Need advice on studio equipment.

[Spiral Photo]

So my wife and I have been talking to banks to get quotes for loans. We're trying for a $3,000 loan to start a small and basic studio out of the garage. Keep in mind, this is not for camera equipment other than to get a XTi body for a different purpose. What I mainly need advice for is studio lighting. What should I get? I've looked at the Novatron 3-light kit, which I know how to use (I used to rent a 2-light Novatron kit when I worked at a camera store), but with the remaining, say, $2200, what are good choices for me in terms of lights, stands, umbrellas, light meter, backgrounds, etc? I've considered going the wireless flash route, but I've decided that I want modeling lights.

Here's what I currently have as far as stuff like that goes:

White, silver, and gold umbrellas
Sync Cord
2 Light Stands
9' Wide Background Stand

Would the NovatronV400D 3 Head Mini Pro Kit (3 light kit) be a good candidate? It's about $1060, and leaves me a good chunk of money left over for things like props, backgrounds, and so forth. Or does anyone have a different suggestion that would work?

[coreypolis]

this is going to sound rude probably, and I don't mean it to be, but do you have clients already?

If not, that money would be better spent on marketing and branding of your company, otherwise I'm not sure how a bank would be able to loan you money without the possibility of repayment.


As for lighting, it also depends on what you want to shoot and how much space you have. A 2-3 light setup of at least 1200 watts would be preferable, if not more.

A light meter is essential for the just starting out and understanding lighting. Soft boxes are a personal choice, but often work well

I'd suggest a set of pocket wizards. no matter who you work with, at some point a model will trip over a sync cord and bring down the light or camera. Not to mention that sync cord go bad very fast.

Lots of light stands, the longest and largest background support system you can put in, gel for the BkG, lots and lots of sand bags.

[Wilt]

Your budget is too tight for the lighting equipment you really need. The Novatron is fine for hobbyists, but forget making a business unless you only shoot in darkened rooms...the modelling light is too anemic! Up your lighting budget at least $500 just for lights, not to mention the light modifiers you will need to use.

[Spiral Photo]

Whether or not I have clients at this point (which I do have...I also have a huge family), for the first while after we get set up, it's all about practicing and getting it down with digital. I used to do it all the time for people using rented lighting equipment and my old film bodies, so this isn't anything all that new to me, aside from learning what the differences are using digital. This is just a goal that my wife and I have had for quite a while, and now we're in a good position to go ahead and pursue it.
Advertising should be no problem around here. Our main goal with all this is to build up the studio and do senior portraits, which I am already doing on location. This is where my customer base comes from so far, and I've had a few repeat customers over the last few years. It's finally time for us to add the studio.

[Spiral Photo]

Your budget is too tight for the lighting equipment you really need. The Novatron is fine for hobbyists, but forget making a business unless you only shoot in darkened rooms...the modelling light is too anemic! Up your lighting budget at least $500 just for lights, not to mention the light modifiers you will need to use.

Unfortunately, this is not an option for us, and I know there are systems out there that can accommodate us. Please keep in mind that this intended to be small at first, but we need something we can get by with to do primarily JUST yearbook-style headshots.

[Wilt]

Very early in my career, after learning lighting with a Novatron, I tried to make a business including bridal portraits on location. The modelling lights are anemic. The modelling lights are anemic. The modelling lights are anemic. Don't waste your precious money on a plaything for your business, buy a real tool that has a value in that setting.

[Spiral Photo]

So what would you suggest in that price range? Like I said, I need advice on what TO get, not what NOT to get.

[Wilt]

A two light Dynalite (with 250 w modelling lights) with 500 ws power pack and an umbrella and grid spots and carrying case and stands has list price of $1400; three lights and additional things is list $1700 in their portrait/wedding kits. Cheaper at B&H, $1260 M52BT-PS and $1560 M53DT-PS, respectively. Good money spent on quality professional equipment, not on hobbyist toys.

[coreypolis]

I've been really pleased with Normans, and the Calumet monoblocks. An older set of prophotos would be a good choice too

[Spiral Photo]

Good money spent on quality professional equipment, not on hobbyist toys.

You might as well stop helping. I already said that that level is where we have to start, with upgrading planned in the future. We've been putting this off for long enough, and if we have to start at the bottom using 60watt bulbs and standard living room lamps, then so be it. We simply cannot start off with YOUR current equipment. You may have the money, but we don't. Your answers don't fit the question, but thanks for trying.

Very early in my career, after learning lighting with a Novatron, I tried to make a business including bridal portraits on location. The modelling lights are anemic. The modelling lights are anemic. The modelling lights are anemic. Don't waste your precious money on a plaything for your business, buy a real tool that has a value in that setting.

We're not doing weddings, if you'd have actually READ the original post and a following post that I made, you'd have seen that I said we are doing this out of our garage and for senior portrait yearbook headshots.

[Wilt]

Then simply rent better quality equipment as you need to use it. It is far better to not SQUANDER your limited funds. I am not trying to upgrade you, I'm trying to advise you not to throw away good money...good luck trying to find a buyer for your used Novatrons. Have you ever seens that stuff bought and traded actively on POTN?

BTW, 'my equipment' far exceeds what I advised for you. 2000 ws power pack and fan-cooled bare tube heads, to give you an idea of how far my needs have progressed beyond simple portraiture. I do still have two kits with 500 ws packs and lights for when I need to do location portraiture.

