Lightroom

[canon shooter]

Any details on what the release version of Lightroom will be?

Will it be ony a RAW converter or will it be a stand alone that does RAW and finall editing. Will it replace Photoshop

[jfrancho]

Download and install the beta release and you'll see most of it. It does a lot more than catalog and convert raw, but not as much as PS.

[canon shooter]

Download and install the beta release and you'll see most of it. It does a lot more than catalog and convert raw, but not as much as PS.Are you using in connection with Photoshop or as a stand alone edit without Photoshop

[badfish]

Full release of lightroom for mac and pc is slated for Q4 of this year.

[blackviolet]

let's hope so (Q4), although the current beta three runs until january 07.

[jfrancho]

Are you using in connection with Photoshop or as a stand alone edit without PhotoshopI've been trying out as a sort of replacement to bridge. I can't quite figure out where it fits in the whole scheme. I have CS, CS2, iView, Photomatix, DPP, RSE and a couple of other utilities in my workflow, so adding another isn't too appealing, but there are some things that I like about Lightroom, beyond it's superficial "cool" look. As far as editing, so far I've just used the raw conversion part. It doesn't have the editing capability that I need, but I could survive if that was all I had. Some of the stuff looks pretty good.

[chris.bailey]

Lightroom is not advertised as a Photoshop replacement though it will do most things and in my experience do them very well. Once you get used to it the interface it is a damn good RAW image processor (though a little slow at the moment) and I now find myself using it pretty much as standard for RAW processing, cropping, and drafts leaving photoshop for things such as belemish removals etc.

My workflow is now -

1) Download and rename off CF cards using Adobe dng convertor.

2) Process dng Raws in Lightroom including Crops/B&W etc.

3) Export as Tiffs ready for final PS editing and as jpgs/pdfs for Web or disk previews

4) Touch up relevant Tiffs in PS for final Tiffs.

[fivefish]

1) Download and rename off CF cards using Adobe dng convertor.

2) Process dng Raws in Lightroom including Crops/B&W etc.

Just curious... why not just let Lightroom import the .CR2 file?

Why are you converting it first to .DNG?

I haven't worked using DNG before. Wondering if there's any advantages over the Canon RAW file format.

[jfrancho]

I'm sure that a search of DNG on this forum and a peek at Adobe's info on it would help you decide. I think it's a waste of time. Others think I'm foolish. Whatrya gonna do?

[chris.bailey]

Just curious... why not just let Lightroom import the .CR2 file?

Why are you converting it first to .DNG?

I haven't worked using DNG before. Wondering if there's any advantages over the Canon RAW file format.

Lightroom seems to work a little faster on a dng RAW file and the dng converter lets you import from card, rename and convert all in one step. I', not saying its the right workflow but it is working for me just now.

[canon shooter]

Lightroom is not advertised as a Photoshop replacement though it will do most things and in my experience do them very well. Once you get used to it the interface it is a damn good RAW image processor (though a little slow at the moment) and I now find myself using it pretty much as standard for RAW processing, cropping, and drafts leaving photoshop for things such as belemish removals etc.

My workflow is now -

1) Download and rename off CF cards using Adobe dng convertor.

2) Process dng Raws in Lightroom including Crops/B&W etc.

3) Export as Tiffs ready for final PS editing and as jpgs/pdfs for Web or disk previews

4) Touch up relevant Tiffs in PS for final Tiffs.Do you need a plug in to convert to DNG?

And then do you also save the original CR format file

[chris.bailey]

Do you need a plug in to convert to DNG?

And then do you also save the original CR format file

dng convertor is a free Adobe download and a stand alone application. I am not also keeping the CR file

[KevC]

I'm pretty disorganized with my files. I just draw my files from the card, then dump them on the desktop. However, I went on an extended vacation (~3mo) and I used my laptop exclusively.

So right now I have a whole bunch of CRW files everywhere. A problem is that I shot over 10k and now I have RAWs with the same name.

I'm thinking of using Lightroom to organize it all. I don't plan on going on a vacation anytime soon so I'll use my desktop exclusively as photo storage.

Thoughts? Lightroom is good with that? I want to rename, then possibly DNG. I always thought Lightroom/Aperture was more of a organizer than a post processor. I still have CS2 to do all that work.

[jfrancho]

If you have CS2, just use the batch rename to rename based on metadata such as date taken. Then you can break up the pics into logical groups.

