Fired..quit..? Not hired?

[bdj3]

I just wanted some feedback. A friend of mine asked me to freelance for her to help her start her modeling agency. So I said sure...I'm new to photography and have been told I take great pics but fashion is a whole new area. I was to get paid 1st a $100 per model. Then she told me $200. Then she told me I wasn't experience enough and she wanted me on the shoot but to train with the other photographer but it was going to be a "free" hands on experience...so in other words no payment. I told her thanks for the offer but I couldn't do it for free and I would charge her$75 bucks to be there to train for her business, how she wanted it done. She said she couldn't afford to pay 2 photographers so I was cut loose. :( I feel bad but I don't know how things work in the fashion business...and I didn't want to be taken advantage of earlier in the business.any takers on giving me their opinions? tx

[Saralonde]

I don't know how things work in the fashion business either, but that doesn't seem right. I don't understand how she thought you weren't experienced enough to pay, but were experienced enough to train the other photographer who is obviously less experienced than you. No other explanation?

[PEACHMAN]

No experience doesn't pay much in any business...how do your shots compare with the glamor section?? I think I would grab at any chance for experience , even a couple of gigs for free...I have done a couple of weddings with a local pro and learned volumes...or you could work a deal where she only pays you a token amount for any shots she actually liked and used....good luck! It would be great to be in the position to go pro...

[jra]

I guess it depends on what you want. If the experience alone doesn't make it worth it to you then walk away. If you're really wanting to get into this area of photography then the experience alone may be worth it. I guess you're the only one who can answer this question.

[Art Rodriguez]

I don't know. If it was me I would have asked her if I would be taking pictures with this other photographer. If she said no, that she wanted me to learn from this photographer, then I would have tried to find out who the photographer was and look at some photos that they had taken. If they were good then I would have jumped at the chance to train with the photographer. Even if I wasn't getting paid. I would like to get into this type of photography, so the experience with working with a photographer who knows what they are doing would be enough pay for me.

Art

[bdj3]

thanks all.
I guess what my problem was / is was inconsistency and the other photographer Ive seen his work but it didn't have that "wow " these are awesome. But then he knows his camera inside&out. Personality wise....he seemed nice enough but didn't have the "get up and go" style. He was more wait for the perfect pose, perfect light and just take a few pics. I don't know I think we both expected something for nothing.... But when one door closes another opens right? tx!

[Saralonde]

Sorry about my post. I misread you. I thought you were supposed to train the other photographer, not train with the other photographer.:o

[Mathiau]

So, one second she wants to hand you $100, then $200, THEN decides your not good enough...

Did she not bother to look at your pics before tossing money at you? If this is her buisness, and this is how she acts, she isnt going to get very far.

[txduggan]

So, one second she wants to hand you $100, then $200, THEN decides your not good enough...

Did she not bother to look at your pics before tossing money at you? If this is her buisness, and this is how she acts, she isnt going to get very far.

I think this is what would have bothered me...

If I was told I was being compensated, then told the compensation would be increased, then told there would be no compensation, I think I would have said thank you very much and good luck...

Not to sound hypocritical, but I agree with the other posters that any experience that is offered to you should be grabbed at every opportunity......but, in this particular circumstance, based purely on what the original poster shared, was that he was geting his chain yanked.

And this coming from a "friend"? Hmmm....

Maybe the OP didn't provide every detail; I find it daunting to communicate every nuance I want to share in cyberspace...especially when yer multi-tasking!:cool:

Best,

Tom D

[jra]

thanks all.
I guess what my problem was / is was inconsistency and the other photographer Ive seen his work but it didn't have that "wow " these are awesome. But then he knows his camera inside&out. Personality wise....he seemed nice enough but didn't have the "get up and go" style. He was more wait for the perfect pose, perfect light and just take a few pics. I don't know I think we both expected something for nothing.... But when one door closes another opens right? tx!

I agree that the inconsistency would be annoying but she may have had good intentions at first and then realized she hadn't thought things through properly. Still, the experience may still be worth it if it is something you can put on your resume. The next time another opportunity comes up, you'll be able to say that you have some experience in this field of photography. If it's not something you want to pursue in the future, it's most likely a waste of your time. Just MHO :)

[LBaldwin]

I think there could be a couple of things going on here. First and formost you want to make sure that you are working for a reputable agency. And that may be the first rub. There is a better than 90% chance she does not know what she is doing. In hiring a newbie and tossing amounts around that is a red flag.

