9 year old soccer - FIrst sports photos C&C requested

[cdc]

I took these at my son's soccer game yesterday (he is the one in blue and white) and wanted to get some advice on what could be improved. Taken with digital rebel and canon 75 - 300 f/4.0 set at 80 mm, iso 100, 1/250, f/6.3. The light was rather harsh as well (cloudless sky at high noon). I did some minor pp (crop, curves, saturation, and sharpness).

This is my first real attempt at sports photos of any kind so I would be very happy to hear anyones advice on how to improve with the shot or the PP. I personally think that the focus is not as sharp as it could have been and maybe I needed a slightly faster shutter speed.

Thanks

[cdc]

two more

[SuzyView]

Honestly, these look like they came out of the CF card not very sharp and you tried to sharpen, but got very flat edges.

The settings are okay, but should open up to f4 and at 1/500 to not get blur. That lens 70-300 is not such a great lens, as much as stores like Best Buy will tell you. My neighbor bought it with her Xti and couldn't figure out why all her pictures are so blurry. And you get what you pay for in this case. If I were you and I was trying to do sports with fast little feet going, I would definitely get the 85 1.8 ($330) and see what that does for you. Rent one if you can.

[cdc]

You are correct in the fact that they came out of the camera a little less sharp then i would have liked. I will try it out at 1/500 and see what I get next weekend.

Thanks for the comment. I plan on investing in better lenses as soon as I can but it is not in my budget for the moment and I just have to work with what I got. :)

[eigga]

As posted already you need a faster shutter speed. In full sunlight you should have no problem reaching 1000 even with your lens. Dont be afraid to bump up the ISO to make sure to reach this. You will be fine up to 400 ISO with your camera. Also get a monopod and shoot from your knees.



Lastly keep practicing and posting, much better than my first try!

[Big Hands]

As posted already you need a faster shutter speed. In full sunlight you should have no problem reaching 1000 even with your lens. Dont be afraid to bump up the ISO to make sure to reach this. You will be fine up to 400 ISO with your camera. Also get a monopod and shoot from your knees.

Lastly keep practicing and posting, much better than my first try!

I agree with this and would add to shoot in portrait orientation so you can zoom in tighter. This will give you some more pixels to work with so you can crop them even tighter in post process.

If you plan to keep that body for a while, I would seek to add a battery grip to make shooting vertical much easier. They can be found in used condition for not too much, but you do have to jump on them quickly as they go fast.

Regards,
Jeff

[vetkrazy]

You gotta have a faster shutter. Like said above don't be afraid to go to iso400 and shoot from your knees or sitting on your butt. Also get your lens wide open. In the first two posted they need to be cropped tighter, get rid of the wasted space to the left of the action. The second two could be cropped vertical just on the the two boys fighting for the ball, would be a more dramatic picture.Time to start saving up for that 70-200:lol::lol::lol:

[cdc]

Thanks again for all of the feedback. Saving up for a better lens is in the works but it will take some time (already have the battery grip though). The good news is that we have another game this weekend so I will try out some of the suggestions and see where that gets me.

[superdiver]

If I have decent light I like to use my 170-500 sigma lens. Ilike the extra long reach, but its not really considered a spor tlens. Its my birding lens....LOL

If you are going to be shooting on days with les light look at something like a 70-200 2.8 its reach is short for regular soccer fields, but your son will probaboly be playing on small fields for a couple more years.

I like to shoot in Av and adjust my ISO so that I have a ss of at least 1/500 and I shoot as wide open (low f-stop number) as possible to isolate the subject.

Shoot in RAW and use a CWB, it will help your pictures look alot better, also crop alot tighter.

Here are some examples, note these are not very good compared to most of the sport shooters on here, but you will get the idea...

http://superdiver.smugmug.com/photos/190681951-L.jpg

http://superdiver.smugmug.com/photos/187929980-L.jpg

http://superdiver.smugmug.com/photos/187934024-L.jpg


And, like any proud dad, here is my son....
http://superdiver.smugmug.com/photos/187937289-L.jpg

[cdc]

Ok. got a chance to go out last weekend and try again. This is about a 50% crop taken at 1/800 f5.6. This game was earlier in the morning so the light wasn't as harsh but we were facing into the sun and i though it might be considered rude to go to the other side of the field :) I didn't do much pp to it other then some curves adjustment and a little saturation boost.


