Lens question for motorshow and motorsports

[sGu]

hey guys, i'm new to this heaven-alike place for EOS users, and i have a question for all the experts out there.

I'm going to Birmingham motorshow and Silverstone Grand Prix(July), and i'd like to know what lens would be ideal for the event. I have 3 lenses:

a. 17-40mm f4 L
b. 24-70mm f2.8 L
c. 70-200mm f2.8 L IS

For the motorshow, i'm considering 17-40mm for the general purpose, considering i'll be quite close to the cars(models really).

But F1 is the real headache for me, i know my lenses aren't really long enough for the racing, so i'm considering getting a TC for my 70-200mm lens, will 1.4x be enough or should i get a 2.0x, any suggestions?

[Canuck]

Umm...what kind of distance from subjects are we looking at?

[iwatkins]

sGu,

Welcome to the forum. :lol:

For the motorshow you want a lens that puts you as close to the car as possible, but still getting the whole subject in. Reason being, otherwise people just walk in front of you while trying to take the shot :)

17-40 would work well for this.

See: this thread for some shots from this years AutoSport Show at the NEC (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=23116&highlight=)

As for Silverstone, all depends what sort of shots you want and also where on the circuit you will be. I.e. hwo far from the action you will be. KennyG or Cadwell could advise on shooting at Silverstone as I no real experience of photoging there.

Cheers

Ian

[Cadwell]

Hi sGu. Welcome to the forum.

Silverstone is laid out as a modern F1 circuit. There are nice big gravel traps and run-off areas to keep the drivers safe. That means you are a long way from the cars. There are nice big debris catch fences to keep the spectators safe. In order to shoot over the catch fences (cos you don't want a photo full of fence) you need to stand back and further up the terraces/banking. That takes you even further away from the cars... can you see where I am going with this? Basically the place is a pig for photography and you need every mm of glass you can get if you want to be able to "fill the frame" with a race car. Some locations like "Becketts" are a complete waste of time (not even the Hubble has enough mm for there...).

I use a Sigma 120-300mm f/2.8 and at Silverstone it ALWAYS has the 1.4x TC on it (@420mm). Sometimes it's not enough and I put the 2xTC on it (@600mm). KennyG once told me that it's one of the few places his 500mm prime gets a run out.

All that is a kinda long winded way of saying "get the 2x" in my opinion.

p.s. The 17-40L does a great job at motorshows. The only down side with it is that at f/4.0 you will be using flash all the time and flash and shiny motorcars is a combination that takes practice... E-TTL tends to get a bit confused so you need to watch your histogram and be prepared to dial in a bit of FEC... but the results can be very good.

[sGu]

Thanks for the quick reply, guys.

Umm...what kind of distance from subjects are we looking at?
well, i booked my ticket a bit late, so i only manage to get Stowe ones, not sure how far that is from the actual track, but it's the first big corner after a straight run(i think). Do u have to remain in ur seat the whole time? or can u go down couple of rows to get a better angle to shoot? even walking abt the whole track?

About the glass, it seems mine is way out of the basic range, even with a 2x TC, i doubt it'll fill the frame with the car, just hoping i can get sharp images for further cropping; or save up enough money to equip a longer lens ...

Speaking of using flash for the motorshow, what kinda of settings do u recommend? I haven't really used much of my flashgun, usually i tend to shoot with available light, so any tips would be a great help. :)

[PhotosGuy]

Speaking of using flash for the motorshow, what kinda of settings do u recommend? I haven't really used much of my flashgun, usually i tend to shoot with available light, so any tips would be a great help.

I don't recommend flash if you can use the Photo$hop Elements that came with your camera. I shot the Detroit Motorama & Autoramas with a 300D, kit lens, & a tripod. Both shows had lousy lighting & what seems like 1000 lights in the celing which will all reflect in the car & you'll have to learn how to Patch & Clone them out. Still, I think the results are worth it.

Here's a pic from Autorama: (I posted the version with the lights left in.)

39-Lincoln-Zephyr-comp_26.jpg
http://img72.photobucket.com/albums/v218/PhotosGuy/Car%20Stuff/39-Lincoln-Zephyr-comp_26.jpg

Link to the gallery:
http://img72.photobucket.com/albums/v218/PhotosGuy/Car%20Stuff/

Shoot RAW & custom WB. It's good that you're used to shooting with available light. Don't be afraid to get down to the 1/2 second range & ISO 400. The 300D can handle it, so the 10D should too.
And, don't forget to show us how you did!! :wink:

[Cadwell]

Good advice on shooting cars from PhotosGuy and if you are there on one of the trade days take it. If you are at one of the public days then be prepared to use flash. Your chances of being able to use a tripod and long exposures during the rugby scrum that is a public day at the NEC is slim to zero.

[sGu]

I wasn't thinking abt using a tripod at all, but i was thinking abt bring my monopod for the live motorshow. If u have been, what was it like? do i need to take monopod? worth it?

I will however, take flash with me, will try to practice E-TTL beforehand.

