Making the monitor and printer match

[Highland]

Would anyone be so kind as to post step by step instructions for setting up monitor and printer. OS=XP, Printer=i950.

I cannot seem to get the two to match no matter what.

Thanks
Don

[Webster]

Don't have step by step instructions, but I can tell you that unless you have invested in a profiling kit complete with monitor sensor, you haven't got a chance. With profiling software and no monitor sensor you can get kind of close, but not spot on. Even with the very best (very expensive) profiling gear, unless you completely control the lighting around the monitor you won't get a consistent match, since our visual system adjusts the perceived white balance to match ambient color.

If you're not willing to invest in some decent profiles, then it's quite possible to learn to adjust the color balance of the image itself so that your photos will print correctly.

[kafene]

Highland wrote:
Would anyone be so kind as to post step by step instructions for setting up monitor and printer. OS=XP, Printer=i950.

I cannot seem to get the two to match no matter what.

Thanks
Don

I don't think I'd even think about investing in equipment to calibrate monitor/printers, especially for home use.

Webster's right, there's really no way to nail it. If there was all the prepress houses would have it, including many designers and arthouses. :-)

This is what one of the good Photoshop guys do at my work. He calibrates the monitor using the adjustments that came with the OS (this is all on the Mac and I realize you have a PC). It's not the greatest tool, but it gets you to a kind of visual conistency.

Since color management is not a perfect science, what I suggest is to realize and learn the differences between your monitor and the printer. You will need to start off with a decent monitor and be able to make adjustments to a CONSISTENT and CONSTANT level. If you have a monitor that changes brightness or contrast each day, than it's pointless. Have the picture the way you like it and make a test print.

If the picture comes out a little bright or too dark, make the adjustments to the image and print it out again. Keep a layer in Photoshop with the adjustments so that you can keep making them on that layer until the picture comes out the way you like it. Now at this point, the picture you see on the monitor will not look like the way you want, but the printer image will. Essentially, you've swapped the visual between the monitor and the printer. Now the PRINTER is giving you what you like and the MONITOR is not. The image can then be saved with the adjustments layers. Now you'll need to make some profiles or apply by cut/paste the layers adjustment to see if it works on the other images of like exposures. You may need to set up several profiles or settings. You'll also be making plenty of test prints. Once you get these done, you'll have a "decent" workflow for getting close to what you want.

Don't forget to SAVE the image WITH the adjustment layers or make back-ups of the original images.

kafene.

[MediaMagic]

webster wrote:
Even with the very best (very expensive) profiling gear, unless you completely control the lighting around the monitor you won't get a consistent match, since our visual system adjusts the perceived white balance to match ambient color.


What is considered to be the best ambient lighting? It is better to work in the dark with only the light from the monitor? Or certain bulbs at specific angles to the monitor glass?

[scottbergerphoto]

Here's a poor man's way:
1. Use Adobe Gamma that should be in your Windows XP Control Panel to calibrate your monitor (CRT not LCD). Turn off the lights. Save the profile you made as your working profile. Update it every few months.

2. Experiment with the printer settings on your printer software ( Digital Camera, sRGB, Photo Enhance, etc.) until you get a print that closely matches your monitor and use that setting.

I use an Epson 2200 set at sRGB in the printer drivers. I have my 10D set to sRGB but shoot raw and convert in BreezeBrowser. I post process in Photoshop Elements 2.0.
It's not full color management but it works.
Scott

[Highland]

Thanks Scott

[Mark Kemp]

Try the following

http://www.icehousedesigns.com/tools/monitor.php

http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints1A.html

http://www.photoscientia.co.uk/Gamma.htm

[Hatem Eldoronki]

Here's what I did:
I use Adobe Photoshop to edit/print my pictures. I didn't calibrate the monitor (since it didn't really matter: I'm using my laptop's LCD screen). I picked "Adobe RGB 1998" as my printer's color profile, in the 'Printers and Faxes" settings menu within the XP Control Panel. Matches perfectly.

