Rebel XT VS Nikon D70s

[Brian Tilley]

I'm ready to step up to a DSLR. Considering the Rebel XT and the Nikon D70s.

Any thoughts on how the two compare, primarily in terms of image quality?

The guy at the local camera shop says the D70s produces better images, even though the XT is 8 MP VS the 6 MP for the Nikon.

Looks like the basic kit lens is better on the Nikon.


Thanks

[lostdoggy]

MP is not a good indication of picture quality. They both are very capable camera w/ an excellent collection of lenses that can be attach to them. Just remeber this you are asking this question a Majority Canon owner Forum and will most likely get a very bias answer. But, this is one of the most friendliest photo forum you'll find on the web and may I say the helpful as well.

[basroil]

i checked out rebel xt, 20d, 10d, d50, d70, d70s back when i got my xt. the image quality of the d70/d70s/d50 is on par with the 10d until iso800, where it dies and you really can't use too many of those pics from a d70. rebel xt/20d have better sensors, so lower noise thoughout the range, and a lot less 400-1600. kit lens on nikon may indeed be better, but it's an slr you are talking about, that's why so many lenses are avaliable to choose from. don't buy the camera with the better performance out of the box, get the one you won't want to replace after you get a few lenses (if you will never get other lenses, get a prosumer point and shoot). the rebel xt will give you better pictures than d70, but be prepaired to spend more than twice the camera's price on lenses. it would go for the d70 as well, so don't think you'll get out of buying lenses. slrs are expensive, but the quality is worth it, at least to me.

[FlashZebra]

Read these:

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos350d/

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikond70/

Note: Image wise and functionally the D70 and D70S are very alike. The D70S does have some enhancements, including a larger viewing LCD.

Enjoy! Lon

[Ryanisme]

isnt the LCD just for reveiwing purposes tho?
and not image taking porposes?

in my opinion a slightly larger LCD to view a pic youve already taken isnt a reason to take one over the other...

on another hand
im getin my hands on a d70 to check out
gonna play with it a while

then decide weather i want a d70 or the canon 30E

[Tee Why]

I'm ready to step up to a DSLR. Considering the Rebel XT and the Nikon D70s.

Any thoughts on how the two compare, primarily in terms of image quality?

The guy at the local camera shop says the D70s produces better images, even though the XT is 8 MP VS the 6 MP for the Nikon.

Looks like the basic kit lens is better on the Nikon.


Thanks
Sounds like the salesman is trying to get rid of the Nikon D70s prior to the announcement of the D80 on Aug. 9th to me. The Rebel XT is expected to be replaced come Sep. as well after Canon announces it's replacement on Aug/Sept as well. So you may want to hold off till then if you want the latest and the greatest. The D80 is going to be a 10.2MP sensor a la Sony alpha A100. DPR just tested it and it's noisier than the canon at higher ISO's.

Anyway, if you are worred about image quality only, the Canon is better. If you are considering other issues such as system, lenses, ergonomics, prices, then it'll be a personal decision. Both will be replaced in a month or so, so you can get good deals on the older models.
If I were you, I'd wait for the new release and get those. If you must have one now, which ever one fits your hands/budget/photographic needs better.
Good luck
P.S. I'd take what sales people say with a grain of salt.

[R Hardman]

While not the D70 here is an article of intrest. http://www.popphoto.com/cameras/1924/hotshot-shoot-out.html

[Brian Tilley]

Thanks for the comments.

The salesman also insisted that "because the sensor in the XT is smaller than the one in the D70s" I will get better quality results from the D70s. I didn't realize until I got home, that the XT uses CMOS, while the D70s uses a CCD. Looks like we are comparing apples to oranges, so size may be irrelevant. He claimed that the XT's sensor is too small to get good 8MP images.


My main question is this:
If we were to put equal quality lenses on each camera, which one would produce better pictures?

I would think that under ideal circumstances, an 8MP would be preferable to a 6MP one. More detail and more to work with in Photoshop.

[Scorper]

The D70s pictures have an awful lot of noise, ISO1600 is totally unuseable and even ISO800 is pretty bad. Ergonomics on the D70s is better than on the 350D though (though you can buy the battery grip and that makes it alot better).

[tbrasington]

The salesman speaks lies! Both are capable cameras. I have the XT and spent the weekend playing with a D70 which my friend has. I would go with the XT over the d70 just as I do shoot a lot at high ISO levels. I would post some comparrison pictures but I can't due to copyright reasons. ( I was shooting an exhibition.)

