450D/XTX rumors?

[sonofjesse]

450D/XTX rumors?

This camera should be coming in the next 4 months I'm guessing, what are the specs anybody hear anything?

[Collin85]

What I anticipate:

DIGIC III
10/12MP
Live View
Highlight priority
ISO 3200
Larger LCD

I heard a few places mention swivel-screen and movie mode too. If that's the case, I'm definitely buying one.

The 40D's AF would be nice, but I doubt Canon would do that.

[Adamora]

Links please :/

[Redsnapper]

It'd be interesting if Canon ended up crossing into the 40D's market range like they did before. I see a few others here and elsewhere think they'd be more careful about that kind of thing again. The only problem is that there's not a lot of room to move.

Considering the market for the Rebel a swivel screen and movie mode isn't a bad idea. A lot of the cameras that people would be upgrading from or may even be considering instead would have these features. They could add a lot of those kinds of features from the non-SLR market to make it look more of a worthwhile step in the series as far as "added features" while not stepping on the 40D's toes and still making it look more attractive to a new buyer. I think if Canon pulled something like that it would also help distinguish the Rebel and the xxD lines more in the future (add more low end camera/consumer style features to the Rebels and more trickle down from above of semi-pro/pro type features to the xxD) and reduce the chances of them competing with each other at all. A good entry level DSLR with all the features of the compacts could be very tempting to people and might make them move up that price bracket.

Perhaps Canon will manage to surprise everyone again with the next launch. They so often do. Keeps things interesting.

If anyone gets good reliable leaks or info, then that would be nice to see. There's a never ending tide of speculation passed off as leaks and edited photos pretending to be new models!

[sonofjesse]

Thansk guys. I just see sony http://www.sony.net/Products/dslr/

There having IS inthe body it looks like and up to 6400 ISO. And The rebel has no stock IS and the lenses are high and ISO 1600. So to the avg person they might lose bussines. I think they need to do a good one to compete wtih everybody.

Any rumors on dates? I would like to have a new body.

[Collin85]

Thansk guys. I just see sony http://www.sony.net/Products/dslr/

There having IS inthe body it looks like and up to 6400 ISO. And The rebel has no stock IS and the lenses are high and ISO 1600. So to the avg person they might lose bussines. I think they need to do a good one to compete wtih everybody.

Any rumors on dates? I would like to have a new body.

Uh.. the A700 isn't in the same price range as the Rebel series.. so I don't see how to the 'average person' Canon would lose business. To the average person, price is arguably one of the most important factors - the A700 has a RRP of more than $100 over the 40D.

[wernersl]

and in-body IS is a joke

[_aravena]

And we're talking about Sony. What is their need for overpricing? Stupid marketing as well with consumer reports. I had a lady come int he other day saying consumer reports show...some $400 Sony P&S is great. For one, i hope so for that price, but for 2, taking pictures there and then, they sucked. Idk, people see something and that's how it goes.

Canon has no worries. They will still sell and still win with the pros. One pro buys a 300 F2.8 IS, think how many rebel's you could buy. Besides, in body IS, from what I've heard from most sellers is that it does suck. I've had one salesperson try to tell me otherwise.

But don't forget, probably 4fps. Can't stay at 3 forever, especially since the 40D went up. Still, might be interesting. IF it is, then I'll swap my 20D for one as a back up. I like the smaller size for certain things. I thought of getting an XT anyhow.

[wernersl]

i could see it being benificial up to about 50 maybe 70mm. anything longer than that it wont do squat for ya.

[anmoldagreat]

its going to be hard for canon to do much of an upgrade on the xti w/o stepping on the 40ds toes
im thinking live view, digic III, 18-55IS kit lens, and an cf/sd card slot

[John_TX]

Besides SD cards being physically smaller, is there any benefit to using SD vs CF cards? I've personally had 2 SD cards randomly die on me (name brand cards). I've never had trouble with CF cards though, and have a couple 256 & 512MB cards that are a good 6 years old & still work great.

