Advertising how to Start

[asdisc]

Ok I've been searching for days, and I don't seem to get a real good answer.

The things I've seen is

1. Word of Mouth
(I guess I talk enough to people because this doesn't work for me)
2. Hand out business Cards at other jobs
(I do individual portraits in my house so there aren't any potential clients around)
3. Yellow Pages
(Not a place I would spend money)
4. Newspaper Ad
(Debating this one, would it work)
5. Flyers on Cars
(Tried this one today, almost got a ticket for solication outside of Target)
6. Door Hangers
(Might give this one a shot)
7. Vehicle with Website/Advertising on it
(Have had it for 6 months not one single call)


There are others but that seems to be a repeating theme. The point is how do you start out in this business without spending an arm and a leg to get your name out there. We have a website but it doesn't bring in any customers. I'm at a lose of what to do next? Any and all help would be greatly appreciated.

[Gary_Evans]

Without knowing things like your budget, target market etc any advice can only be very generic but this is how I got a studio up and running some time back. I teamed up with the local paper to run two competitions three months apart. First one was to find the towns local beatiful baby - free sitting, free entry etc. Paper printed all the entries and readers picked the winner. Parents had the option of buying prints. Second competition was to win a large framed family portrait. Entrants had to answer 5 questions plus complete a caption "I would like to win a family potrait because .........". This gave me loads of leads plus some great advertising slogans.

By using the paper in this way I got free advertising and approx 80% of the local population knew about the studio very quickly and this appears to be the problem you are encountering.

[Mom2Twins]

I agree with the pp, knowing your target market would be very helpful. We are 6 months into our business and are averaging 3-6 sessions weekly. Here is some of the things we did:
Team up with local businesses. We have offered free portraits of some of the local business owners kids in exchange for them letting us put a large print of their child up in their biz...with our contact info on it.
We also teamed up with a local children's boutique, doing basically the same as above, only it wasn't their kid, but a kid wearing their clothes, and we promote them in every e-newsletter we send out.
E-newsletters are a great idea, too. Every person's email you know...friends, families, anyone, compile a list. I even went into my inbox and wrote down emails addresses from forwards...people I didn't know. I use vertical respones for my enewsletter service. If they don't want to get the emails, they can remove themselves from the list, but noone has thus far. And actually one of those people I didn't know booked.
OF course, put biz cards EVERYWHERE, and make sure your website address is on them.
Everytime we have a special, like we did the first 5 seniors this year free, no sitting fee, we put flyers up everywhere.
We also had a ribbon cutting ceremony that the local paper covered and published...that was very helpful.

[asdisc]

Thanks for the info.

Target Market would be
Maternity - Family Portraits (Not looking at Senior Portraits quite yet)
NO weddings, we're not set up for it.
We are in a surburb of San Antonio, so tons of people around, but also lots of options for people to choice. (Target and Walmart types of photos seems popular unfortuantely)
Here is our website
www.cameronstudio.net


Any other advice would be great. :)

[Mom2Twins]

here is something we are about to do...at the local OB/GYN's office, each new pregnant mom gets a bag of goodies. Coupons, offers, etc., all relating to baby, and we are in the process of getting our maternity program info added to that bag, as well as posting a flyer about it at the clinic. We will also be posting a flyer about our infant/baby program and the local peditricians offices.

[asdisc]

How did you go about doing the bag of goodies? Did you go there in person or just send a letter? That's a great idea to get new clients. Thanks thats a great step in the right direction.

[rhys]

Ok I've been searching for days, and I don't seem to get a real good answer.

The things I've seen is

1. Word of Mouth
(I guess I talk enough to people because this doesn't work for me)
2. Hand out business Cards at other jobs
(I do individual portraits in my house so there aren't any potential clients around)
3. Yellow Pages
(Not a place I would spend money)
4. Newspaper Ad
(Debating this one, would it work)
5. Flyers on Cars
(Tried this one today, almost got a ticket for solication outside of Target)
6. Door Hangers
(Might give this one a shot)
7. Vehicle with Website/Advertising on it
(Have had it for 6 months not one single call)



My experience: I advertised in the newspaper for weeks and got less money out of calls than I paid for the adverts.

Flyers/posters - people take them down and take them with them but never call.

Business cards - no calls at all.

Web advertising (website) just somebody trying to sell me inclusion in a search engine that I'd never heard of (if it ain't google, it ain't worth it).

[asdisc]

My experience: I advertised in the newspaper for weeks and got less money out of calls than I paid for the adverts.

Flyers/posters - people take them down and take them with them but never call.

Business cards - no calls at all.

Web advertising (website) just somebody trying to sell me inclusion in a search engine that I'd never heard of (if it ain't google, it ain't worth it).


Ok, so what did get you any business?

[Mom2Twins]

How did you go about doing the bag of goodies? Did you go there in person or just send a letter? That's a great idea to get new clients. Thanks thats a great step in the right direction.

We just know a couple of the doc's :)

[rhys]

Ok, so what did get you any business?

