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ashleymcnamara
22nd of January 2007 (Mon), 21:13
I was approached to take some pictures for Suicide Girls...Great exposure right? Possibly great pay right? NOPE, NOT EVEN CLOSE! I was asked to sign the following contract and the more I read the more irritated I got. I am NOT signing this contract. What do you think?

http://suicidegirls.com/media/models/downloads/creative_agreement.pdf
INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY ASSIGNMENT – 7-5-06
INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY ASSIGNMENT
This Intellectual Property Assignment (this “Assignment”) is entered into as of
________________, 2006 by and between SG Services, Inc. (“SG”) and
____________________________ (“Photographer”). WHEREAS, Photographer shot and owns certain
photos identified in Section 1 below and Photographer has agreed to assign all rights, title, and interest in
and to such photos to SG. NOW, THEREFORE, in consideration of the terms and the mutual promises
herein and for other good and valuable consideration, the receipt and sufficiency of which are hereby
acknowledged, SG and Photographer hereby agree as follows:
1. Photos. Photographer shot and owns the following photos:
Number of photos in photoset: _______
Description of photoset: __________________________________________________ _______
Full name of model(s) appearing in photoset: ________________________________________
Date photos were submitted to SG:________________________
The above photos shall be referred to herein as the “Photos”.
2. Assignment. Without reservation or limitation, Photographer hereby irrevocably transfers, sells,
assigns, delivers and conveys to SG all rights, title and interest in and to the Photos as of the moment of
the Photos creation and all rights, title and interest in and to the Photos in any format (e.g., paper or
electronic) and all corresponding negatives or other component parts, whether or not delivered to SG.
Photographer also grants SG a worldwide, perpetual, royalty-free, irrevocable, fully paid up right and
license to use Photographer’s name in connection with any Photos. No rights of any kind are reserved to
or by Photographer or shall revert to Photographer who expressly waives any rights of attribution or
integrity.
3. Consideration. Subject to Photographer’s fulfillment of Photographer’s obligations herein, SG
shall provide Photographer with a free three (3) month membership to the SG website upon the full
execution of this Assignment.
4. Representations and Warranties. Photographer represents and warrants that: (i) Photographer
solely created the Photos; (ii) Photographer has good and valid title to the Photos, free and clear of all
liens, claims, charges, claims of co-ownership, claims of infringement, restrictions and encumbrances; (iii)
all clearances, releases, permits and consents necessary for SG’s use of the Photos have been obtained
and that the use of any Photos does not (and will not) infringe, misappropriate or otherwise violate the
rights of any person or entity; (iv) that Photographer has (and will) complied with all applicable
international, federal, state, and local laws, regulations and rules (including, without limitation, obtaining
and retaining such documentation from any person depicted in any Photos as is required by such laws,
rules or regulations to verify such person’s identity, age and consent to be included in the Photos) and
that all Photos comply with such laws, rules and regulations.
5. Confidentiality. Without prior written consent of SG, except to the extent required by an order of a
court having competent jurisdiction, or under subpoena from a governmental body or agency,
Photographer shall not disclose any trade secrets, proprietary information, customer lists, information
regarding product development, marketing plans, financial records, or other financial, commercial,
business, or technical information or records relating to SG, including but not limited to the terms of this
Assignment (collectively, “Confidential Information”), to any third person, unless such Confidential
Information has been previously disclosed to the public by SG or is in the public domain (other than by
reason of Photographer’s breach of this Assignment or by a third party’s violation of its obligation of
confidentiality).
7. Indemnity. Photographer shall indemnify and hold harmless SG and its affiliates, employees,
officers, directors, shareholders, licensees and agents from and against any damages, losses, costs,
INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY ASSIGNMENT – 7-5-06
liabilities and/or expenses (including attorneys’ fees) which SG or such other party may incur as the result
of any demand, claim, suit, action or proceeding made or brought against SG or such other party and
based directly or indirectly on: (i) any Photos; (ii) the acts or omissions of Photographer; or (iii)
Photographer’s breach of this Assignment.
8. Non-Competition. Photographer agrees that for two (2) years after the full execution of this
Assignment, Photographer will not directly or indirectly: (i) sell or otherwise provide Internet, photographic,
video, film, audio, text, design, artistic or other creative content to any “SG Competitor”; or (ii) own, manage,
operate, join, control, finance or participate in the ownership, management, operation, control or financing of,
or be connected as an officer, director, employee, partner, member, principal, agent, representative,
consultant or otherwise, to any “SG Competitor”. “SG Competitor” means any person, entity or organization
other than SG that competes with SG, including but not limited to any person, entity or organization that
creates, develops, manufactures, produces, distributes, markets, licenses or sells events, products or
services that compete with SG.
9. Non-Solicitation. Photographer agrees that for two (2) years after the full execution of this
Assignment, Photographer will not hire (as an employee, agent or consultant) any employee, advisor or
consultant of SG or directly or indirectly seek to persuade any employee, advisor or consultant of SG to
discontinue his or her relationship with SG or to become involved with any business which is a SG
Competitor, nor will Photographer assist anyone else to engage in any of the foregoing.
10. MISCELLANEOUS. Photographer is an an independent contractor and nothing contained in this
Assignment shall be construed to establish an employer/employee, partnership, agency or a joint venture
relationship between Photographer and SG. Photographer shall acquire no right to use, and shall not use
without SG’s express prior written consent, any SG intellectual property. For two (2) years after the full
execution of this Assignment, Photographer agrees not to disparage SG in any manner. This Assignment
shall be binding upon and shall inure to the benefit of the parties to this Assignment and their respective
successors and assigns and constitutes the entire agreement between the parties and supersedes all
prior and contemporaneous negotiations and agreements regarding the subject matter in the Assignment.
No amendment to or modification of this Assignment will be valid and binding unless in writing signed by
both parties. This Assignment shall be governed by and construed under the laws of the State of Oregon
and the parties hereby consent to the exclusive jurisdiction of and venue in the courts sitting in Portland,
Oregon.
The parties have executed this Assignment to be effective as of the date first written above.
AT THE TIME THAT PHOTOGRAPHER SIGNS THIS ASSIGNMENT,
PHOTOGRAPHER AGREES THAT PHOTOGRAPHER IS EIGHTEEN (18) YEARS OF
AGE OR OLDER.
“Photographer” “SG”
By: ______________________________ By: ____________________________
Name: ___________________________ Name:__________________________
Date: ____________________________ Title:___________________________
Date: ___________________________

