Image appearance PSE2 vs Internet Explorer

[ejwebb]

I have been experimenting with color management - not much fun. I ran Adobe Gamma and process my photos in Elements 2 until they are satisfactory - usually curves and USM - maybe a little saturation.

Anyway, I get them the way I want them to look, save JPEG files and then load to a photo blog site. Before Adobe Gamma my pictures looked the same in the web browser as they did in PSE2 - but now they are significantly lighter in the browser. The images still look correct on my work computer (consistent with the PSE2 presentation) which does not have Adobe Gamma. Any thoughts on why this is occurring?

I know you may need more details so let me know if you do - there are just so many things to consider when dealing with color management that I am at a bit of a loss to understand what is happening with the way my images are being displayed in the applications.

Thanks.

[Jesper]

Well, the whole colour management thing can become complicated...

I don't know exactly how well PS Elements supports ICC profiles, but Internet Explorer certainly doesn't.

First of all: what is your working colour space set to in PS Elements? It should be set to sRGB (or Adobe RGB). Do NOT set your working space to the monitor ICC profile, otherwise PS Elements will save your images in the device-dependent colour space of your monitor. With PS Elements, sRGB would be the best choice. (Unfortunately, PS Elements does not have to feature to convert from one colour space to another - it always saves your images in the working space you set).

For the web, you want to save your images in sRGB, which is a colour space that's supposed to match "the average monitor". That means that with sRGB, in non-colour managed applications like Internet Explorer, you'll have the best chance that the images look correct. However, if your monitor's native (device-dependent) colour space is significally different from sRGB, you'll see differences.

This is what I always write when someone writes (s)he has used Adobe Gamma: If you really want to calibrate and profile your monitor accurately, get a calibration device such as a Spyder (http://www.colorvision.com) or Eye One (http://www.gretagmacbeth.com/index/products/products_color-mgmt-spec.htm). Software-only solutions (where you use your own eyes to "measure" the colours) are not anywhere near as accurate as those devices. Your eyes quickly adapt to colour casts so that you won't even notice them, and how you see colours depends on many things - the ambient light, what you've been looking at the last few minutes, if you're tired etc. I used to use Adobe Gamma, but the profile I've made with my Spyder is MUCH more accurate.

p.s. If you do get a device, make sure to disable Adobe Gamma by deleting it from the Start / Programs / Startup menu (in Windows), otherwise it will interfere with the software that came with your calibration device.

[John_T]

I might mention that the Monaco Optix XR and XR Pro are currently considered to be at the top of the heap for monitor calibrating.

http://shop.colourconfidence.com/product.php?xProd=1067&xSec=56

I've been using the Colorvision Spyder Pro for a while now, and though it is probably a mediocre ok, I don't feel it is cutting it, so I have just ordered the Monaco EZcolor 2.6/Optix XR Pro bundle.

[ejwebb]

Thanks, guys. Advice is all over the place on this stuff and I have tried several suggestions and read several articles but am still totally confused by it all!

I know the best option is to purchase hardware and software and Photoshop CS in order to really get this right but i am just a hobbyist and just can't spend $600 for this right now and am trying to make the best of what I have. I actually like the prints better than the monitor presentation. Maybe I am better off to just dump Adobe Gamma and hope for the best when I print - realizing that the prints are a bit darker and shifted more to red than the screen presentation which is shifted brighter and more to green.

Jesper - I have been unable to find how to select color space in Elements (maybe you can't?) but I think it is set to sRGB with a bunch of numbers following it (not just RGB) because that is the profile it wants to use when I save JPEG's. I usually uncheck the box when saving - not sure if I should or not.

My original images say they are in RGB color space out of the camera but they also list "EXIF color space" as sRGB which seems inconsistent but I don't know what to do about it.

Elements does seem to allow more control over color management when printing and I am using printer color management and turning ICM on in the print driver (Canon S820) for better results.

I know it is hard to give advise on this issue as it is something everyone has to work through to some extent but thanks for listening and providing suggestions that you can!

[John_T]

Actually output to screen and output to printer should be considered as two independent and unconnected functions. If your prints are coming out right, that means that output function is working properly, so don't mess with it. Getting your screen to more or less match the print output simply enables you to make adjustments to an image and have those adjustments be accurately reflected in the print.

Web is another output form that can as well be considered independent from screen and print. For this use Save for Web where you can make some adjustments including Use Document Profile. It hides behind that little arrow at the upper right opposite the Help button. You can also check ICC Profile, making sure it is sRGB.

Check this site out regarding web viewing:

http://www.gballard.net/psd/srgbforwww.html

[scottbergerphoto]

Jesper - I have been unable to find how to select color space in Elements (maybe you can't?) but I think it is set to sRGB with a bunch of numbers following it (not just RGB) because that is the profile it wants to use when I save JPEG's. I usually uncheck the box when saving - not sure if I should or not.[/quote ]

In Photoshop Elements 2.0 you need to select Color management:
Edit>Color Settings> Check off Full Color Management. This will allow PSE2 to recognize embedded color profiles.

[quote]Elements does seem to allow more control over color management when printing and I am using printer color management and turning ICM on in the print driver (Canon S820) for better results.
In File>Print Preview>Check Show More Options>Color Management you will see your source space as the embedded profile of the image. The Print Space selection should be the ICC profile for the printer ink and paper you are using or select Printer Color Management from the pull down menu.

You don't need to do anything about your monitor profile once it is created and saved in the correct directory. Windows uses it in the background.
Regards,
Scott

[ejwebb]

Scott

Thanks for the advise but I was confused by your wording below - should Full Color Management be checked or not checked?

[/quote] Check off Full Color Management. [quote]

I was under the impression that Full Color Management only impacted the embedding of profiles in the file once it is saved, not the recognition of the profiles already in the files - is this not the case?

I will look into profiles for the inks & paper and how to use them. I use Canon inks and Photo Paper Pro.

[scottbergerphoto]

Turn on color management by putting a check in the box next to it. You can't assign or convert files to profiles in PSE2, but you can use the profile it already has. When you open a file with a profile in PSE2 it doesn't tell you it's there until you go into (1) File>Save As. There will be a choice to check off that allows you to keep the profile(check it) or (2) File>Print Preview, under Other Options you should see the profile as the Source.
Regards,
Scott