I think we still need to hear from the radio and TV advertisers.

Personally, I don't get enough business from advertising in traditional ways. One of the best non-traditional would be to make up some sandwich boards and stand near a busy road.

[asdisc]

Really sandwich boards has gotten you business before? I have to see a picture of this. Do you just pay someone to do this I take it?

I don't think in all my years I have ever seen a photography studio advertise on the TV, and only a small radio annoucement if anything.

[rhys]

Sandwich boards work. I have not used them but I have seen them used a lot locally. In fact I spotted one and it was advertising a closing down sale at a shop my wife liked but thought too expensive. We went and prices were high but not ridiculously high.

I am thinking of advertising on my car with magnetic signs and of doing the sandwich board thing too (myself).

[michael_]

im in the middle of a small bus management course which includes my business plan, one thing we discussed sharing simple business card swapping with businesses rleated to your target, i have just handed out 2000 cards to 20 different businesses all related to my target market (motorsport, local clothing stores and a few restaurants) in my locak area, each time i send out a print to a client i send a business card from one of the companys which it relates to, they have my cards at their counter or in the case of two guys who sell car parts who sell stuff online they send out my cards with any products they sell, has drummed up quite abit of work for me in a few different areas (im booked to take menu shots for the local chinese restaurant soon).

Try your local newspaper ive approached mine who do a story each month on a new business in the area, they are doing a story on me in 2 months and are going to include a shot or two of mine and thats for free and circulated to about 30,000 homes locally.

[CannedHeat]

- Sandwich boards - was kind of funny, but heck, who knows. If it works, it works. But if you do this use the "new technology" of sandwich boards - they have now become thost attention-getting spinning boards.

- Television - does work. In a non-photography related business years ago, I tried tv. You would be shocked. even late night worked. However, there are two big "buts": 1. it is prohibitively expensive, 2. it may very well not work for photographers. I agree with the previous poster that where I live I cannot ever remember seeing a photographer advertise on tv. However, when advertising on tv it is a given - many eyes will see it.

- radio - has never worked for me. In the same business noted above (it was a resume business) I tried multiple times, different stations, different demographics and each and every time radio was by far the worst advertising medium I tried. Always a money-wasting disaster.

Direct mail - it is said if you get a 2% or so return, you have had a successful campaign. never worked very well for me.

Additional ideas: lots of cities have businesses that create and mail coupon packets weekly or insert a coupon flyer insert into the local newspaper once a week. consider that. also, lots of cities have welcoming committees that send out packets of info, b-cards, coupons, etc. to new people moving into the city. consider that.

[asdisc]

Sounds like a plan, the local newspaper, maybe its just me though but I don't look at the ads in the paper, I look at the articles and don't even give the ads a first look let alone a second look.

Thanks CannedHeat The "additional ideas" of getting with the city for people that are moving into the area is a great idea.

[tcphoto1]

What do you shoot? What is your short term and long term goals? I shoot Editorial images and would like to shoot more Advertising, so I have a short list of promotional items.

1. Continue working with my Editorial Clients to finance Promo Pieces.
2. Shoot images that will catch potential Clients eye.
3. Update website and increase traffic to it.
4. Continue to shoot images that will sell in Stock.
5. Shoot images for Promo Pieces and mail on a regular basis to Ad Agencies, Design Firms and Magazines.

[Morgandy]

...maybe its just me though but I don't look at the ads in the paper, I look at the articles and don't even give the ads a first look let alone a second look.

That's one of the key points when you're considering advertising in *any* medium: is the medium going to reach your target audience wherever they go looking; and is the medium's duration going to have an effect that will last long enough for the money you're paying? Newspapers only last a day -- or maybe a week.

For all the different types of ads people have mentioned in this thread, which one would you look at if you were not a photographer, but just a person needing photography? Where would you go look for someone advertising those services? I think too many people here are approaching it from the photographer's point of view, and that should not be the case.

[timbernet]

This is what the photographers in our area do:
They are members of the local chamber of commerce. Many people check with their local chamber to see what businesses are around. Good exposure there - fairly cheap, the three nearby chambers out here cost $100/year...

Photos up for a few months at the local coffee joint w/business cards...

Business cards/flyers on bulletin boards at the donut shop/coffee shop (where they don't want full photos)

Saturday Market - I know they aren't everywhere - but I have seen a local pro setup at the local Saturday Market - she is there beside the guy with the tomatoes... hey, whatever works. My co-worker found her that way and bought two prints (at 150$ each).

It depends on the size of the town you are in and where you want to shoot. Our town is only 7,000 people...

[rhys]

I just paid $38 for two DIY magnetic car signs from Office Depot.
I'll settle down to putting the text on them soon.

I'll probably put the sign like this:

Rhys Sage
Photography
803 477 5145
SagePhotoWorld.com

The middle two lines will be large letters while the others are smaller.

[asdisc]

I just paid $38 for two DIY magnetic car signs from Office Depot.
I'll settle down to putting the text on them soon.

