5D is going away prediction

[joeflux]

Just like it happend to me last time I bought my 10D right before the 20D came out, I am seeing the same pattern...

I went to Dell website to buy the 10D and they had it. I waited a few weeks and it dissapeared from the site the day I was ready to buy. Sadly I left the site and found that other sites had it. I purchased the 10D somewhere else, yet wondering why Dell took it down.

35 days after I bought it I saw the 20D popping up everywhere.

To me, Dell takes out the camera right before it's ready to be discontinued. They must get a call from Canon. This means this camera is on it's way out, 5D, and it's ready to get replaced.

I am sharing because I don't wish others to suffer the same calamity. I bought a 10D not knowing of the 20D and I hated wasting money on a discontinued product!!!! So I want everyone to watch out for the next generation 5D coming soon. Good luck.

[blackshadow]

I am sharing because I don't wish others to suffer the same calamity. I bought a 10D not knowing of the 20D and I hated wasting money on a discontinued product!!!!

It's only a waste of money if it doesn't do what you bought it for.

[DrPablo]

It's only a waste of money if it doesn't do what you bought it for.

Agreed.

I use a large format lens that Schneider discontinued in 1971.

It takes beautiful pictures and does everything I could possibly want.

[joeflux]

Doesn't do what I bought it for is not necessarily true. Shooting high action sports at indoor arenas I needed high iso. At high ISO the 10D doesn't perform nearly as well as 20D. Hence, I would have taken advantage of the new 20D digic II technology. But since I don't have spare money I thought of selling the 10D. Yeah on ebay it was selling for $600 less than I paid for it, about 1 week after the 20D came out. So, today I still have my great 10D. Just keeping it below 1600 with my 5.6 zoom lens. I wish I was rich.

[SuzyView]

I bought the 5D because it's the camera I need for what I do. If a new model comes out early next year, I still wouldn't change. I didn't upgrade to the 30D, didn't feel the need. I don't think I'll do anything but love my 5D and 20D. New is new and some people must have it, but I like tools that work, whether new or just recently been replaced on the market.

[Randalls]

This is the nature of digital camera technology, everybody has to get used to it - or dont play. Digis are NOT investments-they are rapidly depreciating tools for a purpose.
It's pretty obvious Canon are clearing their stocks of the 5D with rebates & cheap refurb auctions etc. However I expect to see a 5DN (or similar) only, remember Canon is the only full frame game in town, they dont need to do much on that line.

[DrPablo]

Just to be a skeptic (I'm not sure I agree with this idea myself), but do we know that Canon is planning on continuing the 5D line? Or releasing a new version at all?

1. With no competition, there's no reason for them to do anything other than keep selling the same thing.

2. It's a camera that's very expensive for amateurs, and lacks many features of the pro cameras, most notably the frame rate that even the 30D has. So it finds itself cut off from the vast majority of amateurs, and many pros who feel like it's just too limited.

3. Canon released this camera as an unknown -- into an unfilled niche and an intermediate price point. So not even Canon knew for sure what kind of market it would have. The 5D hasn't held its price very well -- it went for $3200 for a while, and has dropped with rebates and all by around 25%. That's a big drop for a camera that hasn't been replaced, and in since it has no competition to drive the price down this suggests one of two things -- it may be obsolete and due for replacement (as suggested above), or it just might not be selling all that well.

[NickSimcheck]

I tend to agree with Dr Pablo,

Canon marketing said "Hey, what if we make a cheap full frame camera for the serious amateurs and the pros who are switching from film. Nobody has done it, let's see what happens"

The 5D obviously hasn't done as well as they expected, or they wouldn't slap a $300 rebate that can be doubled to $600 on it. Price drops are expected though.

Maybe the 5D is dead. Maybe it's cutting 1 series sales? Maybe most people who want a light weight camera will just pick up a 30D because of the crop and small size. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm right.

[BradT0517]

I really doubt that Canon will knock off half of the line in the only FF digital market

[ScottE]

As manufacturing technology advances, the cost of making large sensors will decrease. That means that medium format based digital cameras will start to be able to compete with the current price of the 1Ds. Not many people who need that kind of resolution would choose a 35 mm based sensor over a medium format based sensor. Medium format took that market over film and will continue to do so for digital.

That means that future generations of the 1Ds will have to be cheaper to compete with medium format. That puts a squeeze on the 5D class market.

I would not be surprised to see the 1D and 1Ds lines merge into one high performance FF digital line.

I would not be surprised to see the 5D line continue, using the same or similar chip technology used for a new 1Ds, but with a more compact body and less professional features, similar to the way the Elan and 1v series of film cameras coexisted. Both used the same sensors (35 mm film), but had different target markets.

The biggest drawback to this theory is that the total FF market is much smaller than the 35 mm film camera market because of the success of EF-S cameras. However, in film we had Rebel, Elan, EOS 3 and EOS 1 series cameras all at the same time. With digital it may be possible to have Rebel, 30D, 5D and 1Ds series cameras.

[joeflux]

With digital it may be possible to have Rebel, 30D, 5D and 1Ds series cameras.

