do you own Canon 70-200 NON IS? help please

[Sendide]

Hi dear friends,
A technical question for those who own the Canon 70-200 2.8 L NON IS : how slow could you go with the shutter speed without having a conciderable blur due to hand shaking; I mean how hard is it to control the wight of this lens (on 10D body) handheld.
If I can control 100mm Macro USM or 37-300 IS (without IS ON), could I handle this lens ?
I've been told that I can get the cheap IS (monopod), but I'm talking about situations when handheld is imposed.
your experience will be for a great help for me to make a decision (if I have to go IS, my plan for the twin speedlite macro flash will start evaporating :roll: )
thanks in advance
Khalid

[rickyd]

Ive been using my non IS 70-200 for the last 3 years shooting everything from auto racing to the grand canyon. Hand held I dont go slower than 125/sec. to insure a sharp picture. Good luck.

Rickyd

[Sendide]

thanks ricky
regards
Khalid

[Olegis]

I shot a picture once at 200mm and shutter speed of 1/60 - and it came out sharp, but that was just pure luck I guess. Usually I try not to go below 1/250 with this lens, bumping up the ISO if needed.

[Ballen Photo]

I try to follow this rule; 1/focal length of lens. In the case of the 70-200 zoomed to 200 it will be at least 1/200th or faster unless the sittuation or circumstance calls for slower, in which case I brace myself against a chair, fence, wall, or anything handy. It also helps to exhale while taking the shot, as any target shooter will tell you. :D :shock: :D
BTW, Mine is the 2.8 non IS.
..........Bruce

[PJ]

SO say I have the 70-200 mounted on a Digital Rebel.
The digital factor is 1.6 correct.
that makes the lens a 112-320mm

Would I then have to shoot at nothing lower than 1/320sec when zoomed all the way in?
Sorry if this is a stupid question!

thanks
Paul

[cmM]

SO say I have the 70-200 mounted on a Digital Rebel.
The digital factor is 1.6 correct.
that makes the lens a 112-320mm

Would I then have to shoot at nothing lower than 1/320sec when zoomed all the way in?
Sorry if this is a stupid question!

thanks
Paul
The focal length of the lens is still 70-200. You don't have to take the crop factor into considderation when calculating stuff like this.
It would still be no less that 1/200 sec if you follow the shutter speed "rule"

[DaveG]

SO say I have the 70-200 mounted on a Digital Rebel.
The digital factor is 1.6 correct.
that makes the lens a 112-320mm

Would I then have to shoot at nothing lower than 1/320sec when zoomed all the way in?
Sorry if this is a stupid question!

thanks
Paul
The focal length of the lens is still 70-200. You don't have to take the crop factor into considderation when calculating stuff like this.
It would still be no less that 1/200 sec if you follow the shutter speed "rule"

No, the rule should be modified to take into account the effective focal length. The smaller the crop the more you are going to notice shaking. That's why the 1/focal length rule works. There's just as much camera movement going on with a 16 mm lens as a 300, but you just don't notice it as much. If you used a 70-200 on a full frame camera at 200mm then 1/200 would be the slowest handholding speed you should use, assuming that you "print" the whole frame. If you crop - like the 10D gives you, then you should modify the rule accordingly.

But once again the 1/focal length rule is a MINIMUM, not optimum solution, and you should use faster shutterspeeds whenever possible. There seems to be a lot of manhood tied to hand holding shutterspeeds as in "I use my 300 at 1/15 of a second, handheld, and I make flawless 16X20's every time." Which of course is utter bull****. Either the user doesn't understand what flawless means, or just knows that they don't have to prove it and for some reason they get off bragging that their results are outstanding.

I think that your odds of getting a good steady shot are determined by the shutterspeed you use. I'll make up some numbers as an example: You could guess that four out of five shots are good where you use a 50mm lens (on a 10D) at 1/125. At 1/60 perhaps you'll get 2 out of five. At 1/30 perhaps one out of ten. And so forth.

In any case why bother to get into this race? I had a friend who used to spend days trying to wring fine grain out of Kodak Tri-X film. He'd play with the exposures, developer and wierd agitation methods, all to get fine grain Tri-X; and we could never figure out why he just didn't use Plus-X, which had the fine grain built in!

So use a monopod with the 70-200. Let it carry the weight of the camera and lens and then you'll have a lot more choice over your shutterspeed. And you can leave the handholding race to the guys who have a Corvette in their future.

[aeroshots2003]

I use the EOS 1N HS + 70-200 2.8 non IS :

at 200mm shots at 1/125 are no problems as far as I've experienced. When going lower though, I won't get 10/10 images sharp.

