nailed with viruses and spywrae now that is it coded for x86 cpu's and the market will likely grow :) I am sure Job's got real pissed when he found out JUST how easily his OS was hacked to all heck to work on hardware he did not want it to work on - welcome to x86 jobs!

As i also said - Windows, it just works for me - i install XP, install my video card drives - mayby sound card and i am done, no hassles, no crashes, nothing.......

I have also installed OS X on a friend laptop - and it came with a drivers CD, so dont tell me you dont have to worry about drivers for your system - you buy new hardware - you need to install drivers - new updated drivers come out, oh, got to go install those now.... Windows also has default drives for common devices as i am sure OS X does as well.

OS X does offer a nice out of the box up and running solution! you dont have to worry as much about viruses or spyware which is peace of mind - but those who get those items - it is usually their own fault for clicking yes yes yes yes and visiting sites they dont look into first. Most Computer problems are caused by that piece of hardware between the chair and the keyboard.

How many video cards can you buy for your MAC vs a PC ?
How many CPU options do you jave for you MAC vs a PC ?
How many motherboards can you choose

Sure with options come possible headaches - but i would rather have freedom over being limited to settle for somthing i may not want.

When Apple comes out with a new CPU - chances are that new CPU wont be compatible with your current Laptop (havent been in the past) - so their goes upgrading your CPU if you had the fastest one, now you have to buy an ENTIRE new laptop...... most PC laptops, you have at least 2-3 years of upgrade CPU options - of course pending on your supplier.

With intel being the supplier now, this may change - unless Apple is still soldering their CPU's into the motherboards so people cant change them.

Bought a dell insprion 9100 came with a P 2.4c CPU Northwood - i put ina 3.2ghz prescott , changed CPU's and back up and running, no new laptop to move all my data over to, and get all my settings configured. Also changed the video card - since now most laptops you can change alot of parts.

[Riken]

In response to Mathiau:

Viruses: You have no clue how software works do you. Just because Macs now run on intel chips doesn't mean the viruses work too. Just like you can't run all the windows software unless you install windows.

Windows works for you and doesn't crash: I'm a .NET programmer for a living. Not a day goes by where I don't curse Microsoft for something (usually VSS). I'm not talking about crashes. I'm talking about a simple function that for some reason doesn't work the way it's supposed to.

Macs have drivers too: No argument except to say that I've found Macs have more default drivers so more new hardware tends to work in that generic way that hardware does when it hasn't had the driver installed.

That most viruses and other problems are caused by the user: One acronym - IE.

How many video cards can you buy for your MAC vs a PC ? Same amount
How many CPU options do you jave for you MAC vs a PC ? What about socket types? For any given socket the number of CPU's is limited to a few GHz difference. And changing socket type requires a new motherboard which leads to...
How many motherboards can you choose? How many can you choose between all the Dell packages? Or HP? or any of a dozen other PC packagers? What's the difference between motherboard x and y anyway? A few hertz on the memory bus? Most motherboards have the same features anyway. And most users won't know or care. If you build your own machines at that level, stick with PCs. If you generally order packages from places like Dell then there's little difference between that and ordering from Apple. Most Dell customers wouldn't replace their motherboard either. Hard drive yes, dvd drive yes, ram yes. Guess what. You can replace all of those on a Mac too.

I use all sorts of systems, from Macs for everyday stuff (web, email, photography), windows (work and games) and linux (server). As a long time Mac user however I keep hearing the same old arguments from Windows users. I'm waiting for the day when Apple throws it all in, starts selling windows boxes and someone complains that Apple sucks because the boxes are white instead of black. I'm also slightly amused that a Mac vs Windows war occurred on a Canon digital photography forum. Canon/Nikon wars maybe, but Mac/Windows?

[Jackal]

Get the PC and use the money towards the biggest LCD you can get with what you saved. PC does everything perfect and I don't care about a flashy bubly animated OS.

I've been using windows since 3.1 and have yet to have a problem with it. Only problem was Windows ME. Let's not talk about that garbage, though. XP has been running flawlessly since it was released for me. No crashes. No viruses. No problems.

Just know what you're doing. If you want to keep your PC running perfect then follow these simple guidelines:

-Install anti virus and keep it updated (free-av.com)
-Install zonealarm (firewall)
-Install Firefox and never touch IE ever again
-Don't open strange emails or download strange things.

That's it.

[Mathiau]

In response to Mathiau:

Viruses: You have no clue how software works do you. Just because Macs now run on intel chips doesn't mean the viruses work too. Just like you can't run all the windows software unless you install windows.