[05Xrunner]

sounds like you where at Ritz...one of them tried telling me a d50 is better and produces better pics then canon

[StewartR]

I looked at the D50 and D70 before I bought my 350D about 3 months ago. I thought the Canon scored more highly on ergonomics, LCD quality (much sharper and more detailed than the Nikon, despite being smaller) and especially on the ease-of-use of changing the setup and using the menus. I'd read the reviews that say Nikons are noisier at high ISO values, and I thought the 1.6 versus 1.5 crop factor would have some benefit too as I do more long-lens shooting than wideangle.

[Mr. Clean]

Thanks for the comments.

The salesman also insisted that "because the sensor in the XT is smaller than the one in the D70s" I will get better quality results from the D70s. I didn't realize until I got home, that the XT uses CMOS, while the D70s uses a CCD. Looks like we are comparing apples to oranges, so size may be irrelevant. He claimed that the XT's sensor is too small to get good 8MP images.


My main question is this:
If we were to put equal quality lenses on each camera, which one would produce better pictures?

I would think that under ideal circumstances, an 8MP would be preferable to a 6MP one. More detail and more to work with in Photoshop.

At the ISO 100 the difference would be hardly noticeable, perhaps a tad better on the XT. At higher ISO's, the XT's picture quality would be better. Really it comes down to which one you prefer aesthetically. Both Canon and Nikon have good third party lenses available, but just by randon searching it appears that Nikkor lenses are far more expensive without added much to IQ.

[tbrasington]

I thought Nikon's didn't have ISO 100? Just 200+. Or is that different in the D70s and D200 ?

[prep]

I have used the D70 somewhat, and have played briefly with the 350.

To the best of my knowlege, both use an APS-C sized sensors.

The noise from high ISO images from the 70 is much higher. Even with daylight shots, shadows can pick up a suprising amout of noise, esp if you are pushing things for action shots.

The control, indicator, and general layout of the D70 make me wonder just what Nikon where thinking. Putting the on-off switch around the shutter release is an acident looking for somewhere to happen. Menus are pretty OK though.

The thing that Nikon wins on is the SB-800 flash and it ilk. But, that does not overcome the drawbacks on the 70.

I don't like the 350 much, much much prefer the 1 style controls, but it is in my opinion much less trap prone than the Nikon.

Also EF lenses are ahead of Nikors, except for the very short end of the range. Canon has not a good unit in that range yet... But yes, the standard kit Nikor is very good compared to other kit junkers. But, why not get a good lens for either?

[basroil]

Thanks for the comments.

The salesman also insisted that "because the sensor in the XT is smaller than the one in the D70s" I will get better quality results from the D70s. I didn't realize until I got home, that the XT uses CMOS, while the D70s uses a CCD. Looks like we are comparing apples to oranges, so size may be irrelevant. He claimed that the XT's sensor is too small to get good 8MP images.


My main question is this:
If we were to put equal quality lenses on each camera, which one would produce better pictures?

Sounds like the salesman is trying to get rid of the Nikon D70s prior to the announcement of the D80 on Aug. 9th to me. The Rebel XT is expected to be replaced come Sep. as well after Canon announces it's replacement on Aug/Sept as well. So you may want to hold off till then if you want the latest and the greatest. The D80 is going to be a 10.2MP sensor a la Sony alpha A100. DPR just tested it and it's noisier than the canon at higher ISO's.

if you thought a 8mp 1.6 crop was bad, a 10.2mp 1.5 crop (ie a100 or d80, both have same horrible little ccd) would be much worse.

as for equal lens on both cameras, xt would win by far. 8mp over 6mp is a 33% improvement in image size, and the cmos sensor at anything over iso 200 would be better. by iso 1600, d70(s)/d50 (same sensor i believe if my memory holds) gets very noisy compared to a rebel xt, especially when looked at from converted raws (no denoise). if you can spend 2k instead, 30d+17-40mm f4L will give you much, much better looking pictures than either of the two cameras (for about 400 less, 20d will give you significant improvements, but still no 3% spot)

[05Xrunner]

I thought Nikon's didn't have ISO 100? Just 200+. Or is that different in the D70s and D200 ?

I dont know about D70's but my buddies D50 doesnt have ISO100 starts at 200

I just looked at the specs the D50 nor D70 have ISO100
Why would they not have ISO100

[liza]

Hard to say why they don't have ISO 100. Probably just a Nikon thing. As for D70 vs. XT, the XT wins out in the low noise at high ISO's department. My shooting buddy has a D70 and he's always griping about noise. He can't use ISO's above 800 without an unacceptable level (to him) of noise. On the other hand, Nikon's kit lens is better. But you aren't buying the camera for the kit lens, now are you? :)

[Tee Why]

XT has a 1.6 crop and the D70 has a 1.5 crop, so they pretty much have the same size sensor. Goto dpreview.com and see the images for yourself. The XT is a bit better at image quality but the biggest difference is in the noise at high ISO's.

