For a very dark bar would a 50 1.4

[gardengirl13]

be enough? I was hoping to get more lenses, but if I buy the 30D All I can afford for this type of shooting is the 50 1.4 for now. (I've tried the 1.8 and didn't like it- too cheap and too slow) I could save a bit longer and see about the 34L which is one I think I'd really like on a crop (for many years all I had on my film SLR was a 50 and I like the range) Currently on my film camera the lenses I use most are my 35, 50 and 85.

thanks!

[md_129]

With the 30D you can get away with higher ISO's with less apparent noise, the fifty sounds like a great choice given your situation; this lens is really sharp at f/2.

[gardengirl13]

Do you think it might be too "telephoto" in a small bar? I'd be pretty close the the band, say 5-20 feet away at any given time. The last time I shot them I used (on a film body) the 50 and the 85, but to get whole band shots I needed the 50) Here's some of what I took http://www.bluecoyoterocks.com/pics.htm Don't mind the quality these are scanned on the cheapest scanner possible. The bar is the firebird lounge, the lighting is horrible, the photos were taken on fuji1600 and with the tungsten light came out very red. The lighter shots were during warm up with the sun coming in the windows.

I'm not good at doing bands yet, I'm very new at this kind of shooting, so please don't be too harsh.

[René Damkot]

The 50 on a 30D will have about the same FoV as the 85 on a film body.
If the 1.8 was too slow, I'm not sure if the 1.4 will be enough: It's 2/3 stops faster.
Also: DoF is extremely thin at 1.4. That will require a bit of thinking.
Crank up the ISO to 3200 if needed. Use a monopod.
If you like 35, 50 and 85 on FF, you might consider Sigma's 20/1.8 and 30/1.4 as well for the 30D. Or Canons 28/1.8 if you want only Canon.

[gardengirl13]

How does the 28 1.8 compare to the 50 1.4 image wise? I do a lot of printing it's not just for the web.

[René Damkot]

Well, for starters, the 28 is a lot wider ;)
Search the lens forum for samples. Both are a bit soft wide open. The 50 is a bit sharper stopped down. Both are very usable. Sigmas 30/1.4 seems to be better then both, but won't fit my camera...

[gardengirl13]

yeah if I upgrade someday to the 5D or whatever it will be at the time I can actually afford one, I couldn't use the sigma.

So with the 30D on 3200, and the 50 set to 2.0 I should have some usable images? The quality of them doesn't have to be great yet, they'd only be for the website, plus I'd only want 3-4 printed.

Just to clarify, I'm not getting paid by the band, the guitarist is my husband. So he doesn't need anything too much. I just want to use them to practice and get better!


eta: since I shouldn't be spending the huge amount on the 35 yet, how would the 35 2.0 handle this type of stuff? If needed I could shoot B&W and not worry as much about the grain.

[DwightMcCann]

Can you beg or borrow lenses to try them out? It is very hard to know what to suggest without any real information about the venue or your style or more precise goals. Must you shoot in a venue if your husband is a band member? I am working with a band and have done bio images in a studio, will soon do more and will be shooting them in my living room tomorrow ... the first iteration of the website is taking a while ... see www.A-Touch-of-Soul.com (in my .sig, too.) I am less worried about gig pictures right now than providing fans with something nice to see. And Press Kit images don't need to be gigs either.

Be sure to bring back whatever you work on ... it helps us all to see what others do even if it not top quality professional work ... there is always something to learn. ;)

[René Damkot]

Here (http://www.prime-junta.net/pont/Reviews/da_Canon_35_mm_2/a_Canon_35_mm_f2.html) is a review on the 35/2.0. Great lens IMO. Same site also as a review of the 20/1.8 and the varying 'species' of 50mm lenses.
I have one, but mine is totalled, since beer managed to get between the front elements. Repair cost would be more then it's worth (since the back element is also scratched) :o

[md_129]

Can you beg or borrow lenses to try them out? It is very hard to know what to suggest without any real information about the venue or your style or more precise goals. Must you shoot in a venue if your husband is a band member? I am working with a band and have done bio images in a studio, will soon do more and will be shooting them in my living room tomorrow ... the first iteration of the website is taking a while ... see www.A-Touch-of-Soul.com (http://www.A-Touch-of-Soul.com) (in my .sig, too.) I am less worried about gig pictures right now than providing fans with something nice to see. And Press Kit images don't need to be gigs either.

Be sure to bring back whatever you work on ... it helps us all to see what others do even if it not top quality professional work ... there is always something to learn. ;)

To supports Dwights rational

I found this thread here, http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=190688

This may or may not be helpful to your sitution.

[dave_bass5]

Im getting my singers girlfriend to shoot us tonight using my 30D and i cant decide what lens to take. she has a good eye, used to be an amature photog but this new digital age baffles here a bit so its got to be kept simple.
Its a small place and she will be sitting directly in front of the playing area (yeah, no stage again) so good line of sight. I have used my 35mm f/2.0 for quite a few gigs and i feel its "ok" but i know we will need wider tonight. I would love to have a f/1.4 lens but cant one one in time (really need to get a Sigma 30mm f/1.4 asap) so the choice is either my 24-105L or Tamron 17-50 f/2.8. The Tamron seems to win on all points apart from the fact that the 24-105L will be good for close ups. i doubt she will move around much. I also have a 550Ex flash that would be ideal but agian, its having to set it up and tell her what to adjust if the shots arent exposed right. It would be bounced but even so i cant tell how the shots will look. we wont get a sound check and the lights are only put on once we start playing, plus we are only doing one set so i cant get to the camera to make adjustments.
Im thinking of setting the camera up like this. ISO 1600 (maybee 800), TV mode 1/60. plus setting M mode to around 1/125 f/4. with M she can then put the OB flash on it shouldnt be too strong and with TV she should be ok with long shots with out flash.
Once i get to the venue i will have a little play around with the settings but i think the above should be ok. the shots are only for our website so not too important and im sure i can PP them enough to be ok. of course it will be shot in RAW.

any thoughts?

