Best advice you've been given

[tim]

I think there's a need for an "advice" thread, short and to the point, and preferably without lots of "thanks" posts or questions. This thread will be linked from the wedding forum FAQ if it starts to become valuable. I would ask that only professionals or people who've successfully done a few weddings post. If mods would like to clean up the rubbish that would be valuable.

The best advice i've gotten recently is to "get amongst it". It is possible to be in or near the middle of things but still be discreet, especially if you dress to blend in - all black for me. For example, I used to hang back during speeches, use a long lens, and get mainly head shots of the speakers. Often you can't get shots of the head table that way because there's too many heads in the way. My last couple of weddings I was close to the head table, crouching in front of it sometimes, sometimes off to the side using a short lens, plus my usual back of the room with a long lens, and the results are great.

Please try not to clutter up the thread with questions and "thanks" posts as that will quickly diminish the value of the thread.

[howzitboy]

advice I give everyone is relax and be yourself, if u relaxed, your customers will be relaxed and u will get better shots. and have FUN!!

[cdifoto]

I'm not going to claim to have hundreds or thousands under my belt, and I don't know if it would work for everyone, but I say harness the nerves. Once you do that, and just start shooting, things kind of flow from a technical/operational standpoint.

Even if it's not a wedding I get jitters before starting but once the first shot is fired things are good.

Also I might add: know your gear. It helps you embrace the nervousness if you actually know where all the controls are on your camera and don't have to think about how to change settings.

[Phil V]

The most important function in the post processing workflow is the Delete key.

[tim]

The most important function in the post processing workflow is the Delete key.

Absolutely agree. Just doing that now.

[Banbert]

I
The best advice i've gotten recently is to "get amongst it". It is possible to be in or near the middle of things but still be discreet, especially if you dress to blend in - all black for me..

Exactly the same thought struck me as I was watching MOWP2. I cant recall which photographer it was (I think it was Marcus Bell) and right after the ceremony he was litterally 2 feet from the bride as she was getting all her hugs and congratulations from people. He got some awesome shots and really didnt look like he got it in the way, he did a great job of just blending in despite being very close. Because he was very close her could move around them to another angle very quickly to get the best shot.

Compare that to my own newbie approach which is to give them plenty of room, hang right back with my 70-200 which meant that I kept getting my shots blocked and had to move bigger distances to change angles, will deffo try to get in there amongst it a bit more for our next wedding.

[strmrdr]

All the technical skill in the world is useless without the people skills and the desire to use them when it comes too weddings.

or

If you dont love people dont do weddings.
hence I dont do em.

[strmrdr]

The flip side of the coin if your among them you are effecting how they are acting and you can get more natural action from the sidelines with some people.

[tlc]

some advice - shooting the wedding is only part of the battle.

you've got to have a strong marketing strategy - referrals are fine, but you should have something else to fall back on. pick a demographic and design a marketing package to suit it.

website attraction - dont scrimp here - your web appearance is probably your most strongest visual - brides these days search for a lot of wedding stuff online. they are on their lunch hours and have limited time so keep your website fresh and up to date. have a professional design your site or buy a template that is fashionably current.

keep current with the wedding market - join forums and research what others are offering - stay with the current 'trend' if you fall behind and are not aware of what others are offering or what is currently 'hot', your not going to get the upscale weddings you may want.

[tim]

Photography is only 10% of the job of the wedding photographer working for themselves. Post processing takes ages, albums take quite a while, then there's general small business tasks like advertising, customer communications, general administration, training and staying up to date, and i'm sure many many more things that slip my mind right now. On the wedding day you're not just the photographer, you're also part wedding coordinator, day planner, choreographer, and problem solver as you're usually the person most experienced with weddings.

[Yella Fella]

My only advice based on being a contract/freelance photographer, is you definately have to be a peoples person. You have to truly get one with the B&G, bridal party etc etc from the word go.

Considering I haven't even seen who im shooting or met them in person until the day; all but just a phone call week before to introduce myself as their photographer for their chosen package.

Know your shooting style and don your lenses to suit appropriately. For e.g. if I was shooting a cheap package based on 20 pics, then I won't rely so much on my 70-200 f2.8 IS lens doing a lot of candids. Its a 20 pic album, so this usually (and 95% of the times) consist of groups/formals/B&G shots in the album, so I probably use 24-70 lens on main body, and possibly 85 on secondary.

Again, communication is the key... you can only advise on your style best to the client and end of the day, you are working for them so you have to work around them. You may get some that work around you, but very rare. Talk the to client, make sure you know what they want and what their getting from you.