[fivefish]

Lightroom/Aperture was more of a organizer than a post processor

It's both. It's PP is very good (I think, IMHO). The organizing part can still use some improvements.

And if you have an image editor like PS, you can export from LR to PS with all the LR image adjustments already applied, do your cloning in PS, save in PS, and LR will show the updated image.

It's still a BETA but I'm finding I'm using it more and more and will probably buy it when released.

[DaveG]

I've been trying out as a sort of replacement to bridge. I can't quite figure out where it fits in the whole scheme. I have CS, CS2, iView, Photomatix, DPP, RSE and a couple of other utilities in my workflow, so adding another isn't too appealing, but there are some things that I like about Lightroom, beyond it's superficial "cool" look. As far as editing, so far I've just used the raw conversion part. It doesn't have the editing capability that I need, but I could survive if that was all I had. Some of the stuff looks pretty good.

I don't get Lightroom. Everything that it can do as far as image manipulation goes should be in CS3 - or Adobe has had brain damage! As far as using it to track images, how do you do this over the next decade without a 20 terrabyte hard drive. Then maybe it'll make sense. I don't sort my professional work that way. I don't add custom metadata to 99% of the work and in a lot of cases I couldn't anyway.

To give an example consider a wedding. I shoot it in RAW and the total size is about 4 gig. The folder is called something like Jones Smith August 5 wedding, and then I have sub folders below that (card 1, 20D etc.) Then I do work on the files and produce .psd files for shots where I want to preserve layers. Eventually everything is converted to jpegs for printing and for files that go to the B&G. Now the total file size is about six to eight gig.

I may know the B&G's name but no one elses, and believe me I'm not going to start. So what could I put in the metadata to help me find stuff without creating a lot more work and no more functionality? Not to mention that this is one small wedding and it's 6+ gig! A typical small commercial assignment won't fit on a CD and I do a bunch of those each week. Since there are some serious storage issues, how can Lighthouse or anything else track images when the final direction has to be "Look in your filing cabinet. Find the Jones Smith wedding file and open the DVD."?

If I was a stock photographer then I'd have to track things in the Lightroom way and I'd have to pay the workflow price of creating metadata tags. But I suspect that for every (real) stock photographer out there, there are dozens of pro's like me.

I just think that Lighthouse's emperor isn't wearing any clothes, and I can't figure out why no one has pointed this out. As a new improved version of Bridge it may or may not be useful. As a wonder application I think that it's a snow job.

[fivefish]

Different people have different workflow. Here's mine that suitable for my needs.

I copy all my CF cards to a temp directory. I tell LightRoom where this temp directory is, and let Lightroom reference it in it's original location. (NOT IMPORT, unlike Aperture)

I quickly go through the pics, assigning a STAR level (1 star, 2 stars,... 5 stars). I do this step fast and am brutal with this judging.

Depending on the project, I may keep 3+ stars... or only keep 4 and 5 star rated photos. I adjust the search slider bar to show only 3, 4 or 5 star photos. The less than perfect shots are hidden away.

Then I perform tweaking,exposure, saturation, that kinda stuff on the remaining keepers. ... and may upgrade or downgrade my star ratings. Some pics go up to 5 stars, some get downgraded to 0 stars and get hidden automatically.

At the end of the tweaking, all remaining 3, 4 or 5 star photos get exported to DNG or JPG or whatever format I like, and export them to my RAID network drive in it's own YEAR/MONTH/PROJECT-NAME directory.

DONE!

The temp directory on my local hard drive is now deleted. The temporary import project folder in LR is also deleted.

BONUS: I then import/reference the YEAR/MONTH/PROJECT-NAME directory on my network drive (i.e. the keepers) into Lighroom... then I have thumbnails of those shots in Lightroom. If I need to go back and look for a photo, a quick scan of the thumbnails finds it... or I can do the STAR rating search.

I personally don't use IPTC/EXIF info.

[blackviolet]

everyone who is doing RAW conversions in Lightroom (both Windows and OSX) should be aware that any images converted/manipulated under the beta programme may not be read in the final release. this is due to a variety of code changes currently being implemented partially due to implementing some of pixmantec's elements together with other changes. in fact they jokingly said *guaranteed not...*. they are not maintaining any backwards compatability to beta releases.