[René Damkot]

High ISO; 1600 or 3200.
Av, wide open.
Fast lens, so the 24-105 is out.
No flash.

[Rjohnston]

Shot this w the 50mm 1.4

http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n284/rcjohnston/DPP_0058.jpg

f/2, 1/80, 1600iso

[dave_bass5]

High ISO; 1600 or 3200.
Av, wide open.
Fast lens, so the 24-105 is out.
No flash.

Thanks
Yeah, i had a feeleing the 24-105L was too slow.
Ended up taking just the 17-50 f/2.8.
We managed to get the flash looking good as well so although there were a very low % of keepers without flash there were enough good ones for the job.

[gardengirl13]

rjohnston- how dark was that stage? The bar doesn't have any spot lights, only ambient lights.

Dwight- yeah I have shot them on film at a practice before their last gig. Wasn't happy with the shots (probably a developing issue.) I may go to another practice with the digital.

I'm not too worried about the lens, it's more the speed. Every gig I've shot was with the 50 and the 85, so I know the 35 and the 50 will suit me fine. It's more so praticing enough before the show to get clear sharp images. I would love the 35L but it's just too much money, I'm going to only save for it if I see that the f/2 doesn't work for me. Otherwise it's crazy to spend that kind of money not knowing if the 2 would be good enough.

Thanks fo rall you help guys!! The gig is Dec 16th so I hope to post the images here on the 18th.

[Rjohnston]

rjohnston- how dark was that stage? The bar doesn't have any spot lights, only ambient lights.

They just had about 3 lights, plus a very bright neon sign to the right of that pic.

[gcobb]

I think I put this in another thread but if you are in contact with the band members it isn't out of line to ask them to get some lights on stage with them. Many bands already have 56s on tripods or floor pars or something available to them. Explain to them that if they want the best, they need to work with you on getting enough lighting.

I did a show in Jackson, TN 3 weeks ago. I have another shoot there on Thanksgiving night. I've gotten with them, they've picked up some lights and I'm getting some narrow diffuser gels to soften the harsh light from the par cans.

Tell them you need light. :)

[blackshadow]

You said the 50 1.8 was "too slow" are you talking speed or AF speed?

Sounds like what you need are the 50 f1.4 or the Sigma 30 1.4 - both are awesome lenses for very low light in small clubs.

Don't be afraid to jack up the ISO to 3200 either and if you have to run the shots through Noise Ninja or some other noise reduction software during PP.

I have had quite a few of my shots blown up to 24x20 or 30x20 prints shot in low light at 3200 ISO and they look stunning.

[dave_bass5]

You said the 50 1.8 was "too slow" are you talking speed or AF speed?

Sounds like what you need are the 50 f1.4 or the Sigma 30 1.4 - both are awesome lenses for very low light in small clubs.

Don't be afraid to jack up the ISO to 3200 either and if you have to run the shots through Noise Ninja or some other noise reduction software during PP.

I have had quite a few of my shots blown up to 24x20 or 30x20 prints shot in low light at 3200 ISO and they look stunning.

I just got a 50mm f/1.4 but took it back and got a 30mm f/1.4. i like the FOV better.
Im hoping to shoot lots this weekend as my band are playing here
http://www.blackandwhiteballs.co.uk (http://www.blackandwhiteballs.co.uk/)
As there is another band playing ill get some good practice in. hoping to get someone to shoot us as well.
Im going to try TV mode, 1/60 ISO1600 f/1.8 (i dont really know why, just sounds right). ill probably have to drop the speed and apature down for the crowd shots.
Anyone like to give some comments on this?

[gcobb]

I shoot in AV mode wide open and watch my shutter speed. You kinda of have to watch their stage lighting if it blinks, make note of how much movement is on stage, where they stand mainly, etc. There are lots of variables, just don't go in there thinking you can fire off 30 shots and be done. :)

[blackshadow]

gardengirl - from what you have said the 50 1.4 will suit your needs perfectly for starters - you might have to use the old foot zoom to back up a bit now and then but overall you will find it very useful

[dave_bass5]

just don't go in there thinking you can fire off 30 shots and be done. :)

Oh god no, ill try as many different settings as i can.
I normally would use AV mode but im thinking i would rather have an underexposed shot due to the camera not getting a fast enough apature rather than a blurred shot.
although im not really worried about getting any too many sohts of the other band im going to use the evening to get as much experience as i can shooting under these conditions. normally we are the only band playing and if i hand my 30D over to someone to take some shots i normally set it up before hand for them. after Sat i might have a better idea of what to set it to and to give better advice. these are the type of people who have spent ages trying to find the zoom on my 35mm f/2.0 (this has happend twice)