Neophyte who isn't getting it - help

[devilwoman]

Ok...you all have been so good about explaining things, but due to my pixelated challenged mind I just cant seem to get it when it comes to comprehending image size in the camera as compared to the computer monitor and a printed image size...I just dont get it!!!! Its like being in college trig all over again....AHHHHHHHH. Everyone else is getting it and I am feeling like an idiot...ok no coments about the idiot thing :(

I have a Canon G2, I have a Canon i9100 printer. I have a 17 in monitor. Depending upon the quality of the photo, how will I know if I can print an image 13 x 19 that is going to be quality (in focus etc). I have printed 8x10's I thought were going to be great only to find out they were out of focus. Looked great on the computer screen, but not on paper. I have read people here who have printed poster size prints with the images they get on their G2 and I say to myself "how is that happening"? If someone has the patience to hold my infantile hand and try to explain this I will do my best to understand....but maybe, like in trig it has been explained down to my level and the fact is I'm just not going to get it...how sad for me that would be. Anyway any takers here willing to be my mentor for this task I would be forever thankful. :lol:

Thanks
devilwoman

[CyberDyneSystems]

Hmmm..

Not having a G2.. I can't offer any hard and fast rules on print sizes from the files it generates.. but here is an article that may help;

http://www.microscope-microscope.org/imaging/image-resolution.htm

and another tidbit

http://www.design-works.com/resources/web_graphics_v_print_graphics.htm

and this gem;
http://www.projectorcentral.com/format_resolution.htm?print=1

As far as trying to get the best prints..

Here's the easiest advice to try.

Shoot with the g2 at the largest image size and quality possible.

Print with a program that will allow you to print directly to a specific paper size without you needing to "resize" the image yourself.. (I think PS has a "fit to page" option.. but if not I know ACDSeee does....)

This way at least you know you are not making things worse by incorrectly adjusting the image.

[dicky109]

I have a G-1 and have printed tack sharp up to 8 1/2 x 11. Never tried larger, but I believe that some of the images would lend themselves to a bigger print. Part of the reason is a judicious use of Unsharp Mask or the Fred Miranda action "Intellisharpen", however, I've found the most critical factor besides the good advice from Cyberdyne is having the original image as sharp as possible. As you know, its easier said than done with the G-series, as autofocus is difficult under low light, and manual focus is not easy, since the LCD screen is so small with poor resolution.

My only advice is for lower light images, don't expect to be able to make large prints in most cases, unless you can master the manual focus function. Under normal daylight conditions, there shouldn't be a big problem.

Also, if you use PS, check that the image size is not defaulting to a low resolution setting or a small print size. If you have to size up, you'll lose clarity. For prints, I shoot either in RAW or JPG Superfine with minimal compression, size at 300ppi, & always save my work as TIFF in the largest size I anticipate printing..
Good luck

[John_T]

Hmm, perhaps you are also getting mixed up between focus, motion blur and pixelation at more than 100% blow up. If you don't know which is which because of what, they can all look the same. On the camera display you can't really tell anything about an image. On the computer display you need to be able and know how to look for the details.

I have G2 images from a couple of years ago that print out perfectly at 13x19 on my i9100, so you know it can be done. You might want to start out by checking the quality of the chain from your camera to print. The printer is capable of professional quality prints, so it is not a source of your problem. How good/new is your monitor and graphic card?

If you tell us what software you are using for photo editing, it will help us to be more specific in getting you where you want to go.

Don't worry, it is all very logical and at some point it goes click and all falls into place. Every single one of us gets lost in space at some time or the other, so don't think you are alone. :lol:

[devilwoman]

You all are so incredibly patient, thank you. I appreciate your advise and will take it to heart. Indeed the G2 has been a "challenge" interms of clear crisp images for me. I have many wonderful images, but the focus issues have really made me wonder if all digital cameras have this issue. I have a hunk of change invested in this camer and lenses so I'm not about to give up. I think each time I use the camera I learn something new...I often hear myself go." huh, I didn't know it could do that." Everytime I use my infrared lens it like discovering a whole new world. Anyway, again thanks...and hopefully I will be able to create some larger prints. I guess that is why 4x5 and larger make for awesome poster size prints. Who can afford that though... :cry:

THANKS :D

[CyberDyneSystems]

.....Every single one of us gets lost in space at some time or the other, so don't think you are alone. :lol:


Are you kidding?!!!

Look at my avatar! With me "Lost in space" is a permanant condition! :shock: :roll: :wink:

[twl845]

:wink: Devil woman - I think a G2 is 3mp. I think if you stay in logical print sizes for 3mp you shouldn't have any trouble making sharp prints. I kind of think your problem might be camera shake. Try taking your shots at a higher shutter speed like 250 per second and see if your prints improve. If not then I don't know.