:)

[KartGirlsMom]

Scroll down about half way on this page (http://www.beattheboys.com/racing_pics.htm) and you can see what I took at the 2002 USGP with my Elan7 film camera with a 70-200 f2.8L with a 2x. Obviously I was pretty far away in some of them, especially the start of the race. I think this is pretty typical of the kind of shots you can get without a press pass.

[sGu]

Thank u for showing me these pix, with 10D's 1.6x crop, i should get more out of my 70-200mm :)

[KennyG]

Silverstone, GP, debris fences, short lenses, security like the CIA, not good.

You can't get good shots from Stowe from public areas other than some heading off over the rise. Public areas were designed for keeping people away from the cars and not with photographers in mind. Even official pohotogs are severely limited as to where they can shoot from and Silverstone is where all the big lenses come out. It is one of the very few places my 500 F4 IS gets an airing.

You have to shoot as wide open as you can if you want to make the fence 'disappear' and that gets more difficult the further back you are. You will not be allowed to just nip down a few rows to take pictures. The GP security goons (look a lot like Bush's secret agents) will be on you like a pack of hounds. You have such a small field of view, at the speeds the cars will be travelling getting a good shot is more luck than judgement.

Spend most of your camera time behind the scenes and for the pit walkabout if you have the right pass. I did a bit if celebrity hunting one year and ended up with a set of shots that was like a list of Oscar attendees.

At least the roads in/out of Silverstone are not the nightmare they once were and the car parks are a lot better.

[sGu]

Cheers for the heads-up, m8.

It's certainly a bit disappointing, as it'll be my first time there and kinda looking forward to take some photos. I guess i'll take my gear and see what i'm gonna get :?

When u mentioned the right pass, i'm not sure what kind pass will come with my ticket, is gold pass the one can grant u access to most areas?

From ur experience, is it busy on fri n sat b4 the race on sun? would i be able to access more areas if it's not so busy? i'm sorry if i asked some really stupid questions, just trying to find out as much as i can.

Thanks m8

[PhotosGuy]

if you are there on one of the trade days take it.

Good advice that I forgot to mention. I usually try to go on the set-up day or a weekday. Fewer people & they will try to stay out of your way. It wouldn't hurt to take an "assistant" to try to block the path in front of you. He can also carry a 30X40" white card to reflect in the chrome for close ups!

i was thinking abt bring my monopod for the live motorshow

Use what your used to outdoors. I have a tripod I prefer because I've been using it a long time, with a quick release, & I just leave the adjustments loose.
For the show inside, it won't do you much good if the light level is as low as I'd expect it to be. As I said before, I was down to 1/2 second.

[sGu]

thanx for the advice, photoguy, i think i'll take pretty much everything i have, just in case.

[Cadwell]

It's certainly a bit disappointing, as it'll be my first time there and kinda looking forward to take some photos. I guess i'll take my gear and see what i'm gonna get :?

OK, don’t be disappointed – I hate to see people disappointed, if I’ve played a part in making you feel that way I am sorry, and it’s not all doom and gloom. First about your Gold ticket; it gets you a reserved grandstand seat on the Sunday and roving access on the Friday and Saturday. Unfortunately it doesn’t get you anywhere special like the infield or the paddock. Passes for those areas are like rocking horse droppings and they’re not handed out to mere mortals like us ;)

Friday and Saturday are better than Sunday for wandering about and taking photographs. Friday may be a wash out this year due to the qualification rule changes and the one engine rule. That makes the teams reluctant to run on the Friday in case they suffer engine damage so they will do very few (if any) laps. What I will be doing is going up on Saturday for photography and then concentrating on watching the race on the Sunday. I don’t think I will bother with Friday but if you have never been to Silverstone before it might be worth you going in order to get the lie of the land.

Now about locations for photography. The pit straight, Copse, Maggots, Becketts, Hangar Straight and Stowe are all pretty poor. There are big fences and you are a long way from the track so forget the North and East sides of the circuit. However, there ARE places at Silverstone where even F1 cars have to slow down a bit and the good news is that at some of them you CAN get decent shots even with a relatively short lens. The places you want to be (and you can get there with your Gold ticket on Saturday) are the Club grandstand to catch them as the cars drop to first gear through the corner, panning shots are possible from the banking on the run up to Abbey. You can get some decent close-ups as the cars break for Abbey itself and then run through Farm from the Abbey and Farm enclosures, you can get some nice panning shots from the Bridge enclosure although the cars are very quick through there and finally you can get some good shots of the cars going through the first part of Luffield from the back of the Luffield terrace.

So get your 2xTC and have fun. Hope that helps and has cheered you up a bit ;)

[sGu]

it certainly does cheer me up :D i'll try to enjoy myself during the event regardless, a opportunity to take good shots will be a bonus. now i can't wait to go down there.

thanks again, Cadwell.

[EOS-100-10-1D]

I have found this Thread looking for advice on Photo Locations as I am going to Silverstone for the Moto G.P. (General Access Ticket, no Grandstand Ticket. I own an EOS1D Classic & EF 300mm f4L + EF 1.4X Extender).

Silverstone claim to have had a lot of work done for the 2010 Season including moving the Spectator Area closer to the Track. Has anybody been to Silverstone this year & so could update the Thread, has there been any improvement for Photography from the Spectator Areas?