[jgatti]

Besides SD cards being physically smaller, is there any benefit to using SD vs CF cards? I've personally had 2 SD cards randomly die on me (name brand cards). I've never had trouble with CF cards though, and have a couple 256 & 512MB cards that are a good 6 years old & still work great.

You can't bend the pins on an SD slot.

[CamaroSS]

Now think about this for a second. How could an SLR shoot a movie? It would have to be at least 30fps. I wouldn't hold my breath on that one.

[John_TX]

Prices on the 400D are falling through the floor. Amazon has it for $542! Clearing out inventory for sure. Adorama dropped their price to $549 and B&H dropped it from $579 to $559.

[Dragos Jianu]

Now think about this for a second. How could an SLR shoot a movie? It would have to be at least 30fps. I wouldn't hold my breath on that one.

Easily : with the mirror up, just like live preview. the same way P&S do it. And just like P&S cameras, the movie mode won't support full resolution.
The real problem standing in the way of this is the marketing division.

[Collin85]

Now think about this for a second. How could an SLR shoot a movie? It would have to be at least 30fps. I wouldn't hold my breath on that one.

Think about it. You have a 40D, so it shouldn't be too hard.

(Hint: Live View).

[CamaroSS]

Think about it. You have a 40D, so it shouldn't be too hard.

(Hint: Live View).

Are you aware of how Live View works? It drops the mirror down. At this time you are not able to capture any images. You are able preview what would be seen through the viewfinder, and make its way to the sensor. When you hit the shutter the mirror comes back up and the image is taken and it goes back down. There is nothing being recorded into the camera when the body is in Live View mode. So, in order to capture a movie clip an SLR would have to have its shutter release at least 30fps to capture accurate motion. I don't see this happened unless they find a way to stuff an extra sensor in there to shoot movies only.

Is it possible? Yes
Will we see it on an SLR under $700? Probably not anytime soon.

If they get it to work I want to know how they did it because it will be incredible.

[Livinthalife]

Now think about this for a second. How could an SLR shoot a movie? It would have to be at least 30fps. I wouldn't hold my breath on that one.

30FPS is recording, the shutter would stay open, not flip up and down 30FPS. So I don't what's so hard to believe about it.

But I doubt this is the next step, as they would also add a microphone and speaker to it...It would cross the line of DSLRs and POint and shoots.

[John_TX]

Amazon has the 400D + Kit lens for $590! The 400D is definitely on it's way out!

[Livinthalife]

Amazon has the 400D + Kit lens for $590! The 400D is definitely on it's way out!

I know, It's already 590! lol! JK!

Can't wait till the specs are released, gonna be nice!

[John_TX]

Dell has the 400D (body only) for $509.
I imagine B&H/Adorama/Amazon will again lower their prices soon as well.

[Collin85]

Are you aware of how Live View works? It drops the mirror down. At this time you are not able to capture any images. You are able preview what would be seen through the viewfinder, and make its way to the sensor. When you hit the shutter the mirror comes back up and the image is taken and it goes back down.

Are you aware of how Live View works? You're making this way more complicated than it needs to be and your information is incorrect.

Live view initiates mirror lock-up. The reflex mirror is locked up, the shutter is opened and image output from the sensor is displayed in real-time. How would live-view be possible if the mirror drops down? The mirror locks up. It doesn't drop down. If it dropped down, the mirror would be obstructing the sensor on the optical axis and live-view would not function.

When you hit the shutter button, it takes the picture. The mirror does not do anything until the Set button is pressed again. An exception to this is when you're using flash, where the mirror comes down briefly during the half-press.. atleast for the Mark III. I imagine this is no different with the 40D.

The common situation where the mirror does flip back up and then lock-up again is when you want to re-AF. If you don't need to AF, Live View does NOT alter the state of the mirror between shots.

There is nothing being recorded into the camera when the body is in Live View mode.

