Legs-N-Heads

[ilya]

My post-70-200 L/2.8IS purchasing probation is about to expire.

I've had plenty of time to think about what I "need", and I have the need for a solid, lightweight tripod, with a quality head.

I did some research, but I'd like to know what you guys think is da-bomb of a combination, so I won't say what I'm considering:

Here are the parameters:

Up to $400 for both head and legs

Max load, right now anyway - 10D, the 70-200, and a 420EX. So about 5-6 lbs. If I ever get a 600mm I'll upgrade to a sidekick... (yea aha)

Carbon if it makes sense within that price range.

Relatively compact in size, or at least not a huge thing. Portability is important.

Ball-joint head vs 3d vs geared? I'd totally prefer a pistol grip ball head, unless there are issues. Quick release a must.

Flip levers vs twisties? (have flip levers now, not a huge fan)

Geared center column - good or who cares?

Do I need to spend more money?
If you can post pics of your set up, appreciate it; or just advice. (Max 1 mule picture per page :wink: )

Many thanks
Ilya

[CyberDyneSystems]

Pistol grip heads,. I am partial to them too.. there are only two that I know of,. both cheap. $100.00 or $80.00 both Manfrotto.

Geared Column? When you get that 600mm f/4 you'll need a diferent tripod and head for sure (it WON'T be as portable as what you are looking for now) Save the geared column for the 600mm set up. :roll:

Carbon fibre? Don't know a thing about it except that its pricey! :)

But if you get the pricey pistol grip at $100.00 that leaves $300.00 for the carbon legs :)

P.S.

I have these legs @ about $100.00
http://www.bogenimaging.us/product/templates/templates.php3?sectionid=2&itemid=768


And these heads;
http://www.bogenimaging.us/product/templates/templates.php3?sectionid=8&itemid=2529

http://www.bogenimaging.us/product/templates/templates.php3?sectionid=8&itemid=269

[Belmondo]

Ilya, I bought a monster Bogen tripod a while back, but it's way too heavy for anything onther than oil derrick use. (Sure is solid, though)

I bought a somewhat smaller, but much more practical set of legs (Gitzo, of course), and I really love the thing. It's quick and easy to set up, and the 'rapid column' is amazingly versatile. This is it: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=206491&is=REG

I'm using the Bogen 488RC2 ball head on it. I like that one because it's fairly large and rigid, and uses the same QR plates that the 486RC2 head on my monopod uses. This way, I don't have to change QR plates when I move from the tripod to the monopod and vice versa.

Thos.

[Mark Kemp]

I have Manfrotto 190CL legs and a115 head. Aluminium not Carbon, but not ridiculously heavy and pretty stable. I got it because my old Cobra kit kept slipping or sinking under the weight of long L lenses and heavier bodies.
This combo is pretty flexible as well. The legs will go completely flat for low shots and the head is just a two lever release and it is then completely floating. It is also a simple screw not a quick release plate, but I like this as it still only takes a few seconds to get the camera off and there is no plate left attached afterwards, which I find get in the way.
Not sure about US prices but I would think well under your budget, so maybe you could get the carbon version of these legs.
One other bit of advice go for snap locks on the legs rather than screw locks as they are much quicker.
The Manfrotto catalogue is excellent by the way full of good pics and handy data, I expect you can order one via their website or your local dealer might have one.

[IanD]

I am ashamed to admit that I use a Manfrotto 190 NAT 3 set of legs with a Manfrotto 486 RC2 ball head. (forgive me Gitzo)
Not the lightest legs in the world but very steady. The green upper blends in well in the woods. The leg locks and the padding on the top of the legs is a nice touch. Padding is great in cold weather as it acts like a insulator for the hands.
The 486 is the same head that I use on the monopod.
Has worked well for me.

[DaveG]

My post-70-200 L/2.8IS purchasing probation is about to expire.

I've had plenty of time to think about what I "need", and I have the need for a solid, lightweight tripod, with a quality head.

I did some research, but I'd like to know what you guys think is da-bomb of a combination, so I won't say what I'm considering:

Here are the parameters:

Up to $400 for both head and legs

Max load, right now anyway - 10D, the 70-200, and a 420EX. So about 5-6 lbs. If I ever get a 600mm I'll upgrade to a sidekick... (yea aha)

Carbon if it makes sense within that price range.

Relatively compact in size, or at least not a huge thing. Portability is important.

Ball-joint head vs 3d vs geared? I'd totally prefer a pistol grip ball head, unless there are issues. Quick release a must.

Flip levers vs twisties? (have flip levers now, not a huge fan)

Geared center column - good or who cares?

Do I need to spend more money?
If you can post pics of your set up, appreciate it; or just advice. (Max 1 mule picture per page :wink: )

Many thanks
Ilya

I use a set of Gitzo 1225 metal legs with a Gitzo magnesium ball head. That would fit your price range and load needs, so there's a start. You didn't say how tall you are and that's important. I'd never buy a tripod that was shorter than my eye level with a camera attached. You'll find yourself bent over for a long time one day, and it'll just kill your back, so take the tripod's height into consideration.

