I'm Lost with Flash

[GhillieSkins]

Hi Everybody,

This may sound stupid but I'm trying to figure out the best way to handle a situation, am wondering what you may think is best for me.

Scenario: I will be taking photos indoors of products and will be dependent upon flash for lighting, 10D is the camera being used, which is best?

#1 Master/Slave flash:
If so is thier a flash bracket in which 2 flashes can be attached? My thinking here is that a 420EX on one side and a 420EX on the other side facing inward at a 45 degree angle would eliminate any shadow. But after second thought this may be overkill when all the shooting is being done within 10 feet.

Option 2:
Buy one flash (like a 420 or 550EX) and buy a hood to cover it so it softens the light when shooting the product.

Option 3:
This thing : http://porterscamerastore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=13-0242&Category_Code=F3C

Thanks experts for your help!

[robertwgross]

I was doing something vaguely like this the other day. I set up my camera on a tripod, and it was pointed at the product. On the hot shoe, I used the ST-E2 as the master. Then a couple of feet off to the left was the 550EX flash (on tripod) as a slave and off to the right was the 420EX flash (on tripod) as the other slave. Then I used pieces of white foam board to build a box around the outside. That way, light was bouncing all the way around.

---Bob Gross---

[MediaMagic]

robertwgross wrote:
I was doing something vaguely like this the other day. I set up my camera on a tripod, and it was pointed at the product. On the hot shoe, I used the ST-E2 as the master. Then a couple of feet off to the left was the 550EX flash (on tripod) as a slave and off to the right was the 420EX flash (on tripod) as the other slave. Then I used pieces of white foam board to build a box around the outside. That way, light was bouncing all the way around.

---Bob Gross---


I'm almost positive you've just solved a problem I was having shooting some small musical instruments. I never thought to build a box around it.

[robertwgross]

MediaMagic wrote:
...
I'm almost positive you've just solved a problem I was having shooting some small musical instruments. I never thought to build a box around it.

Ahh. One more thing if the musical instrument is metallic.....

If it is a brass instrument, like a trumpet, then do the lights like we discussed. Then above it all someplace, string up some Christmas tree lights. In a studio setting, I use higher intensity bulbs, and I string them up red-blue-green-red-blue-green. This is similar to over-stage lighting. Let those colors magically dance over the metallic surface and turn down the flash intensity a bit.

---Bob Gross---

[scottbergerphoto]

Consider reading the book: Mastering Flash Photography by Susan McCartney. It's available at Amazon.com. It's a great book.
Scott

[MediaMagic]

robertwgross wrote:
MediaMagic wrote:
...
I'm almost positive you've just solved a problem I was having shooting some small musical instruments. I never thought to build a box around it.

Ahh. One more thing if the musical instrument is metallic.....

If it is a brass instrument, like a trumpet, then do the lights like we discussed. Then above it all someplace, string up some Christmas tree lights. In a studio setting, I use higher intensity bulbs, and I string them up red-blue-green-red-blue-green. This is similar to over-stage lighting. Let those colors magically dance over the metallic surface and turn down the flash intensity a bit.

---Bob Gross---


I can visualize the effect of the Christmas lights. That's a fantastic idea (it amazes me what you pros come up with). Is there a recommended distance for the lights above the instrument that works best for you? or does that really matter?

Thanks for these excellent tips.

David

[DaveG]

GhillieSkins wrote:
Hi Everybody,

This may sound stupid but I'm trying to figure out the best way to handle a situation, am wondering what you may think is best for me.

Scenario: I will be taking photos indoors of products and will be dependent upon flash for lighting, 10D is the camera being used, which is best?

#1 Master/Slave flash:
If so is thier a flash bracket in which 2 flashes can be attached? My thinking here is that a 420EX on one side and a 420EX on the other side facing inward at a 45 degree angle would eliminate any shadow. But after second thought this may be overkill when all the shooting is being done within 10 feet.

Option 2:
Buy one flash (like a 420 or 550EX) and buy a hood to cover it so it softens the light when shooting the product.

Option 3:
This thing : http://porterscamerastore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=13-0242&Category_Code=F3C

Thanks experts for your help!



1) When I light products I use a portrait lighting set-up to begin with. That means that the main light is about one stop more powerful than the fill. You must put the fill within 20 degrees of the camera so both sides of the subject will have the same light fall on it. The main can be anywhere you'd like but mostly at about 45 degrees to the subject.

If you want to use the wireless TTL funtions that the Canon system offers you'll have to start with a 550EX as the master (the 420 can only be a slave not a master) and even though this is a more powerful flash it's going to be your fill. A second 550EX or more likely the more affordable 420X will be the main. The 420 should be set as the B group flash and the 550 will default to A. Select a 1:3 lighting ratio - in stops that's almost one stop and any media: colour neg, slide or digital will handle that latitude without any problem.

2) A flash is a point source of light. The only way to make it less of a point source is to get it very close to the subject or to make the light very big. Bouncing the light into an umbrella will make a softer area light, but putting a Stofen diffuser on a flash won't. The Stofen or any product like that will produce a slightly larger point source. I use a Stofen when I want to cover with a super wide angle lens or if I have some confidence that I'll get bounce reflections from the ceiling and walls. I wouldn't want to depend on this for product photography

3) That looks like a difficult way to get fill flash. That light is going to be within 20 degrees of your camera, and by definition is fill. You will want more directional light for you main.

4) This is the way I'd do it.

If your product is relatively small (literally table top) I'd find a room with some big windows and no direct sunshine. I'd buy a couple of reflectors. B&H (and others) sell round fold up reflectors. The come with a zip-on cover that has four surfaces, gold, silver, white and black. You can put the product on the table and use the sunlight as your main. The reflectors can be used to throw some light into the shadows. Since you CANNOT overpower the main light this way (something called conservation of energy!) you can't mess up. Two of these reflectors and stands will probably cost you less than one 420.

If you have no money at all you could get foam-core from an art supply store that would work almost as well. I've seen all white, all black, and black/white kinds of foam core. Don't dismiss the black either since it's useful as a "negative light" as well as an emergency background, but the double sided black/white would be the most versitile.

If you do got to an art supply store ask them if they have any damaged foam-core available. You don't really care if a corner of this stuff is snapped off - and you're likely to do it yourself, sooner rather than later - so save some money.

[robertwgross]

MediaMagic wrote:
I can visualize the effect of the Christmas lights. That's a fantastic idea (it amazes me what you pros come up with). Is there a recommended distance for the lights above the instrument that works best for you? or does that really matter?


The original idea came up from memories in a concert band on a stage. They would always have rows and rows of colored stage lights up high over the stage. That created lots of colored reflections in the brass instruments.

So, if we have properly scaled down from stage lighting, we might use 10-watt or 20-watt high intensity bulbs at a range of 5 feet above the subject. I shoot with a main light "in the subject's face" and then scattered secondary lights, depending on what I am trying to highlight. The colored bulbs are overhead, so they should not have any effect on color at the subject's face. They should only reflect off the metal reflective surfaces.

What I am trying to do is to rig up a mirror so that I can get twice as many colored spots as without the mirror.

---Bob Gross---

[GhillieSkins]

Thank you everyone for your suggestions, it is very helpful.