My guess, we will have: Rebel XTii, 40D, 7D, and 1DsMkIII

[coreypolis]

5d is the newest of the prosumer and pro cameras, its the last to be updated.

[Rob612]

5d is the newest of the prosumer and pro cameras, its the last to be updated.


Seems reasonable. Moreover, it has no competitors in the market, except the 1DsMkII (that, AFAIK, has lost in sales - altought I am not able to quantify - since the 5D came out). It would seems stupid to me to change something that has no competitor. I see much more reasonable a new 1 body, maybe something that combines the 1Ds2 and the 1D2N capabilities in the relatively near future.

Anyway, 5Ds do for me, and I won't change unless something really needed comes out.

[roger the photographer]

If anybody wants to get rid of his/her 5D 'cause it could lose value, I know some buyers who would buy immediately at a discount price... I, for one, would simply love to have a second one!:lol: :lol: :lol:

[SuzyView]

If anybody wants to get rid of his/her 5D 'cause it could lose value, I know some buyers who would buy immediately at a discount price... I, for one, would simply love to have a second one!:lol: :lol: :lol:

My sentiments, as well. The 5D is a great camera, and I know that someday it will be replaced, but so what? I think the 20D is a great camera and haven't upgraded. If I didn't get the 5D and had reasons to do so, and I was shooting professionally, I would have gotten a used 20D for a second. Now that I have the 5D, it's actually been great having both these cameras. Now, if I hire an assistant anytime soon, I will buy something used and if the price of the 5D was good, I would jump on it.:lol:

[roqdawg]

http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=A0533285

They still have the 5D.

[jiggling_john]

yep
this doesnt surprise me considering any upgrades wont be here till february march?
The way i see it, the 1d will get a raft of new improvements and bits, the 5d will inherit from the 1d, maybe - just maybe, the 30d will inherit full frame (sooner or later all slr's canon do will be full frame) the 400d will stay and all the above wil get digic3. Now that seems highly probable to me...

[joegolf68]

I think Dr. Pablo has the right idea. Just the other day, on another thread, someone got upset when I said the 5D is not a big upgrade from the 30D. I just don't see the 5D as that much better since it offers less fps, same MP and other things, I don't get why the 5D is even there except as a place holder in-between prices of the very high end and the middle section.

[coreypolis]

I think Dr. Pablo has the right idea. Just the other day, on another thread, someone got upset when I said the 5D is not a big upgrade from the 30D. I just don't see the 5D as that much better since it offers less fps, same MP and other things, I don't get why the 5D is even there except as a place holder in-between prices of the very high end and the middle section.

you are kidding right?

[cdesperado]

JoeGolf... Unfortunately, you were incorrect. The 5D is actually distinctly different than the 30D.

For example,
1. They do not have the same MP (8.2 vs 12.7)
2. They do not have the same sensor size (22.5 x 15.0 vs 36 x 24 mm)
3. They have distinctly different ISO options (significant advantage to 5D)
4. The 5D has 8 WB settings (vs the 30Ds 6 WB settings)

As far as frame rates, that gets a little tricky. As you mentioned, the 30D has a "perceived" advantage over the 5D since the 30D is listed at shooting 2fps higher IF it is set in the high-speed mode.

However, that advantage would primarily only be noticed by folks who are doing a lot of high-speed shooting (Sports, possibly weddings or other events) and I am assuming that shooting in the higher speed means there is a "give" somewhere else. However, even with that said, the 5D reclaims this advantage when you factor in the buffer size and the bursts themselves.

The 30D features the following:
*** DIGIC II processing
*** The user can select high-speed or low-speed continuous shooting
*** at 5 fps or 3 fps - up to 30 (JPEG), 11 (RAW) or 9 (RAW+JPEG) consecutive frames when set at 5 fps and fast 0.15-second startup time

The 5D features the following:
*** DIGIC II processing
*** 3.0 fps for up to 60 consecutive JPEG or 17 RAW frames in a burst.

For a concise comparison, read this:
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/compare_post.asp?method=sidebyside&cameras=canon_eos30d%2Ccanon_eos5d&show=all

[canoflan]

;) Just like washing your car brings rain, I just bought the rebated 5D for $2,000 after rebate (body only) and it WILL be discontinued.;)

[coreypolis]

;) Just like washing your car brings rain, I just bought the rebated 5D for $2,000 after rebate (body only) and it WILL be discontinued.;)
all will be discontinued, but the 5d wtill has life left, and its still a great camera.

[DrPablo]

you are kidding right?

I don't think what's quoted is exactly what I meant. I was pointing out the strange market position of the 5D, as opposed to comparing its feature set directly to the 30D.

The issue is one of price point, not just features. The 5D is twice the price of the 30D, more or less, and half the price of the 1D Mark IIN, more or less.

That extra $1000+ you pay to go from a 30D to a 5D is almost exclusively to pay for the sensor, i.e. 50% larger and 50% more pixels. And you actually lose some features, like the faster fps and the on-board flash (yes, for what it's worth). On the other hand, the 5D lacks a ton of the pro features that you find on the 1-series bodies.