My arguement was because Apple is going to X86 and such it's market share should grow, especially with boot camp - which in turn will make it a more appealing target - i know just because they are using x86 doesnt mean windows code will work - That is my fualt i should have clarified.


Windows works for you and doesn't crash: I'm a .NET programmer for a living. Not a day goes by where I don't curse Microsoft for something (usually VSS). I'm not talking about crashes. I'm talking about a simple function that for some reason doesn't work the way it's supposed to.


Coders i have heard like some of windows because of the api and .dll system for coding makes it easier... - is that not the case? I dont program so this is your area of expertiese.


Macs have drivers too: No argument except to say that I've found Macs have more default drivers so more new hardware tends to work in that generic way that hardware does when it hasn't had the driver installed.


Good to know, i will admit what irks me is that XP seems to get all of my hardware - BUT rarely seems to have network card drives for things like a Realtek or broadcom based NIC, some very popular companies, but other then that - well, i just reformated my laptop - inspiron 9100 (had to replace the mobo) and the network and sound were the only 2 things not picked up.


That most viruses and other problems are caused by the user: One acronym - IE.


Yes, this is true - IE lets in too many things - why i like FireFox and Opera, IE 7 is a big step from previous IE's, but even people with IE and virus scanners and such, still get in fected because they bypass the security on their systems for purdy flashing advertisments :)


How many video cards can you buy for your MAC vs a PC ? Same amount


ATI as an example

MAC products:

I count 12 from as far back as when Radeon started
http://www.ati.com/products/mac.html

PC
(for link click products and look at most all other catergories)
I count 21 alone on the front page of home and office alone -
nd that doesnt count the 2-4 sub categories of the x19 / x18 / x8 line of cards

So well over 30 cards - and NVIDIA is the same - and then you have the other companies like BFG / eVGA / sapphire / asus who all make variations of those cards

So no, no where near the same.


I highly doubt that...
How many CPU options do you jave for you MAC vs a PC ? What about socket types? For any given socket the number of CPU's is limited to a few GHz difference. And changing socket type requires a new motherboard which leads to...


Yes, but at least you haver the option from going from a say 2.4 ghz CPU upto 3.2ghz over the span of 2 years to get more performance out of your system if it is lacking instead of being stuck with your 2ghz CPU you bought last year because they wont release anything else and if they do it will be a new socket.

MAC seems to come out with a new product and release maybe 2-3 CPU speeds and that is it until their next big release a few years later.



How many motherboards can you choose? How many can you choose between all the Dell packages? Or HP? or any of a dozen other PC packagers? What's the difference between motherboard x and y anyway? A few hertz on the memory bus? Most motherboards have the same features anyway. And most users won't know or care. If you build your own machines at that level, stick with PCs. If you generally order packages from places like Dell then there's little difference between that and ordering from Apple. Most Dell customers wouldn't replace their motherboard either. Hard drive yes, dvd drive yes, ram yes. Guess what. You can replace all of those on a Mac too.


Dell / HP and others have FAR more options for customizing your system then Apple - on apples site i could choose more ram, or a larger harddrive for their laptop sections... Again, it would be nice if Apple increase their options. I know, some people dont need all of the options, and sometimes an abundance of options can confuse someone, but i think for apple to really grab the market by the nuts - they need to allow in more options and more freedom with the customization of their systems

Many mobo's do offer the same features, many dont, you can go from basically finding a mobo that has firewire, no firewire, X amount of USB ports, or Y amounts ATX / mATX , SATA and IDE< only SATA, only IDE.

Perhaps some people dont need those options, but for those who do, maybe they would have purchased a MAC instead of a PC, but they didnt because of the lack of options.


I use all sorts of systems, from Macs for everyday stuff (web, email, photography), windows (work and games) and linux (server). As a long time Mac user however I keep hearing the same old arguments from Windows users. I'm waiting for the day when Apple throws it all in, starts selling windows boxes and someone complains that Apple sucks because the boxes are white instead of black. I'm also slightly amused that a Mac vs Windows war occurred on a Canon digital photography forum. Canon/Nikon wars maybe, but Mac/Windows?

I feel my arguments all have base, and i always hear the same old arguments from MAC users - and yet i never and many people i know, experience the issues that MAC users always complain of.

I would love to get a new MAC system - i would love to be exposed to one, but my pocket book doesnt allow it for me.

Ithink Apple is a large enough company now that they could afford to allow in more options in their O/S for selections on hardware.