By such logic putting 10.2 MP's into the same sensor size as a D70 as in the D200 would be the worst. I bet the camera salesman isn't saying that about the D200 though, that D70 has better image quality than the D200. He or she is either really ignorant about cameras and/or is telling you lies to sell you what product needs to move.

Goto dpreview or few other sites and do your own research. As for image quality, the XT is a bit better but it's not a hugh thing you'll easily notice. Go with features, price, ergonomics instead.

[Clint]

March 2006 issue of popular photography will help you with seven different cameras beeing compared, both CANON and nikon are in there,CANON came out on top of the majority of the test. GET THE CANON !!!!

[Tee Why]

Nah, see if they have any 1MP cameras since cramming less megapixels into a sensor is better.

[basroil]

how about a 4mp 1.3 crop (1d)?

and no, generally 1mp sensors are mcuh smaller than even 1.6crops. most are 4 crop or higher (yes, that's a lot)

[hegemon]

would it just be really stupid to go out and pay $750 for a 350D right now? I'm about to pull the trigger on this, but everyone seems so convinced that there's a new one coming out in September....

Although, Photokina isn't until the end of September, beginning of October.

[liza]

They'll probably announce it the week before the show, as they have in the past, but won't make it available for a week or two afterward. Some sites will do pre-orders, so you might keep that in mind.

[tbrasington]

With the actual release much later. Comes down to what you need and what you can afford. If you can afford to wait till the next 350d is out then wait. If not buy now and enjoy it. Unless you are desperate for extra features get the 30d or 5d if you need that larger resolution.

Otherwise the $750 is well spent. The 350d is an excellent camera.

[hegemon]

I'm tempted just to buy it now and eBay the sucker for $650 or $700 when the new one is out...

[mdmedicgod]

Ok, although I own a 20D they have the same sensor.

If you click on this link you will see the diffrence at night. We are no pro's nor amatures we are in the middle.

All the photos watermarked Wayne Barrall are shot with the D70s and all the ones watermarked Patrick Davis are from the 20d.

Before you click the link. Let me warn you its PJ shots of an accident scene. In case that type of thing disturbs you. However, its shows the image quality well

http://www.pbase.com/barrall74/72006_fruitland_mva_w_rescue

Patrick

[lostdoggy]

Ok, although I own a 20D they have the same sensor.

If you click on this link you will see the diffrence at night. We are no pro's nor amatures we are in the middle.

All the photos watermarked Wayne Barrall are shot with the D70s and all the ones watermarked Patrick Davis are from the 20d.

Before you click the link. Let me warn you its PJ shots of an accident scene. In case that type of thing disturbs you. However, its shows the image quality well

http://www.pbase.com/barrall74/72006_fruitland_mva_w_rescue

Patrick

The ones by PD was significantly better then the ones by WB as far as noise is concern.

They are very impressive considering the fact they were taken @ 3200iso.

[Tee Why]

would it just be really stupid to go out and pay $750 for a 350D right now? I'm about to pull the trigger on this, but everyone seems so convinced that there's a new one coming out in September....

Although, Photokina isn't until the end of September, beginning of October.

It's upto you. Going by 300D and 350D so far, the new rebel is due out this fall in Aug/Sept. I suspect it'll be the same sensor Digic II with the same AF and plastic body and ISO 1600.

I think the main improvements maybe in the body, since everyone was complaining that it was too small, now standard 2.5 LCD, and picture style.

If you want these features and want to pay a bit more, then wait. If not and you want the XT at a good price, get the XT.

[rhys]

I have the XT and I'm just not that comfortable with it. In fact, I'm downsizing my Canon kit with the eventual aim of going back to Nikon.

[liza]

Ok, although I own a 20D they have the same sensor.



Actually, it isn't the same sensor. Similar,yes, but not the same.

[Brian Tilley]

Thanks to all for the comments.

It is good to hear from folks who have used both models and still say that the XT is at least as good as the D70s. Can't beat the price. Even after adding a good lens it may not cost much more than the D70s.

Looks like comes down to features and feel.

Rhys: Is it the feel of the camera, its features, or performance that you don't like about the XT?

Thanks again.