10d with Av or TV doens't work with 550ex

[tzrider]

Hi there,

Although the manual says different my 10d
doesn't work in Av or Tv with the 550ex.

A, P and M work fine. Av works fine with
custom function 8 set to 1/200 instead of
Auto. But Tv still doesn't.

If I choose Tv and set shutter speed to 1/180
it still needs 4 seconds exposure time ...

Any ideas ???

Best wishes,

Jeroen

[RichardtheSane]

If you choose tv with 1/180th of a second, it should give you 1/180th of a second - as you have told it what shutter speed you need.
The flash will then fire and expose the scene correctly.

What happens when the flash fires? Does the scene expose correctly.

Basically I think your camera is working fine, AV is doing what it should as auto setting will still aim to get a balanced exposure between background and flash illuminated foreground.

[Motorsports Photo]

Canon has a strange way of using flash. Av will have abnormally long exposures with low light. I haven't used my 10D with flash yet, but my D30 worked well on Tv, but I only used shutter speeds around 1/60.

Your best bet is to use P or X when doing flash pics. P does a pretty good job in most cases, and X will be your best bet when you need total control.

-Pete

[robertwgross]

Let me ask a stupid question.

Are we sure that the mirror lockup function is not enabled?

That could explain a few things.

---Bob Gross---

[scottbergerphoto]

Motorsports Photo wrote:
Canon has a strange way of using flash. Av will have abnormally long exposures with low light. I haven't used my 10D with flash yet, but my D30 worked well on Tv, but I only used shutter speeds around 1/60.

Your best bet is to use P or X when doing flash pics. P does a pretty good job in most cases, and X will be your best bet when you need total control.

-Pete



The 10D is doing exactly what it is supposed to do in Av. It is trying to properly expose the background, just as it does in any other mode. You don't see this in program modes, except slow sync (Night Portrait - see page 41 of the manual), because the camera is set to not go slower then 1/60 sec. in a program mode. Try this. Set your camera on a tripod in a dimly lit room or outside on the street at night with some light from street lights or shops. Have your subject in the foreground as you normally would. Using flash take a picture using Av and then P mode. The one taken in P mode will have a dark background, and the one taken in Av will have a properly exposed background. The subject will be exposed the same in both as the exposure of the subject is controlled by the flash in low light. I use Av with flash when I want an interesting background properly exposed. As it is a longer exposure then P mode, you have to have your subject remain still until you hear the shutter close.
Scott

[openspace]

I don't use Av or Tv with flash unless I have adequate ambient light and am just using my flash for fill. The Av and Tv settings are not designed to "read" the flash, whether internal or external. If it is dark, no matter what flash unit you use, or what you set the aperture to, Av mode is designed to set the shutter speed for proper exposure WITHOUT flash. Ditto for Tv and aperture.

That is why Canon suggests only using the program modes or manual when using flash. Here's my foolproof technique:

Set camera to Manual, set a shutter speed, set the aperture, take a test shot and check exposure. Don't worry about whether the camera says that the image will be underexposed. That is what the flash is for - to make up the difference. If the image seems underexposed, you can either lower the shutter speed, choose a wider aperture or adjust the flash exposure compensation.

[Daytripper]

Check Custom Function 16.

If it is enabled the shutter speed you set in Tv mode will be overridden to avoid underexposure.

Cheers,
Pete

[scottbergerphoto]

openspace wrote:
I don't use Av or Tv with flash unless I have adequate ambient light and am just using my flash for fill. The Av and Tv settings are not designed to "read" the flash, whether internal or external. If it is dark, no matter what flash unit you use, or what you set the aperture to, Av mode is designed to set the shutter speed for proper exposure WITHOUT flash. Ditto for Tv and aperture.

That is why Canon suggests only using the program modes or manual when using flash. Here's my foolproof technique:

Set camera to Manual, set a shutter speed, set the aperture, take a test shot and check exposure. Don't worry about whether the camera says that the image will be underexposed. That is what the flash is for - to make up the difference. If the image seems underexposed, you can either lower the shutter speed, choose a wider aperture or adjust the flash exposure compensation.

It really depends on what you mean as fill. When I take pictures at night in NYC, I use Manual or Av to expose for the city lights (storefronts, street lights, etc.) and I use the flash to expose the subjects I'm shooting in the foreground. If you try to do this in a program mode(other then Night Portrait which eliminates the 1/60 sec limit), the camera will try to expose for the ambient (background) light, but it will not go slower then 1/60 of a second. That will leave you with dark, underexposed backgrounds most of the time. In addition, the camera has no idea what part of the background you want to expose properly. It will average the scene and come up with an exposure, which may not be right for that neon sign in the corner. Taking a spot reading of that sign with a hand held spot meter, setting your exposure for it in Manual, and letting the flash light the subject gives you a picture of the neon sign in the background and your subject both well exposed. In a well lit banquet hall you can probably get away with a floor of 1/60 of a second. I suggest reading: Mastering Flash Photography by Susan McCartney. It's available at Amazon.com
Scott

[tzrider]

I found the following solutions myself:

- Av - check custom function 3 (set to 1/200)
- Tv - check custom function 16 (disable it)

All sorted out, although I find Canon's solution
towards function 16 a bit strange,

Condition I was flashing were very dark,

Best wishes,

Jeroen

[scottbergerphoto]

tzrider wrote:
I found the following solutions myself:

- Av - check custom function 3 (set to 1/200)
- Tv - check custom function 16 (disable it)

All sorted out, although I find Canon's solution
towards function 16 a bit strange,

Condition I was flashing were very dark,

Best wishes,

Jeroen
Why would you want to convert a semi manual setting to automatic? What's the point of Av with a lower shutter speed limit of 1/200 sec. ? If your not interested in slow shutter speeds to capture ambient light why not shoot a program mode? Why not set it to manual and use 1/200 as your shutter speed? Are you worried about depth of field with flash? I'm confused! Please enlighten me.
Scott

[cardigan1979]

This is only what I've found has worked for me through trial and error.

If you want an even flash use 1/60 sec f.8 and work around this say 1/90 f.5.6 1/125 f.4 1/180 f3.5 1/200 f2.8

It very rarely fails me. Usually on 400 asa

It's not in no manual but have a go

Rich

[openspace]

scottbergerphoto wrote:

It really depends on what you mean as fill. When I take pictures at night in NYC, I use Manual or Av to expose for the city lights (storefronts, street lights, etc.) and I use the flash to expose the subjects I'm shooting in the foreground.


Sounds good to me. Flash is just one of those things you have to play around with. It all depends on your subject - are you exposing for a foreground subject like a person, wildlife, or a flower in the breeze that you know won't remain still for a 2 second exposure of the background, or is your entire scene unmoving? Do you need a properly exposed background, or are you only concerned with the foreground?

One of my favorite techniques that I use when taking night shots of people or wildlife is to take one shot, exposing for the person or animal, remove the person or animal from the scene, then take a second shot that properly exposes for the background. I then use Photoshop to combine the two - basically a double exposure.

My best advice for flash users - get out there and get shooting. Bring a notebook and record what you do. Study the Exif information for your shots. Practice, practice, practice!