rhys
22nd of January 2007 (Mon), 21:21
It wouldn't download for me.

If they won't pay enough, there's no more to be said, really.

Croasdail
22nd of January 2007 (Mon), 21:23
That's a pretty bad contract. The worst part is they want to put you out of work for two years. These non-compete things are always in there, and never enforceable. When will stupid people stop putting in language like that.

On the other hand, I have done work for clients where the customer takes full "commercial" ownership of the images. Basically a camera for hire. If I want to put some of the resulting images in my portfolio, or blow them up to wall sized and hang them in my home - no problem. But I can't resell them or give them to someone who would otherwise buy them.

This is one of those cases where you simple strike out the offending language and pass it back to them to see if it is acceptable. But taking sole ownership.... that is pretty standard stuff when someone hires you to do a shoot. Your working for them.

Oh.... cute web site. It speaks to your style well. Good job on that one!

ashleymcnamara
22nd of January 2007 (Mon), 21:24
Not only are they NOT paying me they are telling me I cannot work with anyone else. So crazy I had to share it.

ashleymcnamara
22nd of January 2007 (Mon), 21:25
That's a pretty bad contract. The worst part is they want to put you out of work for two years. These non-compete things are always in there, and never enforceable. When will stupid people stop putting in language like that.

On the other hand, I have done work for clients where the customer takes full "commercial" ownership of the images. Basically a camera for hire. If I want to put some of the resulting images in my portfolio, or blow them up to wall sized and hang them in my home - no problem. But I can't resell them or give them to someone who would otherwise buy them.

This is one of those cases where you simple strike out the offending language and pass it back to them to see if it is acceptable. But taking sole ownership.... that is pretty standard stuff when someone hires you to do a shoot. Your working for them.

That is exactly what I am going to do...there is going to be a lot of striking! lol

rhys
22nd of January 2007 (Mon), 21:43
Lol. I'd just tear it into little pieces and move on.

ashleymcnamara
22nd of January 2007 (Mon), 21:44
Lol. I'd just tear it into little pieces and move on.