[photography By Evangelos]

I have all my CRT and LCD displays calibrated with the Monaco OPTIX colorimeter and it is excellent. What I see is what prints out with LCD on the laptop and the CRT at home. I also use soft proofing soft ware which also helps in the final image for viewing the correct colors if you are very critical but I have stopped using it because the OPTIX has the monitors in perfect calibration. It runs around $239.00 for the Monaco OPTIX and here is a link for you.


http://www.dtgweb.com

[MediaMagic]

Photography By Evangelos wrote:
I have all my CRT and LCD displays calibrated with the Monaco OPTIX colorimeter and it is excellent. What I see is what prints out with LCD on the laptop and the CRT at home. I also use soft proofing soft ware which also helps in the final image for viewing the correct colors if you are very critical but I have stopped using it because the OPTIX has the monitors in perfect calibration. It runs around $239.00 for the Monaco OPTIX and here is a link for you.


http://www.dtgweb.com


So you also use this system rather than the sony color calibration on your Artisan?

[photography By Evangelos]

The Artisan monitior is used in a differant application and will not work on a regular CRT monitor like an LCD or on one of my regular CRT's.

[Vegas Poboy]

Not to start a fight but from my understanding most photo printers use the RGB setting for monitors, printers and scanners. I'm presently in a Digital Darkroom Class using PS7 and the sRGB is mostly used for web applications. I currently have all of my equipment matched using the Adobe calibration and get excactly what I see on my monitor. I'm still using the HP photosmart 1000 & Ilford inkjet paper.

I'm aware everyone has they're own preference, also the Digital Photoshop book by Scott Kelby recommends using the RGB setting.

[scottbergerphoto]

Vegas Poboy wrote:
Not to start a fight but from my understanding most photo printers use the RGB setting for monitors, printers and scanners. I'm presently in a Digital Darkroom Class using PS7 and the sRGB is mostly used for web applications. I currently have all of my equipment matched using the Adobe calibration and get excactly what I see on my monitor. I'm still using the HP photosmart 1000 & Ilford inkjet paper.

I'm aware everyone has they're own preference, also the Digital Photoshop book by Scott Kelby recommends using the RGB setting.

Hey Poboy,
Are we doing the same thing or am I missing something? Monitor calibrated with Adobe Gamma, Printer set to sRGB. Prints from Epson 2200 match the monitor.
Scott

[MediaMagic]

Photography By Evangelos wrote:
The Artisan monitior is used in a differant application and will not work on a regular CRT monitor like an LCD or on one of my regular CRT's.


Ah, I was just curious. I thought maybe you had found that the Sony calibration wasn't as useful/thorough as the third party. The Artisan is one of the monitors I am considering for purchase to use for my digital darkroom so that caught my attention.

David

[Vegas Poboy]

scottbergerphoto wrote:
Vegas Poboy wrote:
Not to start a fight but from my understanding most photo printers use the RGB setting for monitors, printers and scanners. I'm presently in a Digital Darkroom Class using PS7 and the sRGB is mostly used for web applications. I currently have all of my equipment matched using the Adobe calibration and get excactly what I see on my monitor. I'm still using the HP photosmart 1000 & Ilford inkjet paper.

I'm aware everyone has they're own preference, also the Digital Photoshop book by Scott Kelby recommends using the RGB setting.

Hey Poboy,
Are we doing the same thing or am I missing something? Monitor calibrated with Adobe Gamma, Printer set to sRGB. Prints from Epson 2200 match the monitor.
Scott

Not sure if we're missing I was just recently taught that all components should have the same ICC profile and that sRGB is used mostly on websites. Most Pro photo printers use RGB again if it works for you great.
It seems that every one adjust and prints a different way but to get what your looking @ the profiles should match. I was going to purchase a Pantone but right now I can't afford to purchase it and the Epson 2200 so I've set up a profile for my Printer & the locals Sams Club and I get what I see.

[design crusader]

scottbergerphoto,

Vegas Poboy was correct. The sRGB color space is not the optimum color space for viewing, editing, and printing RGB photographic images. Vegas Poboy was saying that he uses the Adobe RGB color space. Adobe RGB has a large color gamut that is more suited to print reproduction. If you have had a chance to review the 1Ds (or 10D) Workflow CD from CANON (free), you can see that the professional photographers featured on it all use the Adobe RGB color space (and are predominently on Macs).