That's completely irrelevant. When the LCD EVF on a point and shoot digital is on, does that mean it must be recording? Of course not. When you press the shutter button, it starts to record. Same principle with a dSLR in Live View.

So, in order to capture a movie clip an SLR would have to have its shutter release at least 30fps to capture accurate motion. I don't see this happened unless they find a way to stuff an extra sensor in there to shoot movies only.

Is it possible? Yes
Will we see it on an SLR under $700? Probably not anytime soon.

You are making this way more complicated than it is or needs to be. There is no need to flip the mirror up and down at 30fps. The reflex mirror simply stays in mirror lockup and the sensor data is recorded to video. In other words, just the same as Live-View functioning, except you're also recording what's happening.

The complication for movie recording with dSLRs and Live View comes in the form of AFing, not what you mentioned. For the camera to consistently AF while recording different scenes, the mirror would have to flip down again to achieve focus, followed by lock-up once more and the shutter opening. If Canon overcomes this, it's not difficult at all to implement a movie mode. But this isn't such a huge deal at this time, as only a few models even in Canon's P&S range offer automatic-refocusing whilst recording. The S5-IS does, the G9 doesn't.

Like I said before, the hint is 'Live View'. ;)


If they get it to work I want to know how they did it because it will be incredible.

Well.. not really. The solution isn't difficult.

[CamaroSS]

Secreast out!

I'll shut up. Everyone can go back to predicting specs on a Camera.

[Livinthalife]

Secreast out!

I'll shut up. Everyone can go back to predicting specs on a Camera.

LOL! Well at least your a good sport ;)

hmmm more predictions....Do you think they will "improve" the "anti-dust" system? My buddy has the XTi, and I saw of his shots at F16, and I saw spots from dust!!!

[John_TX]

I'm not sure they can really improve it too much, unless they somehow improve the "shake" algorithms.
But even then, no matter how much the sensor "shakes," it's still not going to do anything for dust that even a rocket blower has trouble removing.
Maybe they could improve the coating by making it less porous and really slippery (like a teflon coated pan).

[Dragos Jianu]

hmmmm February ? :D Considering the D80 shares the same AF with the D200 it sounds rather rainy for Canon. Think D90 at 1000$ with 51AF points and 12mp and VGA LCD....

[bradcphoto]

this would be an amazing body and cheap too. i could benefit from a nice big lcd screen, as my 350 and 1D are in lack of screen size.

[CamaroSS]

LOL! Well at least your a good sport ;)

hmmm more predictions....Do you think they will "improve" the "anti-dust" system? My buddy has the XTi, and I saw of his shots at F16, and I saw spots from dust!!!

I try to be. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong.

[Sprout Crumble]

and in-body IS is a joke

No it isn't. Far from it. Telephoto lenses benefit more from lens-based systems but in-body is both effective and very useful as well as being effectively free.

Not everyone in the market for a 400D has the money for an IS lens collection.

[ak_powder_monkey]

for a movie, why not put a sensor up above the focusing screen by the meter?

[Collin85]

for a movie, why not put a sensor up above the focusing screen by the meter?

Because:
a) It's not necessary.
b) It would add to the manufacturing costs. For a non-essential feature like a movie mode, Canon would want at most a burden only on the R&D costs. Extra materials and manufacturing costs on the technology associated with every body produced thereafter isn't an ideal way of doing business.

[John_TX]

I don't want a bloody movie feature. If it cost Canon $10 to put it in the camera, it will cost us $50+ more.

[Collin85]

I'd personally love a movie mode. :)

[j-paka]

movie mode would be pointless if you were able to afford the extra money for the camera why not buy a descent video camera

[Collin85]

movie mode would be pointless if you were able to afford the extra money for the camera why not buy a descent video camera

What can I get in the way of video cameras which can take 8-10MP stills in RAW format, with a similar quality and all the flexibility provided by a dSLR system?

