Photo Viewers: Epson vs Archos

[JeffreyVB]

I am looking to buy a portable photo viewer to a) backup my CF cards while on shoots and b) to show off my work when not shooting. I am looking at the Epson P-Series and I have heard great things about them. I have also seen some of the Achos models, but I haven't heard much about them. Any thoughts, one way or the other??

[Cathpah]

archos has bigger screens and I believe bigger hard drives....they're also cheaper.

epson has the nicest screen I've seen on a portable device in my life. if you read the reviews, it seems that everyone is blown away by the screeen. I think the epson is designed well too. For instance, when you put a cf card in, it goes all the way in. Doesn't stick out and risk damage, so you can just put the epson in your bag/pocket and not worry about it.

although my p5000 was expensive, it shows off my work beatifully to prospective clients or while doing event photography and just plain works. well worth the money.

[Mat Fitzsimmons]

Considered the new Canon M80?

[JeffreyVB]

Never heard of the Canon M80. After a little web research, it seems that they are not available here in the States.

Does the Archos have slots for memory cards? Or would I have to load my pics via a USB connection?

[samnz]

I've got the Vosonic VP8360 (http://www.vosonic.com/index.php?PA=product&id=59&kind_id=12) 100GB

Does what it's advertised to do - and well. Read RAW files as well and has CF/SD card slots.

Cheaper than the Epson too.

[Mat Fitzsimmons]

After a little web research, it seems that they are not available here in the States.
Ahhh, sorry, I didn't realise they weren't releasing it in the US. Hmmm!

[JeffreyVB]

Samnz, how do you like the Vosonic? Looking at it on the website it looks pretty slick. Did you buy it direct, or from another vendor?

[SuzyView]

I want to see what the M80 is like as well, but probably won't upgrade. I have the Epson P-2000, which is an older version, slow, but still, amazing quality screen. With the cost of the P-5000 or the M80, I can almost get to the Dell laptop I've been working on.

[jevidon]

Samnz, how do you like the Vosonic? Looking at it on the website it looks pretty slick. Did you buy it direct, or from another vendor?I second this question, though it seems I'll be buying it before you can answer :)

[Tsmith]

Well I just got the Epson P-3000 from BuyDig for $428 + $100 MIR valid till the end of this month.

Totally impressed by this device. Displays RAW files without having to shoot RAW+JPEG and the EXIF data along with Histogram info. The LCD is just as mentioned above, simply beautiful.

Really looking forward to using it soon while on vacation in Glacier NP. Already have 10 DVD movies converted to DivX so the plane flight won't be so boring. You can get a Lenmar extra battery from amazon.com for around $20, lot cheaper than the OEM type.

[JeffreyVB]

I just bought a NIB Epson P-3000 from a FreMiranda member. Man this thing is awesome. Every positive review that I have read has been met or exceeded. Can't wait to take this thing on some summer roads trips in the coming months!!! :)

[wonny]

I'm using the Creative Zen (60GB). Only downside is you can't see the RAW files, so I shoot RAW and JPEG. No big deal though. Great for pictures, movies and music.

[jevidon]

I'm using the Creative Zen (60GB). Only downside is you can't see the RAW files, so I shoot RAW and JPEG. No big deal though. Great for pictures, movies and music.Shooting RAW+JPG wastes so much CF space for me because I only archive the RAW files...

[BBrat]

I just bought a NIB Epson P-3000 from a FreMiranda member. Man this thing is awesome. Every positive review that I have read has been met or exceeded. Can't wait to take this thing on some summer roads trips in the coming months!!! :)

i picked one up a month ago and its a beautiful device. enjoy!

[TeamSpeed]

Good ol Sunman selling these one at a time on FM.... ;)

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/546471

[Cathpah]

Good ol Sunman selling these one at a time on FM.... ;)

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/546471

yes indeedy. I almost bought one from him as well for my friend to bring to me in Bangkok in a couple weeks when she comes out here...but I was able to get one ordered from Hong Kong in Nepal.

Sunman had great communcation and seemed to be an all-around good guy.

Oh, and the p-5000 freaking rules. I'm sending my laptop home after carrying it around for 6 months...all thanks to my P-thousand (my gangster name for it). The screen is truly breathtaking.

