Manual mode for remote camera??

[tghaines]

Hi fellow forumers,

I have an event this weekend (triathlon) where I am planning to use a remote camera attached high to the finishing arch. I will be sitting at the base of the arch and every finisher will get 2 shots from the same trigger press. 1 long and 1 wide. I have seen this done before and the results are great. I have all the gear to do this and I have tested it functionally, but not at a live event.

My question is : For the remote camera can I just set it at manual and hope for the best that the light doesn't change, or do I use Tv/Av modes, or do I use something complicated like EOS remote on my laptop.

Happy to hear suggestions or experiences.

Thanks,

[freeflydrew]

If it's outdoors, I would shoot with Aperture Priority as your depth of field won't really need to change, yet the available light may...

don't forget to cover the viewfinder and tape down the focus!

[tghaines]

don't forget to cover the viewfinder and tape down the focus!

Thanks freeflydrew,

I understand using MF & tape when I use the remote camera, but whats the reason behind covering the viewfinder?

thanks,

[Rumjungle]

So stray light doesn't come in the back. You have a 1D, right? You should have a built-in cover for the viewfinder.

[tghaines]

I'll be holding the 1D and the 20D will be remote.

No worries covering the viewfinder. I had never thought it was an issue....great to know.

Thanks,

[primoz]

Normally I would say go manual. But in your case, I would go with any of program modes and hope for best. When outdoor and if weather is anything but 100% clear sky, you have really big chance that conditions will change. Especially since you will be out there for at least hour or two.
But if you have chance to change setting every now and then (like every 10mins) then still try manual. I'm sorry to say, but for sport shooting camera is just too stupid (or to advanced) to handle this kind of things automatically. Especially when you can't really control where exactly athlete will be at moment of triggering shutter.

[tghaines]

Thanks Primoz,

I agree. If the weather is 100% I will get the meter out and set it to manual. I will be in that spot from 10:30am to 2pm so the light will change a bit, but luckily (or not) it will be that crappy direct overhead light :( . I use manual 100% of the time normally, but I can't in this instance.

Here is an example of what I am after.
1 shot by me on the ground.
http://www1.global-pix.com/shop/photos/Sports/JRAU/2006%20Sports/ITU%20Worlds%20Long%20Course%20Triathlon/fullsize/LCC0249.jpeg
1 shot from the remote at the same time
http://www1.global-pix.com/shop/photos/Sports/JRAU/2006%20Sports/ITU%20Worlds%20Long%20Course%20Triathlon/fullsize/LCF0249.jpeg

If there are clouds I'll probably iso up to 400 and use Tv and set it to 500 (what we aim to shoot at all the time). I'll still use my meter to get a best guess. I am hoping to shoot at at f7.1, f8, and upward. Even if it's cloudy, it is still very bright and glare.

I have the day before to have a think and play so we'll see.

thanks for the tips,

[johnstoy]

More power to you...get them, there, shots and post them here, right away, you hear?...Looking forward to it...

[tghaines]

Thanks John,

I'm looking forward to it too.....only it's going to be 41C (:eek: 105.8F) on the day so will need to drink more than I shoot. Happy I'm not competing!!!

[tghaines]

Hi Guys,

Thanks to all the tips, this worked like a charm!!! The temp got to 43Deg C and it was a tough day's work. 3500 frames all up from the 2 cameras and a few afternoon beers for me in the Hotels pool!!!!

Here's the set-up on the Finishers Arch:
20D with BG-E2 (didn't need the grip so no idea why I used it. ACK-E2 only goes in 1 spot, the other is empty and there is a cable exit point on the BG-E2)
24-105 f4 L IS set to about 50mm.
Tv Mode at 1/500 (light meter the day before the get this right)
Center average metering (I think that's what it's called)
PocketWizard 2 Plus and home made keep-awake cord.
Manfrotto superclamp and 3D Head.
ACK-E2 - 20D AC Power Supply.

#1 - The Silver stuff is part of one of those emergency blankets(Aus$4). This was to stop the camera melting down in the heat. It was out in the sun all day and did not skip a beat!!
http://trenthaines.myphotos.cc/photos/Forum/1DN_2830.jpg

#2 - The Mount was a Manfrotto Super Clamp with a 3-D head on it. I set the position the day before with some test shots then marked the position on the arch and took the whole thing as it was.
http://trenthaines.myphotos.cc/photos/Forum/1DN_2831.jpg

#3 - Power was from the 20D's AC adaptor. Batteries are not reliable enough in the heat for that amount of time and it was way too hard to replace them mid-race.
http://trenthaines.myphotos.cc/photos/Forum/1DN_2832.jpg

Shot #1 - this is from me and the 1D in Manual Mode with the Pocket Wizard attached to the flash shot-shoe. (1DMK2N with 70-200 f2.8L IS)
http://trenthaines.myphotos.cc/photos/Forum/1DN_4603.jpg

Shot #2 - Same time from the 20D up on the finish arch.
http://trenthaines.myphotos.cc/photos/Forum/IMG_9914.jpg

(Just as an aside - WOW look at the difference in quality of photo....Stoked with the 1D MK2N - Go and buy one now!!!)