As always c&c appreciated and encouraged.

Thanks

[nicmo]

This pix is definitely better than your first series, still a bit soft, but getting there. I would also say you cropped a bit too tight as you cut the ball and part of the foot off. Also watch your backgrounds, the vehicle's reflecting in the sun light, can be very distracting in an images.

You might want to try shooting from the endlines as well. As long as you are not distracting or getting in the way of the goalie, players, refs, or coaches most refs will leave you alone. If you want to play it safe you can always ask the ref before the start of the game. I have never had an issue with a ref in soccer, but if one did have an issue I would comply and do as they ask.

Keep up the good work and keep shooting.

[superdiver]

Much better...

1)I would get my back to the son, you have a camera, the other people wont care, besides its a FREE COUNTRY....LOL..as long as you are not obnoctious about it...LOL

2)only worry about players coming at you when you can see thier faces, except your own kids then spray and prey, they are yours after all you you are DUE all the pictures you want of them....LOL...for the other kids be sure to get thier faces, dont waist you computer space with pictures of other kids that are anything less then what you want...LOL

3)work on focusing and getting clean crisp shots...you are so close...keep practicing!

[Michael_Lambert]

For shooting sports expecially faster moving games like Soccer, you really are going to need a brighter / faster lens!

The shot was taken of a cousin during sunset pretty harsh lighting taken with a 30D 70 - 200 2.8L.

More can be seen here - I am no means great at it just started photographing soccer myself this summer.

http://www.bradfordsoccer.michaellambert.ca/soccer.html

[vetkrazy]

Don't worry about shooting from the others side line, I have done it for years. What normally happens is someones asks if I am from the paper and I say no just shooting my granddaughter. We then talk about grandkids and cameras and we can both go away smiling.

[cdc]

Thanks again for all of the comments and suggestions. As for a tight crop, the ball didn't quite make it all the way in the pic (I was just not quick enough) and I was trying to crop out the part of the kid that was in the left of the pic because it just looked funny....I realize it is not the best example but wanted to get some feedback and it was about all i had. I also realize I need a new lens but it is not in the budget for now.

I think next time I will take your advice of not worrying about shooting from the other side of the field though. Most of the shots came out with some pretty bad hot spots.

Again, thanks for the C&C. It is helping tremendously and I will keep trying to get the best I can with the equipment I have.

[Vigants]

I started with a 70-300 when my daughter was that age and found that except for early morning and late afternoon games I could get very acceptable results by bumping up the ISO and maintaining a shutter speed of at least 1/500. The next year I found that the speed of play increased and the field got larger and my success rate went down, so upgraded to a 70-200 f/2.8 + 1.4x TC. Big improvement in picture quality. Now I would really like a 120-300 f/2.8 but cannot justify the extra $$$ easily. Along the way I tried out some slower, super zoom lenses and came to the conclusion that I'd rather have a fast, shorter lens and crop harder than a long slow lens. If you don't get a good image to start with you cannot really fix it later - and you need either lots of light or a fast lens to make that good image.

[dmwierz]

C,

You've gotten some good advice here.

Let me second the comments on cleaning up your backgrounds. Aside from opening up your lens (which will help further blur the stuff in the background), moving to get a better background can make a HUGE difference. Almost all folks starting out forget all about clean backgrounds and then wonder why their shots still don't "look right" when in fact, they'd look much better had they only moved 20 feet to the left or right. Also, getting lower can clean things up.

Keep on learning. Your shots show improvement. I look forward to seeing your next bunch.

Dennis

[Vigants]

Also, getting lower can clean things up.

Dennis, I am curious about the shooting lower issue. I have heard and read this many times and I have brought a stool several times, but always end up standing - too excited to sit quietly. Besides, with the average shot being 50-100 feet away a difference of 2' of camera elevation makes a difference of about 1 degree of shooting angle. Certainly with very young children on small fields it is important - but the kids are smaller and the shots a lot closer. Our 12/13 year olds are mostly around 5'. Am I not understanding this fully?

[eigga]

Dennis, I am curious about the shooting lower issue. I have heard and read this many times and I have brought a stool several times, but always end up standing - too excited to sit quietly. Besides, with the average shot being 50-100 feet away a difference of 2' of camera elevation makes a difference of about 1 degree of shooting angle. Certainly with very young children on small fields it is important - but the kids are smaller and the shots a lot closer. Our 12/13 year olds are mostly around 5'. Am I not understanding this fully?