I'll probably put the sign like this:

Rhys Sage
Photography
803 477 5145
SagePhotoWorld.com

The middle two lines will be large letters while the others are smaller.



Yea we've had the Signs on the Van for almost 6 months, not a single call from it. That's why we are searching for new approaches to advertising.

[rhys]

Yea we've had the Signs on the Van for almost 6 months, not a single call from it. That's why we are searching for new approaches to advertising.

where on the van?

[asdisc]

where on the van?


It was on the both side rear windows with HUGE letters with the same set up as what you are going to do.

[rhys]

Aha... You didn't use the back of the van?

People only see the back of your van in traffic. They don't see the sides!

[asdisc]

Aha... You didn't use the back of the van?

People only see the back of your van in traffic. They don't see the sides!



True but when its parked at Walmart, Target and other places its still very visible from everywhere in the lot. We'll probably put one on the back sometime.

[CannedHeat]

This is what the photographers in our area do:
They are members of the local chamber of commerce.

That's a good tip. I had forgotten about that. Here they have a branch of the local COC called the Merchant's Association. Many cities have them. Business owners join the group and have quarterly meetings. You would be surprised at the networking relationships that are developed, even between competing businesses. That would be a great way to develop B2B leads.

[rhys]

True but when its parked at Walmart, Target and other places its still very visible from everywhere in the lot. We'll probably put one on the back sometime.

But in a parking lot, people are looking for their car and scurrying to/from it. In a traffic queue you have a captive audience behind you.

[CannedHeat]

But in a parking lot, people are looking for their car and scurrying to/from it. In a traffic queue you have a captive audience behind you.

Not to mention the fact that if you research and set things up right, while operating the vehicle with the sign attached the cost of operation may be a tax deduction. :D

[rhys]

Oddly enough....

I am in the process of starting a photo business myself...

My planned advertising is:
Discount coupons in the papers/magazines locally
Discount coupons in my wife's office (she's the best dentist in Columbia)
Magnetic signs on my Xterra (the Xterra is part of the plan as it exudes affluence)
Business cards (I print them myself until I can generate enough income to merit spending money on having them done)
I might join the CoC too.
Sandwich boards when business is low too.

[asdisc]

Oddly enough....

I am in the process of starting a photo business myself...

My planned advertising is:
Discount coupons in the papers/magazines locally
Discount coupons in my wife's office (she's the best dentist in Columbia)
Magnetic signs on my Xterra (the Xterra is part of the plan as it exudes affluence)
Business cards (I print them myself until I can generate enough income to merit spending money on having them done)
I might join the CoC too.
Sandwich boards when business is low too.


I like the Discount coupons in a paper locally, never really thought about something like that. The big thing is my hubby is military and we are about to move again so I'm just planning on how to start back up (not that I really started in the first place) once we get to where we are going.

[amfoto1]

Hi,

I now do photography full time. But my previous, 21-year career and college degree were in advertising. Other posts have offered a lot of good ideas. Perhaps I can add a little.

First, as has been suggested, very carefully define what you are trying to accomplish. This may be bringing in new customers or retaining existing ones. You might be busy as the proverbial one-armed wallpaper hanger part of the year, bored to tears other months and wanting to try to even out the work load over the course of the year. Other goals might be to increase your visibility, establish your image as a professional and/or increase top of mind awareness. The approach you take needs to be tailored to achieve these goals. You will probably end up with a multi-pronged approach, perhaps directed at achieving several goals.

It can be very illuminating to analyze the customers you currently have coming in and decide if they are what you want and need more of, or if you want to redirect your business in some ways. This will also help you define your target audience and determine what forms of advertising will likely work best to effectively and efficiently reach them.

Next develop a plan and establish a budget that will allow for a sustained effort. No plan or budget is ever totally set in stone, but it will help you map out where you are going and provide some guideposts along the way, at each of which you can decide if things are working out as you wanted, or if you need to tweak things a little.

Think in terms of a mix of advertising media. Also, advertising, PR, promotions and marketing all need to compliment each other. Design your business cards, signage, letterhead, print ads, websites, etc. along a similar unique theme, to help increase recognition. Do self-promotion, PR and other forms of marketing that tie in carefully to your advertising effort.

Think in the long term, not ad by ad. A single newspaper ad is unlikely to generate a ton of responses. Even a couple ads won't usually do the trick. You need to schedule a campaign over time. Advertising on TV, radio and in print all rely on repetition to build momentum over time. Budget for that, or you will waste your money. Some years ago I worked with a hardware store that placed a small "how to" ad on the same page of the local Sunday newspaper every week... and had done so since 1954. Talk about continuity! That wasn't the only advertising the store did, but the local folks new that ad well, looked for it each week and would have howled if it were ever discontinued. That hardware store was pretty much a household name in and around Boulder, Colorado.