:lol::lol: I am almost to that point! Everytime I look at it, it pisses me off! :rolleyes:

NickSimcheck
22nd of January 2007 (Mon), 22:08
it pisses me off! :rolleyes:

You know what they say you should do to the ashes after you've burnt them :lol:

deadpass
22nd of January 2007 (Mon), 22:58
I also decided to start to shoot for SG, but like the OP, I read the contracts and said "f this" The photographer get 100 per published set that you have to send in an invoice for and you have to find your own models until you've had three sets accepted and then you have to apply to become a staff shooter. A huge pain in the ass for 100 bucks.

ashleymcnamara
22nd of January 2007 (Mon), 23:06
I also decided to start to shoot for SG, but like the OP, I read the contracts and said "f this" The photographer get 100 per published set that you have to send in an invoice for and you have to find your own models until you've had three sets accepted and then you have to apply to become a staff shooter. A huge pain in the ass for 100 bucks.


That is craziness! How on earth do they get quality photographers with that kind of thinking? I am a child photographer so that is not the route I was going for anyways but I thought that since they are so huge that it would be a big deal for me...WRONG!

Croasdail
22nd of January 2007 (Mon), 23:49
Ok... I just checked out their web site. Sorry, I was a little ignorant, and since you mentioned they are so big, I thought they might be real. I guess I assumed wrong. I am sure there are plenty of real photographers that post stuff up there, but if I were trying to start a "family and kids" photography business, this is the last site in the world I would want to be associated with. Ok, I take that back, I can think of a few worse choices. Call it what you like, kids and this stuff don't mix. I think they did you a huge favor sending you that contract. For a good percentage of what is one that site, $100 is about right or too much. Now if you were a mid 20's something dude who wanted to pass himself off as edgy and cool photographer, plus see some half naked girls... then this is your place.

Ashley, if you really want to grow your business, there are better ways and places.

kain821
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 01:19
what's wrong with the rest? I only see #8 as an threat

ashleymcnamara
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 09:21
Ok... I just checked out their web site. Sorry, I was a little ignorant, and since you mentioned they are so big, I thought they might be real. I guess I assumed wrong. I am sure there are plenty of real photographers that post stuff up there, but if I were trying to start a "family and kids" photography business, this is the last site in the world I would want to be associated with. Ok, I take that back, I can think of a few worse choices. Call it what you like, kids and this stuff don't mix. I think they did you a huge favor sending you that contract. For a good percentage of what is one that site, $100 is about right or too much. Now if you were a mid 20's something dude who wanted to pass himself off as edgy and cool photographer, plus see some half naked girls... then this is your place.

Ashley, if you really want to grow your business, there are better ways and places.


I completely agree...this is not something that was going to mix with my family business if it was going to be a good deal I would have steered my career in the other direction this is something that you cannot mix with the kid stuff.

rhys
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 09:23
The name of that popgroup (I presume the contract is for a popgroup) is enough to put me off working for them. I don't see why anybody should get upset about a contract no matter how ludicrous it is. I was offered a job by an insurance company in Britain. I read about 2 pages into their contract (using a magnifying glass as the contract was in tiny print) realised that the contract was of debatable legality under UK law as it seemed to indicate that I'd be paid only if they felt like paying me. Anyway, to cut a long story short, I didn't feel it was worth signing that contract and consigned it to the dustbin.

A few days later the manager called and asked when I'd be returning with the signed contract to which I stated that I would not be signing the contract and had tossed it in the dustbin with all the other rubbish. He then started accusing me of working for competitors etc so I just hung up on him. He rang back and was told that if he rang back again I would be filing a complaint of harassment against him with the police. Two weeks later the company closed their local office and moved out of the area.

I generally find people with crappy contracts and crappy business practices don't seem to last very long. I imagine the people behind the contract in the O/P's original posting will not be long in buiness.

overclock
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 11:30
You get a 3 month subscription to their web site! Wow!

sjafari
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 11:39
im sorry, a non-compete clause? come on! I can understand it for industries where there is sensitive information and trade secrets, etc., but not in this case.

elTwitcho
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 11:51
That is craziness! How on earth do they get quality photographers with that kind of thinking?

In a nutshell; they don't.

I used to have a subscription to that site when they had photographers like lithiumpicnic who's work was absolutely incredible, but he no longer works there. As well, his work was of such caliber that he clearly had a different contract as he posted much of the work he'd done on his own website for his portfolio. my guess is that they screwed him around because he now works for a "SG competitor" that has much higher quality photosets.

Clearly based on past experiences they are flexible on this contract. My thoughts are that if your work is good enough, you show it to them and say "ok, this is MY contract" with the terms you're happy with. They may sign it and if they don't, then you walk.

Business is a negotiation, if the deal sucks, get a better one or don't accept it.

