Homeless People make great pictures

[IPATH]

I dont want to demeanize (sp?) the homeless but I think they make great subjects for street photography. Homeless/street kids have probably went through a hell of alot more horrible things than we have and I think sometimes we take that for granted. We (or I) complain about minute things constantly and take what we have for granted. So whenever you feel like YOU have it bad, think of this guy, who doesnt even have shoes.

Again ive only been at this for roughly 2 months so dont expect anything proffesional :)

Id love some feedback of anykind, and check out my vancouver post! I had to bendover backwards to upload those pictures :(


http://photos.fotango.com/p/eba00427226f00000013.jpg

http://photos.fotango.com/p/eba00427226f00000009.jpg

[Shabookie]

I like the first one a lot. He has a stocking cap on his head, but nothing on his feet.... Ouch. It makes you wonder what got him to that point in life.

The only thing I see is that some of the whites are a tad blown out.
The sky in between the two buildings in the background and the street are a tad blown out. They almost look like the same color.

Very cool picks though...

[G3]

Ipath,
I think one reason you may not be getting as much feedback on your Vancouver thread as you'd like is because you posted so many pictures in the same posting. If someone is using dialup, it could take quite a while to load it...a lot of people are going to just give up after a while and hit the old browser back button.

Nice photos, by the way...good street photography.

[Idoc]

I have to agree with G3 here.

For posting multiple images like in the Vancouver post it would be best to do that in the sharing photos section.

The critique is more of a one photo post then if you are lucky it gets nitpicked for whatever qualities it may lack. One thing to help boost replies is to list what you may have been trying to achieve with a photo, list what you may like/dislike about it and others will let you know why the disagree/agree with you.

As for the Homeless, they can make some of the best photos, they have lived the most (in a sense), are weathered and they show that, it's a strange beauty. I would like to see some of the detail in the wheel chair man's face, and is the other guy even homeless?

[karusel]

The shots are ok, but they lack impact, they needed to be more dramatic, with more contrast.

[CyberDyneSystems]

Carefull Ipath.. do the Leica owners know that you are shooting the patented subject matter :)

Of course they would insist on grainy high ISO B&W film...

//sorry :roll:

[Laziferous]

Do you ever feel guilty for taking their picture?

I would feel as if I were imposing a feeling of dehumanization on them. As if they were seperate from among the rest of the humans. Something to look at, and take pictures of, like an animal in the zoo... kept segregated from society in their invisible cage, with bars made of apathy (sorry for the metaphors :roll: ).

I understand the drama that can be shown with a picture, but I wouldn't want people taking pictures of me if I were homeless, and I offer the same respect to them. I do stop and talk to them pretty frequently. I don't always give them money (rarely in fact), but I do offer a meal, and some company. Although, it has on occassion turned into a physical altercation when I refused them money. Those are exceptions however. For the most part, they just want to be treated as a human... which they deserve.

I know most people are probably callous to them, and disagree with me totally. That's ok. I don't want to cause an arguement. It was just my $.02

[Tom W]

Do you ever feel guilty for taking their picture?

I would feel as if I were imposing a feeling of dehumanization on them. As if they were seperate from among the rest of the humans. Something to look at, and take pictures of, like an animal in the zoo... kept segregated from society in their invisible cage, with bars made of apathy (sorry for the metaphors :roll: ).

I understand the drama that can be shown with a picture, but I wouldn't want people taking pictures of me if I were homeless, and I offer the same respect to them. I do stop and talk to them pretty frequently. I don't always give them money (rarely in fact), but I do offer a meal, and some company. Although, it has on occassion turned into a physical altercation when I refused them money. Those are exceptions however. For the most part, they just want to be treated as a human... which they deserve.

I know most people are probably callous to them, and disagree with me totally. That's ok. I don't want to cause an arguement. It was just my $.02

Thanks for the thought-provoking post. Really. There's a wide array of people in all walks, including among the homeless. I try not to paint with too wide a brush, but occasionally, a post like yours is needed to keep me that way.

[G3]

Do you ever feel guilty for taking their picture?

I would feel as if I were imposing a feeling of dehumanization on them. As if they were seperate from among the rest of the humans. Something to look at, and take pictures of, like an animal in the zoo... kept segregated from society in their invisible cage, with bars made of apathy (sorry for the metaphors :roll: ).

I understand the drama that can be shown with a picture, but I wouldn't want people taking pictures of me if I were homeless, and I offer the same respect to them. I do stop and talk to them pretty frequently. I don't always give them money (rarely in fact), but I do offer a meal, and some company. Although, it has on occassion turned into a physical altercation when I refused them money. Those are exceptions however. For the most part, they just want to be treated as a human... which they deserve.