I got the Gitzo legs in a three way trade where a friend of mine traded AWAY a set of Gitzo carbon fibre legs. They were as strong as all get out, and light too. But too light and his camera blew over one day, so goodbye carbon fibre. Now if you were backpacking a lot then CF would be a great idea. However if you are just carrying the tripod for short distances, then the aluminum legs are OK, and a lot cheaper.

I like the ball head approach, but a tilt and pan head works better with a lens with a tripod collar, since the ballhead has added one "knee joint" too many. I mean that you you'll either have to lock up the ball head, or the tripod collar. To use both at the same time is going to cause a lot of unstability. Since I use the 70-200 and a 300 on a monopod a lot more than on a tripod, the ball heads are OK on my tripods. I just don't like the pistol grip heads. They look unstable. However the former carbon fibre guy friend of mine, swears by his.

I like the twisties - as you put it - over the flip kind. I don't think I've ever seen a flip tightened tripod that HASN'T failed!

I don't think that you need to spend any more money than you are planning to unless you really want those carbon fibre legs. And take yourself into a corner and think about whether you REALLY are going to go hiking with this stuff and where lightness is critical; or whether it's just cool to own.

[scottbergerphoto]

Which ever you decide to buy, remember it's not cheaper to buy something twice. If you spend a little more, you can do it once. A Gitzo carbon fibre is very sturdy, but not heavy. I use the Gitzo Reporter Mountaineer, G1228. You save $100 by avoiding the geared column, which I don't like anyway. For a ballhead, loook at www.acratech.net. They make "The Ultimate Ballhead". There's alot of useful information about tripod and ballhead selection here: http://www.reallyrightstuff.com/index.html
Scott

[Tapeman]

I also really like the Gitzo 1228.

To me it is the perfect compromise brtweeen wieght/size and rigidity.
Look at the Gitzo 1276 head. I have the 1275 (same head w/o plate)
I bought my legs & head togerther, used.

This setup performs well with heavy body & 70-200 2.8L & 2x but if you are going to use fast 400mm & up primes alot get something bigger.

[iwatkins]

Ilya,

I can only offer my opinion on stuff I know.

I recently (last six months) bought the Giottos MT-8170 (link to item at B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=296579&is=REG) ) and I love this system. You can get down low for macro work, you can put the column out horizontally for extending out of windows, over water etc. Carbon fibre, looks great, weighs around 5-6 pounds and is solid. Comes with a tool kit, carry bag, carry strap etc. Great quality too. B&H price is well within you budget, still leaving plenty for a head.

I've used it through the winter, covered in mud etc. and had no problems at all. Of course, being carbon you do have to be a little more careful not to smash the legs into anything, but I have done so (twice) and not suffered any problems. :D

Main Giottos site is here (http://www.giottos.com/eng_public/welcome.asp) and they do loads of other tripods/monopods and heads (but I don't think they do a pistol grip). I love their stuff so much I already have a new monopod on order (but don't tell the missus).

I've used Manfrotto, Gitzo and Slik tripods over the years, but I don't think I would go back to any of them. I now believe Manfrotto (Bogen in USA ?) is overpriced, well, certainly is here in the UK.

Cheers

Ian

[Bubber Jones]

How interchangeable are heads and legs from different companies?

Is there a universal mount, or are they all different?

Dan

[CyberDyneSystems]

There pretty much all interchangeable,. standard 3/8" or 1/4" in some case.. (I think those are the thread sizes)

[ChrisNardone]

I have a Bogen 3021BN tripod and 3275 geared head. The setup works great for me. I use it with a spotting scope in addition to 10d and L glass. The geared head is so precise. The center column of the tripod isn't geared but it is solid even fully extended.

[Belmondo]

There pretty much all interchangeable,. standard 3/8" or 1/4" in some case.. (I think those are the thread sizes)

The normal thread for the tripod/accessory mount on a camera is 1/4-20. Most of the tripod legs that I've encountered have a 3/8-16 male thread that the head mounts on.

[ilya]

Thanks all, very useful.

I'm down to the Giotto 8160 ($230), carbon, 63", supports 22lbs, weighs 5.5lbs. Has the center column brace allows the column to be used as a lateral arm with angle adjustment

Or Gitzo G2220 ($206), alum, 64", supports 13lbs, weighs 4.9lbs. Sliding center column that tilts from vertical to horizontal and locks in any position.

So both of those offer most everything I need. So I need a tiebreaker here.

I eliminated the Gitzo 1228, its just too much money relative to the expected use.

For ballheads, I fell in love with the "sideways" pistol grip - Manfrotto 322RC2. Apparently so did everyone else, as B&H and Adorama are out of stock.

Thanks again everyone. I'm in the city a couple of days next week, so I'll go to B&H to feel those legs and some others to make the final call.