303villain
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 14:30
i completely agree with twitcho, they used to have some amazing sets and really phenominal images, as their popularity has exponentially grown, the quality has gone down equally. I had a friend who applied to be an SG but once she saw what the organization is really like she went to Gods Girls instead.

Toss it in the trash :D

coreypolis
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 14:36
isn't SG some kind of porn place? I wouldn't attach my name to anything like that if you want to remain in the portriat and wedding world.

sjafari
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 16:57
isn't SG some kind of porn place?

sweet! another porn vs. art battle is brewing.. :-)

transcend
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 17:09
Suicide girls is notorious for this, FYI.

superdiver
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 17:37
How about someone share a contract thats agreeable and fair, and instead of them always giving you guys the terms, you can give them your terms from the get go?

HectorsGTI
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 17:37
isn't SG some kind of porn place? I wouldn't attach my name to anything like that if you want to remain in the portriat and wedding world.


I'll never understand this sentiment. What's the difference between shooting waffles covered in powdered sugar for a client or nipples covered in baby oil for a client? If you're good at photography and enjoy shooting then you'll find both challenging and fun assignments. Why limit yourself? That would be like becoming a chef and only cooking french fries everytime you went into the kitchen.

ashleymcnamara
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 18:20
I'll never understand this sentiment. What's the difference between shooting waffles covered in powdered sugar for a client or nipples covered in baby oil for a client? If you're good at photography and enjoy shooting then you'll find both challenging and fun assignments. Why limit yourself? That would be like becoming a chef and only cooking french fries everytime you went into the kitchen.


I was not interested in shooting for SG at first because I am a family photographer but my husband made this very same point and I agreed and also decided that IF I did it I would use a completely different name just because I agree I don't think the two should mix

I am not into raunchy photos I am talking pin-up type, classy, nudes if there is such thing. I have only done 1 pinup session before and she was covered (you can see in my flickr acct) so this would have been a challenge to begin with but after hearing back from the coordinator I am NOT interested because honestly its not the drection I was going to go in anyways But I am still irritated about the contract! :lol: Ok I am done rambling...

StealthLude
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 18:48
haha, wow

coreypolis
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 18:51
I'll never understand this sentiment. What's the difference between shooting waffles covered in powdered sugar for a client or nipples covered in baby oil for a client? If you're good at photography and enjoy shooting then you'll find both challenging and fun assignments. Why limit yourself? That would be like becoming a chef and only cooking french fries everytime you went into the kitchen.
just the way it is. You don't see too many adult film stars with lead roles in major motion pictures either now do you ;)

R Hardman
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 19:55
3. Consideration. Subject to Photographer’s fulfillment of Photographer’s obligations herein, SG
shall provide Photographer with a free three (3) month membership to the SG website upon the full
execution of this Assignment.


Where do I sign! :p

poloman
23rd of January 2007 (Tue), 20:44
IMHO just act professionally. Getting pissed will never get you paid. It is amazing how many times you can find something about a prospective client to get pissed about. I agree that they aren't really offering you a darn thing. So, work the contract over with your pen to express what you want. You'll probably end up walking but believe me they'll respect you for it and keep shopping for another desperate fool. If they do it your way, they've paid you a huge compliment! Do make your changes reasonable. ;)

kain821
25th of January 2007 (Thu), 03:54
I generally find people with crappy contracts and crappy business practices don't seem to last very long. I imagine the people behind the contract in the O/P's original posting will not be long in buiness.
but hot chicks sells :lol:

suicide girl has been around for a while I believe

Rumrunner
25th of January 2007 (Thu), 04:03
Sorry, I am too lazy to read all that crapola, but I think the best thing to do is have somebody sign a contract of yours since you are providing the service. I get alot of spam like this too, must be on some kind of photography junk mailing list :( .

Matatazela
25th of January 2007 (Thu), 05:28
I generally find people with crappy contracts and crappy business practices don't seem to last very long.

Agreements prevent disagreements. (Harvey Mackay, 'Swim with the sharks without being eaten alive', p.88

The point of a contract is to protect both parties interests. The one in question only looks after SG. I don't know fish from their website, but I would never, ever, sign that contract.

John Nicholas
27th of January 2007 (Sat), 10:32
Take this job & Shove it.....................

May as well commit suicide

Knightshade
27th of January 2007 (Sat), 13:34
two words come to mind after reading that contract...but I won't use those exact ones and just say, "Uh..no."

jcw122
27th of January 2007 (Sat), 15:18
Suicide Girls is an odd website to begin with...I've never looked into their website further than the main page...it was just sorta weird. Seemed a bit emo to me.