Some thoughts about specific media:

Don't expect the phone to start ringing immediately after you put a sign on your car. It ain't gonna happen (and it might make your car more of a target for thieves, once they think there is a lot of expensive photo equipment inside). The car or truck can be a low cost, "rolling billboard" and may help - over time. But you need to realize its limitations. In traffic or even walking down the street people often don't have the opportunity to write down a phone number (or website url). Also, they are busy doing something else and their minds are very much preoccupied. So, even if you happen to be driving or parked right in front of someone who is looking for the services you offer, and happen to get their attention, the phone number (or url) will need to be very easily memorized, or you might be better off just emphasizing name recognition. I called the sign on a car a "rolling billboard" and it might share some things with actual billboards found beside our roads and highways. One rule of thumb for billboards was to use no more than five words.

When communicating in print, the actual print you choose can make a big difference. Don't write in all caps. It's harder to read and considered "yelling" by some people. Also use normal punctuation an grammar. It's reflects on your professionalism. Reverse type, white letters on a black background, is harder to read so only use it sparingly. Choose an easily read font like Arial, Helvetica, Courier, etc. Elaborate type fonts can make the message hard to read, too.

A photo or illustration can greatly help increase readership of your ad. Kids, puppies and kittens are some of the biggest eye-catchers! Color can really increase readership. Studies I've seen showed that a single (spot) color on an ad in a largely black and white newspaper results in 30% more people noticing the ad. Full process color produces a 50-60% increase. Color does add cost, though. In more colorful publications like magazines, it might even be more effective to run black and white ad, instead!

Select media carefully. If your target audience is people 50+ you probably won't want to buy spots on the local punk rock radio station! It's largely just common sense, but the same is true of most media. The sports section in the newspaper has different readers than the home and garden section, etc. There are 6000 consumer magazines, most area highly targeted. Radio and TV have very precise demographic data about who is listening and watching.

Websites are great and relatively low cost, but desperately need other media to drive traffic to them. Use websites to expand upon the messages in your other advertising. As a rule, a website cannot stand well on its own (the exception is if you offer something that's highly searched online, but you still need to be prominent in search results at the major search engines). Be sure to include your website url in all your print media. If it's very short and memorable, it can also be mentioned in radio and TV spots and included on signs. If it's long and complicated, forget it other than in print media and on your marketing materials.

A good website designer can suggest ideas how to increase the potential your site will show up prominently on search engines. You can also pay major search engines to list your site near the top. Finally, it's very important that a website be refreshed with new material regularly (referred to as "content") to encourage people to re-visit frequently, and hopefully bookmark it.

Check if media have have something tailored for you. For example, most newspapers run at least one "Bridal" special section each year. Great spot for a wedding photographer! Special sections like that are much more likely to be kept for a long time and reread, unlike the daily sections. Some yellow pages have specialized reference sections too.

Newspapers are largely "here today, gone tomorrow", but nowhere near as fleeting as TV and radio spots! The TV magazine in most newspapers have a one week lifespan. But, even in the daily sections, many newspapers publish engagement announcements, and an ad on that page or nearby may be perfect for the wedding photographer, if the newspaper will site an ad in a specific location like that.

One good way to get more mileage out of newspaper (and other print ads) is with a coupon. If, for example, you come up with some sort of introductory offer, tie it in to clipping and presenting the coupon. That way the add is more likely to get cut out of the paper or magazine and stuck to the customer's refrigerator door, where it will hang around to remind them until they get around to responding. Be sure to include an expiration date, say a month or so out. Realistically, be aware that large companies like Procter & Gamble who do lots and lots of couponing expect about a 3 to 5 percent return of coupons, and consider that good response. If running ads in several different media, encoding on coupons can help identify which is working best for you.

People love to get something for nothing. If you can offer something "free", it will almost always increase response. Many years ago I worked with a newly opened seafood market. In a newspaper coupon he offered a free "de-veiner" with each pound of fresh shrimp purchased. Now this was a silly little, red plastic tool used to prepare the shrimp, that probably cost him about 10 cents apiece. A pound of shrimp sold for $10. He gave away almost 400 of those things the first day after the ad appeared! He was happy. Customers were happy, too.

Besides "free", there are a number of words that can be used in ads to get more attention. "Fresh", "love", "you", "new", "best" are some examples. "Sale" and "save" are heavily overused and might be next to worthless.

The photographer seeking advertising and corporate business might look to specialty and business publications (Advertising Age, Wall Street Journal, or local business publications). But, they should probably also be doing more hand-shaking and face-to-face introductions. Sharing their portfolios, then following up with thank you notes and periodic direct mail pieces. How about producing a calendar and sending it out to ad agencies or business customers?

Yellow and white pages are useful, but only up to a point. Many advertisers overbuy space in yellow pages. Modest in-column listings properly located by category and alphabetically can often be just as effective or even more so than a big, multi-color, full-page ad that's a couple pages away. A budget for yellow pages may be better spent on multiple smaller listings under several appropriate categories, rather than one bigger ad. The phone book is still used heavily for reference, but more and more people rely on other sources: directory service via cell phones (411) and the Internet. Be sure to double check that your listings are correct, including calling directory service and looking it up online.