Sitting on a stool may not be low enough. I'm sure Dennis will have a great response as to why but take a look at any pro game and you will see them sitting or on a knee so it must do something.

[Vigants]

Sitting on a stool may not be low enough. I'm sure Dennis will have a great response as to why but take a look at any pro game and you will see them sitting or on a knee so it must do something.

I'm not questioning the wisdom - just trying to understand the why behind it. I'm have trouble figuring out why a 1 degree change should make much of a difference.

[superdiver]

Its a matter of 1 degree over a large distance...actually going from a stool to sitting or laying on the ground is a bit more the one degree, but for arguments sake lets say 1 degree.

draw a angle at 1 degree and extrapolate that out over 100 feet. It makes a big difference. Now make that a 3 or 4 degree or even a 10 degree angle...its huge....

[dmwierz]

Dennis, I am curious about the shooting lower issue. I have heard and read this many times and I have brought a stool several times, but always end up standing - too excited to sit quietly. Besides, with the average shot being 50-100 feet away a difference of 2' of camera elevation makes a difference of about 1 degree of shooting angle. Certainly with very young children on small fields it is important - but the kids are smaller and the shots a lot closer. Our 12/13 year olds are mostly around 5'. Am I not understanding this fully?

Getting low does more then bring out the eyes. It also results in you shooting upwards, which can clean up backgrounds enough to make a difference. However, it's normally done to increase your chances of getting good shots of faces, and it also makes the players look "larger than life" (at the college and pro levels) or at least not so tiny (at the youth level).

I have knee pads I almost always use, and will even end up on my butt in some events (pro, college or youth). The only downside to this, and mostly this is important when shooting the "big kids" is it somewhere restricts your mobility and your ability to get out of the way if a big human comes your way.

Even from a distance of 50-100 feet (don't forget to wait for the action to come closer if you want REAL keepers) getting low can make a difference.

[Vigants]

Getting low . . . bring out the eyes . . . clean up backgrounds . . . good shots of faces . . . players look "larger than life" Dennis:

All good reasons to shoot low (except I'm not sure I want my little girl to look "larger than life" - she is growing up too fast as it is!). I tried sitting the last two weekends but was unlucky in that the play seemed concentrated far away from wherever I went (some days are like that) and my gear was in the shop (front focus issue) so I was shooting a borrowed camera with a slow lens. My gear should arrive home today so this weekend I'll give it another try.

I just spent some time looking at your galleries - you have wicked good timing! I am wondering what you have to say about Sigma versus Canon AF speed. I shoot a Sigma 70-200 now but have been told that the Canon version of this lens has much faster AF. Also I find for soccer 200mm (on a 20D) is a too short, so when light permits I use a 1.4xTC. I sometimes toy with upgrading to the 120-300 but not sure if that will make me happier or just poorer. Since you have a full stable of lenses (and clearly know what you are doing) I'd appreicate any insight/advice.

John

[spsmith]

One other thing to consider with youth - since most of them are right footed and haven't developed their left yet, the action will usually go down the right side and then cut to the middle.

For ball handling pictures with faces, I have found the right end line is a good place to be, but it's bad for shots on goal since you end up seeing their backs. For shots on goal and midfield passing, the left end line is better, but there may be more bodies in the way.

Anyway, I just started shooting kids soccer a few weeks ago and have a ton of back pictures, now I am trying to get more faces!!

[jdando]

Lots of good comments here that I can apply to my youth soccer games. When shooting with XT what is the "best" focus method? AI servo or?

jeremy

[Vigants]

Lots of good comments here that I can apply to my youth soccer games. When shooting with XT what is the "best" focus method? AI servo or? jeremy

I've been trying to figure that out (reading and testing) for a long time. Conclusion I've come to is that while on paper it is AI Servo, in practice I seem to get more keepers using One Shot and continually refocussing by half pressing the shutter button.

I suspect that the One Shot method forces to camera to register on what I have acquired at the moment right before I want to shoot whereas with the AI Servo mode you are relying on the camera to have continually tracked the subject you originally locked in on.

So when/if AI Servo works that is great, but any glitch in the camera tracking that original target and only God knows what you are focussing on . . .

Maybe some more expeienced folks can chime in and set me straight if I am off base.