I know most people are probably callous to them, and disagree with me totally. That's ok. I don't want to cause an arguement. It was just my $.02

IMHO, this is exactly the reason you SHOULD photograph them and PUBLISH the photos. Believe it or not, there are people out there that don't even realize or care that they exist. At least if you photgraph them, it draws some small amount of attention to their plight.

There are many schools of thought regarding these people and they all have at least some amount of merit. There are people who think that these people are all victims of circumstance and that the rest of society should take care of them. Other people think that they are where they are because of decisions they made and that no one else should have to share in the responsibility of taking care of them. Still others just don't think about them. The one thing that everyone should agree on is that they are human and are deserving of the basic considerations and rights that every other human deserves. One way to make sure they aren't completely forgotten about and swept under the rug is by documenting little pieces of their lives with photographs.

Just my $.02

[bikerider]

I would have waited around until there was some interaction bewteen the subjects and people, it would put more of a 'photojournalisitc' edge to the shots.......as for the morality of shooting homeless people, I think it depends entirely on the intention of the photographer, as with all sensitive subjects. 8)

[JMAS]

I have to agree with Laz on this one. Though, I think it is OK to argue :wink: .

Let me elaborate a bit (I have only 3 minutes to do this right now, so please pardon any mistake):

*Permission*
When taking photographs of people as primary subject, the photographer should, in my opinion, ask them permission and explain the intent. If not before taking the picture, to avoid spoilling the moment/ oportunity, then after.

*Purpose*
To be aiming to shock society with an image like these it is OK, if we intent to do this with the purpose of make people aware and change things or if we want to point out the human being behind the rags.
Ultimatelly this could bennefit the homeless person or others in the same situation. :idea: There are however better ways to do it through photography.
Here in Portugal we have a photography magazine made by a non profitable organization using professional photographers, and the homeless apply to sell it.
Part of the funds goes to care for them (lodge, meals). Another part for their own salary. The conditions are that the person cannot be drunk or comsuming ilegal substances, must keep clean and so on.

*Person*
Just to keep it in perspective, these persons have had life's maybe like ours, up to a point where things went wrong. Some may have never know life as most of us do. They should be object of solidarity as possible.
If you must take the picture please try to give something in return as these are people in need mostly of human warmth (I know this sometimes can be difficult).

We never know if we or our closest may be in such position one day, and once there, it maybe hard to turn arround. Life can be wird.

I'm sorry if my reply comes a bit strong or maybe innapropriate for this forum, but I guess I do not see art in the pictures above, even though that would have been your intention. I just think there are subjects that should be approched carefully for the effect they might have on the audience (in this case also on the subject).Please don't take this the wrong way. Your photos obviously made us think and speak about this (even if in my coffe break).


Jaime

[karusel]

Do you treat them more humanely when you ignore them or when you take photos of them?

[JMAS]

Do you treat them more humanely when you ignore them or when you take photos of them?


As human beings, should we limit our options as such? :wink:

[karusel]

No. So what is your answer?

[agwright]

here's a photo from my mate terry - one of the best i have seen

http://www.dpchallenge.com/image.php?IMAGE_ID=55507

[brownt]

here's a photo from my mate terry - one of the best i have seen

http://www.dpchallenge.com/image.php?IMAGE_ID=55507

Reading through the previous posts here I thought I'd better add...

I did ask him (He's know to his friends as Si) first before I took the shot, didn't want him to feel uncomfortable. I explained what it was for and Si asked that I didn't get his face in it.

I gave Si a little something for his troubles and he was quite interested in seeing the finished shot.

Once I'd entered it into the competition I printed out a copy for him and went back to see him. He really liked the shot, and was pleased to learn that it had gotten me my highest score.

I think if you just stop to say hello first these guys and girls will gladly help. Some of them may not want it done so deserve their privacy, luckily for my Si wasn't camera shy! :-)

[jim monroe]

I have to agree with Laz and JMAS and think they stated things very well.
One remark by another seems to imply that you photograph them or ignore them. As a followup implies, life has more options than just those two.
Also someone remarked that these photographs could draw attention to their plight and be helpful. I agree, but the title of this thread "Homeless people make great pictures" sure doesn't make me think that is what is happening here. Seems to me a pretty insensitive title.
My $.02.

[karusel]

Dude, can you please read my post again? I did NOT say that one can either ignore them or take a photo, I was asking which was better.

I agree the title is insensitive, but that does not make it any less true.

[Idoc]

I have to agree with Laz and JMAS and think they stated things very well.
One remark by another seems to imply that you photograph them or ignore them. As a followup implies, life has more options than just those two.
Also someone remarked that these photographs could draw attention to their plight and be helpful. I agree, but the title of this thread "Homeless people make great pictures" sure doesn't make me think that is what is happening here. Seems to me a pretty insensitive title.
My $.02.