I'm sure those that do this full time as their own business will communicate on a slightly different level, but as a contactor I like my clients to know what I do best and how to incoporate what they want/need in the day.

[Padawan Dad]

Get it right the first time. Try your best to nail white balance, and take the time to frame your shots. Saves hours in post processing.

My website is below, for anyone who needs to check my credentials ;)

[debiharry]

Photography is only 10% of the job of the wedding photographer working for themselves. Post processing takes ages, albums take quite a while, then there's general small business tasks like advertising, customer communications, general administration, training and staying up to date, and i'm sure many many more things that slip my mind right now. On the wedding day you're not just the photographer, you're also part wedding coordinator, day planner, choreographer, and problem solver as you're usually the person most experienced with weddings.

I couldn't agree more Tim and couldn't have put it better myself.

[Belmondo]

---READ THIS OR DIE---

One of the things we have always prided ourselves in at POTN is the general absence of pettiness and mean-spirited bickering. Quite to the contrary, this is intended to be a place where we can get together, share ideas, help each other, learn, and have a little fun.

A recent example of how it's supposed to work can be found in the thread regarding the 1D Mk III. As some of you know, this is a brand-new camera that has been very slow reaching the market and nearly impossible to find. A member learned that a quantity of them were available at B&H and put out the word here in the forum. In a matter of minutes, 16 very grateful members had confirmed orders for their new cameras.

As I said, that's how it's supposed to work. So what's my point?

There appears to be an inherent nastiness among a couple of the people who frequent the Wedding Forum. I don't know if it's a problem with egos or what, but the need to get in the last snarky comment seems to be a matter of compulsion for some of you.

Here are a couple guidelines I’d like to propose:
1. If you are qualified to offer an opinion or answer a question, do so. We appreciate all useful information
2. Don’t feel the need to belittle another member because they do things differently than you. There are more ways than one to tie a shoelace.
3. If you deem yourself a god in the world of wedding photography, you are free to start a religion, but not a flame war, and not here.

This is the 'nice' request to rein in the unpleasantness. After this, we will deal with some of you individually.

[jamiewexler]

Better gear won't make you a better photographer.

[Grace]

Raise your prices. Given directly to me by several professionals :)

[Grace]

The advice I would give * if you've got your business side working properly * stay calm at all cost. No matter how late, how drunk, how rude some people may be - don't let them ruffle your feathers, the bride will appreciate it, her mother definitly will and it will keep your creative mind free :)

[JustKat]

Get a good monitor. Lot less stress after the shots are taken if you can see you did a good job rather than anticipate how many hours it's going to take to fix them:oops:

[highway0691]

1. Knock back a wedding if it doesn't feel right from the outset .
2. Don't try to copy photos from Wedding magazines, develop your own style.

Damian

[Grace]

Follow the money: the dress, flowers, cake, napkins- the details. I heard this from Mike with Belle's Photography :) Specifically when I took a shot @ the workshop and he asked what I did, I said - I blew out the dress ;) he said - no, no.....follow the money! you'd rather crush the blacks than blow the whites!

[sando]

Wedding photography is 10% photography and 90% talk.
You gotta be able to communicate with people to be a success, whether it's at the actual wedding, selling yourself or dealing with any issues.

[mmahoney]

Know the locations .. the brides dressing location, the church, the formals location, and the reception hall all should be checked before-hand for lighting & shooting angles.
Mike

[IODebbie]

I always gather the wedding party together either at the rehearsal or at the start of the wedding day and tell them that when my camera is up for a posed shot, they are looking at me (unless instructed otherwise). There are always people standing around with their own cameras trying to take the same shots I'm taking - the bride does not want 10 sets of eyeballs looking 10 different directions.

Totally agree with both getting into the action and using your personality - I've actually had so much fun with people at weddings even though I find them quite stressful to shoot.

I also ask the bride and groom for a list of unusual, "must" shots they want, if any, so I don't forget those in the hustle and bustle of the day.

[picturecrazy]

Not a shooting tip but a tip for running a successful business (whether photography related or not).

The best way to succeed is to help others around you succeed.

[SuzyView]

One of the best bits of advice I've gotten in this forum is "Have a plan first, then a backrup plan in case something goes wrong with the first plan." Even with pros, something can go wrong, equipment can fail, location can change, timing of events change at the last minute. If you are calm and in control, people will respect you, even if the situation is stressful.