Direct mail has the potential to target an audience very carefully. This just comes down to developing or buying a mailing list that matches up well to your best prospective customer. The next trick is getting people to open the mail and look at it, not just toss it in the garbage unopened. (Hint: hand written addresses and real stamps on envelopes make them much more likely to get opened.)

As mentioned, other PR, promotion and marketing should tie in carefully with your advertising.

In terms of promotion, join relevant trade associations. There are a large number of photo-related associations on local, regional, national and international levels. The smaller local and regional ones are probably best for developing business leads. National and international associations are perhaps more about prestige.

But also look into organizations specific to certain industries or events. Here in the Bay Area, for example, we have an equine network made up of horse breeders, owners and people who provide horse-related products and services, including equine photographers. Someone who specializes in architectural photography might become a member of a local commercial real estate organization.

Once involved, think in terms of how you might partner up to the mutual benefit of the organization and your own self-promotion. Recently I met a photographer who specializes in cats. He's a member of the Cat Fanciers of America and each of the past 15 or more years has put together a calendar with 12 or 13 of his favorite photos from that year. It's sold as a charitable fund-raiser for the CFA, probably at little or no profit to him. I'm sure some customers come to him in hopes their cat will be featured, but more importantly the good will and recognition he gets in return are simply brilliant! He nearly always has a waiting line of customers at his booth at cat shows all around the country.

Yes, the Chamber of Commerce is a good possibility. By all means get involved in some networking and service organizations, if time allows. There are many possibilities: breakfast clubs, business owners, small business alliances, Junior Achievement, Kiwanis, the Elks, etc.

In some places you will find a "Welcome Wagon". These are sort of a hybrid of direct marketing , networking and advertising, offering information and a packet of materials for newcomers in the area. You can pay to have a coupon or flyer included in the packet, if new folks like these are a good target audience for you.

Get involved in something where your potential customers are active. Think creatively. A friend of mine who is a mortgage broker used to play upwards of 200 rounds of golf a year until health issues forced him to play less and his business simply took off to the point he didn't have time anyway. He went out alone as a "walk-on" and got added to a group of strangers, always on a weekday. Inevitably by the ninth hole he'd be asked "So, Gary, what do you do for a living that allows you time to play a lot of golf like this.", at which point he responds that he helps people with their mortgages and, of course, happens to have business cards to hand out. No sales pitch, just a brief mention, initial contact and then back to golf and pleasantries. The vast majority of his new business was found this way. Yes, he was able to write off his golf equipment and greens fees as business expenses. I just haven't figured out a way that golf might benefit a photographer... yet!

Perhaps you could write a column for the local newspaper, or teach a class at a local school, or give a seminar to raise awareness about and interest in your specialty. You'll get your name out at the same time, in close association with the services you offer. There's a local real estate broker who has a weekly 1/2 hour Q&A TV show here, that gets his name in front of a lot of people. A radio show might be an alternative. Or how about a blog on the Internet?

Some big mistakes in all forms of advertising: I've already mentioned not planning for the long run, putting all your budget into a single, brief effort. Add to that advertising the features of your business, not benefits for your customers. It's very important to advertise to the customer's point of view, tell them how they will benefit. This might be "Our portraits will give you a lifetime of wonderful memories", instead of "We're wonderful portrait photographers". Or, how about "Our 20 years experience assures you will get the very best." instead of "We've been in business 20 years."?

Many ads also fail to include a "call to action". This can be as simple as "Call today". Or, it might create more urgency with "Offer limited to the first 25 callers".

Have reasonable expectations. Advertising cannot make the sale or close the deal. It can simply create awareness and, hopefully, get people to make the initial contact. What you do with it from that point on is up to you. An auto dealer once told me the campaign I was running for him was "Bringing in way too many people, they're bothering my sales people and tying up all our demonstrator cars with test drives". Such a problem to have!

Be careful about timing. Too often I had advertisers tell me "January is our slowest month. That's when we want to advertise and get our customers to call or visit". Wrong! If their business is seasonally slow for good reason, they cannot "force" people to call and visit unless they offer something different and/or approach different potential customers. Ski areas don't promote to skiers and snow boarders in the summertime when there is no white stuff on the slopes. Instead, they might reach out to different potential customers who want to hike or mountain bike on the mountainside trails, or perhaps enjoy a sunset tram ride up to the restaurant at the top to enjoy the view.

The old adage is that the best advertising is word of mouth. That's true. But, A lot of people forget to ask for it! In follow up "thank you" letters to customers you can ask if they would refer a friend. You may make it worth their while by offering them something for the referral, perhaps "a free 8x10 with your next print order". If you direct mail a coupon to past customers, it might be a good idea to include a second coupon that they can give to a friend.

Speaking of mailings, maintain your customer database and work it regularly. Nothing intrusive or too frequent, or it might backfire. Just a "here's what's new with us" note occasionally or perhaps a Christmas or birthday card, occasionally a discount coupon or "preferred customer" offer. At retirement, doctors, dentists and even real estate brokers have been known to sell a large, well maintained customer database for thousands and even hundreds of thousands of dollars. Wouldn't that be nice?