With OS X Apple is in a great position to give windows a run - unlike Linux who can not get their act together, the various distributers - Linux will not be able to compete with Windows on a desktop / home user level.

OS X can, and could, but somethings will need to change for that - they can keep their cases - i think the G5 case is sexy! and frankly OS was more or less "garbage" as well intil OS X came along, previous to that like OS 9, multitasking was a joke! and considering the field MAC's were used for - where multitasking was something everyone would be doing, their support for it, and ram allocation was ridiculous!


I didnt mean to turn this into a PC vs MAC debate, - i wanted to point out why one may be more appealing then the other, MAC have their niche, PC's have their niche, but MAC's are not as unique in their niche any more as they were 5 years ago.

[peatoire]

Let's just say it's a case of 'horses for courses' and be done with it ;-)

[StevenRaith]

Get a mac if you just want to be able to turn it on, [and once it has been released in x86 versions] buy the software, and go.

Buy a PC if you like tinkering and have a bit of awareness about how the guts of an x86 architecture Win32 OS works with regard to drivers, etc.

I like Windows machines because I can use variants of drivers, modify those drivers, modify the hardware, change the hardware, as and when I go along.

However I know that if I ever got to the stage where had the money, and I just wanted a machine to browse the web, do my email and a bit of PS, I'd probably get a Mac to compliment an XP/vista machine that I would be using for hardware testing/dev stuff, etc.

Horses for courses is correct.

Now dry yer eyes, the lot of ya ;)

[Riken]

Ithink Apple is a large enough company now that they could afford to allow in more options in their O/S for selections on hardware.

With OS X Apple is in a great position to give windows a run - unlike Linux who can not get their act together, the various distributers - Linux will not be able to compete with Windows on a desktop / home user level.Something I read recently changed my mind about this. I use to think that too until I read this (http://daringfireball.net/2006/04/asinine_and_or_risky_ideas) which basically points out that Apple is a hardware company that uses OSX to sell hardware. So I don't think that what you described is likely to happen.
OS X can, and could, but somethings will need to change for that - they can keep their cases - i think the G5 case is sexy! and frankly OS was more or less "garbage" as well intil OS X came along, previous to that like OS 9, multitasking was a joke! and considering the field MAC's were used for - where multitasking was something everyone would be doing, their support for it, and ram allocation was ridiculous!*cringes* OS9 is the Windows ME of the Mac world. OS8 is Win98 and OSX is XP (sort of). It's not like WinME was any good :D

[Double Negative]

You can lead a horse to water...

*shrug*

Use whatever works for you. All I know is I've been doing this for nearly 30 years and I won't touch a Windows PC. Draw your own conclusions.

[staciecd]

I've learned that Mac users are diehard, but PC users seem comfortable with either choice. I had to make the decision in November and got a Dell. Except for poor customer service, everything has been great. I got a better machine for less money and didn't have to convert my software.

My fiance just got a mac notebook and likes it. I think that he likes the laptop more - he doesn't see a real difference in performance. He likes the bells and whistles of the mac, but paid alot for all of that fluff.

Stacie

[Mathiau]

thanks for the link, interesting read, I would have thought apple would of liked to expand it's hardware base to sell more units..... not limit them.

:) WIndows Me, man what a JOKE!! windows 98 with windows 2000 icons! and absolutly nothing worth while on it! i cant beleive that made it out the door!

[JeffsJeep04]

I've learned that Mac users are diehard, but PC users seem comfortable with either choice. I had to make the decision in November and got a Dell. Except for poor customer service, everything has been great. I got a better machine for less money and didn't have to convert my software.

My fiance just got a mac notebook and likes it. I think that he likes the laptop more - he doesn't see a real difference in performance. He likes the bells and whistles of the mac, but paid alot for all of that fluff.

Stacie
We are diehard for a good reason ;)

I was windows only for quite a while...once you start actually using the mac, you start to realize that there are some things in windows you just put up with...once you don't have to anymore, they frustrate you when you go back.

As for macs being less for tinkering with....I find quite the opposite to be true. The OS is yours to modify as you see fit. You can write scripts to execute common tasks for you. Automater makes this a drag and drop affair. On windows you have lots of little hidden windows, things running in the background, etc. I like to know what my machine is doing :lol:

[Double Negative]

Well hey, someday at least you'll have those SIX different versions of Longhorn^H^H^H^H^HVista to look forward to. ;)

Maybe they should just call it Windows 2004-2007. :razz:

[Riken]

Maybe they should just call it Windows 2004-2007. :razz:I've heard Vista is being bundled with Duke Nukem Forever.