It's all about priorities. A person who desires a movie mode with a dSLR obviously values photographs foremost and movie capture as a secondary benefit.

[farrukh]

movie mode would be pointless if you were able to afford the extra money for the camera why not buy a descent video camera

Because this will use EF lenses and those decent video cameras got tiny sensors with 6x crop lenses aka no DOF fun

[anmoldagreat]

the reason the xti price is dropping everywhere is because canon is now selling the xti w/the 18-55IS lens
no new camera is coming out i dont think

[jgatti]

the reason the xti price is dropping everywhere is because canon is now selling the xti w/the 18-55IS lens
no new camera is coming out i dont think

Where is XTi 18-55 IS kit being sold?

[Collin85]

the reason the xti price is dropping everywhere is because canon is now selling the xti w/the 18-55IS lens
no new camera is coming out i dont think

I humbly disagree. I believe the 450D is scheduled for imminent announcement.

[anmoldagreat]

Where is XTi 18-55 IS kit being sold?

i dont know of everywhere it is being sold at but atleast kits camera is able to order the xti 18-55IS kit for same price as normal setup

[MLphoto]

new xti?

[DStanic]

I think if they made the body feel a bit nicer (less plasticy.. more like the Nikon D40 or Sony Alpha), perhaps change the buttons a bit and/or menu system.
along with live view and/or a 3" LCD and/or swivel screen, Digic III of course, and simply sell all of them with the IS version of the kit lens would be enough of an "improvement" to sell more cameras.

[MLphoto]

What I anticipate:

DIGIC III
10/12MP
Live View
Highlight priority
ISO 3200
Larger LCD

I heard a few places mention swivel-screen and movie mode too. If that's the case, I'm definitely buying one.

The 40D's AF would be nice, but I doubt Canon would do that.

movie mode :O HOLY CRAP

that would be insane i always have been waiting for movie mode on slr camera's but i just got my xti last month but if it had movie mode oh **** i would get it right away.


but i want to XTi to come out after summer of 08, that would be better...

[lowcrust]

C'mon, stop it with the movie mode already! It won't happen! Unless it's some sort of toy version. Imagine being able to shoot with a 300 2.8 IS even at 1 MP... That would set the world on fire!

Anything other than these will have me mighty confused;
DIGIC III with 14bit color (duh!)
Live View (duh!)
10MP (don't think they wanna put the xxxD before the xxD in resolution again)
Higher resolution LCD (I would be disappointed if they didn't)
Some sort of improved AF (although I doubt they will cross type, at least all of them).
1/4000 shutter (don't think they'll upgrade that but probably a slightly faster shutter lag).
Kit will include new cheapo IS lens (duh!).
Slightly larger buffer (nothing major).
Direct Print button (duh!!!)

These I'm not sure about;
3" LCD (they probably will, although the fit will be tight)
sRAW (why not?)
Higher ISO (maybe a boost mode in 3200 but native 3200 sounds too good to be true)
More rugged design (it will be a poor mans version if that's the case)
Weather sealing (it will be a poor mans version if that's the case)
Swivel screen (I really doubt it but it would appeal to p'n's:ers and Canon might be desperate!).
Custom creative modes (I really don't think they wanna confuse Average Joe with too many buttons and such!)
Faster FPS (maybe 4... but could they go crazy and do 5?)

No way;
Movie mode (!)
In-house IS (will probably never happen, but the xxxD series would be the logical start).
SD card support (some day, but not now. Maybe 500D).
FF sensor (c'mon you'd have to be insane to think they would ditch APS-C the xxxD line).

[Livinthalife]

I'm really curious as to what they will put out without stepping on the toes of the higher end models.

Though I was surprised when the XTi came out with Digic III, 10 mp, and dust removal before the XXD cameras.

[Collin85]

I'm really curious as to what they will put out without stepping on the toes of the higher end models.

Though I was surprised when the XTi came out with Digic III, 10 mp, and dust removal before the XXD cameras.