[JeffreyVB]

Good ol Sunman selling these one at a time on FM.... ;)

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/546471

That's who I got mine from. Smooth worry free transaction. Paypal'ed the payment on a Monday, had my P-3000 in my greedy little hands that Wednesday evening!!!

[TeamSpeed]

I have the older generation P4000, 80gb, same screen and card reader. I am considering selling it and buying the 2nd gen 40 gigger, just for the smaller size and faster processor.

[samnz]

Samnz, how do you like the Vosonic? Looking at it on the website it looks pretty slick. Did you buy it direct, or from another vendor?

I second this question, though it seems I'll be buying it before you can answer :)

Hey sorry guys for late reply.

Firstly JeffreyVB congrats on the Epson - I had considered it very briefly but couldn't justify the cost for the very limited use I'd get out of it.

jevidon I have been using the Vosonic for a few weeks now and am bloody impressed.

Reads 30D RAW files. Recorded a few episodes of Smallville (mp4) off TV (they're...errrrr...for the wife :o) + a handful of American Idol episodes - have about 5 dvd movies (converted to avi), + 2 or 3 movies recorded directly from dvd. On top of that about 500 mp3 files, 8GB of pics, and I still have about 60+GB left.

This thing comes with all the accessories you could possibly need - cables, cords, case, earphones, cradle, charger etc.

The hardrive is upgradable and the battery is replaceable - A fuji digicam battery.

I bought it off an NZ auction site called TradeMe. The seller also runs the vosonicnz website. Very friendly and helpful.

Hope this helps. Sam

[ScottE]

If you are interested in viewing the image consider the newer Vosonic VP8390. This has an Organic Light Emitting Diode screen that should give a better image than LCd, especially if you are using it outdoors in sunlight.

Has anybody used one of these devices. I would be interested in comments.

[samnz]

If you are interested in viewing the image consider the newer Vosonic VP8390. This has an Organic Light Emitting Diode screen that should give a better image than LCd, especially if you are using it outdoors in sunlight.

Has anybody used one of these devices. I would be interested in comments.

My mate bought the 8390 about a week after I bought the 8360. Movies were very vibrant and alive. But for RAW file/Image viewing, they looked a little 'overdone'. Plenty of contrast, saturation and brightness ... however for me - I found the image representation somewhat, overexagerated in terms of what might be seen on my modest laptop.

By all means, if you want the OLCD to watch movies, go for it! The image is brilliant.

[JohnJ80]

I have a Epson p-3000 and a Hyperdrive PD70X. The P-3000 is ok, but the download speed is slow (about half or less than half) the PD70X. However, the P3000 is more versatile - you can see photos (and they look great), you can transfer them to another FAT32 formatted disk drive etc... It makes good backup.

The P3000 has crappy video - basically is just a click this side of unusable if you want to watch a movie. Lots of pixelation, lots of unsynced audio and video, lots of herky jerky video. I've been fooling with frame rates etc... and it doesn't seem to matter much.

I did find a cheap battery and external charger for the P-3000. See:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Battery-for-Epson-P-2000-P-2500-P-3000-P-5000-as-EU-97_W0QQitemZ170126269388QQihZ007QQcategoryZ15215QQ ssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
and an external charger

http://cgi.ebay.com/Charger-for-Epson-EU-97-battery-f-P-2500-P-3000-P-5000_W0QQitemZ170125169967QQihZ007QQcategoryZ50518 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I also understand, but have not tried it, that the Sony PSP adaptor and car adaptor also work for this unit. That will give you 12V capability.

J.

[Tsmith]

The P3000 has crappy video - basically is just a click this side of unusable if you want to watch a movie. Lots of pixelation, lots of unsynced audio and video, lots of herky jerky video. I've been fooling with frame rates etc... and it doesn't seem to matter much.

It depends on how your doing the conversion. I use a Program called # 1 DVD Ripper to covert to DivX and use the default Lame MP3 encoder at 192 Kbits, video resolution at 640x480 and the video/audio is synced perfectly. The video quality looks almost HD like.

[JohnJ80]

I'll give that a try. I'm on a mac, but I have the ripping software to do all this.

