What do you *not* like about your tripod head?

[Scottes]

I've been looking at tripods and head and can't find a head I like. I have no desire to spend a ridiculous amount (like over $200) on my first real head, considering that I'm also looking at a tripod and L.

I've tried browsing, searching, and lurking on-line. I tried 3 different camera stores. Nothing jumps out saying that this is the right one. Since I've spent so much time looking for the good points and getting nowhere, I thought I'd try the reverse, and look out for the things that suck.

What do you dislike about your tripod head?

I've got a cheap, mediocre tripod with a pan-tilt head. It will continue to do for the small glass and landscapes that I do. So I'm looking for something on the wildlife side, much more mammals than the occasional bird. Camera is a 10D (no BigEd) and the largest lens mounted will be a 100-400 L IS. The 1.4 TC will go on when I can do manual focus at F8. Tripod will be a Bogen 3021PRO unless someone talks me out of that.

If I had the budget a Kirk BH-1 would be mine, but at $340 plus plate it's too much. Even the BH-3 at $100 less is a bit pricey. I truly like the idea of the friction control on these two, and haven't stumbled across any cheaper ones that look decent.

All comments appreciated. I'm going nuts.

[PacAce]

Check out the Manfrotto 3221 WN tripod legs and the 486RC2 ballhead . The whole setup is solid and well constructed. However, don't expect to be doing much panning with a ballhead.

[CyberDyneSystems]

I like the 3021 and 3001 pro legs alot. An excellent choice.

...and I have to admit to being partial to the "pistol grip" ball heads.. O-kay so that makes me kind of an oddball.. but I can't be the only one who likes them,. they are a big seller! :)

To specifically answer your question,

What I DO NOT like about my Ballhead
The downside is what PacAce refers to... I want a ball head with a seperate panning pivot... but the ones that have that are in the $200.00 plus range. :(

I am actually looking for/thinking of designing a seperate panning plate that can be inserted between any tripod and any head.....

Best of both worlds.

[Belmondo]

I didn't like the 486Rc2 ball head because you couldn't pan with it. The 488RC2 is stouter, uses the same quick release plates as the 486, and can be panned. The 486 is happily at home on my monopod, and I can use the same QR plates on both.

Life doesn't get any better than that!

Thos.

[PacAce]

I didn't like the 486Rc2 ball head because you couldn't pan with it. The 488RC2 is stouter, uses the same quick release plates as the 486, and can be panned. The 486 is happily at home on my monopod, and I can use the same QR plates on both.

Life doesn't get any better than that!

Thos.

Tom, I just took a look at the 488RC2 and it looks exactly like the 486RC2 except that it's a tad bigger. We must have different definitions of what "panning" means. :D

[BTW, for me, panning means being able to move the camera along the vertical and horizontal axis independently of each other, which is quite hard if not impossible to do with a ballhead.]

[CyberDyneSystems]

Doesn't the 488 haave seperate "pan only" bearing in it's base?

The difference is actually made obvious by the extra knob on the side which I assume,. if it like the other ball heads I have seen loosens only the pan function?,. while leaving the "ball" locked tight by the main lever/knob?

The 486
http://www.bogenimaging.us/fileindexednew/module2/item/file0005613.gif

The 488
http://www.bogenimaging.us/fileindexednew/module2/item/file0005626.gif


This is EXACTLY the feature that I wish my pistol grip ball head had,. but alas like the 486,. it does not.

Am I wrong on this? Does the extra knob do something else?

[PacAce]

Doesn't the 488 haave seperate "pan only" bearing in it's base?

The difference is actually made obvious by the extra knob on the side which I assume,. if it like the other ball heads I have seen loosens only the pan function?,. while leaving the "ball" locked tight by the main lever/knob?

The 486
...

The 488
...



This is EXACTLY the feature that I wish my pistol grip ball head had,. but alas like the 486,. it does not.

Am I wrong on this? Does the extra knob do something else?

Aah! :o Thanks, CDS, for the insight. Now I see the difference.

Sorry, Tom, I should never had doubted you. :oops:

[Belmondo]

[quote="CyberDyneSystems"]Doesn't the 488 haave seperate "pan only" bearing in it's base?

Yes. That's the main reason I bought it.

BTW, I always had a mental definition of 'panning' is being able to sweep along the horizontal axis. I've never thought of it in terms of the vertical axis. Am I wrong?

Thos. (Tom)

[Scottes]

From Bogen:
"The 488RC2 features a separate fast action ratchet lever for 360° pan and an easy to grip locking knob for +90°-90° tilt movements."
vs
"The 486RC2 features a single ratchet locking knob for 360° pan and a double groove for +90°-90° tilt movements."

Looking at the pictures and attempting to understand, it seems that the 488 has seperate locks for 360-degree pan and ball, whereas the 486 has one lever that locks everything.

Basically what CDS said.

[PacAce]

...BTW, I always had a mental definition of 'panning' is being able to sweep along the horizontal axis. I've never thought of it in terms of the vertical axis. Am I wrong?