Nothing else is really needed. Very few photographers pick up the camera and start to produce industry standard work.

Industry standards.... really? Are there any? Yes, and they are at times rigid and other times all over the map. So now what. If you have not got the chops photographically, then learn what it is you need to know. Look at magazines, newspapers catalogs and most of all, zeds to learn what REAL agencies want.


I have been shooting fashion for quite a while and it changes all the time.

I would bet a case of O'douls that she wanted to charge "new faces" for pictures, classes, make-up, walking, talking etc. The same crap that JRP and others have been foisting on young girls for decades. They have been sued so many times that the state of CA makes it really hard to open a new franchise.

A new face should never have to pay for anything to GET work, except a book and a few zeds and they should not cost more than few hundred bux.

If she was a real agency here in CA then she has to be licensed, bonded and insured just like any other temp agency. But many try to get around that by offering "classes" contracts etc.

Do yourself a favor and don't EVER get involved with a fly by night modeling operation. Many a new photographer gets sued and or jail time when they get involved. There was one in our area that is now a guest of the state and lost his home, wife and freedom.

He did as the agency asked and shot some risque stuff of a minor. The 'agent" said that she had checked her ID. And had a signed MR for her. Nope

The agent was using the business as a way to pander to teens and the photographer suspected it but did nothing to stop it even after he was told.

In short when and if you are approached do some homework with the DA's office, the small claims court and the BBB, all have pubic records.

Remember just like 400 2.8's for 2500 on ebay if it sounds to good, it probably is.

http://www.easybackgroundcheck.com/

Les

[GyRob]

Some friend is all i can say !
Rob.

[dijetal]

BEWARE of these Signs of Scam Talent Agencies:

Beware of any newspaper classified or display ad looking for any kind of model or talent. Modeling agencies have plenty of hopefuls coming to them so they don't have to advertise for models.
To avoid being ripped off, aspiring models should look for and attend “open calls” at reputable modeling agencies. Well-known agencies in large cities usually have open calls on a weekly basis.
Do not respond to subway, bus or classified ads that promise modeling and acting jobs to people with no experience, or of all ages and sizes, etc. They are come-ons.
If an agency has to charge money up front it usually means they do not have enough modeling work for either the agency or the model to survive on.
You should be free to go to any photographer you want to. Legitimate agencies will provide you with a list of photographers that you could go to.
Modeling agencies are not employers. So, while they may try to get you work while representing you, there is no way a legitimate agency can guarantee you work.
The hours of a model are uneven and sporadic. You will not have the flexibility to choose your own hours, so beware of claims that you will be able to "Work full or part time."
All photographs may be shot in one session by one photographer, but you should still look different in all your photographs by wearing a variety of cosmetics, clothes, and hairstyles. Beware if it's the salesman snapping off a few shots like for a passport photo.

To break into the business, you need professional photos of which there are two standard types, a "head shot" and a "composite card."

The head shot usually is an 8" x 10" black and white photo of the face, with your resume printed on the back. A "comp card" usually features several shots on the same sheet, showing off poses in different attire or settings.
Be sure to get all verbal promises in writing.
Be leery of companies that only accept payment in cash or by money order. Read it as a strong signal that the company is more interested in your money than your career.
Run an instant background search (http://backgroundsearch.com/backgroundcheck/backgroundcheck/instant-background-check.html) on the Managers/Owners so you can find out about their criminal records, law suits, court judgments against them, bankruptcies, company names, and other stuff.
Often, what you thought was a legitimate job interview with a talent agency turns into a high-pressure sales pitch for modeling or acting classes, or for "screen tests" or "photo shoots" that can range in price from several hundred to several thousand dollars.
Any professional casting director, agent, or manager has an office and regular business hours. There is no reason to discuss employment opportunities or negotiate contracts late at night or in someone’s apartment.

[GyRob]

you say a friend - one has to question that .
Rob.