J

[Tsmith]

John when I let the Epson software do the conversion to DivX it would be out of sync as you said but using a third party app to do the conversion and then just move the converted file into the P-3000 using the Link2 software allowed it to work fine.

[Helenica]

I have the vosonic 8360. I find the LCD display poor!

[samnz]

I have the vosonic 8360. I find the LCD display poor!

Compared to... ?

Just trying to help these guys get an idea that's all.

[Helenica]

Compared to... ?

Just trying to help these guys get an idea that's all.



I can only compare it to the quality of my 20D screen. In comparison, the highlights/shadow/colour detail is dismal. I have tried different brightness settings, but can't say that I am satisfied with any of them. Also there only seems to be one angle where the screens views nicely, namely with the screen tilted fairly far backwards which isn't how I want to view my foto's.

[JohnJ80]

John when I let the Epson software do the conversion to DivX it would be out of sync as you said but using a third party app to do the conversion and then just move the converted file into the P-3000 using the Link2 software allowed it to work fine.

Is there a format that works better than others? I was converting to Mpeg4 - is that the problem?

J

[jevidon]

I can only compare it to the quality of my 20D screen. In comparison, the highlights/shadow/colour detail is dismal. I have tried different brightness settings, but can't say that I am satisfied with any of them. Also there only seems to be one angle where the screens views nicely, namely with the screen tilted fairly far backwards which isn't how I want to view my foto's.thanks for the input. I was planning on buying one of those, but I am going to hold off...any UK forum members know how to get a hold of a Canon M80?

[Tsmith]

Is there a format that works better than others? I was converting to Mpeg4 - is that the problem?

J

DivX is what seems to work best as it greatly reduces the size of the file while retaining a very good video and audio. Mpeg4 will take up more space. Remember the screen resolution of the P-3000 is only 640x480.

[strmrdr]

Is there a format that works better than others? I was converting to Mpeg4 - is that the problem?

J
mpeg4 is a problem a lot of times.
mpeg4 is a specification and there are dozen of implementations some are very compatible with each other some aren't.
Unless both the encoder and decoder have the same implementation there are often issues.
Divx solves this because Divx is an implementation and not a specification.

[neil_r]

if you want the best available, in my opinion you should look at the Jobo GIGAVu Pro http://www.jobo.com/jobo_digital/giga_vu_pro_evolution/gb/index.html

[JohnJ80]

DivX is what seems to work best as it greatly reduces the size of the file while retaining a very good video and audio. Mpeg4 will take up more space. Remember the screen resolution of the P-3000 is only 640x480.

That was it - DivX. Converted it into that format and it worked great. Thanks for the tip.

J

[Tsmith]

That was it - DivX. Converted it into that format and it worked great. Thanks for the tip.

J

Good deal John ... ;)

[JohnJ80]

Be nice if they put that in the manual. They make a point of saying how they have all these codecs for the various video formats in there. One would sort of expect MPEG to be one of the safe ones. DivX would have been just about the LAST one I picked.

Thanks again.

J.

[Sathi]

I bought an archos 504 with the idea of photo backup on the go but I think I made a mistake. I bought it a couple of months before the compact flash price crash. Now that you can get a 16gig CF card for $100 these things are starting to make less sense. The price drops in flash memory now seem to be far outpacing increases in sensor megapixels. In a year when a 32GB card is $70 AR no one will need a drive based solution anymore.

[JohnJ80]

except that the file sizes keep getting bigger and cards fail or can be corrupted easily.

My backup strategy is three pronged when traveling or for important shoots -

1. CD/DVD or 2nd PSD or Laptop.

2. PSD like Epson p3000 or Hyperdrive device.

3. External portable HD that interfaces to P3000 above.

I then spread these over traveling companions and they do the same.

For a week trip, I will shoot about 2-3000 shots that are 12MB each (36MB). I do that in 4GB chunks so a 16GB card does me no good. Cards fail and I don't want all that tied up in one card. I fail too - like open the door when the card is writing (I've done that a couple of times) and corrupt the card.

I do agree with the sentiment that it is very feasible to carry a days worth of shooting in CF cards with the possible exception of lots of sports shooting where you are shooting a lot of bursts. I don't carry a PSD with me unless I need to see (or show) shots that I recently took (Epson P3000).