[jfrancho]

I don't get Lightroom. Everything that it can do as far as image manipulation goes should be in CS3 - or Adobe has had brain damage! As far as using it to track images, how do you do this over the next decade without a 20 terrabyte hard drive. Then maybe it'll make sense. I don't sort my professional work that way. I don't add custom metadata to 99% of the work and in a lot of cases I couldn't anyway.

To give an example consider a wedding. I shoot it in RAW and the total size is about 4 gig. The folder is called something like Jones Smith August 5 wedding, and then I have sub folders below that (card 1, 20D etc.) Then I do work on the files and produce .psd files for shots where I want to preserve layers. Eventually everything is converted to jpegs for printing and for files that go to the B&G. Now the total file size is about six to eight gig.

I may know the B&G's name but no one elses, and believe me I'm not going to start. So what could I put in the metadata to help me find stuff without creating a lot more work and no more functionality? Not to mention that this is one small wedding and it's 6+ gig! A typical small commercial assignment won't fit on a CD and I do a bunch of those each week. Since there are some serious storage issues, how can Lighthouse or anything else track images when the final direction has to be "Look in your filing cabinet. Find the Jones Smith wedding file and open the DVD."?

If I was a stock photographer then I'd have to track things in the Lightroom way and I'd have to pay the workflow price of creating metadata tags. But I suspect that for every (real) stock photographer out there, there are dozens of pro's like me.

I just think that Lighthouse's emperor isn't wearing any clothes, and I can't figure out why no one has pointed this out. As a new improved version of Bridge it may or may not be useful. As a wonder application I think that it's a snow job.It's been a few weeks since really trying to get to know this program, and I keep finding myself saying, "Screw this!" and going back to Bridge and CS2. It kind of reminds me of these so called PS replacement apps, like Lightzone or IrfanView. Yes, it has a spiffy raw converter, but that's it. It's a lot of show, and no go. I agree, whatever development put into file browsing and raw conversion better be in CS3. And it better be presented as an evolution of the current product. Being a PS user since v. 4, I'm not up to the task of re-learning to use a monster app, and I probably only use 1% of it's total capability. As for the IPTC data comments, for events, I just use a single phrase that describes the event. For example, I used the text, "Ray Serafin and Al Meilutis invite the listeners to an open house at the 90.1 WGMC Studio." for the caption on all 130 images from that event. I don't plan to use anything other than the title and creation date for reference. They are all in their respective event folders in redundent storage. I can find that like everyone else does - browsing the dir and reading the names. I do include copyright, website, address, phone#, etc. in the metadata as well, but that's more for the customer/employer. I do the same with code or documentation I create for my day job. In conclusion, I don't think Adobe is trying to "snow" us as much as we snowed ourselves with all the hype. Many of us were big fans of Pixmantic's products, and expected Lightroom to be an extension of their work. Lightroom looks more like tangent, with their tech slapped in as an afterthought.

[Joel Hooks]

I've been EAGERLY awaiting lightroom for months. Checking my RSS reader hoping that the Labs will have finally released the windows beta.

I think the application has a lot of potential, but the performance is SLOW. I run a Dual AMD Opteron with 4gb of ram and a GF6800 Ultra. It reminded me of trying to run PS on my kids' computer. IF Adobe can fix this and get the RAW processing speeds up to snuff, I might get excited about this software. Until then i won't be using it. It doesn't offer any additional functionality beyond what Bridge does for me now, so I do not see the point.

[canon shooter]

everyone who is doing RAW conversions in Lightroom (both Windows and OSX) should be aware that any images converted/manipulated under the beta programme may not be read in the final release. this is due to a variety of code changes currently being implemented partially due to implementing some of pixmantec's elements together with other changes. in fact they jokingly said *guaranteed not...*. they are not maintaining any backwards compatability to beta releases.Is this true if converted to Jpeg or Tiff

[canon shooter]

I keep hearing people refer to Bridge. I assume this is a RAW converter. Can anyone provide link to website

[jfrancho]

Bridge is an enhanced file browser that comes with Photoshop, and works with the rest of Adobe's Creative Suite. It can launch Adobe Camera Raw, apply settings from camera raw to multi image selections, manages raw sidecar files, handles metadata tagging, renaming based on metadata or whatever you want, image preview, etc. It'll even allow you to run Photoshop actions as batch jobs on groups of images. It doesn't have the current vogue feature of creating catalogs, or albumns, as many other management systems. You just point it to a folder in the files list and it does it's thing.