Thos. (Tom)

My American Heritage dictionary defines:

pan3 (p²n) v. panned, pan·ning, pans. --intr. 1. To move a movie or television camera to follow an object or create a panoramic effect. --tr. To move (a camera) so as to follow a moving object or create a panoramic effect. [Short for panorama or panoramic.]

So I would think that following a space shuttle shooting straight up into the sky would also be panning, too, right?

[Belmondo]

...BTW, I always had a mental definition of 'panning' is being able to sweep along the horizontal axis. I've never thought of it in terms of the vertical axis. Am I wrong?

Thos. (Tom)

My American Heritage dictionary defines:

pan3 (p²n) v. panned, pan·ning, pans. --intr. 1. To move a movie or television camera to follow an object or create a panoramic effect. --tr. To move (a camera) so as to follow a moving object or create a panoramic effect. [Short for panorama or panoramic.]

So I would think that following a space shuttle shooting straight up into the sky would also be panning, too, right?

Leo:
As I said, that's the definition I had in my mind. Unfortunately, we also know what a dummy I am capable of being---a fact that I've made no great effort to hide. FWIW, I also believe the earth is flat. :wink:

I would only ask this: Why aren't pan/tilt heads called pan/pan? Obviously, this is a conspiracy among head manufacturers to perpetuate my misconception.

[PacAce]

From Bogen:
"The 488RC2 features a separate fast action ratchet lever for 360° pan and an easy to grip locking knob for +90°-90° tilt movements."
vs
"The 486RC2 features a single ratchet locking knob for 360° pan and a double groove for +90°-90° tilt movements."

Looking at the pictures and attempting to understand, it seems that the 488 has seperate locks for 360-degree pan and ball, whereas the 486 has one lever that locks everything.

Basically what CDS said.

The 488 definitely does make it a lot simpler to shot panoramic landscape pictures.

[CyberDyneSystems]

Panning is considered horizontal left to right or right to left..

Just look at a pan tilt head... the panning feature allows only horizontal movement :)

Following a moon launch up into the stratosphere would not be panning,. it would be tilting :)

Now look what you've gone and done PacAce,. you've gone and got Tom to call himself "stupid" again! :(

We can't have him doing that any more than three or four times a week! :wink:

[PacAce]

...I would only ask this: Why aren't pan/tilt heads called pan/pan? Obviously, this is a conspiracy among head manufacturers to perpetuate my misconception.

My guess is...(have you noticed that I do a LOT of guessing? :) )...that they used to call the pan/tilt heads a pan/pan/tilt head because you can pan on the horizontal axis and you can pan on the veritical axis. But you can also tilt the head so that the camera goes from landscape to portrait.

But, guessing again, people must have gotten tired of referring to these heads as pan/pan/tilt head so they sortened it to a pan/tilt head.

But then, guessing again, people like you (wondering why a pan/tilt head is called a pan/tilt head) got confused by this so the head manufacturers decided to simply call them 3-way heads which, I'm sure, confused yet another bunch of folks who are wondering what the 3 ways are that the head is adjustable for. :mrgreen: :lol: :D

[Belmondo]

CDS.
I'm just trying to understand. If Peter Pan can fly straight up, does he then become Peter Tilt?

If you shake a pinball machine from side to side, why does it say 'Tilt?' Shouldn't it say 'Pan?'

Anyway, thanks for keeping track of the number of time I call myself stupid. One can never be too humbel, especially when he/she deserves to be.

You must admit, there aren't many people on this forum whose feet are as often so firmly planted in their mouths as are mine. This is a throwback to my junior high school band teacher who once told me, "I'd rather hear a mistake than to not hear you at all." I'm not sure he meant that literally, but I became a very loud (albeit mediocre) musician. The band teacher's greatest challenge thereafter became trying to figure out how to shut me up without hurting my feelings.

People are still wrestling with that one.

Thos (Tom)

[PacAce]

Panning is considered horizontal left to right or right to left..

Just look at a pan tilt head... the panning feature allows only horizontal movement :)

Following a moon launch up into the stratosphere would not be panning,. it would be tilting :)

Now look what you've gone and done PacAce,. you've gone and got Tom to call himself "stupid" again! :(

We can't have him doing that any more than three or four times a week! :wink:

I for one think Tom is "special".

He's special 'cuz he's got 2 X 10D and I only have one.
He's special 'cuz he can shoot at 400mm using 4 different lenses and I can only do it with one.
He's special 'cuz he taken lots of great train pictures and I've only taken one, and of a pathetic HO scale model at that.

But most of all, I think he's special 'cuz he's a special kind of guy who's proud of his red 10D. :D

[CyberDyneSystems]

Hmmm much to consider,.

...if you take your favorite skillet off the stove,. and hang it up by it's handle,. does it become a "frying tilt"

If you turn your SLR on it's side,. (this by the way is the third axis in three way heads.. the ability to switch to portrait from landscape :) )
...will the specialized TSE 90mm lens mounted be a "Pan Shift" lens?