:lol:

[Mathiau]

I know unreal - an actually Vista i have heard could have upto 13 versions!!!! dam that fancy GUI crap.


lol Riken, no wonder Vista keeps getting delayed for Duke Nukem Never :)

[bonzaisushi]

When is vista coming out? what a joke.

[Mathiau]

2007 sometime, but who knows since they keep having to redo the code for legal reason and crap.

i wont buy vista until it has had @ least 6+ months to mature and to see just how bad the DRM in it is.

XP is perfect for my needs! and if they lock down XP - it will just get cracked to hell, just as vista will as well when it comes out.

[JCR]

Damnit is my mac ready yet? my chips are cold and my shake is melting!

I love these kinda discussions :D

[JCR]

Actually what really fascinates me is the human mentality, were all white, or were all black, or were all white that likes rock, or were all black that likes rap..
but hang on

were also all white, like rock and prefer harleys, but those guys like yamaha..
oh no wait! were all white like rock like harley and like photography but hate nikkon..
there was an old lady that swallowed a fly :)

It's a tool ladies and gents, it performs a function. If you like the red handled screwdriver say aye! if you prefer blue say nay.
but it's still a screwdriver and both colours do pretty well at what their made for. Personally I find it tricky sourcing left handed ones. Trouble is a screwdriver can be used as a weapon too.

[Double Negative]

Everybody knows the blue screwdrivers are superior to the red ones. Give it a rest, already.

:razz:

[Mathiau]

So can laptop, if you throw it just right and it was heavy enough you could probably take a head off.

But, also a screw driver is not just a screw driver :) - What materials was it made of? will it dull easily, ona flat head will the end break off under too much pressure?

:)

[bonzaisushi]

So can laptop, if you throw it just right and it was heavy enough you could probably take a head off.

But, also a screw driver is not just a screw driver :) - What materials was it made of? will it dull easily, ona flat head will the end break off under too much pressure?

:)


ahhh yes, and there are some high dollar screwdrivers that can be used for multiple applications with many differnt Attachments.

[jbkalla]

ahhh yes, and there are some high dollar screwdrivers that can be used for multiple applications with many differnt Attachments.

Oh, yeah, sure! If we're talking African Screwdrivers... (to the banging of coconuts) :-)

[Citizensmith]

if i go with that Will aperture be ok for general photo editing?

Nobody seems to have commented on Appeture. Apple fired all the senior staff on the design team and are offering anyone who bought it a fairly large refund. That should probably tell you how badly it sucks.

[jbkalla]

Nobody seems to have commented on Aperture. Apple fired all the senior staff on the design team and are offering anyone who bought it a fairly large refund. That should probably tell you how badly it sucks.

uh, I read somewhere here that they also hired a new staff. I've never heard that it sucked. Of course, I can't run it on my G4, so THAT sucks!

[NickC]

Nobody seems to have commented on Appeture. Apple fired all the senior staff on the design team...

This is speculation having been mentioned on a few rumor sites that claim having "inside information." Every time I see someone repeat the story, it changes in breadth and scope. For example, Citizensmith says "all the senior staff" when the original rumor said "several engineers." Design team does not equal engineering team. Senior staff does not equal engineering team. And fired does not equal asked to leave.

Read it for yourself! No mention of senior staff. No mention of design team. No mention of fired. (other sites may have changed the story but I believe ThinkSecret broke the story)

http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0604aperture.html

[Double Negative]

It's no secret that Aperture kinda sucks. It's a great program, nice features and eye candy. But it's a real pig and needn't be. Plus, it's only a v1.0 product with a quick v1.1 fix. If Apple sticks with it, I'm sure it can be a great program like FCP.

Regardless, one piece of software doesn't change my mind about the platform. I love my Macs. :-P

[JCR]

A challenge? http://www.clicksmilies.com/s0105/spezial/Fool/duel.gif
http://www.driverheaven.net/photoshop/
Ladies and gentlemen start your engines, or in the case of the mac, wind up the rubber bands :D

[PuR HART]

why would anyone spend 300 bucks and not put that toward PSCS2 it boggles me I have heard not so good of stuff about Aperture

[jbkalla]

why would anyone spend 300 bucks and not put that toward PSCS2 it boggles me...


Good point! Photoshop should be the first editing investment on anyone's PC/Mac! Aperture isn't a photo editor, though it can do some RAW editing. It was meant to be used before Photoshop in the workflow.

[Riken]

Aperture does not equal Photoshop
Aperture equals Adobe Bridge