[Tony-S]

I think the application has a lot of potential, but the performance is SLOW. I run a Dual AMD Opteron with 4gb of ram and a GF6800 Ultra. It reminded me of trying to run PS on my kids' computer. IF Adobe can fix this and get the RAW processing speeds up to snuff, I might get excited about this software. Until then i won't be using it. It doesn't offer any additional functionality beyond what Bridge does for me now, so I do not see the point.

The same seems true on my Mac Mini Core Duo. Aperture runs quite adequately (no speed-demon, though, because of an anemic video chip on the logic board), but LRb3 is dead-dog slow. It is a Universal app, so it should run better with the Intel chips. I'm sure once Adobe removes all the error-trapping code that LR surely has, it will run better on both Macs and Windows machines.

[jfrancho]

Is this true if converted to Jpeg or TiffI am sure that this refers to the recipe of raw settings. A .jpg or .tif are universal standards based formats, while raw are not. This is why when new cameras come out, unew updates for raw converters are reqired.

[KevC]

I just started importing ALL (2000+ and counting) my CRWs into Lightroom. It'll change them to DNG and organize into date for me. I'm happy it does that at least =). Pretty nice having everything organized like that.

[Jesper]

My workflow is now -

1) Download and rename off CF cards using Adobe dng convertor.
Do you know that Lightroom can convert RAW files to DNG itself while importing? You don't need to run them through the stand-alone DNG converter program first.

(At least, the Windows beta 3 version has the option to convert to DNG while importing).

[blackviolet]

Is this true if converted to Jpeg or Tiff

it won't affect images based upon .jpg and .tif. hopefully they will at least port any meta instructions that we've added in the beta to the final release.

[canon shooter]

Bridge is an enhanced file browser that comes with Photoshop, and works with the rest of Adobe's Creative Suite. It can launch Adobe Camera Raw, apply settings from camera raw to multi image selections, manages raw sidecar files, handles metadata tagging, renaming based on metadata or whatever you want, image preview, etc. It'll even allow you to run Photoshop actions as batch jobs on groups of images. It doesn't have the current vogue feature of creating catalogs, or albumns, as many other management systems. You just point it to a folder in the files list and it does it's thing.I don't have Photoshop, I use PSE4. Does it have a form of this tool

[canon shooter]

Do you know that Lightroom can convert RAW files to DNG itself while importing? You don't need to run them through the stand-alone DNG converter program first.

(At least, the Windows beta 3 version has the option to convert to DNG while importing).How do you do this in Lightroom

[canon shooter]

Different people have different workflow. Here's mine that suitable for my needs.

I copy all my CF cards to a temp directory. I tell LightRoom where this temp directory is, and let Lightroom reference it in it's original location. (NOT IMPORT, unlike Aperture)

I quickly go through the pics, assigning a STAR level (1 star, 2 stars,... 5 stars). I do this step fast and am brutal with this judging.

Depending on the project, I may keep 3+ stars... or only keep 4 and 5 star rated photos. I adjust the search slider bar to show only 3, 4 or 5 star photos. The less than perfect shots are hidden away.

Then I perform tweaking,exposure, saturation, that kinda stuff on the remaining keepers. ... and may upgrade or downgrade my star ratings. Some pics go up to 5 stars, some get downgraded to 0 stars and get hidden automatically.

At the end of the tweaking, all remaining 3, 4 or 5 star photos get exported to DNG or JPG or whatever format I like, and export them to my RAID network drive in it's own YEAR/MONTH/PROJECT-NAME directory.

DONE!

The temp directory on my local hard drive is now deleted. The temporary import project folder in LR is also deleted.

BONUS: I then import/reference the YEAR/MONTH/PROJECT-NAME directory on my network drive (i.e. the keepers) into Lighroom... then I have thumbnails of those shots in Lightroom. If I need to go back and look for a photo, a quick scan of the thumbnails finds it... or I can do the STAR rating search.

I personally don't use IPTC/EXIF info.I think what you are saying is that you save from the CF card to hard drive and then OPEN images in lightroom for editing???

What is the difference between this and importing to Lightroom??

Finally I have imported imaging into LR but must be very slow. How do I edit the file in LR for WB, exposure etc.