XTi is NOT DIGIC III!

There seems to be so many people here who thinks it is! I can't figure it out. Is there some popular site online which has been asserting it as so? :lol:

[Livinthalife]

XTi is NOT DIGIC III!

There seems to be so many people here who thinks it is! I can't figure it out. Is there some popular site online which has been asserting it as so? :lol:

CRAP! I don't know why I thought so. I could have sworn I saw it somewhere....Must have been one of the rumors that stuck to me....My bad! :o

[Collin85]

CRAP! I don't know why I thought so. I could have sworn I saw it somewhere....Must have been one of the rumors that stuck to me....My bad! :o

No worries bro'. :) Now I just need to track down the source of this vile infestation of a 'fact' and annihilate it from this universe. :eek:

[Livinthalife]

No worries bro'. :) Now I just need to track down the source of this vile infestation of a 'fact' and annihilate it from this universe. :eek:

haha! So I'm not the only one?

[Collin85]

haha! So I'm not the only one?

NO! I've had to politely correct many people over the past few months now. First I thought it was just some newbie-mistake or perhaps even a typo, but I've been noticing it fairly commonly and some even assert it as if it was concrete fact. Lies.. all lies! :lol:

[John_TX]

I'm really curious as to what they will put out without stepping on the toes of the higher end models.

Though I was surprised when the XTi came out with Digic III, 10 mp, and dust removal before the XXD cameras.

For the record, the XTi only has Digic II. Hopefully the 450D will have Digic III or IV.

EDIT: Sorry about that! I should have refreshed my browser window before posting as it was stale and a couple people ahead have already pointed that out!

[Livinthalife]

For the record, the XTi only has Digic II. Hopefully the 450D will have Digic III or IV.

EDIT: Sorry about that! I should have refreshed my browser window before posting as it was stale and a couple people ahead have already pointed that out!

No prob, but I doubt the XTX will have Digic IV since the III is pretty new

[mantra]

but i can't believe

how can canon add a movie feature in a reflex???
i did read that the new 450 will include a movie maker

[gef]

You can't bend the pins on an SD slot.

Funny I know someone that did that to their XT... They managed to straighten them out but I guess it can happen....

[rockabilly808]

while I think most series photogs would frown upon an SLR wiht movie mode I think it would be a brilliant marketing move on canon's part, because i hear a lot of of people who get put out by the fact that you can't take movies with current SLR's. it also seems to be that them now selling the XTI with the 18-55 IS lens is a response to Nikon changing their kit lens to an 18-55 VR lens, I suspect they may opt for a metal body, which would be a series one up on the current competitor in the same price range; the nikon D40. Would canon go to 5 FPS in a XXXD series body, personally I don't think so as long as the 30D is still an in production Body (stepping on the XXD series toes as it were) for sure a larger LCD, live view and digic III. other than that though I can't really say.

[cloose]

30D is not an in production model already.
I could easily see an XTx with live view, 5 FPS, movie mode, Digic III, and 12 mp's

[rockabilly808]

30D is not an in production model already.
I could easily see an XTx with live view, 5 FPS, movie mode, Digic III, and 12 mp's

it seems to me that with their SLR's canon's really hasn't gotten sucked into the pixel peeping, but idk, however seems like they'd have to upgrade the resolution to appeal to the uninformed that think more megapix=better camera

[BikePilot]

If they would make the body more like a 40d in terms of build and keep everything else the same I'd buy one. The Xti has all the performance I need, but I can't stand the flexy plastic body and all the creaking!

[DStanic]

Hopefully the next plastic body will at least be as nice as the Nikon 40D, Sony alpha, Pentax etc.

12.1mp seems realistic, as the G9 has it.

[rockabilly808]

Hopefully the next plastic body will at least be as nice as the Nikon 40D, Sony alpha, Pentax etc.

12.1mp seems realistic, as the G9 has it.

we bought my mom a D40X for hr B-day and after messing with it i do have to admit it feels better in the hands than the XTi

[lowcrust]

I usually like the built of Nikons better but in the case of the D40 it's simply too small for me. I hope the 450D is lighter but not smaller than the 400.

[DStanic]

I really liked the size/feel of the Sony alpha. If they could make it feel close to that, they could add a 3"LCD and still have enough room for the buttons.

[Collin85]

I personally couldn't care less if they upgrade the screen size to 3" or not.. but what I DO want is a better resolution screen. To me, there's nothing worse than making a screen bigger but keeping the number of pixels constant. It doesn't help.

[alkady]

450D/XTX rumors?

This camera should be coming in the next 4 months I'm guessing, what are the specs anybody hear anything? ANy news on this i am in the market to buy another Canon DSLR and would HATE to buy the 400d then this come out grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[Collin85]

ANy news on this i am in the market to buy another Canon DSLR and would HATE to buy the 400d then this come out grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Why? The 400Ds are at exceptional prices right now. It's a fine camera and won't magically 'stop working' when a successor comes out.

[alkady]

Why? The 400Ds are at exceptional prices right now. It's a fine camera and won't magically 'stop working' when a successor comes out.
Nothing wrong with the 400D but i dont have one and am due an upgrade for my 350d and wonder if it is worth waiting to upgrade

[Collin85]

Nothing wrong with the 400D but i dont have one and am due an upgrade for my 350d and wonder if it is worth waiting to upgrade

The 450D isn't going to give you much of an image quality improvement over the 400D. The only things worth waiting for would potentially be the 40D's AF system (doubt Canon would implement that though) and the highlight tone priority. Everything else (DIGIC III, 3" screen etc.) are negligible upgrades in my mind. Live View might be useful to you, but I personally don't find it a dealbreaker in the slightest.

If they put in a Movie mode, that's something I'd upgrade for too.

My point is, for many.. the 450D's imminent release isn't exciting because of the camera itself - it's the fact that you could then snap up 400Ds for dirt cheap.

Plus, is there anything wrong with your 350D? Looking at your gear, I'd recommend putting your money in better lenses first. The 350D is still a formidable camera.

[Daviiiiiid]

XSi!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

[alkady]

XSi!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1


Canon unveiled a new digital SLR late Wednesday night, the EOS Rebel XSi. The new camera replaces Canon's current entry-level D-SLR, the XTi, and includes several features that raise the bar for the sub-$1,000 D-SLR category.
The 12.2-megapixel camera includes a 3-inch LCD reminiscent of consumer point and shoots, a live view feature previously only available in the much higher-end Mark III series, and improved image quality with a new CMOS sensor.
The new sensor allows for enhanced ISO sensitivity up to 1,600. The Analog-to-Digital conversion process has also been upgraded a to a 14-bit A/D processor. That essentially means the camera can produce more accurate colors than previous models. At the heart of the XSi is the Digic III processor that is being included in all new Canon cameras.
Finally, Canon has decided it's time to move to SD cards for the first time in an entry-level D-SLR. Forgoing the CF cards used in the XTi. the XSi now takes SD and SDHC cards. Shipping in April, the XSi can be had for $800 (body only) or as a kit with an EF-S 18-to-55-mm f/3.5-5.6 lens for $900

[lowcrust]

This was a bigger letdown than the 30D launch.

No higher ISO, that's bad. Hopefully the 1600 performance will be improved, but most likely only to make up for the more megapixels...

And more megapixels... sigh.

Still not an upgrade in resolution, that's really really weak. I'd rather have a smaller LCD with higher resolution than a bigger screen. In fact I'd rather keep the old screen, makes the buttons more accessible, improves battery life, keep size and weight down ON TOP of the cost reduction.

Integrating a SD slot is great and all, but at the expense of the CF slot? That's BS!

Live View... meh.

New battery.. if it's noticeably better then great, if only to support the new LCD, that's horrible (for those who already own a couple as well as newbies wanting to tap on the vast pirate market (it will take time and cost more initially)).

Bigger bulkier heavier... bad.

New battery grip without any improvements... bad.

New AF, that's truly awesome and the only really exciting upgrade so far. There's a few other goodies of course, like larger viewfinder and improved grip, that is always welcome, but difficult to get excited about until you've experienced them. And hardly reasons to upgrade on their own.

[Collin85]

This was a bigger letdown than the 30D launch.

How was it a bigger letdown than the 30D? Did you really expect some revolutionary upgrade?

Here is a list of improvements:

Bigger viewfinder
Spot meter
Custom menu
More MP (with chances are same ISO performance as 400D)
Better AF
Live View now with Passive AF
Bigger body/redesigned grip
Bigger LCD
ISO in viewfinder
Dedicated ISO button
14bit RAW
Multi-shot self-timer mode.
Highlight Tone Priority
Better battery
Different colour schemes for back LCD
Speedlite information available on LCD


No higher ISO, that's bad. Hopefully the 1600 performance will be improved, but most likely only to make up for the more megapixels...

And more megapixels... sigh.

I'm all for lower MP, better high-ISO noise.. but we've got to be realistic here.
Did you really expect ISO 3200 or atleast any real improvement in high-ISO performance? The 40D's ISO 1600 isn't terribly better than the 400D's and Canon obviously wants you to cough up for FF if you want it that bad. So in this respect, I'll take all I can get. Hence I ain't gonna bag out 12MP if it's going to give me an ISO 1600 similar to the 400D's.

I'd rather have a smaller LCD with higher resolution than a bigger screen.

So would I, but the 40D got the same treatment. Secondly, for a camera whose controls display interface is through the LCD; I can't complain about a bigger screen. Thirdly, if you're concerned about the inferior battery life caused by a bigger LCD, change the colour scheme (new feature) to the one with a black background. That way, the LCD eats up even less BL than the 400D.


Integrating a SD slot is great and all, but at the expense of the CF slot? That's BS!

How is it BS?

Firstly, this camera is entry-level. The obvious primary market is for first-time dSLR owners; principally those upgrading from P&S. Makes total sense to integrate SD.

So chances are if you're an already established Canon dSLR system owner, you'd probably be looking to upgrade to a model which isn't a Rebel. But even if you are (and I'm one of them.. a pretty dedicated Rebel stalwart).. I still can't figure out what the big fuss is about. The argument has been done already. (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?p=4776931#post4776931)


Live View... meh.

Seems like you're just nitpicking features you don't personally like. Fair enough, I don't find LV to be of personal use to me either. But that doesn't detract from the fact that this feature is generally considered to be a key 'upgrade feature'. Also, the new Passive AF feature on the 450D's LV would be something I'd like to look into.


New battery.. if it's noticeably better then great, if only to support the new LCD, that's horrible (for those who already own a couple as well as newbies wanting to tap on the vast pirate market (it will take time and cost more initially)).

True, I don't want to have to switch to new batteries, but that's life. As for the LCD battery life, I already addressed that above.


Bigger bulkier heavier... bad.

Why? If it improves handling ergonomics, then you'd be one of few to say that was 'bad'.


New AF, that's truly awesome and the only really exciting upgrade so far. There's a few other goodies of course, like larger viewfinder and improved grip, that is always welcome, but difficult to get excited about until you've experienced them. And hardly reasons to upgrade on their own.

That depends on the individual.

Here are a personal list of improvements I'm very keen on:

Bigger viewfinder
Spot meter
Custom menu
Better AF
Live View now with Passive AF
Bigger body/redesigned grip
ISO in viewfinder with Dedicated ISO button (an absolutely huge plus IMO)
14bit RAW
Highlight Tone Priority
Better battery + Different colour schemes for back LCD = Ultimately better BL than 400D
Speedlite information available on LCD

That's a pretty worthy upgrade to me and more than enough to keep me away from a 40D.

[lowcrust]

Looks like we're mostly in agreement.

The post you are linking to is newer than mine so I'm not sure what you meant with that (if anything). It's no big deal either way, I'm not a potential 450D owner because I'm looking to buy a xxD and a 5D mkII down the road. I'll keep me 350D when I do (and it has a CF slot!). I just don't see why all the P'n'S'ers have to have a DSLR and how that in itself is an argument to swap the CF for SD. If the change is so insignificant and the cost is so small compared to what we DSLR owners already put in equipment, why would a potential buyer who is about to flash out a 1000 bucks base a decision on a "50 dollar card"? To me CF is better and to me it makes sense having the same cards on all DSLR in the Canon lineup.

I'm also one for fewer standards, so if it's a across-the-board decision to scrap CF altogether for SD I'd "comply"... =)

About the weight, I've been corrected on that one, it's not heavier. And if better handling means slightly bigger camera I'm all for it (see top post on this page in this thread). If they need to make it heavier and bulkier just to fit a bigger below par LCD I'm not so thrilled. I don't want a bigger camera, just bigger/better grip. And as I said, on that one I stand corrected, I got just what I wanted (strictly from a "general Canon development" point of view, of course, as I'm not buying it anyways).

[Collin85]

I'm also one for fewer standards, so if it's a across-the-board decision to scrap CF altogether for SD I'd "comply"... =)

That's definitely what I'm thinking.

In the electronics gadgetry market, SD by far has a higher proliferation mark and I've always felt that the format will replace CF in the long run. To me, it's inevitable and hence most importantly.. 'expected'. So it was no surprise to me to find Canon doing it by first introducing it into the new Rebel (makes most sense from a marketing POV). Since the xxDs are a natural progression in the upgrade path for Rebel owners, I'm sure Canon wouldn't want the new solely-SD group to then complain about having to go CF, so I expect the xxDs to be next on the list to go SD exclusive (or atleast dual SD+CF for awhile). Yes, it will generate lots of complaints.. but the main point here is that people are just afraid of change. After a little while, I think most will just get over it as if nothing had happened.

So in my opinion, there's no point fighting against it. If we can acknowledge that CF is on the decline, then we should just comply with SD taking over.

Damn, felt like I was distributing propaganda just then. :lol:

[photobitz]

Probably not much need for CF these days since SD is now running at similar transfer speeds and can store similar amounts plus the cards are a fraction of the physical dimensions. Switching to SD you'll miss out on being able to use micro-drives, but I think they are a bit redundant these days.

As far as features go, it's sounding like the 450D/XSi will rival the 20D/30D.

[Dragos Jianu]

I like the 450D. Very nice upgrades, especially compared to the direct competition. It blows the D60 away and it costs just 50$ more (probably less in real life since Canon always allows price creeps). Even the 400D was a neat lil camera which i enjoyed using while switching cameras with a friend on different shoots. I'm actually thinking of buying a 450D. They simply deliver the goods without costing as much as a high class L lens. I'd rather invest in good lenses rather then bodies myself.
Even the improved dynamic range (shadows and highlights enhancements), higher MP, live view and nicer viewfinder alone make the 450D a great upgrade. The small size compared to the higher classes is very nice too. Easier to lug around and makes any lens seem huge :p

As for the SD it's a great strategy since most people upgrading from P&S cameras have SDs rather then CFs, SDs can also be used on your PDA and with the cost of memory cards nowadays it's silly to even mention the switch.
I don't see what all the fuss is about with all these complains. It should, by all means be a better studio camera then the 40D in terms of IQ (higher resolution, d-lighting).

Show me one nicer camera in it's price range from any other manufacturer. Canon got it right on this one.

[lowcrust]

Not so sure about the price though, it could be a little too high. Then again the 400D will probably live on to fill that gap. It's probably essential from a business stand point if you're going to consistently upgrade your entry level camera like Canon does.