Photos from Inkjet printers

[Brianbar]

I received the below response from Canon Canada.

Brian

Thank you for your E-mail inquiry.

In order for photos that you print on the i850 printer to last a long time
it is recommended to use Canon Photo paper pro and genuine Canon inks.

If you are using 3rd party inks or refilling your ink tanks, then the
photos will not last very long.

When using Canon's genuine inks with the photo paper pro, images can last
up to 25 years.

In order for the photos to last up to 25 years, they must be place in a
book or under glass in a room with regular lighting.

The secret to long lasting photos is to use the Photo paper pro paper and
genuine Canon inks.

Should you require further assistance, please feel free to email us or
visit our customer support website at http://www.canon.ca


Sincerely,

Roch S.
Technical Support Representative
Customer Information Centre
Canon Canada Inc.

[atleypnorth]

do you think they were trying to get across to use Photo paper pro paper and genuine Canon inks ??? :)

[Longwatcher]

Kodak is currently claiming with the newest batches of Ultima paper that they will last over 100 years with Canon inks in an open home environment. They have the scientific research to at least back up the claim based on peer reviewable tests.

That beats 25 years in a sealed environment.

Just my opinion and the fact that I have had bad results with Canon paper fading way too fast.

[kraterz]

Yeah, inkjet mfgrs have been claiming 10 yrs, 25 yrs, and 100 yrs for a long time. They've been disproved time and again with unfailing regularity. In fact how many current printers have been around for 40-100 years?

Forget about the so called scientific lab based accelerated aging tests. Just get a Fuji crystal archive print from your local lab and the same print from your inkjet and tape them both to your fridge. See how long each one lasts. All my inkjet prints (Epson, Canon, etc) have faded in a few weeks to months. My lab prints show absolutely no shifts.

Most people do NOT frame or laminate all their prints or keep them in highly controlled environments.

[digidog]

I agree with kraterz. Printing on an inkjet is a waste of time and money. Just get your pictures burned onto proper photo archive paper. You'll probably have to experiment for a bit to get your monitor calibrated properly but once you have the quality is superb and you know they won't fade.

[Roger_Cavanagh]

It is simply not true to make sweeping generalisations that inkjet prints will not last. There is a good deal of independent information on the longevity of prints available from Wilhelm Imaging Research (http://www.wilhelm-research.com/index.html). Here is just one quote from a November 2003 interview prublished in Shutterbug. I mention this because I happen to own the 2000P:

The previous pigmented ink sets that the Epson used, which was known as the archival ink set and used in the 2000P and the 7500 and 9500 large format machines, was what we considered an extremely high light stability pigmented set. With many type of media it would go past 200 years in our standard display conditions test.

They have data for the Ultrachrome Inks used in the 9600 (and my new R800 :) ). Under "bare bulb" viewing conditions unframed prints on various Epson papers are given permanence ratings from 37 years (Epson Canvas) to 75 years (Somerset Velvet with Premier Art Spray). Prints framed with a UV filter achieve ratings of 75 and greater than 180 years for the same two papers.

I t is clear from comments that Henry Wilhelm makes in the interview and elsewhere that it is very important to match paper and inks correctly to ensure image permanence.

Regards,

[scottbergerphoto]

I agree with Roger. My Epson Stylus Photo 750 and 2200 prints are just beautiful. I have prints on my wall for three years (Stylus Photo 750), not in direct sunlight, with no signs of fading.
Scott

[JZaun]

Well to say that lab prints will last and last is not always true. I have lots of Scuba trip photo's from the 80's that are not recoverable. They have faded and cracked. They were stored in a proper acid free photo book and kept in a closet. Now that is just under 25 years. So much for that.. I think the Digital images on CD will last but I question all else. I do have some 8X10 HP prints that have been on my walls for over 5 years!

Well at my age they don't have to last but so long anyway! :D

Just my 2 cents worth.

JZaun

[Roger_Cavanagh]

I think the Digital images on CD will last but I question all else.

No, that's definitely not true. You have to keep checking CDs and replace them periodically. If you live in the wrong part of the world your CDs can be eaten by fungus. :)

Some more links on this here (http://www.rogercavanagh.com/helpinfo/37_cdsafe.htm).

Regards,

[msvadi]

I'm sorry, but it sounds like TV commercials to me ;)

I received the below response from Canon Canada.

Brian

Thank you for your E-mail inquiry.

In order for photos that you print on the i850 printer to last a long time
it is recommended to use Canon Photo paper pro and genuine Canon inks.

If you are using 3rd party inks or refilling your ink tanks, then the
photos will not last very long.

When using Canon's genuine inks with the photo paper pro, images can last
up to 25 years.

In order for the photos to last up to 25 years, they must be place in a
book or under glass in a room with regular lighting.

The secret to long lasting photos is to use the Photo paper pro paper and
genuine Canon inks.

Should you require further assistance, please feel free to email us or
visit our customer support website at http://www.canon.ca


Sincerely,

Roch S.
Technical Support Representative
Customer Information Centre
Canon Canada Inc.

[mookiemeister]

I use Canon Photo Paper Plus Glossy. Anyone know if that paper last as long or longer than Canon Photo Paper Pro?

[digidog]

It is simply not true to make sweeping generalisations that inkjet prints will not last.