Ilya

[LiquidMantis]

Any update? I'm debating between the almost same two tripods, only the Giottos 9170 (Aluminum 5 section) instead. I can't get my hands on a Gitzo so I'm curious how they compare.

I did pick up a Giottos "P Pod" monopod on Sunday though. It's very well-machined and solid feeling.

[CyberDyneSystems]

Ilya,. in your first post you mention the Sidekick,..

The Sidekick REQUIRES the use of a Ballhead with a pan only function,. the manfrotto pistol grips don't do that :(

Just an FYI.

[LiquidMantis]

Ilya,. in your first post you mention the Sidekick,..

The Sidekick REQUIRES the use of a Ballhead with a pan only function,. the manfrotto pistol grips don't do that :(

Just an FYI.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but I've got a Manfrotto 3265 pistol grip on loan from a friend and it will pan while locked.

[ilya]

Any update? I'm debating between the almost same two tripods, only the Giottos 9170 (Aluminum 5 section) instead. I can't get my hands on a Gitzo so I'm curious how they compare.

I did pick up a Giottos "P Pod" monopod on Sunday though. It's very well-machined and solid feeling.

....Been working like a dog

Stopped by Fri, to learn they close at 1pm for sabbath

In the city again tomorrow and thu, will check it out thu and report back

/dog tired ilya/

[gvansmith]

Any update? I'm debating between the almost same two tripods, only the Giottos 9170 (Aluminum 5 section) instead. I can't get my hands on a Gitzo so I'm curious how they compare.

I did pick up a Giottos "P Pod" monopod on Sunday though. It's very well-machined and solid feeling.

....Been working like a dog

Stopped by Fri, to learn they close at 1pm for sabbath

In the city again tomorrow and thu, will check it out thu and report back

/dog tired ilya/


I remember many years ago driving up to Gotham on a Friday evening for a Saturday photo session and thought I’d visit B&H first thing in the morning to pick up a few items. This is when I discovered B&H take Saturdays for Sabbath. However, until now I did not know that B&H closes for Sabbath Friday afternoons as well. Thanks for the info.

[ilya]

Ok

Although I was within a few blocks of B&H, I didn't have time to stop by.

But I did order and receive the Gitzo 2220 legs ($206), and 488RC2 Midi Ball Head with Rapid Connect ($90).

I really wanted the grip ball head Manfrotto 322RC2, but it was out of stock. Wouldn't you know it - same day that I got the regular ball head, I got an email from B&H that they had it in stock :roll:

First impressions -

Legs - light, sturdy, and good looking. They weigh 4.9 lbs / 2.2kg (while the carbon fibre version that costs $520 weights 2kg.)

Center column tilts from vertical to horizontal and lock in any position. Its very handy for getting the macro or perspective shots.

Twist locks are great. Smooth and quick - quarter turn.

The only thing to get used to is aligning the legs to level. Because the tripod is designed to adapt to any terrain, the legs don't have set notches to get everything level instantly. I'm getting the hang of it though.

Ball head - excellent. Fluid and smooth. There is a ball tension adjustment, and a pan adjustment with degree markings. Supports about 8kg, and weights 1.5lbs. Its quick release, and the plate matches the plate I have on my monopod.

Here it is folded up, compared to a standard photo backpack...

http://images.fotopic.net/?id=3174813&outx=600&noresize=1&nostamp=1


Ballhead and top of legs
http://images.fotopic.net/?id=3174814&outx=600&noresize=1&nostamp=1

With lense
http://images.fotopic.net/?id=3174821&outx=600&noresize=1&nostamp=1


And here are some ducks I shot while checking out my new 2x Tcon (with the 70-200is). This is at 400mm, F8
http://images.fotopic.net/?id=3173024&outx=600&noresize=1&nostamp=1

[Belmondo]

Ilya:
Great minds. I have the same setup...Gitzo w/488RC2. Well done. I particularly like that ball head because the QR plates fit the 486 RC2 which is ideal for the monopod. (I actually think I've said that earlier in this thread somewhere, but it's worth repeating.)

I agree that the carbon fiber unit was not worth the extra $$$$.

Thos.

[IanD]

Sweet setup but there is a little problem in photo #2.
That hunk of "L" will work a lot better with a camera body behind it. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
(Just had to say that before Thos saw it :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: )

[Belmondo]

It doesn't matter if all you're trying to do is impress the chicks.

Amazing---I didn't see it. :oops: :oops:

Thos.

[ilya]

Sweet setup but there is a little problem in photo #2.
That hunk of "L" will work a lot better with a camera body behind it. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
(Just had to say that before Thos saw it :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: )

Shoot, that's why I was having a hard time focusing ... :D

....

Thos is right. Size matters. Folks have been asking whether I'm carrying high grade optics, or if I'm just real glad to see them :shock: :lol: :lol:

[Mark Kemp]

I thought it was a digital ixus behind there