And learning from the various pros here in the wedding forum, there is always room for improvement in the skills, in the technique, in the PP, in the business part.

And if you don't enjoy the pressure, the crazy mothers-in-law, the hot outside shots, the clergy who have requests at the church, the bride who doesn't like to be photographed, the time you have to spend PP and chasing the customer for the payment, maybe wedding photography isn't for you. After shooting weddings for 4 years now, I am slowing down. It's okay. But I still enjoy the pressure because I love the results.

[JimAskew]

I'm not a Pro but in the few weddings I have shot as the lead photograher I have learned the following:

a. Practice...practice...practice...and practice some more...make things as automatic as possible.

b. Always check your camera settings everytime you change the environment... ISO, exposure comp, etc

c. Redundancy...if it is critical to the execution then have a backup plan and know how to switch to it quickly...we all know about the two bodies rule...but what if a lens fails? A CF card? A flash unit?

d. Recon...if possible always visit each shooting location before the event and at the same time of day you will shoot the actual event...know your environment.

[superdiver]

Best advice I have been given was by Liza about the 85 1.8 for indoor sports...


Thanks Liza...your my hero!

[samnz]

ADVICE TO GIVE

"Never offer to hold someone's drink"

Morale: "Two hands on your camera are better than one hand stuck up your..."

Meaning: The moment your hands become coat hangers, coasters or temporary flower vases...your chances of capturing the winning photo have lessened by 100%!!!

[Eoseni]

Do onto your clients as you would have your own wedding photographer do onto you. OR Give 100% and then some; be generous and humble, and good will follow.

[Philco]

Advice that helped me lately, after second shooting w/ someone I consider one of the best. This is all basic stuff, but still hard to learn in some ways:

~Always fill the frame. (I often had a lot of dead space at the top of my frame, esp. w/ crop viewfinders) In other words, make the frame count, not just half of it.

~ Watch your EC. In full sun, people in front of foliage will overexpose so dial down. People in front of white buildings will underexpose as if backlit, dial up. It seems so basic, but since my frist 10 weddings where all in doors and I always had shade for formals, I hadn't dealt w/a whole lot of midday sun ceremonies.

~ Use all the focus points. I was told early on to always focus and recompose w/ the center point. I never got great at it, especially when things are moving, so my compositions were akward. I've gone back to using all the focus points (w/ the custom function keeping my thumbstick on at all times) and it's helped my compositions get back to where I like them.

~ A little dutch angle goes a long way. Too much is artsy fartsy. A little helps creat a flow, and separates your images form uncle bobs.

~ Buy a 5D : ) I wasn't planning on doing so already, but after shooting w/ this other pro, who preferred his 5D to his MK II, I made the jump and I LOVE this camera. The stuff that comes out of it is really, really nice. I still love the 30D and use it for all the long lens stuff, but dang, the 5D is nice. Of course I'm the idiot that paid retail during a non-rebate time, so that's bad advice.

Great idea for a thread. Cheers.

Philip

PS - forgot one other thing. I was recently turned on to the Flip-It! flash bounce/diffuser attachment, and I love it. It's so simple, cheap, and effective - it's improved the look of my flash photography, and it's allowed me to bounce just from the card when there's been no ceiling or wall to bounce off of.

[monter]

Do onto your clients as you would have your own wedding photographer do onto you. OR Give 100% and then some; be generous and humble, and good will follow.

I have similar advice. for what it's worth (I've only been shooting for a year) Think about your own wedding and what you would have wanted (or will want) to see in your pictures. think how happy you would have been if one or two things were done differently and do that. your brides will be forever grateful!

[Tish]

Best advice--listening to everyone on this forum when they talk to the newbies. Even when the advice isn't nicely phrased, it's accurate, and it kept me from "diving in" until I was ready to actually produce work worth being paid for. Tim & his FAQ were huge helps.

Next best, from a local photog, who got it from her mentor: If you're hyper self-critical or perfectionistic, NEVER look at your images the night of the shoot. I do best if I can take a day or two before processing (other than a few for a preview), as my judgement is less clouded with distance. If you're the same, grab a few favorites for the preview, have a glass of wine (or whatever) and leave the rest for another day. Just don't put them off too long. ;)

[tim]

Try to avoid calling people "the gentleman with the grey hair" or "the old guy" during formal photos. They don't smile after that. "The man in the dark suit" also isn't recommended except for a laugh.

[Wedding Shooter]

If you are looking to build your business, work really hard at develloping a strong relationship with wedding venues - they can bring you a lot of referrals.