J

[midlife_crisis]

except that the file sizes keep getting bigger and cards fail or can be corrupted easily.

My backup strategy is three pronged when traveling or for important shoots -

1. CD/DVD or 2nd PSD or Laptop.

2. PSD like Epson p3000 or Hyperdrive device.

3. External portable HD that interfaces to P3000 above.

I then spread these over traveling companions and they do the same.


I've run software department's that haven't used this level of disaster recovery.

[ThomasEd]

I have an Archos 604, and have just tried connecting it to my 400D. (question was in another thread, but I have now worked it out!) I have to say I am very pleased with it. I bought the archos originally because I am travelling a lot, and wanted to be able to watch movies and listen to music other than the selections the airlines give you. The screen quality is excellent, and very sharp. The camera attaches directly to it via USB for picture viewing. I bought the Archos attachment, but I guess you could also use a USB hub. The archos can also be easily attached to TV or computer, and makes a very versatile storage or viewing device, as well as an on the move anti-boredom device. All in all - I am very happy with it, + the battery life if excellent. About 16+ hrs for music, 4 for film, and I guess a fair amount for pics.

[Sathi]

except that the file sizes keep getting bigger and cards fail or can be corrupted easily.

My backup strategy is three pronged when traveling or for important shoots -

1. CD/DVD or 2nd PSD or Laptop.

2. PSD like Epson p3000 or Hyperdrive device.

3. External portable HD that interfaces to P3000 above.

I then spread these over traveling companions and they do the same.

For a week trip, I will shoot about 2-3000 shots that are 12MB each (36MB). I do that in 4GB chunks so a 16GB card does me no good. Cards fail and I don't want all that tied up in one card. I fail too - like open the door when the card is writing (I've done that a couple of times) and corrupt the card. You can bu

I do agree with the sentiment that it is very feasible to carry a days worth of shooting in CF cards with the possible exception of lots of sports shooting where you are shooting a lot of bursts. I don't carry a PSD with me unless I need to see (or show) shots that I recently took (Epson P3000).

J

Although file sizes are getting bigger, the rate at which compact flash prices are falling is far faster. My comment is more directed towards the near future than the present. Also even though your backup solution is superior, it is not necessarily practical for everyone. Not everyone has the $ to spend on 4 portable systems for redundancy. Not everyone has travel companions that you can unload a laptop onto. When I go on vacation it is usually camping with a backpack, not hotels and car trunks. You can buy 3 x 16G CF for a total for 48 gigs for the same price you can buy a 40G Epson p3000. Granted you don't have that nice screen to review pics, but there is a substantial savings in weight and size. I would also rather have my pics distributed over 3 compact flash cards than one single magnetic disk as that is safer and more reliable.

[airbutchie]

I just purchased the Epson P-5000 model... You guys weren't kiddin' about the image quality display... Absolutley amazing... It's like watching Discovery HD on a plasma TV... Breathtaking to say the least... I'm glad I went with the Epson route... It's a pretty penny, but like everyone says, "it's worth every single one!!!" Can't wait to backup my pictures of Greece on it... Santorini, Capri, and Mikonos are going to look amazing!!!

- airbutchie :D

[Black_lab]

I've just ordered a 1D Mk3 and I need a backup device. The Vosoniv VP8390 looks the part. However at the moment the Mk3's RAW files are not supported. Cam any one with a Mk3 send me a "small" raw file that Vosonic can look at please.

[Cathpah]

I just purchased the Epson P-5000 model... You guys weren't kiddin' about the image quality display... Absolutley amazing... It's like watching Discovery HD on a plasma TV... Breathtaking to say the least... I'm glad I went with the Epson route... It's a pretty penny, but like everyone says, "it's worth every single one!!!" Can't wait to backup my pictures of Greece on it... Santorini, Capri, and Mikonos are going to look amazing!!!

- airbutchie :D

haha...yup, the screen is nuts. Some shots look better on the screen than printed!

it's just another reason I love the p-5000...I can pass it over to a prospective client and they'll be blown away by the colors/contrast/everything.

[Ingsy]

I'm thinking of getting a Vosonic VP8360 for a number of reasons:

I'm off on honeymoon later in the year and want a single device that will allow my to play music and videos etc for the flight, plus allow me to back up photos (400D) in case the memory card fails. I'll leave the photos on the card as well as back them up to the Vosonic so I won't be leaving all my eggs in one basket.