[devilwoman]

twl845 - thanks, I use a tripod for every shot. Its become habit. The G2 is a 4MP and does provide wonderful results when all conditions are met..I just dont find this camera very forgiving, but I've embraced this and vowed to make the best of it. The focusing issue is so weird. I look in the LCD screen at an object that I'am going to take a picture of and even in the screen its not crisp. Yet when I take the picture and see it on the 10sec preview, it looks crisp. When it gets downloaded into my computer and I look at it on the screen it looks crisp, but when I start to enlarge it, it doesn't take much before it looses its clearity. So I guess the goal is to take the image at the size you want to print so that you are not doing any type of enlarging later. Which makes since....considering the information Cyber suggested to read.

Any suggestions on using the manual focus....if I look through the LCD and see a less than crisp image, what can the manual focus really do for me...I've used it and really dont think its much of a tool...but hey I am probably doing it wrong...who knows?

[twl845]

:?: Hmmmmmm...... If the photo looks crisp on your monitor, but prints out of focus when you change the image size to make it larger, could it be that you are leaving it at a very small resolution? Are you using Photoshop? If so when you go to Resize and make it larger do you also raise the resolution to 300 for say a 8x10? If you're making an 8x10 or larger and you leave the resolution at say 100, the photo will have to interpolate ( I think that's the right term) and make phony pixels. That might make it appear out of focus.
If all your settings are right, could it be your printer software?

[barryfernelius]

There are so many things that can go wrong with focusing! I also have a G2, but I can make large prints with no difficulty using a high-quality Epson printer.

Sorry about the length of this post, but here are a few things you might consider to help you solve your focus problems:

1. Which camera mode are you using when you take your photos?

2. For that camera mode, what are the settings, including the ISO. (After you've downloaded pictures to your computer, you should be able to see all of these settings for each picture.) In general, low f-stop settings (2.0 to 2.2) give a more shallow depth of field (more difficult to focus!), and slow shutter speeds (less than 1/30th of a second) are subject to camera shake (which also wrecks havoc on focusing).

3. What are the lighting conditions when you take your photos?

4. Have you accidently turned on the manual focus when you were intending to use autofocus? (And consider the reverse of this: were you using autofocus when you intended to use manual focus?)

5. When you are taking photos of a close-up object, are you using the macro mode? If not, you could have focus problems. Conversely, if you are in macro mode and trying to shoot a photo of something far away, you will have focus issues. (When macro mode is on, there is a flower icon in the display--provided that your display is configured to show these kinds of settings.)

6. In the middle of the display, there is a square. If you press the shutter half-way, you'll hear the autofocus working, and the square will turn green if the camera can focus on the image within the square. If the square doesn't turn green, the camera is not reaching focus. The camera has a better chance of reaching focus if there's an object in the square that has sharp tonal contrasts--both light and dark areas with sharp edges between the areas.

7. By the way, I've had better luck when I turn off the continuous autofocus. (See the camera menus in shooting mode to see how to do this.)

8. And, when I'm shooting handheld, I prefocus by holding down the shutter half way. Then, I wait, holding very still, for the proper moment to shoot the picture.

9. As mentioned in a previous post, use the highest resolution and superfine JPG.

10. When you use a tripod, are you using the timer mode or remote control? If not, you still can shake the camera when you push the shutter!

11. When you're shooting handheld, you should hold the camera in such a manner that you won't bounce it when you push the shutter. There should be an opposing force from the bottom of the camera (provided by your thumb) that will let you feel like you're gently squeezing the shutter with your right index finger, as opposed to punching the shutter.

12. When you're looking at your photos on your monitor, you might want to zoom to 100%. (This is called 'Actual Pixels' in PhotoShop Elements.) Then, pan around to get an idea of what the focus is like. When the focus is a little bit soft, some sharpening of the image will help. Experiment!

13. Check your printer settings. My Epson printer prints at 360 dpi in fast mode as its default. When I want to print high quality photos, I change the printer driver settings to 720 dpi with the highest detail setting. Also, there may be settings for the dithering algorithm. (Generally, I use the diffusion dithering algorithm.)

14. My printer has a native resolution of 720 dpi. (Check your printer specs to find out your printer's resolution.) When you scale your image, the dpi settings sometimes change to weird numbers (like 435.78 dpi). The best results are obtained when you use reasonable dpi settings. For my printer, 720dpi / 2 = 360dpi. 360dpi / 2 = 180dpi. 180 dpi / 2 = 90 dpi. 90dpi / 2 = 45 dpi. The smallest incremental dpi change for my printer is about 45 dpi. This means that the best image scaling occurs when I set the the dpi to 45, 90, 135, 180, 225, 270, 315, 360, 405, 450, 495, 540, 585, 630, 675, and 720.

[John_T]

Hmmm, one thing I haven't seen here is at what resolution you are shooting. RAW, SuperFine, L, M1, etc. I put a lot of images through a G2 1-2 years ago and I don't remember them being all that bad, even at A3.