Send press releases to the local media whenever you have something new to announce. These are most likely to be published by smaller publications. (Larger newspapers often end up cutting dozens or even hundreds of stories every day, for lack of space.) There is a bit of an art to writing a press release. Look for books about it at the local library.

Finally, there's no substitute for "face to face". Get out and meet people. Then your advertising, PR, promotion and marketing will remind them of you, and they will be more likely to call or visit when they need your services.

Cheers!

Alan Myers

[asdisc]

WOW that was one of the most interesting reads about advertising I've ever seen.

Nothing like a crash course in marketing that gives a nice overall approach to it. Thanks for taking the time to respond to my question.

[timbernet]

Other posts have offered a lot of good ideas. Perhaps I can add a little.


:shock: If that is adding a little, I would be scared to see what is a lot!

:-D Great post, a lot of good information in there.

[rhys]

This is one of the most interesting threads that I have ever encountered.

I went out and bought a DIY magnetic sign. I blew $40 on it and wish I hadn't as the lettering looks like crap. I'd have been better paying somebody else to do my signage for me!

[asdisc]

This is one of the most interesting threads that I have ever encountered.

I went out and bought a DIY magnetic sign. I blew $40 on it and wish I hadn't as the lettering looks like crap. I'd have been better paying somebody else to do my signage for me!



We just had a local graphics Design shop do it for us. It was under a 100 for both sides of the van with 2 inch letters, and we're getting the back of all our cars this week too.

[CannedHeat]

Amfoto1,

For all active in this thread and all future searchers/readers, thanks for spending a large chunk of your time producing a quality post to the benefit of all.

(P.S., welcome to potn.)

[Yuztoo]

Alan, it was a pleasure to read your post, thank you so much for taking the time to write it.



ps
When's your next seminar and could you please sign my book? ;)

[Banbert]

If your not on the first page of googles search results for "your area + photographer" etc then your wasting time and money on other forms of advertsiing because thats what you should be putting your efforts into.

We started up last year and before our referals started coming in virtually all our business was from adwords and organic search results .... there will be people in your area now searching for photographers and if your not listed high up in the search rankings then google adwords is a good way to present yourself to them whilst you work on your SEO.

We tried a few of the things that you have mentioned above when we first started up, most of whch we got nothing from, adwords and then organic search results is what brought in the business and the organic search results continue to bring in the business.

We dont use adwords any more because we have as much business as we want at the moment from referals, organic results, our blog and networking..... all of which are free and definitely the best way to get clients.

[S.Horton]

Huh. No mention of how to build by word-of-mouth..........

[rhys]

Huh. No mention of how to build by word-of-mouth..........

Quite honestly I don't think web advertising is really worthwhile. My opinion is that for photographers, people are more likely to ask people they know, attend trade fairs etc and look in the phonebook. The web is useful though as an online portfolio. Even then, nothing beats a real portfolio.

[Banbert]

Quite honestly I don't think web advertising is really worthwhile. My opinion is that for photographers, people are more likely to ask people they know, attend trade fairs etc and look in the phonebook. The web is useful though as an online portfolio. Even then, nothing beats a real portfolio.


Sorry but I think your living on another planet if you actually believe that.

100% referals is where most of us want to be with our business of course but when your first starting up (and particularly so if your competitively priced) then the web is an invaluable source of clients ..... weve booked about 40 weddings since we started up and the largest portion of that was from organic search results or adwords ..... and in our first few months when we started with zero clients adwords was the no. 1 source because we were still working on the SEO.

Lots of brides live away from where their friends live now or simply choose to find their own photographer and many of these start with a search on google, if your not on the front page in one way or another your missing out.

[RiveraRa]

craigslist?

[CannedHeat]

Quite honestly I don't think web advertising is really worthwhile.

As a person who has experience in this area working with customers ranging from small mom & pops to multi-million dolar corporations, I will also disagree with that.

Even if your website is nothing more than a common "brochure on glass" it can serve a very important purpose: as an augmentation to other, traditional advertising.

Whatever your method of traditional advertising: tv, radio, newspaper, magazines, phonebook, whatever, most would agree that contract ads can get expensive. The web allow the opportunity to cut back a little on the traditional advertising and say "see our website for more info." On the website you are afforded the opportunity to present examples, more detail, testimonies... whatever at a low price; a price that would be horrendously high if communicated via other, traditional media.

[rhys]

I respect the fact that a website can be a handy online portfolio although one is heavily dependent upon the accuracy of the viewer's monitor. In terms of using it for advertising I have yet to be convinced. Most of the people I meet would not use the internet for looking up a business. I certainly would not! It costs so little to put a website together and so many are clearly fraudulent. Websites, IMHO, rank alongside buying a 1D Mk 5 from a guy in Romania (who has an early sample) via ebay with payment via Western Union!


To put it another way... website visits never relate to sales. I have had websites for about 10 years and over 10 years they have resulted in maybe 3 sales. The publicity gained from them is largely worthless as the only people that have time to sit looking at websites all day are the people that have all day to look at websites - ie people with no money.

[CannedHeat]

To put it another way... website visits never relate to sales.

Perhaps it's not the web as an advertising medium, but rather your website that is not producing contacts/leads. These forums are full of many, many people who are gracious and willing to help. Consider putting it out there asking for critique and help. You'll probably get it. /Dan

[asdisc]

Quite honestly I don't think web advertising is really worthwhile. My opinion is that for photographers, people are more likely to ask people they know, attend trade fairs etc and look in the phonebook. The web is useful though as an online portfolio. Even then, nothing beats a real portfolio.



Almost every single thing I do from going to dinner to buying things for work, and for the kids or house is done online. I don't go by word of mouth from people to tell me what store to go to. I just do lots of research online, I google it and then look at the first page, and only the first page to see what I want spend my money on.

[rhys]

For better or worse, I had 3 signs made for my Xterra. They cost me $106 but if they result in a single booking, they'll have been worthwhile. Next I'll go for a business licence. When I get close to the booking time I'll get some insurance too.

[Banbert]

I respect the fact that a website can be a handy online portfolio although one is heavily dependent upon the accuracy of the viewer's monitor. In terms of using it for advertising I have yet to be convinced. Most of the people I meet would not use the internet for looking up a business. I certainly would not! It costs so little to put a website together and so many are clearly fraudulent. Websites, IMHO, rank alongside buying a 1D Mk 5 from a guy in Romania (who has an early sample) via ebay with payment via Western Union!

To put it another way... website visits never relate to sales. I have had websites for about 10 years and over 10 years they have resulted in maybe 3 sales. The publicity gained from them is largely worthless as the only people that have time to sit looking at websites all day are the people that have all day to look at websites - ie people with no money.

You seem to have quite a negative approach to the internet, not quite sure why that is or whether its the region that you live in but for me in the UK its by far my most powerful sales tool that generates well over 50% of my initital bookings and contributes quite a lot to my after the job revenue as well.

Sorry but classifying people who have time to look at websites as not having any money is just clueless. Virtually every single person I know uses the internet as part of their daily life for finding information or making purchases, the only 2 people I can think of who dont use it are my Grandparents who are in their 90's, and in their case a lot of the decisions and purchases made for them are made by my parents who both use the interent for a lot of these tasks. My mother is a real show of how far the internet 0has come, uptil a couple of years ago she hadnt used a PC at all .... these days she is buying and selling stuff every week on ebay, uploading her photos and printing them off via photobox, emailing me virtual cards, booking holidays online etc .. not bad for a 60+ year old.

Even with the referals that we have coming in now our last 5 bookings were all as a result of people that googled for us.

1. My main website is where people find me initially via google searches and links from other sites, they can see a lot of my work there presented in a nice way, it doesnt matter if their monitors not calibrated because they dont know any better so wont notice anything wrong unless its way out, in which case they will be used to seeing everything look funny anyway.

2. My blog is where people can see my most recent work and other stuff I post there. After a wedidng lots of guestsgo there to see the initial photos and slideshows that I load up there, this generates leads from them and the people they know.

3. We load our proofs up onto the web and people can buy them from a full service site that handles everything and we just get a cut of the money credited to our account, this has been a nice little added earner.

4. When we make our clients albums we load proofs onto our website for them to view and for their friends and family to view, they can order exra copies for anyone that wants one, parents quite often do.

5. I have an old internet community that I have been running for a lot of years and I run google ads on that and the revenue from that covers the whole of my hosting each month.

6. I use facebook to network with friends and clients and I think this will generate its own leads as my network grows.

7. I use youtube for hosting some videos of us working at weddings, hey yah never know that may generate some leads and its free so why not give it a go.

8. We will use whatever else comes along to promote ourselves, I am just a newbit at this is my first full year but I can see already that a large chunk of being successful is about marketing and the nets the place for that!

If your not reaping the benefits of the net I think you have to look at the presence you have on it.

[CannedHeat]

The publicity gained from them is largely worthless as the only people that have time to sit looking at websites all day are the people that have all day to look at websites - ie people with no money.

I did not see this until I read Banbert's excellent reply. To be honest, but diplomatic, this is a rather misinformed statement. The internet demographics are quite the opposite.

Are you familiar with the Pew Research Group? You may have read the name in the newspaper or heard it on the news. They are considered one of the main source-authorities on internet usage, demographic, and trend tracking. They are often quoted by newspapers and media outlets worldwide.

Perhaps it would benefit you and your future advertising efforts if you would go to this link (http://www.pewinternet.org/PPF/c/2/topics.asp)and spend ample time reading. It is a comprehensive report about all facets of internet usage and demographics. You will find that (quite the opposite to the statement you made) the internet demographic is exactly one you should be exploring.

[rhys]

I did not see this until I read Banbert's excellent reply. To be honest, but diplomatic, this is a rather misinformed statement. The internet demographics are quite the opposite.

Are you familiar with the Pew Research Group? You may have read the name in the newspaper or heard it on the news. They are considered one of the main source-authorities on internet usage, demographic, and trend tracking. They are often quoted by newspapers and media outlets worldwide.

Perhaps it would benefit you and your future advertising efforts if you would go to this link (http://www.pewinternet.org/PPF/c/2/topics.asp)and spend ample time reading. It is a comprehensive report about all facets of internet usage and demographics. You will find that (quite the opposite to the statement you made) the internet demographic is exactly one you should be exploring.

I had a software website with programming resource, information and software for sale. No software sold so I wrote a few utilities that programmers could use. They sold but not in quantities that merited writing more. I had some nice photos on sale. After a year and zero sales, I axed that site rather than pay an extra sub. In fact, I had so few views that I knew nobody was even looking at the photo sales site.

I have effectively a place marker for my sagephotoworld website that I might develop further.

Really I guess I should rename this thread or start another entitled starting a business. Thus I shall exit this thread and start another. Join me in my adventure....

[Banbert]

I had a software website with programming resource, information and software for sale. No software sold so I wrote a few utilities that programmers could use. They sold but not in quantities that merited writing more. I had some nice photos on sale. After a year and zero sales, I axed that site rather than pay an extra sub. In fact, I had so few views that I knew nobody was even looking at the photo sales site.

I have effectively a place marker for my sagephotoworld website that I might develop further.

Really I guess I should rename this thread or start another entitled starting a business. Thus I shall exit this thread and start another. Join me in my adventure....


The internet isnt some sort of magical device that creates money for people out of thin air, you have to have products that people want to buy in the first place, you have to market them properly to those people, you have to optimise your site to get the traffic so that those people can see your products .... in short its a great tool but just putting a website site up and then expecting sales to come rolling in isnt how it works.

[Yuztoo]

Almost every single thing I do from going to dinner to buying things for work, and for the kids or house is done online. I don't go by word of mouth from people to tell me what store to go to. I just do lots of research online, I google it and then look at the first page, and only the first page to see what I want spend my money on.


I agree whole heartidly with this statement, I too haven't made a purchase over $100 without first researching it online and also finding the best price.
Even if I then go out and buy it in the "real world" atleast I know what I want and how much it's worth.

Word of mouth IMO is overated, how often do you hear things recommended here on the forums, that are of little/no use to the OP?
People tend to recommend only what they know, and with something as "one off" as wedding photography what exactly are they comparing it too?

[Checkers Fan!]

If you are a legitimate business and conducting yourself in a professional manner, you have a business telephone line, right? If not, then you should get a commercial listing so that your kids don't answer the phone and so that you'll avoid all of the problems involved in using your home phone for business.

When you get the business listing (and phone service), your phone company's Yellow Pages will give you two or three one-line listings in addition to your listing in the business white pages. This will allow you to place a listing in two or three photography categories.

The Yellow Pages ad is essential. It is the first place people turn to when they start looking for most services. It also helps people to FIND YOU AGAIN if they lose your business card.

If you don't have the bucks for a 1/8 page listing to make the phone ring all day, a 1/2 inch listing as an alphapetical column insert may be enough for your business. The phone book is particularly useful to the less internet -savvy potential customer. You may be able to list your web address in a column ad. I am unsure because it has been awhile since I worked in that end of the photography industry.

Unfortunately, a web presence is essential these days, if for no other reason than to put some photos in front of the prospective client and to give him a better idea of who you are. I am sure that you can find a lot of people who can help you to increase and maximize your internet presence.

(It doesn't hurt to use your business name in a photography forum and offhandedly mention that you photographed the queen of England last week).

[rhys]

The QUeen of England? Well, I might have photographed John Mellor, MP :p

[canuck88]

Word of mouth. Period. (this includes internet word of mouth on forums, etc)

Do good work, treat your clients properly, and work will continue to pour in.

It's a slow start, but IMO the best way to build long-term growth.

PS - word of mouth also includes exposure - get involved with your chamber of commerce, etc. Get out and meet people!

[S.Horton]

^^ The world is run by the people who show up.

The Web of Word of Mouth is a consumer behavior notion.

It operates in roughly an 8:1 ratio, with bad comments moving 8x as fast as good comments. (Varies by industry, geography, culture, so fellow biz people hold your pounce)

So, to cement your point, protect that reputation, be fair, be honest, at all times.

BTW, although not directly related to this thread, it is somewhat reasonable, when inspecting anectodal comments on POTN, to either divide the count of negative comments by 8 or multiply the number of positive by 8 to get a somewhat more accurate idea of a trend. By way of example, if people polled said 10 to 500 that their Canon purchase was 'bad', you could assume it is roughly 400 to 1 positive ( 8x500 to 10). To bring that back on topic, consumers tend to provide 8 times the weight of a positive comment by a friend vs. any negative comment heard or seen. More cement; build and protect your professional reputation at all times.

...still no mention of how to build that web on this thread. Interesting.