And most curious,. the old sport of tiliting??? The horse definately move in a panning fashion towards eachother! They'd have to,. unless they could fly?

[Belmondo]

CDS:
You've given us much to consider. I have a headache.

Thos (Tom)

[Belmondo]

But then, guessing again, people like you (wondering why a pan/tilt head is called a pan/tilt head) got confused by this so the head manufacturers decided to simply call them 3-way heads which, I'm sure, confused yet another bunch of folks who are wondering what the 3 ways are that the head is adjustable for. :mrgreen: :lol: :D


Geez....I hate beating dead horses. This is my stupid guess about 3-way heads:

They have the pan/tilt features already discussed, plus the camera can also be rotated on the head from landscape to portrait (or any point in between), hence, the third way.


The earth is flat, isn't it?

[CyberDyneSystems]

Geez....I hate beating dead horses. This is my stupid guess about 3-way heads:

They have the pan/tilt features already discussed, plus the camera can also be rotated on the head from landscape to portrait (or any point in between), hence, the third way.


The earth is flat, isn't it?

I hate to brag,. well actually I love to brag,. but

I allready said this three posts up! :)
If you turn your SLR on it's side,. (this by the way is the third axis in three way heads.. the ability to switch to portrait from landscape )

[Belmondo]

So you did.

Never mind.

[PacAce]

The earth is flat, isn't it?

Yes it is, Thos! :D

And every night, Atlas has to come over and turn it upside down to get it out of the direct sun so that people can sleep at night.

[Scottes]

Ummm... So what do you hate about your tripod head? :)

I now need 2 tripods with heads - I no longer know how to use my cheapo pan/tilt because I no longer know what it does. I'm safe with my skillets though, however they hang. And I won't be shooting any shuttle launches.

Maybe I'll just get a beanbag....



No hard feelings about hijacking this thread, though Pekka might have to move it to the Definitions forum. I generally have a blast when threads digress, especially when Thos is involved. However, I'm surprised that Gitzo did not make his way into a sentence here. You guys are losing it.

[PacAce]

Ummm... So what do you hate about your tripod head? :)



Oh, yeah! Getting back on topic here, I just love my tripod and head for what it's good for. But I also hate the fact that I can't pan and tilt with it as easily as I would like when I want to track a bird in flight.

Since I also shoot videos, I'm thinking of getting a good, solid video head. Then I'll see how it works out with the 10D for tracking.

[ChrisNardone]

I have a Bogen Manfrotto 3275 Mini Gear QR Head. I just started using it. What I don't like about it is that it is a little stiff. Also with a separate knob for each of 3 axes, I have to take my eye off the view finder to find the knob I want. Both of these problems will likely improve with time.
What I like about it is that it has very precise geared movement.

[SWPhotoImaging]

Well now . . .

I have a Bogen/Manfrottto 3021 Pro, with the center post that can be slipped out and installed either horizontally, or upside down. With the post horizontal, the head orientation is 90 degrees offset.

Therefore, I can use my Pan/Tilt head to pan either horizontally, or vertically, and to tilt either vertically or horizontally.

If there were any space shuttles launching around here, I suppose I could then Pan the tripod head as I followed the ascent.

Then again, it's possible that re-orienting a pan/tilt head just makes it a tilt/pan head, and I'm perpetuating a rediculous thread . . . . . yep.

[banjobob]

I was looking at the 488RC4, it looks similar to the 488rc2 but with levels. Is one plate better than the other?

[Belmondo]

I opted for the 488RC2 because the QR plate is the same as on the 486RC2 which I already owned. This way, I could have the 488 on the Gitzo tripod, and the 486 on the Bogen monopod. I have extras of the QR plates, so I can just leave those on the bodies and the lenses with tripod rings. I can freely move all my equipment back and forth between the tripod and the monopod without having to change QR plates.

BTW, I have a Bogen 3051 tripod with a 3047 3-way head on it. It's heavy, solid, and lives in the back of my truck. I like to use it whenever I'm shooting @400mm and don't have to lug the contraption more than a few feet. It's not at all bothered by the weight of the 10D with BG-ED3, and any lens I currently own. It really is the strongest tripod I own---or have ever owned.

[fredlord]

I don't mean to be a PITA here but the aeronautical terms for the three axes of motion are roll, pitch and yaw. I write this in the vain hope that it might help in defining what a prospective tripod head might be capable of.

Roll is when one wing goes down and the other goes up. (When you rotate from horizontal composition to vertical or vice versa.)
Pitch is when the nose goes up or down and the tail goes the opposite. (Tilt is what I've always called this.)
Yaw is when you turn left or right. (Panoramic = Pan for short.)

I hope this doesn't further the confusion and I recommend the Kirk BH-1 highly as you will never need another tripod head ever. It's cheaper to buy the good one first because you probably will buy it eventually anyway. Murphy's twelfth law, I believe.