I did not spend the extra cash on IS since I mostly work in outdoor daytime conditions and working with f/8.0 I seem to have sufficient shutter speed most of the time.

Hope this helps...


Aero

[cmM]

No, the rule should be modified to take into account the effective focal length. The smaller the crop the more you are going to notice shaking. That's why the 1/focal length rule works. There's just as much camera movement going on with a 16 mm lens as a 300, but you just don't notice it as much. If you used a 70-200 on a full frame camera at 200mm then 1/200 would be the slowest handholding speed you should use, assuming that you "print" the whole frame. If you crop - like the 10D gives you, then you should modify the rule accordingly.

I'm a little confused here. Are you saying that taking a picture @ 320mm using a full frame, and the same picture at 200mm with a 1.6 crop sensor (same amount of shake... theoretically) and print them both on 8x10 for example you will see the same amount of blur? :roll:

[timmyquest]

No, the rule should be modified to take into account the effective focal length. The smaller the crop the more you are going to notice shaking. That's why the 1/focal length rule works. There's just as much camera movement going on with a 16 mm lens as a 300, but you just don't notice it as much. If you used a 70-200 on a full frame camera at 200mm then 1/200 would be the slowest handholding speed you should use, assuming that you "print" the whole frame. If you crop - like the 10D gives you, then you should modify the rule accordingly.

I'm a little confused here. Are you saying that taking a picture @ 320mm using a full frame, and the same picture at 200mm with a 1.6 crop sensor (same amount of shake... theoretically) and print them both on 8x10 for example you will see the same amount of blur? :roll:

That is what he's saying, that is what makes sense to me...but frankly i'm as baffled by it as you are.

I've read on sites (reviewing lenses) that the rule should be put to effect with the "added length".

[DaveG]

No, the rule should be modified to take into account the effective focal length. The smaller the crop the more you are going to notice shaking. That's why the 1/focal length rule works. There's just as much camera movement going on with a 16 mm lens as a 300, but you just don't notice it as much. If you used a 70-200 on a full frame camera at 200mm then 1/200 would be the slowest handholding speed you should use, assuming that you "print" the whole frame. If you crop - like the 10D gives you, then you should modify the rule accordingly.

I'm a little confused here. Are you saying that taking a picture @ 320mm using a full frame, and the same picture at 200mm with a 1.6 crop sensor (same amount of shake... theoretically) and print them both on 8x10 for example you will see the same amount of blur? :roll:

Yes

[cmM]

yes
Okay... I learned one more thing. :wink:

[DaveG]

yes
Okay... I learned one more thing. :wink:
It's not the focal length that's doing it. It's the magnification. If 50 is normal or 1X, then the magnification is one and happily the 1/focal length happens to work. But if 25 is normal then 50 is 2X and requires twice the shutterspeed for the same solution, ASSUMING THAT YOU WANT TO MAKE THE SAME SIZE PRINT!!!

All of this is nice to know but outside of hard news or sports I rarely handhold my camera if there's any way to avoid it. For pictorial or magazine stock shots I hear a voice in my head that says, "You don't really care about this do you?" when I hand hold. And I hate that voice. A tripod gives me freedom to choose apertures and shutterspeeds as I desire, dicatated only by the relative motion of the subject, not how my muscle tone is working on that day.

I'm also lazy so if my monopod wants to carry the load of my 70-200, camera body and whatever else I've hung on it then it's OK with me.

At the end of the day with either a tripod or monopod, I get a technically better capture - even at higher shutterspeeds - than I could by handholding.

[mjordan]

[quote=cmM]
So use a monopod with the 70-200. Let it carry the weight of the camera and lens and then you'll have a lot more choice over your shutterspeed. And you can leave the handholding race to the guys who have a Corvette in their future.


If handholding will get me a Corvette, I'll be glad to get some fuzzy pictures. Shoot, I have plenty of fuzzy pictures now. Where do I get my Corvette?


:lol: :lol:

Mike

[DaveG]

[quote=cmM]
So use a monopod with the 70-200. Let it carry the weight of the camera and lens and then you'll have a lot more choice over your shutterspeed. And you can leave the handholding race to the guys who have a Corvette in their future.


If handholding will get me a Corvette, I'll be glad to get some fuzzy pictures. Shoot, I have plenty of fuzzy pictures now. Where do I get my Corvette?


:lol: :lol:

Mike
I just figured that a Corvette was cheaper for these guys than a schlong enhancement. But you do what you need to do.