Hi Roger
Yes, you're right, I try not to generalise too much but I still find myself doing it. I guess where I'm coming from is that for those people (like myself) who can't be bothered with faffing around with ink/paper combinations, colour matching, blocked jets, empty cartridges, etc. then using a commercial lab is just so much easier once you've got your monitor calibrated. You possibly don't have the same creative flexibility when it comes to the type of paper used and so on but that depends on the individual lab. I'm also more confident about the longevity of prints made using photosensitive paper as its a well established technology. Any claims (regardless of the tests done) about inkjet print longevity are much more speculative as the technology is relatively much more recent. Personally I just can't be bothered with reading endless articles about which combination of ink and/or paper might give you the best results. However this is a personal judgement call. You're obviously happy with your prints too. :)

Daryl

[salc0025]

digidog........what do you mean burning pictures on to proper arhival paper? is this a chemocal process or a dgital? how do you go about doing so?
thank you, soory im a bit new to photography

[Hellashot]

They are really pushing their most expensive glossy paper, which they only sell in small packages for a high price. Epson has the best quality glossy paper for the price with their premium glossy 4x6 that I use for 4x6 in my Canon i560. :)

[Longwatcher]

If I remember the i850 uses the BCI-6 inkset.

- I can confirm that with Kodak Ultima High-Gloss a print will last for at least 4 years behind glass.

- I can confirm that a Kodak Ultima HighGloss/Satin or Ilford classic Pearl print will last for 3.5 years in open (non-sunlit) environment without fading.

- I can confirm that the older batches of Canon paper would last about 4 weeks in my office environment before starting to fade. Kodak still going after 2.5 years in same environment. Newer batches of Canon paper supposedly much better.

In back of the car window tests I did Kodak did poorly because that same resin coating that prevents fading broke down and flaked in the heat of the car. ilford did fine.

Epson paper seems to be okay overall with Canon ink, but not as good as Ilford or Kodak Ultima.

Wilhem Research took longer then Kodak research to realize that light was not the only factor in fading. However Kodak research uses a lower standard then Wilhelm. Wilhem research maybe an independent lab, but when it comes to statements about Kodak research he is not unbiased.

No research can know for sure what all factors actuall contribute to print fading, but I know from reading technical papers that for COLOR prints. inkjet dye based prints can last as long and appear to be able to last longer then conventional COLOR prints.
B+W is a completly different story and a conventional silver halide print will most likely last a lot longer then a inkjet print in the same conditions if properly developed on acid free paper.

Lastly,
I believe that prints done using Epson "Archival ink" on Epson "Archival" paper will last longer then Canon prints, but prints using Canon ink will last longer on ilford paper then epson prints done not using both archival ink and paper. and both will last longer the conventional COLOR prints.
This last part is just my opinion based on experience and reading way too many technical papers.

[SWPhotoImaging]

I have inkjet prints made on a Canon i9100 with Canon ink on Canon Photo Paper Plus Glossy, framed under glass with acid-free mats, that have hung in my office under both flourescent and daylight for more than two years without any sign of fading.

I also have a 4x6 print, made on Canon Photo Paper Pro with Canon ink, sitting propped on a mantle at home, unframed and completely exposed front and rear, but under no sunlight or direct lighting other than some ambient bulb lighting from a room light that is on for a few hours each night. The one on the mantle has faded very badly in the seven months it has been there.

From my experiment, I'd have to conclude that air exposure is more damaging than light.

[snappa]

Longwatcher, Could you please tell me what profile you used for printing Kodak Ultima on a Canon printer.
Thank you.

[Briancd]

I use Canon Photo Paper Plus Glossy and get great prints with my i560 inkjet printer. I still have the original digital files saved and expect that if any photos fade I would just print again.

[lostdoggy]

I have inkjet prints made on a Canon i9100 with Canon ink on Canon Photo Paper Plus Glossy, framed under glass with acid-free mats, that have hung in my office under both flourescent and daylight for more than two years without any sign of fading.

I also have a 4x6 print, made on Canon Photo Paper Pro with Canon ink, sitting propped on a mantle at home, unframed and completely exposed front and rear, but under no sunlight or direct lighting other than some ambient bulb lighting from a room light that is on for a few hours each night. The one on the mantle has faded very badly in the seven months it has been there.

From my experiment, I'd have to conclude that air exposure is more damaging than light.
Have you consider the ash & soot might be a contributing factor in its fading???
Ashes have been used for neutralizing acid for quite sometime and it is a reactive agent combine w/ humidity.

[SWPhotoImaging]

No, I haven't, since it is a gas sealed fireplace, that hasn't been on at all in the months that the photo has sat on that mantle.

[Longwatcher]

Longwatcher, Could you please tell me what profile you used for printing Kodak Ultima on a Canon printer.
Thank you.

I use either the standard Canon glossy pro if lazy or a custom paper profile using calibration device and scanner versus each paper type if not lazy. Not much difference I have noticed except just a touch too much orange/magenta shade in standard profile.
I did not like the Kodak profile, but others have had good results. Note: the key to Kodak paper is to slow the printer's print speed down (can't remember where you need to do this int he software). Makes a big difference without significantly slowing down print speed (for me at least).