Canon D flash sync speed

[evilenglishman]

I've just read on dpreview that the 20D has an improved flash sync speed of 1/250th.

My D-60's sync is 1/250th even though dpreview says its 1/200th.

what am I missing????

[robertwgross]

My goodness, that must be an odd one.

All other D60 cameras have a maximum sync speed of 1/200th, and the manual spells that out.

---Bob Gross---

[evilenglishman]

i always use mine at 1/250th

http://www.electricvenus.com/dump/speed.jpg

[robertwgross]

i always use mine at 1/250th


Then it appears that you always exceed the published maximum sync speed of the camera.

I'm sure that there is a gray area where you have "technically" exceeded the sync speed, but it still works marginally. I'm not sure that you would consistently get good results.

Or... maybe your D60 is an odd one.

---Bob Gross---

[evilenglishman]

I've never had any problems with flash at this speed and I'd be interested to know if others can use 1/250th.

Also does anyone know why that exif says F-Stop f10 and Apature value f9 ?

[Jon]

I notice the metadata said "Flash: Did not fire". Maybe that's part of it.

[Jon]

Also does anyone know why that exif says F-Stop f10 and Apature value f9 ?

Rounding error (f/9.5?) or displayed f/ stop differs from that actually used (1/2 vs. 1/3 stop setting) maybe.

[evilenglishman]

I notice the metadata said "Flash: Did not fire". Maybe that's part of it.

it always says that with studio heads

[stuartf287]

What does the photo prove? Not only does the metadata say no flash, but there is no evidence of flash in the picture. When I use automatic modes with my D60 it always sets the speed at 1/200 when the flash is on.

[Jon]

I notice the metadata said "Flash: Did not fire". Maybe that's part of it.

it always says that with studio heads

So, you were using studio heads, not a Canon dedicated flash? Any more information that may help us, like model of flash, or maybe that you were set for FP sync? It's possible that a studio strobe may have a long enough duration (or enough delay) that you don't get (noticeable) shutter cut-off, but not likely. The D60 manual says X-sync for them is 1/60. The X-sync speed is the fastest at which the shutter is completely open, so the entire image area is illuminated by the (very) short burst from the flash.

[evilenglishman]

What does the photo prove? Not only does the metadata say no flash, but there is no evidence of flash in the picture. When I use automatic modes with my D60 it always sets the speed at 1/200 when the flash is on.

When using studio heads I use manual not one of the automatic modes - try looking at the highlights in the eyes for evidence of flash :roll:

http://www.electricvenus.com/dump/eyes.jpg

[Jon]

What does the photo prove? Not only does the metadata say no flash, but there is no evidence of flash in the picture. When I use automatic modes with my D60 it always sets the speed at 1/200 when the flash is on.

When using studio heads I use manual not one of the automatic modes - try looking at the highlights in the eyes for evidence of flash :roll:

http://www.electricvenus.com/dump/eyes.jpg

It was real easy to see that from the first image you posted. Please - if you want an answer, give us all the information instead of implying we're idiots for not knowing exactly what the circumstances were that gave rise to your question. For instance, what about modelling lights, white balance setting, . . .

[iof]

My D60 will set a shutter speed of 1/200 when I turn on the flash, even if that would result in overexposure(AV mode, large aperture, lots of ambient light). That makes me think the fastest sync speed is 1/200, at least on my D60.

[evilenglishman]

Jon, i posted that as stuartf287 said there was no evidence of flash in the photo - yes, I thought it was obvious too :roll:

I'm not implying anyone is an idiot, I was just asking a legitimate question as to how i can use the flash at that speed, nothing more. I don't think modelling lights or white balance have anything to do with it, but yes the modelling light was on on that photo although the flash works fine without modelling lights.

[robertwgross]

I think it is safe to say that 1/200th is a bit safer than 1/250th for a maximum sync speed for the D60.

---Bob Gross---

[Jon]

Jon, i posted that as stuartf287 said there was no evidence of flash in the photo - yes, I thought it was obvious too :roll:

I'm not implying anyone is an idiot, I was just asking a legitimate question as to how i can use the flash at that speed, nothing more. I don't think modelling lights or white balance have anything to do with it, but yes the modelling light was on on that photo although the flash works fine without modelling lights.

No, in the first image you posted it was not obvious that the catch-light was coming from any kind of flash. I enquired about white balance and modelling lights as auto white balance could mask that the exposure was actually under tungsten light. In your initial query, you mentioned nothing about using studio flash. You're doling out the info in dribs and drabs, which makes responding very difficult. Canon quite clearly says in the D60 manual that X-sync is 1/200 with their flashes; 1/60 is safest with studio flashes. Not having a D60 (and accompanying PC cord flash) handy, I can't readily duplicate your situation here (you were using a PC cord to trigger the flash?).

[evilenglishman]

Jon
I was using a pc cord attached, it works okay with an infrared trigger too. I can't think what other info I can give. Re-reading my first few posts I see why there was some confusion. My on-camera flash works at 1/200th.

When I first got the camera I tried some flash heads at every speed just to test it and found that the maximum was 1/250th so I have used that ever since.

[Jon]

OK - we know that there's a signal to the flash shoe when a 550EX is set to FP, or when a non-EX flash is used, even beyond 1/200 sec. There would also be a signal to the PC socket under the same conditions. BUT the camera won't think that a flash is being fired (since the flash isn't talking to the camera) hence "no flash", and presumably the flash heads you have are slow-enough discharge to stay lit for the extra time needed to cover 1/250 sec. (or your shutter's a little off ;{)# ).

[evilenglishman]

okay so its probably the duration of the flash heads that makes it work then.
I hope the shutter isn't off a little - I don't like the sound of that :shock:

PS: I get the "flash: did not fire" all the time with studio lights, as does a friend with a 1Ds.

[PhotosGuy]

evilenglishman wrote:
Also does anyone know why that exif says F-Stop f10 and Apature value f9 ?

Rounding error (f/9.5?) or displayed f/ stop differs from that actually used (1/2 vs. 1/3 stop setting) maybe.

I don't use the +/- compensation & I get the same type of 'different' exif info. I wonder if one is the calculated f-stop vs. the set f-stop?
I've seen this, too. Then I decided that it's not worth my time to try to find out why there's a difference. :wink:

[evilenglishman]

I wonder if one is the calculated f-stop vs. the set f-stop?
I've seen this, too. Then I decided that it's not worth my time to try to find out why there's a difference. :wink:

One thing i have noticed is that it only appears on jpeg and not on raw

[stuartf287]

I did notice the catchlights, but since I didn't try to enlarge the photo I thought they were attributable to natural light from a window (they are rectangular in shape). I don't use studio lights myself and didn't recognize the more likely source.

Your D60 apparently has a capability which Canon has neither advertised nor acknowledged in the user's manual. I hope mine works the same way, and I'll try to check it out when I get home.

[robertwgross]

OK - we know that there's a signal to the flash shoe when a 550EX is set to FP, or when a non-EX flash is used, even beyond 1/200 sec. There would also be a signal to the PC socket under the same conditions.

"Signal" is kind of a rough term here, since there is no intelligence or data. When the camera body wants to cause the flash unit to fire, it momentarily causes a short circuit (via transistor) across the contacts of the hot shoe and/or PC connector.

In a different vein, there is a two-way data signal that appears on the hot shoe if the body is talking to a Canon flash, and it has a small amount of intelligence.

---Bob Gross---

[CyberDyneSystems]

Two things.

"Aperture Value" and F/stop are indeed two differnet things.. (I don't recall the details but I've only used f/stop my whole life. Somwhere we had a great thread expalining the difference.. sorry I can't recall the details.)

As far as the 1/250th?

If you were using the strobes, with all set to manual.. are we sure they were in fact "synching" ? In full manual can you not actually set the shutter speed to whatever you want? Whether the srobes synch or not be damned?

Just curious.. I don't have any expeirence with Studio lighting so forgive me for my ignorance here.

[evilenglishman]

In full manual can you not actually set the shutter speed to whatever you want? Whether the srobes synch or not be damned?


yes you can. As I mentioned earlier I tried it at all shutter speeds and 1/250th was the last speed before they didn't work or sync properly.