Monitor calibration with SpyderPro

[PacAce]

I just bought myself a SpyderPro with OptiCal monitor calibration kit which just arrived today. I installed the software and followed the instructions on how to calibrated both my CRT and LCD monitors.

I first calibrated the CRT, which is my primary monitor. I then made the LCD the primary and calibrated that. After going through all the motions of calibrating both monitors and saving the ICC profiles for each, I came out of the experience rather disappointed with the results. I was expecting to get the CRT and the LCD to almost come close to each other in color. But instead, the CRT came out with a reddish cast and the LCD came out with a bluish cast. They looked a lot better BEFORE when I had calibrated the monitors by "hand" using Adobe Gamma calibration program.

Can anybody offer any insight as to what I may have done wrong with my SpyderPro calibration?

Thanks.

[John_T]

Colorvision is coming out with dual head calibration "soon" with Optical 4.0. In the meantime choose your CRT as your primary monitor, calibrate it to perfection and leave the LCD for tools. I have two identical Sony 21" GDM-F520 CRTs, and while the primary is perfect, the secondary is close but still has a slight reddish caste which is annoying, but useable for general non-critical stuff.

The problem is calibrating the LUTs of both ports of the graphic card independently. On the secondary you can get the monitor controls in the ball park, but not the second port LUT.

And be sure you have fully kicked out Adome Gamma, Coloreal or any previous software "calibrator". Important!

[PacAce]

Thanks, John. I'll take you advice while patiently waiting for the next version of Optical. BTW, do you know if that's a freebie upgrade or does one have to pay for the upgrade? Just wondering.

[scottbergerphoto]

I use Spyder with Optical on my CRT and I am very happy with it. I shoot Adobe RGB and print on an Epson 2200. The prints look almost identical to the monitor. As stated above, be sure to use msconfig(Windows) to get Adobe Gamma Loader out of Start Up(uncheck it). In addition, calibration isn't designed to make your CRT look better. It makes sure that Windows knows how your monitor displays colors.
Scott

[PacAce]

scottbergerphoto wrote:
In addition, calibration isn't designed to make your CRT look better. It makes sure that Windows knows how your monitor displays colors.
Scott

Now, this is where I get confused. I thought that calibration was to make the monitor show as true a color as possible so that when I'm editing a picture, the greens and the reds and the blues really are those colors and not something with a shade of some other color. When I see a white object on the screen, I'd expect it to be white. If I see a cast of red on it, wouldn't the tendency be to use Photoshop to color correct that image to remove the cast? But the problem is that the cast is coming from the monitor and is not really in the image itself. ???

[scottbergerphoto]

PacAce wrote:
scottbergerphoto wrote:
In addition, calibration isn't designed to make your CRT look better. It makes sure that Windows knows how your monitor displays colors.
Scott

Now, this is where I get confused. I thought that calibration was to make the monitor show as true a color as possible so that when I'm editing a picture, the greens and the reds and the blues really are those colors and not something with a shade of some other color. When I see a white object on the screen, I'd expect it to be white. If I see a cast of red on it, wouldn't the tendency be to use Photoshop to color correct that image to remove the cast? But the problem is that the cast is coming from the monitor and is not really in the image itself. ???

I might have this wrong PacAce, but I don't believe that monitor calibration changes the colors that your monitor produces. The only adjustments you make to the picture when calibrating is brightness, contrast, and color temperature. The calibration then records how your monitor displays the various colors and creates a profile that tells windows what that profile is, so that whenever you use a color smart application that application also has that information. I don't know how you would correct the color cast that you have on your monitor. I'll follow this thread to see if someone has an answer. You might also want to post this question on www.Robgalbraith.com in the Color Management forum.
http://www.robgalbraith.com/ubbthreads/postlist.php?Cat=&Board=UBB3
Happy New Year,
Scott

[PacAce]

scottbergerphoto wrote:
I might have this wrong PacAce, but I don't believe that monitor calibration changes the colors that your monitor produces. The only adjustments you make to the picture when calibrating is brightness, contrast, and color temperature. The calibration then records how your monitor displays the various colors and creates a profile that tells windows what that profile is, so that whenever you use a color smart application that application also has that information. I don't know how you would correct the color cast that you have on your monitor. I'll follow this thread to see if someone has an answer. You might also want to post this question on www.Robgalbraith.com in the Color Management forum.
http://www.robgalbraith.com/ubbthreads/postlist.php?Cat=&Board=UBB3
Happy New Year,
Scott


If I recall correctly (and I should since I only did it yesterday) I had to go futzing with the Red, Green and Blue controls to get them the way OptiCal wanted it. And it took several tweaks of the control to get them there. So if that's not a way to get a neutral color the way SpyderPro sees it and without any color casting, then I'm not sure what that exercise was for.