I know the device will do all I want, but I guess I'm after a bit of confirmation from anyone who's got one of these that it's £200 well spent.

Thanks :)

[samnz]

I've still got mine :)

No problems so far except RAWs from 40D and 1D are only jpeg thumbnails - so it's really pixelly. The Jpeg files are no probs.

I haven't had to replace anything, update anything or add anything...as I said in a previous post - it comes with all the accessories you need...plus it's cheap ;)

[Ingsy]

Thanks for the reply. Did it back up your RAWs though ready to export to a PC?
I've got a 400D so would this be a problem?

[samnz]

Absolutely - stores the photos in a chronological way...and in its own folder. Also when the 8360 is hooked up to the computer, it becomes an instant card reader.

RAW/CR2 files are a p.i.t.a. when dealing with ANY system - I'm not sure what kind of RAWs the 400D deals with but jpegs are sweet as.

NB: This is only concerning "viewing the RAW/CR2 files on the 8360." You can download absolutely ANY file you wish. It will store it for you just like a normal harddrive. Whether it will play it on the 8360 is another question.

[Ingsy]

If RAWs are that much of a pain on any back up device, would it be worth shooting in RAW+JPG mode, just in case?

Think I'll look into getting one of these then, thanks for your help :)

[samnz]

Glad could help. Shooting Jpeg + RAW is totally up to the individual. I personally shoot RAW ONLY.

Once again if you wish to "VIEW" images on the Vosonic, jpeg will be a pretty safe option. After all - you've got 100Gigas to play with :)

Best of luck and congrats for your wedding ;)

Sam

[TeamSpeed]

RAW/CR2 files are a p.i.t.a. when dealing with ANY system - I'm not sure what kind of RAWs the 400D deals with but jpegs are sweet as.



The Epson P-3000/5000 now allows better viewing of the Canon raw files, and you can even zoom in now. The older line only showed the JPEG thumbnail and you could not zoom.

[tara_lynn]

I'm thinking of getting a Vosonic VP8360 for a number of reasons:

I'm off on honeymoon later in the year and want a single device that will allow my to play music and videos etc for the flight, plus allow me to back up photos (400D) in case the memory card fails. I'll leave the photos on the card as well as back them up to the Vosonic so I won't be leaving all my eggs in one basket.

I know the device will do all I want, but I guess I'm after a bit of confirmation from anyone who's got one of these that it's £200 well spent.

Thanks :)

Well I was all set to buy the vp8360 today but made the mistake of going onto the Vosonic website to check something and they have a new version out in May. Argh the new version (vp8860) looks better, has a bigger screen, better resolution and takes up to 250 gb sata hard drive. Now I feel the need to wait till the new model comes out in case I can afford it or if not afford it hope it bumps down the price of the older model. Maybe a good idea to wait incase the price does drop if you don't need it urgently.
Tara :)

[Ingsy]

Hello Tara - yeah, I had seen that on their site. Out sometime in May apparently, so not long to wait - I've got until October so think I'll hang on and see what happens.

[samnz]

Gee - that was easy. Downloaded the latest firmware onto the Vosonic: BUDDABING! Can read 40D RAWs now. STOKED!!!! :)

[JohnJ80]

Anyone know how fast the Vosonic will download a card?

J.

[samnz]

My cards not full but I just did a time test with
37 x 40D RAW Files 2GB Sandisk Extreme III
34.92secs :)

Not sure if that's normal/fast or slow. FWIW when I'm on the job, I don't do any backing up till I've got some time up my sleeve. I'll also put the card away (not use it again) and I won't format until the photos are verified once I get home - juuuuuuust in case ;)

Haven't mysteriously lost any or accidentally lost any...but anything's possible.

The Epson P-3000/5000 now allows better viewing of the Canon raw files, and you can even zoom in now. The older line only showed the JPEG thumbnail and you could not zoom.

The Vosonic has always been able to zoom and basic EXIF overlayed with histogram has been pretty handy. But I very rarely use it.

I looked at the Epson but for the money, it offered so little at the time - compared to the Vosonic.