[devilwoman]

Wow, thanks for all the suggestions and tips...I have a lot to check out before I can give you any results. Thanks and when I have exhausted your suggestions I will let you know the outcome. Again thanks for all your help. I LOVE PHOTOGRAPHY!!!

To answer a few of your questions.

I shoot superfine, I don't really understand the RAW information and JPG seems to work for me, unless that is part of my problem.

I keep the ISO setting at 50. I took some pictures at the beach one day with a different setting I think 400, (it was pretty cloudy) and the grain was terrible.

I use a tripod all the time regardless, but I dont use the remote...I will try that as well.

I am pretty sentisitive to the lighting situations...

6. In the middle of the display, there is a square. If you press the shutter half-way, you'll hear the autofocus working, and the square will turn green if the camera can focus on the image within the square. If the square doesn't turn green, the camera is not reaching focus. The camera has a better chance of reaching focus if there's an object in the square that has sharp tonal contrasts--both light and dark areas with sharp edges between the areas.

I will pay more attention to this. I don't use continuous focus.

Paint Shop Pro is my post imaging software. Why...I dont know, thought I would give it a try and then eventually move up to Photoshop...cost had something to do with it as well.

12. When you're looking at your photos on your monitor, you might want to zoom to 100%. (This is called 'Actual Pixels' in PhotoShop Elements.) Then, pan around to get an idea of what the focus is like. When the focus is a little bit soft, some sharpening of the image will help. Experiment!

13. Check your printer settings. My Epson printer prints at 360 dpi in fast mode as its default. When I want to print high quality photos, I change the printer driver settings to 720 dpi with the highest detail setting. Also, there may be settings for the dithering algorithm. (Generally, I use the diffusion dithering algorithm.)

14. My printer has a native resolution of 720 dpi. (Check your printer specs to find out your printer's resolution.) When you scale your image, the dpi settings sometimes change to weird numbers (like 435.78 dpi). The best results are obtained when you use reasonable dpi settings. For my printer, 720dpi / 2 = 360dpi. 360dpi / 2 = 180dpi. 180 dpi / 2 = 90 dpi. 90dpi / 2 = 45 dpi. The smallest incremental dpi change for my printer is about 45 dpi. This means that the best image scaling occurs when I set the the dpi to 45, 90, 135, 180, 225, 270, 315, 360, 405, 450, 495, 540, 585, 630, 675, and 720. I will check this out too.

Again thanks!

[John_T]

At a slower shutter speed, even if your camera is on a tripod, pressing the shutter button can cause enough vibration to give you motion blur, even at 1/125s. The more you are extended on the telephoto end, the more pronounced it will be. If you are shooting at slower shutter speeds on the tripod, use the timer at 2 secs if your tripod is very stable, and at 10 secs if it isn't. Nuff time for the vibrations to have dampened between the time you push the buton and the actual shutter release. Of course don't touch anything after pushing the button. And no illusions, motion blur is always there, it's just that it's apparent effects are reduced by camera stability, higher shutter speeds and wider angle.

As for focussing, if you want to understand your camera better, take your glasses off, contacts out, or walk around in the fog and try to find something that will help you find out where you are. Assuming your camera's AF and lens focus functionality is correct, it is reall just like that. You have to find something definable for it to fix on. And if you or your subject are moving, shaking or vibrating, it is that much more tricky.

When you shooot JPEG, the camera does most of the image processing automatically. When you then take that already mostly processed image into your photo editor and start messing with it, unless you go very carefully, you are only likely to make your image worse. The print is the proof. Unless you have a lousy printer, the print always tells you the truth. If you have a very good calibrated monitor, it will get you closer to the truth, but the print is the last report on what went on before. The reason for shooting RAW is because the RAW image is exactly what came off the camera's sensor and enables you to process that image with all the control in your hands, and consequentlially, you will learn a great deal more about producing better images with the camera and making more out of them in post processing.

Above all don't just dump bad pix. They are your best teachers. Examine them in detail and they will tell you what went wrong, and if you get the message, they will help you see how to do better next time.

[HKMonkey]

...when I take the picture and see it on the 10sec preview, it looks crisp. When it gets downloaded into my computer and I look at it on the screen it looks crisp, but when I start to enlarge it, it doesn't take much before it looses its clearity. So I guess the goal is to take the image at the size you want to print so that you are not doing any type of enlarging later...
If I understand you correctly, your photos are coming out fine (because it looks crisp on the screen), but the clarity issue is only occuring during the image resizing on the computer. What program are you using to resize your images? I also have a G2 and have no problems like this. At Large and Superfine, the image printout with no resizing should be roughly 9.5" x 12.5" at 180 dpi. Help me out, anyone, if I am mistaken here. So even if you shrink the image to 8 x 10, it should be fine if the photo itself is in focus. That is what leads me to believe it is all in your post processing. Let us know what program you use and the steps you take to resize and we'll see what we can determine from that. :wink: