Using a gel on flash to match color temp.

[s8langwo]

I haven't seen many references to this topic to I'm posing it to the forum.

Do you use a gel strip attached to your flash to bring the color temperature of the flash closer to the ambient light source? The benefit would be similar to using fill flash in daylight. Exposing for the ambient background while featuring the subject in the foreground in similar color temperatures.

Thanks in advance.
Kevin

[Wilt]

I have a warming gel on my flash!

[John Mireles]

I don't. I actually like the underexposed, warm colors of background when I'm shooting with flash.

John

[tim]

I don't, but if I had a gel and some way to attach it easily i'd probably do it from time to time.

[suyenfung]

this is something i am going to experiment with in the off season. i would like to be able to gel the flash so tungsten goes blue. cool background and warm subject is something i see all the time in cinema and it always looks great. my concern is flash power, the deep red required to do this would have to reduce output by 2-3 stops. just another reason to get a dedicated external battery thingy.

[picturecrazy]

I don't, but if I had a gel and some way to attach it easily i'd probably do it from time to time.

ditto... an EASY and secure method of attaching a gel is the only thing that keeps me from using them. Otherwise they're a PITA.

I would love to use gels for better colour balance.

[Curtis N]

Velcro works for me.

[tim]

Funny, my gels don't stick to velcro :p

[jamiewexler]

I just use tape to secure the gel. They are taped to the back when i don't need them and taped to the front when needed. I'm with John on this one, though. The one time I gelled my flash, I found that the color was too well matched and I missed the warmer backgrounds... I think I need 1/2 cto gels.

[JustinL]

I used to do the same method Curtis described, but if I wanted to use a flash modifier I was stuck because the velcro was in the way.

[Curtis N]

I have never felt handicapped by the inability to put tupperware on my flash.

Incidently the velcro was originally for a Lumiquest Promax System. It also works fine for the Lumiquest Softbox, a simple bounce card, gels or a spare tennis shoe.

[mckc]

Yup...i use simple gaffer tape to hold it on both sides...dont know what I do without a gel.

[Wilt]

I have a warming gel on my flash!

I have a 1/4 DTO on my flash at all times, not so much to 'match the ambient' but simply to warm up the otherwise coolish electronic flash a touch. It complements the bride's face better, IMHO. I merely sandwich it in between the wide angle lens attachment of the Metz 45CL flash and its regular lens. Or apply it to the front of my Metz 54MZ with little bit of tape along the edges.

[cprofit]

I also standardly use a 1/4 CTO on my flash to warm up the subject. I keep my WB set to auto, shoot in RAW, and the (off camera) flash is on manual so the the camera isn't correcting for it's color. I can correct the ambient WB in PP, which is harder to control so I'm not even trying in PP, but my subject usually has a nice warm cast and not the blue/whitish cast of an electronic flash. While I usually use the flash in manual, the times I've used a CTO gel'd flash in TTL w/ the WB has been set based on ambient, so in camera WB settings using TTL didn't seem to be 'fooled' by my foreground gelling.

I sometimes find my 1/4 a bit too warm, so I'd like to get an 1/8th CTO, as I'd prefer gels effecting skin to be more subtle. The 1/4 CTO eats up about 1/3 of a stop, which isn't much of an issue.

For attachment I use a 5" long gel, with pieces of velcro applied to my flash side like Curtis's flash, but not all the way around. I've used velcro 'dots' on the actual gel, and used a hole punch through one dot on each gel. I put the hole there so I can store each gel set on a binder clip, which helps make sure that when I take X flashes on location I take X number of gels too. Also, when applying the velcro to the flash I set it low enough (5" gels allows this) so that I can still fit my stofen ominbounce on the top of the flash. With the velcro applied low enough, I still have ample room to still maintain the flavor seal, and maximum freshness, of my flashmounted tupperware. :)

Here is an example of the effect of using the 1/4 CTO. I believe I shot in Av mode and underexposed the ambient by around a stop?


http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1131/1319787035_5aeb6ff3c8.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/cprofit/1319787035/" title="Photo Sharing)

[John Mireles]

What is a DTO? There's color temprature orange (CTO) and color temprature blue (CTB), but I can't figure out what a DTO is.

John

[John Mireles]

I sometimes find my 1/4 a bit too warm, so I'd like to get an 1/8th CTO, as I'd prefer gels on the subject and effecting skin to be more subtle. I'd recommend a bastard amber gel. It's not as orange as the CTO and looks great on skin.

John

[suyenfung]

i should have mentioned that i did the paper clip thing shown in this thread -

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=205509

i used electrical tape for a stealth look. it works fine and after ten weddings the clips are still in place.

instead of trying to get the free swatch book at b&h which is never in stock, i paid a couple bucks per book at adorama.

i agree that matching color temperature is a little boring, but using them to achieve creative coloring is definitely worth exploring.

[cprofit]

I'd recommend a bastard amber gel. It's not as orange as the CTO and looks great on skin.

John

Thanks John - I'll definitely check it out. :)

[picturecrazy]

I've thought abou velcro and tape and such... but in reality, running like a madman everywhere in a wedding, my gear isn't exactly treated delicately. tape and velcro would likely get shredded and ripped the way I use stuff. Not to mention, for the last 5 weddings or so I've been shooting in pouring rain... not that I'd use gels in rain but the adhesive velcro would likely weaken considerably being soaked over and over.

Which is why I've been searching high and low for a PROFESSIONAL, robust gel attachment solution.

I've been considering buying the gary fong whaletale with it's gels, and just hacking off the big whaletail part and only using the gel holder.

Other than that, I've not seen a single pro solution for gelling a 580.

[John Mireles]

instead of trying to get the free swatch book at b&h which is never in stock, i paid a couple bucks per book at adorama.You should be able to call www.rosco.com and get them to send you a stack of swatch books for free. I was poking through their web site and came across this page that has all of their gels online: http://www.rosco.com/us/filters/roscolux.asp

John

[cprofit]

I've thought abou velcro and tape and such... but in reality, running like a madman everywhere in a wedding, my gear isn't exactly treated delicately. tape and velcro would likely get shredded and ripped the way I use stuff. Not to mention, for the last 5 weddings or so I've been shooting in pouring rain... not that I'd use gels in rain but the adhesive velcro would likely weaken considerably being soaked over and over.

Which is why I've been searching high and low for a PROFESSIONAL, robust gel attachment solution.

I've been considering buying the gary fong whaletale with it's gels, and just hacking off the big whaletail part and only using the gel holder.

Other than that, I've not seen a single pro solution for gelling a 580.

Why not just carry an extra couple pieces of velcro and/or some gaffers tape? There are two parts to fail, either the velcro or the adhesive.

Adhesives: While the adhesives may not have an outstanding lifecycle, it seems like it's shortcomings could be fixed quite rapidly in a pinch. I figure the adhesive is more likely to fail, and if it does a new piece of velcro could be placed on it pretty quickly, or a piece of gaffers tape could get you through the event. Sometimes I just take a couple feet of gaffers tape with me. It's amazing how many uses you can find for it, and a couple of feet folded on itself fits quite well in the pocket.

Velcro: I've never had a problem with velcro not holding gels after a while. Sure it's not the best substance for holding down items with any weight, but the gel doesn't need that much stickiness to stay in position.

While both solutions may not be 'professional', I'm not seeing a whole lot of other 'professional' alternatives, though I admittedly haven't looked into Mr. Fong's Tail. Also, I see a whole lot of 'pros' with velcro smattered flashes, so it seems like it may not be perfect but it does work. :)

[Curtis N]

Lloyd,

Those gels and adhesive velcro are tougher than you might think! It really takes some effort to peel the gel off my flash when I'm done with it. And I've seen adhesive velcro hold up well, even when drenched.

Lacking a ready-made alternative, I do think it's worth a try.

[picturecrazy]

I had a tiny lumiquest softbox that velcros onto my 580. After a couple rainy shoots the velcro fell off, so I haven't used it since. Which is why I want to try something different than adhesives.

In fact, I want something just like this: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/52902-REG/Sunpak_1167_FK_6_Filter_Kit.html

hard plastic gels that wont rip, and can be directly attached to a flash with no adhesives. Very quick to remove and put in. Much smaller chance of damage. Little to no chance of having to perform emergency repairs. I just with they made something like this for the 580.

I just know from past experiences, my DIY solutions don't stand up to the rigors of pro use and end up being more of a pain more than anything else.

[mmahoney]

There is this clear goop they use to attach your new credit card to the paper page which is a low-tack adhesive.

Not sure what it's called but I'm sure if you ran a thin bead of it over the outside edges of the gel it would hold to a flash head fine, plus it could be re-used a lot before losing it's adhesion.
Mike

[s8langwo]

Thanks for all of your responses.

When time permits this weekend, I'm going to play with an 85B gel to drop the flash temp to about 3200K. What prompted the purchase of the gel was the desire to improve flash images inside of a large church sanctuary. I often would have the subject exposed for flash and the ambient tungsten lighting at about 0.5 to 1 stop underexposed. My past attempts have not been very pretty as the two light sources are too far apart.

I'll try capturing some images after Sunday's services to show before and after if anyone is interested.

Kevin

[Wilt]

What is a DTO? There's color temprature orange (CTO) and color temprature blue (CTB), but I can't figure out what a DTO is.

John


'DTO' is the result of a brain fart...I only put it on my flash almost two decades ago, so forgot its name! In fact, I'm not even certain it is 1/4...it could be 1/8 !

I just found my swatch book and both the 1/4 CTO and 1/8 CTO are missing from it! So I just looked at my Metz flash units and verify that one of them is on one flash, and the other one is on the other flash!

[Jon Rouston]

I laminate mine to make them more robust. I have velcro on the flash head and attach velcro to the other side as well.

Will post some pics up when I get home (if I remember)