So it finds itself between the very affordable 'good enough for many pros' 30D (and 20D) bodies, and between the expensive but every-feature-you-could-possibly-need true pro cameras in the 1-series. So there are two well-identified markets between which the 5D finds itself, and only Canon's projections and expectations will tell us whether there are enough buyers in that pocket.

[coreypolis]

I don't think what's quoted is exactly what I meant. I was pointing out the strange market position of the 5D, as opposed to comparing its feature set directly to the 30D.

The issue is one of price point, not just features. The 5D is twice the price of the 30D, more or less, and half the price of the 1D Mark IIN, more or less.

That extra $1000+ you pay to go from a 30D to a 5D is almost exclusively to pay for the sensor, i.e. 50% larger and 50% more pixels. And you actually lose some features, like the faster fps and the on-board flash (yes, for what it's worth). On the other hand, the 5D lacks a ton of the pro features that you find on the 1-series bodies.

So it finds itself between the very affordable 'good enough for many pros' 30D (and 20D) bodies, and between the expensive but every-feature-you-could-possibly-need true pro cameras in the 1-series. So there are two well-identified markets between which the 5D finds itself, and only Canon's projections and expectations will tell us whether there are enough buyers in that pocket.
I was more refering to his mis stated facts than your observations.

[steveathome]

All depends what you do and what you need it for, personally if I currently had the funds I would be waiting outside my local photographic store before they opened to purchase the 5D. I already own the 30D and 350D.
I dont do sports, I have dabbled in it - portrature is my preference, and no-one is going to tell me the 30D has an advantage over the 5D for that.
My first SLR the Olympus OM1n was discontinued years ago, but I sure wish I had kept mine, its still a splendid 35mm film camera.
Horses for courses.

[joeflux]

Yeah, it all depends on what you do and what you need it for... BUT I don't have $3500 for a Canon 1D Mark II N that I need to shoot professional sports or $2500 for the used Canon 1D Mark II on Ebay. Thanks everyone!

[joeflux]

Yeah I did try the 1D original for $1200 on ebay and it came broke, no flash. Returned it but I did notice the resolution wasn't good enough for magazine shoots I am doing.

[coreypolis]

Yeah I did try the 1D original for $1200 on ebay and it came broke, no flash. Returned it but I did notice the resolution wasn't good enough for magazine shoots I am doing.
it doesn't have a flash :confused:

[roger the photographer]

A 12.7 MP 24x36 sensor is a tremendous advantage all by itself. This sensor doesn't seem to know what noise is all about... I simply do not use NoiseNinja under ISO 800, a thing I couldn't do with my 20D.

It is customary to say that one should not crop, that the shot should be right the first time. Many of us know that this is simply not true in many circumstances. Shooting birds and insects are good examples. And then, you thank Canon for the added precious no-noise megapixels.:lol:

[sageone]

JoeGolf... Unfortunately, you were incorrect. The 5D is actually distinctly different than the 30D.

For example,
1. They do not have the same MP (8.2 vs 12.7)
2. They do not have the same sensor size (22.5 x 15.0 vs 36 x 24 mm)
3. They have distinctly different ISO options (significant advantage to 5D)
4. The 5D has 8 WB settings (vs the 30Ds 6 WB settings)

As far as frame rates, that gets a little tricky. As you mentioned, the 30D has a "perceived" advantage over the 5D since the 30D is listed at shooting 2fps higher IF it is set in the high-speed mode.

However, that advantage would primarily only be noticed by folks who are doing a lot of high-speed shooting (Sports, possibly weddings or other events) and I am assuming that shooting in the higher speed means there is a "give" somewhere else. However, even with that said, the 5D reclaims this advantage when you factor in the buffer size and the bursts themselves.

The 30D features the following:
*** DIGIC II processing
*** The user can select high-speed or low-speed continuous shooting
*** at 5 fps or 3 fps - up to 30 (JPEG), 11 (RAW) or 9 (RAW+JPEG) consecutive frames when set at 5 fps and fast 0.15-second startup time

The 5D features the following:
*** DIGIC II processing
*** 3.0 fps for up to 60 consecutive JPEG or 17 RAW frames in a burst.

For a concise comparison, read this:
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/compare_post.asp?method=sidebyside&cameras=canon_eos30d%2Ccanon_eos5d&show=all


I was thinking about adding a 5D to my aresenal...great comparison. I could see why having a 5D in the bag would be an advantage for me. I am very happy with my 30Ds and 20D, but a 5D would be nice. Then again, so wouldn't the 1D. :)

[cdesperado]

I have to admit, I've never shot with the 5D myself - However, it sure seems like a great camera body. I know several shooters with "high speed needs" who ARE using them for weddings and fashion shoots and they are pleased as punch with the camera.

IMO, it is every bit a "professional's" camera. With things as good as they are, you can't help but wonder what surprises has in store for the next gen of the 5D and 1D series, but that's another thread. <grin>

[joeflux]

it doesn't have a flash :confused:

I know it doesn't have a flash. The hot shoe for flash came broken.