I'll read through the manual again to make sure I'm not missing something and give the color calibration another go. I'd sure hate to think I wasted $239.00 on a calibration gizmo that doesn't get me any closer to getting neutral colors on my monitor than the manual way I did before.

Thanks for your input, Scott. And that goes for you, too, John.

[scottbergerphoto]

PacAce wrote:
scottbergerphoto wrote:
I might have this wrong PacAce, but I don't believe that monitor calibration changes the colors that your monitor produces. The only adjustments you make to the picture when calibrating is brightness, contrast, and color temperature. The calibration then records how your monitor displays the various colors and creates a profile that tells windows what that profile is, so that whenever you use a color smart application that application also has that information. I don't know how you would correct the color cast that you have on your monitor. I'll follow this thread to see if someone has an answer. You might also want to post this question on www.Robgalbraith.com in the Color Management forum.
http://www.robgalbraith.com/ubbthreads/postlist.php?Cat=&Board=UBB3
Happy New Year,
Scott


If I recall correctly (and I should since I only did it yesterday) I had to go futzing with the Red, Green and Blue controls to get them the way OptiCal wanted it. And it took several tweeks of the control to get them there. So if that's not a way to get a neutral color the way SpyderPro sees it and without any color casting, then I'm not sure what that exercise was for.

I'll read through the manual again to make sure I'm not missing something and give the color calibration another go. I'd sure hate to think I wasted $239.00 on a calibration gizmo that doesn't get me any closer to getting neutral colors on my monitor than the manual way I did before.

Thanks for your input, Scott. And that goes for you, too, John.

John,
I have Spyder with Optical. Are you referring to the software settings in Optical or actual color controls on your monitor when you say you were tweaking the Red Blue and Green controls?
Happy New Year,
Scott

[PacAce]

scottbergerphoto wrote:
John,
I have Spyder with Optical. Are you referring to the software settings in Optical or actual color controls on your monitor when you say you were tweaking the Red Blue and Green controls?
Happy New Year,
Scott


Scott, I guess you were directing that question to me and not to John.

Yes, the tweaking I was referring to was the controls on the monitor based on the instructions given by the software. Now that I think of it, I'm not sure if it was when I ran PreCal or when I ran OptiCal with the calibration mode set to "Precision" in the preference.

Anyway, I redid the calibration in Standard mode instead of Precision mode and it looks better now than when I did it the first time, but it still isn't any better than it was before I bought SpyderPro (or maybe the difference is so slight that my eyes can't make it out).

Happy New Year!

[scottbergerphoto]

PacAce,
I just looked over the ColorVision manual. I see there are adjustments in PreCal for individual monitor colors. I didn't pay attention to it when I calibrated my monitor as my monitor doesn't have individual gun controls. I checked ColorVision's web site and found this:http://www.colorvision.com/faq_detail.jsp?faq_id=26.
It looks like you were right to expect it to remove the color cast.
Scott

[John_T]

There are three steps/functions in calibration.

1. The Spyder puck reads your screen and Optical, Photocal, Precal, whatever, guide you in twiddling the contrast, brightness and RGB knobs on your monitor until the monitor's guns are in the color temperature/RGB/luminance ballpark.

2. The puck and Optical then refine the calibration by writing instructions to your graphic card's Look Up Table (LUT), enabling the graphic card to steer the monitor to the correct temperature/RGB/luminance.

3. The puck then checks the screen for accuracy and Optical writes an ICC profile for your monitor and sets it as default in Windows colorm management. The profile doesn't directly affect the monitor in any way. It is only a reference for Windows and your programs to display a graphic specifically for your monitor.

Because monitors decay and drift over time, and because you may change color depth, resolution or refresh rate, or some programs, like games, may play with your graphic card's settings, you will periodically need to recalibrate on a scheduled basis or whenever there has been some change made to your graphic card settings. Unless you have a Sony Artisan, your monitor itself is just a dummy that, within it's capabilities, does what the graphic card tells it.

Especially if your monitor was very incorrect before, it will definitely look "better" after calibration and profiling in that the eye can tell that the colors are correct and the screen should look crisper and "tighter". Shadow detail improved, etc.

In terms of your display "looking good", your graphic card is of the very most importance, even if your monitor is mediocre. Most people go out and by a new monitor with great expectations, hook it up to their old slump graphic card and are disappointed. The monitor can't display anything better than the graphic card gives it.

That's why I only buy Matrox graphic cards. The competition, IMO, don't even come close for color work.

[scottbergerphoto]

Thanks for the info. It was very helpful.
Scott