What was the reason for sRGB, it seems was created for the PC and for the web (Hewlett-Packard and Microsoft). It is so much PC that it is based on a gamma of 2.2, whereas Macs are a gamma of 1.8. Some would consider sRGB to be too limiting (small) of a color gamut and that it is possibly already outdated.

Here was the reported reason that sRGB was created, see the quote below:

-------------

To address these concerns and serve the needs of PC and Web based color imaging systems, we [Hewlett-Packard and Microsoft] propose a colorimetric RGB specification that is based on the average performance of personal computer displays.

-------------

Heavy Photoshop users and others are familiar with the high quality of EPSON printers and the need for a wide RGB color gamut like Adobe RGB.

Hope this sheds some light on what Vegas Poboy was saying.

[scottbergerphoto]

design crusader wrote:
scottbergerphoto,

Vegas Poboy was correct. The sRGB color space is not the optimum color space for viewing, editing, and printing RGB photographic images. Vegas Poboy was saying that he uses the Adobe RGB color space. Adobe RGB has a large color gamut that is more suited to print reproduction. If you have had a chance to review the 1Ds (or 10D) Workflow CD from CANON (free), you can see that the professional photographers featured on it all use the Adobe RGB color space (and are predominently on Macs).

What was the reason for sRGB, it seems was created for the PC and for the web (Hewlett-Packard and Microsoft). It is so much PC that it is based on a gamma of 2.2, whereas Macs are a gamma of 1.8. Some would consider sRGB to be too limiting (small) of a color gamut and that it is possibly already outdated.

Here was the reported reason that sRGB was created, see the quote below:

-------------

To address these concerns and serve the needs of PC and Web based color imaging systems, we [Hewlett-Packard and Microsoft] propose a colorimetric RGB specification that is based on the average performance of personal computer displays.

-------------

Heavy Photoshop users and others are familiar with the high quality of EPSON printers and the need for a wide RGB color gamut like Adobe RGB.

Hope this sheds some light on what Vegas Poboy was saying.
The Epson 2200 printer drivers do not have a selection for Adobe RGB. What do you suggest. I use photoshop Elements 2.0 which I don't believe is a color savy app.

[design crusader]

I have never used Photoshop Elements 2.0.

But, in Photoshop 7.01, the Print Preview dialogue box gives you radio buttons to select your Source Space--you would select Adobe RGB; and radio buttons to select your Print Space--you would choose your EPSON printer driver (EPSON 2200 Standard driver).

Is this possible in Elements? I am not sure. But, to start with, I can recommend that on your 10D you set your parameters for the Adobe RGB color space. Then, when you convert the RAW file to TIFF and open it in Photoshop (or Elements?), I recommend that you immediately assign your 16 bit file to the Adobe RGB color space. The only other color space that I would recommend is ColorMatch RGB. However, I generally only recommend the ColorMatch RGB space for images that are low key (in a low key image the Histogram would show that most of the info is in the three-quater tones and shadows -- far left portion). Don't get me wrong, Adobe RGB does a great job keeping rich saturated full colors, but with low key images it has a tendency to loose detail (seems to decrease the dynamic range a little).

Let me know if this helps. Thanks.

[Vegas Poboy]

Another way is to set the color management under control panel- properties and you'll see abox that you can load color profiles into. Also do the same for your scanner.

[scottbergerphoto]

Vegas Poboy wrote:
Another way is to set the color management under control panel- properties and you'll see abox that you can load color profiles into. Also do the same for your scanner.
Did it! Thanks Poboy and Design Crusader.
Scott

[Vegas Poboy]

scottbergerphoto wrote:
Vegas Poboy wrote:
Another way is to set the color management under control panel- properties and you'll see abox that you can load color profiles into. Also do the same for your scanner.
Did it! Thanks Poboy and Design Crusader.
Scott

Great since you're using the 2200 let me know if your prints has improved any.