Loads of great shots, Boss is happy, all I need now is my pay...hehehehhe....I'll just buy more gear anyway :D.

thanks for looking ad helping,

[Rumjungle]

I'm glad to see that it worked out for you. How much of a lag do you think there is between the 1d and 20d shots? I see that the lead runner has his right foot forward in both shots, but the guy in back has his left one forward in the 1d shot, and his other foot out on the 20d shot.

[tghaines]

It's hard to say exactly. The PW manual says (from memory) 1/2000th second + shutter lag of the 20D = not much. I'm sure the measurebaters on the forum would know exactly what the delay is ;) .

Sorry - Just realised these are not the matching pair.:oops: :oops:
This one should match.
http://trenthaines.myphotos.cc/photos/Forum/IMG_9913.jpg

When I do this again I will sync the camera clocks from the 1 source (like my desktop) so the times are closer. I have to go by guess at the moment and I used the front runners arms.

Thanks for the comments,

[Curtis N]

Interesting thread, thanks for posting these. I am considering a remote camera setup for a completely different venue (theatre). A few questions:
1) How did you focus? Manual prefocus, autofocus, or some other method?
2) Tell me more about the "home made keep awake cord". I would think you could turn off the "auto-off" function of the 20D?
3) There is a difference in quality, but it's hard to blame that on the camera. The 20D is capable of making sharp pictures with a good lens, properly focused, unless the shots you posted here are severely cropped?
4) One last question: The next time you do something like this, will you do anything differently?

[tghaines]

Hi Curtis,

Thanks for the questions.

1) How did you focus? Manual prefocus, autofocus, or some other method?

The day before I autofocussed then switched to manual and put some electrical tape on the lens to stop the ring from moving.....more later

2) Tell me more about the "home made keep awake cord". I would think you could turn off the "auto-off" function of the 20D?

From memory there are 2 issues, 1) is the camera switching off - I did have the auto-off to None as the camera had AC Power so this was not a problem. 2) there is more of a delay when the camera is "woken-up" from sleep then from when it is awake. I did not need a lightening fast response from the remote camera, so as long as it was ON then I was OK. There are plenty of threads on how to make the cable on the cheap.

3) There is a difference in quality, but it's hard to blame that on the camera. The 20D is capable of making sharp pictures with a good lens, properly focused, unless the shots you posted here are severely cropped?

Agreed:oops: - I have not cropped or PP'd these photos at all, but have compressed them to post. Focus could be an issue as it's not perfect as the subject moves along the finish chute. I think the focus is short in these images from the 20D. They are f10, but at this close distance the focus is not too broad.

4) One last question: The next time you do something like this, will you do anything differently?

* Set camera times the same so Images can be matched by time.
* Spend more time setting focus. Even to the point of measuring with a tape.
* Set to +1/3 - +2/3 stops exposure as many of the athletes are wearing hats. The shadows need lifting (We try prevent the need for PPing due to the number of images)
* Possibly use Av and f22, ISO 400 or something like that to get a safer DOF.

As a first attempt I'm happy with the result, but as with any first attempt you have room to learn. In hiensight I was more concerned about the functionality of the setup than of the quality of the photos....this was dumb as I have loads of "fair" pictures.

Thanks for the questions,

[gmen]

Very interesting thread.... remotes are fun.

Just one thought: Safety cables? Did you use any? Not clear from the images you posted of the set-up.

---- Gavin

[Curtis N]

Trent, thanks for your insights.

A 50mm lens on a 20D at f/10 will have a hyperfocal distance of about 44 feet, and if you focus at 20 ft. you should get acceptable sharpness from about 14 to 37 feet. I still don't know why the shots are a bit soft, but a different focusing technique next time might help answer that.

I'm still confused about the wakeup cord, it sounds like you determined it isn't necessary for what you were doing. With the remote setup I'm considering it shouldn't be an issue. Edit: I did a little searching and found this thread (http://www.photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=123408)most useful for anyone pondering the same issue.

I agree that these would be better if they were exposed a bit brighter. The camera was metering on mostly the light gray dirt. If they were running on new blacktop the result would likely be different.

[tghaines]

A 50mm lens on a 20D at f/10 will have a hyperfocal distance of about 44 feet, and if you focus at 20 ft. you should get acceptable sharpness from about 14 to 37 feet. I still don't know why the shots are a bit soft, but a different focusing technique next time might help answer that.

From these figures (thanks for the math), I still think my focus was short. These guys were out further than that, but I have no real empirical data to support my ramblings. I have no other good ideas as to why the images are soft. I had the 20D set to M-quality JPGs and I have not used this setting before. The 1D has compression for each quality setting and I don't know if the 20D does too?? More investigation needed me thinks.

I'm still confused about the wakeup cord, it sounds like you determined it isn't necessary for what you were doing. With the remote setup I'm considering it shouldn't be an issue.

For the PWs in this situation you may not need a wakeup cord due to having constant AC power. I have made a few cords, but the wakeup is the simplest and the one I use most frequently to cover all bases. In short.....it was the cable I had on the day. ;)

The thread you posted was the exact one I used to make my wakeup cable.

Gavin - No safety cables, but I was thinking about them. Do you have any posts I can look at on the subject? If the camera fell, it only would have hit me anyway :D.

Thanks Guys,