[Spiral Photo]

So then what do you suggest within that budget? That's all I'm asking. I'm not asking if it's a good choice, just what you suggest. Bottom line.

[Wilt]

Start with a 'real' two light setup and use reflector in place of a fill light. Then buy additional light when the budget permits (or rent one when you have a job that earns money to buy more gear). Photogenic makes good PC300DR monolights with 250w modelling light, for $490 apiece (e.g. Adorama). with 7-1/2 inch reflector, Line cord, 15 ft. sync cord, C4-15 flashtube, flashtube protector, 250w quartz modeling lamp.(ESS) (Digital display for flash and modeling settings, infrared remote, wired remote or computer control systems available separately.) Add umbrellas and stands.

[Spiral Photo]

Thank you. I'll take that into advisement.

[vwpilot]

Here is a good kit to start with which meets your budget. Hensel two monolight kit with stands, umbrellas and case for under $1200. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=2251&A=details&Q=&sku=368141&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation

You will get:

Integra Pro 2 Monolight Kit, Stands (90-230V)
Ultra Softbox - 18x26"
Impact - Umbrella - Beaded Silver - 43"

Each Monolight includes: Flashtube (9450401)
Modeling Lamp (GBJCD120300)
AC Power Cable
Umbrella Reflector (87)
Clear Glass Protective Dome
Protection Cap

The kit listed above also includes:
2 Umbrellas
Light Stands
Mono to PC Sync Cord
Grid Reflector
Kit Case
2 Year Manufacturer's Warranty not including flash tube or modeling light

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/images/largeimages/368141.jpg

You will likely need a few other things, but will have about $800-$1000 to work with still.

I like Hensels, they are not quite as popular as a few other brands, but are getting more popular and you wont have too much trouble finding parts or service if you need to. I have worked with Hensels and they work very well and are good professional quality gear, something you wont worry about wasting money on and something you can build onto as well. They also have 300 watt modelling lights.

You would likely want to replace the stands and possibly the softbox and stuff at some point, but these will easily get you started.

[MikeMcL]

where do alienbees fit into this hierarchy of quality. they are very common among pros and enthusiasts, and sell almost instantly on the used market... are they "kid toys" or are they a step above.

they have a good reputation, i was just wondering from some of you who are more judgemental of "pro quality"

thanks. i dont mean to hijack the thread, but i think it applies, as AB's are value light kits in your price range as well. You can get a really nice AB kit for $1600.00

[Wilt]

Alien Bees are more than 'kid toys' but not quite 'serious pro gear'. Some broad generalizations...

The 'kid toys' are really cheap, really low (50-200) watt-second rating, really low output modelling watt (60-100w) with no aftermarket accessory sources except original mfg with a few light modifiers.


The 'serious pro gear' are sturdy, 500-2400 watt-second, >200w modelling lights with many aftermarket accessory sources with broad spectrum of light modifiers.

The 'in between' (for hobbyists and weekend warriors or those on limited budgets) are adequately built, 150-1500 watt-second, 100w modelling lights with some aftermarket accessory sources but usually from same mfg as flash.

White Lightning and Alien Bee have a large group of supporters, and they are a respectable product.

[vwpilot]

Bees arent bad lights, but I would never consider them if I were using them for a business. I dont like their build quality, I dont like their modeling lights, and they are extremely inefficient. They should put out a lot more light for their w/s ratings. I've also heard the light isnt quite as consistent as other nicer brands (as in exposures and WB can change slightly) but havent used them enough to really judge that.

I'd recommend them for someone who is not a pro or planning on it, might use their lights once or twice a month but want something more than the most bargain basement system.

White Lightings are far better though when it comes to quality and output, but there you start to aproach the prices of other lighting systems so it opens up more choices to you. There really isnt much in the AB category except some of the other house brand systems from Adorama and such.

For my first kit I was between a Dynalit pack kit and that Hensel kit I posted earlier and was really leaning toward the Hensel for its price. Then I got a good deal (though still twice the price of the Hensel kit) on a slightly used Profoto Acute system so I went with that.

[coreypolis]

You're here too? Crazy. Viper says <3 OT



White Lightings are far better though when it comes to quality and output, but there you start to aproach the prices of other lighting systems so it opens up more choices to you.

white lighting are ok, just the Ab's big brother. Big advatage with either is the replacement bulb/flash tube costs. Considerably cheeper than other brands

[vwpilot]

Hey, yeah, here too.

White Lightings I think are built far better than the AB though. And they have a better modeling light.

But at that price I would start to consider other systems, such as the Hensel above.

[DocFrankenstein]

The bees are to the pro lights, like Schwartzeneger is to an oscar.

[Wilt]

The bees are to the pro lights, like Schwartzeneger is to an oscar.

His name is Arnold, not Oscar! ;)

[LBaldwin]

I've got to tell you I owned nearly all the systems currently out there ( I used to run a rental department) and I really like the Paul Buff stuff. I have 5 and in 15 years have only had one issue, sent it to TN and turned it around in 3 days door to door.

I had speedos and Norman, they exploded and so I got rid of them. I favor monoblocks over packs, any way. If your powerack goes out so goes all your lights. With the blocks if one goes out the others still work.

I agree with tht others that Novatron is rookie stuff. I buy used all the time, to save money. If it needs repair, I send it back to PCB and they fix it. Please, Please get some good solid C stands for your garage. Use sand bag all the time too.

Get something you can grow with. There are no 2000 WS Nova packs. Like you said it is an INVESTMENT.

I hope this helps,

Les Baldwin