Ok, so you see it as insensitive :?:

What would you have called this thread? And do you think any homeless people might read this and be offended by the title? I know I wasn't it :wink: plus it sure has got tons of replies.

:roll: do you have a home, yes, do they, no, therefore it is merely a title. We label everything in society that we photograph with a title and that is as deep as this goes for me. I do not feel insensitive because I use this "label" by calling them homeless, heck they'll admit it.

Would you have the same feelings if you knew some of these "homeless" people are not homeless. There are people who pose that they are homeless to get money, they have bank accounts, houses, families, but this is the lifestyle they choose to live. I knew someone who made $1000/week during christmas doing this! This does not apply to all of them I just wanted to add another angle to think about.

They are human beings that have feelings & lives and I agree completely with some of the aformentioned posts (Mostly with Laz), but the point of this all is I do think they make some of the best subjects to photogrpah which is what I get from the title. :?: Was that not the point of the original post? :?:

[JMAS]

I did ask him (He's know to his friends as Si) first before I took the shot, didn't want him to feel uncomfortable. I explained what it was for and Si asked that I didn't get his face in it.

I gave Si a little something for his troubles and he was quite interested in seeing the finished shot.

Once I'd entered it into the competition I printed out a copy for him and went back to see him. He really liked the shot, and was pleased to learn that it had gotten me my highest score.

I think if you just stop to say hello first these guys and girls will gladly help. Some of them may not want it done so deserve their privacy, luckily for my Si wasn't camera shy! :-)


For me, this is one good example of the simple things we can do with not so much effort, if we feel we must have a photography of a chosen person as a subject.

Personally, I would choose not to capture that moment, as I would also choose not to capture images of injured or dead people (animals also).

I know there are very aclaimed dramatic photos of misery in various forms. I hope not do any myself.

But this is just my way of seeing things. :wink: I don't expect everyone to agree.


It's good to be able to share points of view with others in such a livelly forum.
I hope my comments haven't offended anyone, as it was not my intention.

Cheers,
Jaime

[stopbath]

Firstly, homeless people are people.

People do make good subjects. (Photographers make pictures.)

I think the value of homeless people as subjects lays more in photojournalism then art, or fashion photography. Thus, some would naturally never take homeless shots, whereas others may shoot a lot. As subjects, they can be very dramatic.

When on the street, we do ignore lots of people. We also watch lots of others. We usually watch those who for some reason stand out in the crowd and homeless by their very nature usually stand out in the crowd.

As for should you shoot or not depends on lots of factors: the photographer, the subject, how close the photographer was to the subject, and the situation at hand.

[IPATH]

Yeah I do agree with Laz on the dehumanization aspect but its not like I just went right in front of him and started snapping. I gave him some money first then asked it would be alright to take his picture after he said he did not mind at all. And of course, it depends on your persepective of that matter. You could look at it this way, by taking pictures of homeless/street people, youre creating sort of an awareness that this sort of thing goes on everyday and you cant ignore it. Im definatley not trying to dehumanizer anybody, in fact, in a way you could say Im actually trying to HUMANIZE them. Make them seem like people instead of just worthless objects mooching for our help and money.
Ill have more pics on the way and Ill be sure to post them in the section

[Laziferous]

I think that everyone here is basically in agreement. It's a sensitive topic, and some people just lean a little further one way or the other, but I think for the most part, we all agree.

I had thought of the point that these type of photos can be helpful, and bring awareness, but it was after I was done typing, so I left it out. I knew someone would bring it up, if no one had, I would have in this reply.

It's good to see so many nice people among these forums. A lot of you renew my faith in humanity on a daily basis.

Chris

[karusel]

Yeah I guess it all comes down to how you take the photos. Listen to Moby - Look Back In while looking at those photos and tell me if you still think they are dehumanizing and insultive. :wink: Then listen to Afroman - Because I Got High, look at the photos again and you'll see things turn very wrong.[/quote]

[ryuwulf]

I just buy them food. I never give money. And 95% of the time they are willing to talk and have their picture taken. My first experience was being "cussed out" by two hobos. Ive since learned to interact a lot better and use a basic smile. That will always ease the mood and peeps find it initially hard to get mad.

In most states the sidewalk or a public place is fair game for photographers. At the same time you are imposing, yourself, by making it obvious that you are taking their picture. Unless you hide yourself, which is just plain weird.

So many peeps here have different opinions on this subject. It boils down to how you feel, and are you respecting their area/situation. Just reverse the roles.




:twisted: