business in wedding photography, hard gig?

[smtp722]

Can some of the Pros who have a business in wedding photography tell me how hard it was for them to start and get it off the ground? Do you find a lot of satisfaction and success in this business? A lot of flexibility? What is your lifestyle like? i.e. day to day preparations..do you take classes continuously, do you teach...etc... What's one big advice you have for someone starting out?

thank you for your time!

[BestVisuals]

Wow - lots to answer.

What I can tell you is that the wedding business is being encroached upon by amateurs quite a bit. The price that most brides expect to pay has dropped, probably by half, in the last 2-5 years. It's far more difficult to make a living as a wedding photographer than it used to be, thanks to digital.

Anyone with a DSLR and Photoshop can produce pretty good images, to be honest. This has blurred the lines between pro and amateur forever.

[smtp722]

hey RVsForFun, i see you used to be a computer programmer! That's my background too, was a programmer, i'm still in IT now tho, not so much programming now but biz systems specialist and always wishing i could do something more fun and flexible and less stressful. so maybe you are the person to ask...any regrets on making that transition? you must have more advice to give then :)

[jamiewexler]

Wow - lots to answer.

What I can tell you is that the wedding business is being encroached upon by amateurs quite a bit. The price that most brides expect to pay has dropped, probably by half, in the last 2-5 years. It's far more difficult to make a living as a wedding photographer than it used to be, thanks to digital.

Anyone with a DSLR and Photoshop can produce pretty good images, to be honest. This has blurred the lines between pro and amateur forever.

Do you have hard facts for that? Many of the experienced pro's that I have talked with (that have successfully made the transition to digital), now reckon they make more money than they ever did.

It would be really interesting to see, with real, hard statistics, if the price of wedding photography has really gone down over the last 5 years or if it's just for folks that have had trouble adjusting their business models to new technology...

[liza]

...always wishing i could do something more fun and flexible and less stressful...

If you want to do something "fun, flexible, and less stressful" you should probably explore other avenues. That isn't exactly how I'd describe wedding photography. ;)

[smtp722]

haha, liza, ok, i guess i should say that if i have to deal with what i'm dealing now, i should at least find it in something i like to do... :) fun,flexible, stress is ok when there's passion in it.

[MrsOpie]

hey, it beats being a real estate agent. :cool:

[liza]

Actually, I find it so stressful that I've made portraiture, school photography, and sports action my primary sources of income. Going into the wedding photography business is expensive. So far, I've dropped about 15K on kit with another 5K anticipated over the next year. That's not counting sample albums, advertising/promotional materials, software, professional memberships, bridal shows, applicable taxes, etc, etc, etc. Not to mention the 95K I'm getting ready to drop for studio space. If you're going to do this as a sideline, it isn't quite as costly, but to do it as your primary career, it's time consuming and expensive, just as it is for any small business.

If you're going to do it right, go through the Small Business Administration for information. I'm using materials from their website to teach an Economics class this semester. There's a wealth of information about writing a sound business plan and obtaining start up funding.

Good luck in your endeavors.

[smtp722]

thanks , liza. that's helpful info you gave me. i'd love to do others besides weddings like fashion photography, casual portraits, magazines,laker games :) (i'm from so cal!)..weddings do seem stressful and especially if you're the one capturing their special moment...what if something breaks in the middle.eek.. good luck with your economics class and your endeavors too. what's your url? i'd love to check out your work.

[liza]

PM sent.

[tbfoto]

Almost every wedding I do may start out as a average everyday wedding but its funny how.... as soon as that organ music starts to play and the people start to enter the room....My heart starts to thump a lot faster....my blood pressure starts to rise....and my head says....IT'S SOWTIME! This is when you better be ready! No "do overs". You get one chance to capture this moment. This is when you earn your money. It can be very stressful. If you dont want pressure...don't be a wedding photographer.

For EVERY wedding Ive done...when I'm all done and packed up and driving back home I think to myself......I'm not getting paid enough to do this. Then I go out the following weekend and do it all over again. I love it!

Tom

[picturecrazy]

basic answer: it's not easy.

Most who try, sink. Many just stay afloat. Only a few thrive like crazy.


Anyone with a DSLR and Photoshop can produce pretty good images, to be honest. This has blurred the lines between pro and amateur forever.


I agree to some extent. Anyone can take a dslr to a wedding, and with great PP skills, put out some nice images. But a real pro will put out a few hundred great images. A real amateur will bring out like 2-5 standouts.

(Notice I said REAL pro and REAL amateur... there are bad photographers who call themselves pro and amazing ones who call themselves amateurs... I'm not talking about them)

[Rick Rosen]

For 2007 weddings here are some national stats:

Average spent on photography: $2,373
Number of weddings in 2007: 2,084,426
Number hiring prof. photographer: 1,046,382 (approx. 50%)
Estimate number of "professional" wedding photographers today: 150,000 - 175,000

1,000,000 / 150,000 = 6.6 weddings per photographer statistically

Results: Most brides today want to spend around $2000 on wedding photography and can find many newer photographers that will serve in the $1500-$2500 range w/album.
Obviously there are exceptions and as we move upward toward the bridal pool that will spend more than the $2300 average the competition among wedding photographers gets more concentrated toward the gradually minimizing pool of prospective clients.

Rick

[thewavebb]

Wow - lots to answer.

The price that most brides expect to pay has dropped, probably by half, in the last 2-5 years. It's far more difficult to make a living as a wedding photographer than it used to be, thanks to digital.

I would have to say that the price has probably gone down, however the profit margin's have probably stayed the same (if not gone up) My operational costs per wedding including insurance, gas and food is MAYBE $100 per wedding. Since I just do non-studio stuff, I have little other overhead to deal with. So some of the old school wedding photogs may have to redo there business model and find where the costs are killing them.

If you want to get into this line of work. I would probably do it as a side job for a couple years. It takes some time to get the viral marketing machine working. This business is still about person-to-person sales and running a efficient business model. I spend around 60 hrs total per wedding (planning, meetings, shooting and editing). 8-14 hrs of that is actual shooting. The costs of starting are pretty low. I think we spent maybe 6k at first and added things as needed. We rented a lot of our backup gear at first.

my wife and I started doing weddings for free for those at my church who couldn't afford a photographer so they weren't going to have one. They had no expectations and it allowed me the freedom to experiment a little. I am just finishing up year 2 now and I couldn't be happier.

My stats:
2006: 8 weddings (6 free, 2 paid)
2007: 18(all paid)
2008: 23 booked with hopes of hitting 28
2009: 6 booked with hopes of 20 (higher paying gigs)

[dsc_1972]

They say things go round in cirles... well, I left a career in advertising and marketing to join the IT industry...
What am I doing now... trying to esape IT!
Well not trying to escape, but trying to learn a different craft, but the more I learn about this craft, the more it lends itself to advertising and marketing.
Next thing we know, 4 piece guitar bands will be popular again!

[liza]

I would have to say that the price has probably gone down, however the profit margin's have probably stayed the same (if not gone up) My operational costs per wedding including insurance, gas and food is MAYBE $100 per wedding. Since I just do non-studio stuff, I have little other overhead to deal with. So some of the old school wedding photogs may have to redo there business model and find where the costs are killing them.


You left out a few things, namely your time and applicable income and sales tax, marketing costs, and depreciation of equipment. I'm sure I've left out a few things, but those are the ones that come to mind.

[dsc_1972]

smtp - is that 's' for simple? ;)
OK you work in IT, so RTFM is natural for you ... but can you:-
run a succesful customer facing business?
work your camera equipment in 'real time'?
capture that decisive moment?
process the photos to the required standard?
negotiate the printing the client wants after demonstrating their options?
market & promote your skills?
etc etc etc.....

[MarkAnthonyPhotography]

Wow, a very interesting thread. Seeing that I've only been up and running for just over 1 year now, this is all good reading to me. I will admit I jumped head first into starting my buisness with the help of some family members who had already started and solidified themselves in the wedding photography business. Much of my "training and experience" came from them, but our vision on marketing and sales where completly different. I will be the first to admit that I am not the greatest photographer. I want to be, so I practice and study everyday. But I am one hell of a salesman and marketer. So I bank on "wooing" my potential clients rather than them choosing me from my images alone. And so far it has worked. As for my first year in buisness I've shot 14 weddings as a second shooter ($200 each). 2 weddings of my own. ($2900 gp). And have 5 booked for 2008 so far. Along with getting my Portrait side up and running hopefully by next year, I feel as though I'm ahead of the eight ball. I still have alot of gear to pick up and much much much more practice and studing to do with my acutal photography. But I couldn't think of anything else I'd rather be doing. I've worked just as hard or harder for companies in the past with very little gratification and satisfaction. So after a grueling 10-12 hours of shooting, running, yelling instructions, more running, squating, fighting for position, lugging 25lbs of gear, "smoozing" then the other 30hrs of PP, I have the greatest feeling of accomplishment and pride. And I wouldn't trade that for a 9 to 5 anyday.

[smtp722]

They say things go round in cirles... well, I left a career in advertising and marketing to join the IT industry...
What am I doing now... trying to esape IT!
Well not trying to escape, but trying to learn a different craft, but the more I learn about this craft, the more it lends itself to advertising and marketing.
Next thing we know, 4 piece guitar bands will be popular again!

ha! how's advertising/marketing? i've always thought it sounded fun and wanted to try that out too but really hard to escape IT!

[smtp722]

smtp - is that 's' for simple? ;)
OK you work in IT, so RTFM is natural for you ... but can you:-
run a succesful customer facing business?
work your camera equipment in 'real time'?
capture that decisive moment?
process the photos to the required standard?
negotiate the printing the client wants after demonstrating their options?
market & promote your skills?
etc etc etc.....

hahaha...you're in IT.. ;) you know what it means..
i'm asking if it's a hard gig..but yah. i think i can do most if not all of those things..

[Padawan Dad]

Is there really any easy job? If you love your work, I think it just becomes easier to bear the hardships it may come with. Weddings can be physically draining for me at times, but I love the challenges and enjoy working in this arena. I still, however, find my day job of facilities management A LOT tougher... although... I don't like it as much as shooting weddings.

[SuzyView]

I only shoot for events my children are in or that I have some association with. I shoot weddings for friends or for people who really cannot afford it. Just like Jim, I shoot military weddings almost for free. But to make it a business that I have to count on for income is a hard choice. About 24 years ago, I had a word processing business to put my husband through graduate school. It was a 16 hours a day job to earn the money I needed. Drumming up the clients was not a problem, but keeping up with the work and taxes and equipment was hard. Photography is a totally different career, but being self-employed is expensive and demanding. I like that I have a day job and shoot only on the weekends mainly.

If the area you live in can accommodate a new photographer, I'd say go into it slowly. We have covered how much gear is required to start a business off right and I think we decided $10K-$25K of gear was not unheard of. So, start up is not cheap.

[thewavebb]

You left out a few things, namely your time and applicable income and sales tax, marketing costs, and depreciation of equipment. I'm sure I've left out a few things, but those are the ones that come to mind.

Marketing Costs: 5 dollars a month to host my webpage. I developed a strong viral marketing plan. I do not advertise beyond my webpage. I made my own webpage.
Sales Tax: I add that to the top of my packages
Depreciation of equipment: Good lenses hardly depreciate. My bodies do a little, but still retain good values. Even if you break it down per wedding, its still nothing to worry about. My computers do loose value, but I build them for cheap and sell them after a year of use for a little less then what I paid to build them.
Time: Thats not an operational expense. That is something I have too much of in the winter months when i'm not shooting as much.
Appliciable Income Tax: You'll have this with any business and I don't see it as a operational cost.

My point was that this is a business that you can run very lean and it lends itself well to word of mouth marketing. You dont need a studio or even a storefront. All you need is some talent, decent gear, a computer and the people skills needed to get referrals.

I have started other ventures that required much more capital and had greater risks involved to make a smaller profit margin.

[CVFinland]

Actually, I find it so stressful that I've made portraiture, school photography, and sports action my primary sources of income. Going into the wedding photography business is expensive. So far, I've dropped about 15K on kit with another 5K anticipated over the next year. That's not counting sample albums, advertising/promotional materials, software, professional memberships, bridal shows, applicable taxes, etc, etc, etc. Not to mention the 95K I'm getting ready to drop for studio space. If you're going to do this as a sideline, it isn't quite as costly, but to do it as your primary career, it's time consuming and expensive, just as it is for any small business.

If you're going to do it right, go through the Small Business Administration for information. I'm using materials from their website to teach an Economics class this semester. There's a wealth of information about writing a sound business plan and obtaining start up funding.

Good luck in your endeavors.

Hi from Finland!
I am doing mainly sport videos and some have asked me to take photos. Could you explain how you work and earn with chool photography, and sports action photos.

Email would be nice too: info(a)arvotuotanto(dot)com

[Svetlana]

I love shooting weddings and engagements. Yeah it's stressful, but to me it's very rewarding. I have invested a lot of $$ in equipment and will keep doing it until I'm done shooting. :) I attend workshops, seminars (actually helped bring Chris Becker and Dane Sanders to Calgary to teach, they both were awesome!). I advertise through facebook, but most of my clients come to me through word of mouth, which is the most important for me - it means my past clients loved my work enough to recommend me to their friends. I have an accountant who takes care of my taxes and I'm hoping this year to outsource album design.

I actually revamped my pricing structure, raised my prices considerably this year and booked a few weddings (including for 2012) with my new pricing. Hopefully this year I will make some money :):).

[Dans_D60]

Photography as a business, in general, has many many issues.

It is one of a few professions with no oversight, requires no license and very difficult to weed out passion from what the client expects.

For sure it is a blast and with so many people wanting to take beautiful wedding photos the odds are in your favor that with enough images you can most likely get enough to satisfy a potential bride as a client.

Personally I believe you (we) need to draw a solid line between fun and passion, even if you charge a fee, from a professional business. My brother is really good at home modifications. He did my kitchen for a really low fee. Has the passion but in the end it is obvious this was not done by a pro. Lucky he is family or maybe I would ask for a refund or worse a lawsuit. Are you all prepared for a lawsuit? It does happen more often than you think.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m all for a friend or someone new to learn by doing. But I would insist you let the client know just want they are getting themselves into and set expectations appropriately.

When I have a bride tell me they have been quoted a fee of $900 to cover their most important day I respond by telling them if price is priority-one for your wedding day experience than I suggest going to Craigslist and find someone who will do it for free! If on the other hand you looking for the best possible experience and memories you will cherish from a professional that is fully insured and will stand behind their products, then you may want to rethink your priorities.

The #1 complaint on many of the bridal forums is their photographer. So many quotes like; “their images look so good when I met them but my wedding day experience and photos are awful”

As a primary or secondary business when you take any value (money or trade) you set yourself as a professional. As a professional you will be expected to have full insurance coverage for yourself and anyone else who shoots with you, pay taxes to both the state and federal, provide value in return for your fees, compete truthfully in the market and be prepared if things don’t go as planned.

I hope this was not gloom and doom. It is not. Photography is a wonderful business that blends art and technology like none other. But moving from fun and passion into a business sets you up with client expectations that I find many just not prepared to take on.

Dan (http://www.danpettusphoto.com)

BLOG (http://blog.danpettusphoto.com)

Dan Pettus Photography (http://www.danpettusphoto.com)

[DavidFenwick]

I've managed to keep increasing my prices over the last few years and maintain the same number of bookings, but, it does takes longer to fill the diary.

There are lots of people who dip their toes into the wedding photography business but very few who stay the course. I think that some of the key attributes required include:

Determination and commitment
Good business sense (including how to promote and market oneself)
Great people skills
A desire to constantly develop and improve photographic skills

I love what I do but I still get butterflies in my stomach before every wedding!