Employer just asked me to shoot a customer appreciation party...

[thoreau]

And I have no clue how to handle this!

The event is for a mid-sized (perhaps 100) group of repeat/loyal customers and is a breakfast 'party' running from 8-11am this coming Saturday at our museum facility.

I've never in my life done any shooting professionally. Everything to date has just been for personal fun, and the vast majority has been landscapes/scenics or other stationary objects, not people.

So in short, I really have no idea how to respond to this. I'd love to shoot the event, but I'm not totally certain how good I am with portraits and candids (don't even have a flash gun other than the onboard on my 40D) and I really have no idea how to answer the 'how much would you charge' question they threw at me.

Help a noob out!!! =)

http://xanthotech.com/gallery/ <-- to give an idea of the types of shooting I've done to date.

[FlyingPhotog]

Your Customers = Your Income and this really isn't the place to "make it up as you go along."

In all honesty, if you've never experimented with flash photography of any kind (let alone off-camera flash and shooting people) then forgive me if this sounds rude but may I respectfully suggest you reccomend to your superiors that they hire a professional. It would be a great learning experience for you if you could assist the pro or work as a 2nd shooter.

As for what to charge, it's pretty obvious that someone, somewhere is pretty sure you'll do this on the cheap but why let them take advantage of you?

[thoreau]

Well, just got a voicemail from them. They're offering $200 for the duration. Dunno if that's normal for 3 hours, or what, but doesn't seem too high or too low to my unknowing eye.

I definitely follow what you're saying about bowing out to a real pro, which was my initial thought. I had only even asked them about this before just so that I could do so on my own time and for personal fun...

[scotteisenphotography]

Well, just got a voicemail from them. They're offering $200 for the duration. Dunno if that's normal for 3 hours, or what, but doesn't seem too high or too low to my unknowing eye.

I definitely follow what you're saying about bowing out to a real pro, which was my initial thought. I had only even asked them about this before just so that I could do so on my own time and for personal fun...

i charge 500 for 3 hours...

[thoreau]

i charge 500 for 3 hours...

But you know what you're doing =)

They said they need to know by tomorrow morning. Since the museum is on the same property as i work at, I'm thinking of heading over there first thing and scoping it out from a lighting perspective... see if there's heavy morning sunlight coming in that would blow out my backgrounds, bad mix of natural/artificial lighting, etc. and maybe use my boss as a quick test subject to see just how difficult the shots would be (i would be seeing the same lighting tomorrow morning that would be present during the event, so it will at least be a good indicator i think of what to expect.)

I also don't know for certain wether or not there would be another hired photog there, so I'd wanna check on that as well. If there is another, I would feel a lot less pressure and probably be able to do a little better vs. being the one and only.

On a related note, this would be a pretty definitive who's who of north scottsdale as these are some high dollar customers who have bought from us many many times. A few of the scheduled attendees would be great people to built rapport with from a 'being able to get access to other things in the future' aspect.

All the same, I'm (sadly, to me) leaning towards declining just to be on the safe side, regardless of what potential contacts could be made.

[pos]

It sounds like they aren't hurting for money so why would they not hire a pro who who would have the equipment and the knowledge that goes with it. If it was me and i was just starting out i would bow out. Remember if the pic's you shoot don't turn out right that will follow you for a very long time. Word of mouth goes a long way. pos

[photojournalista]

If they've seen your photos, they know what to expect. Go and have fun plus 200 on the pocket. ;)

[scotteisenphotography]

But you know what you're doing =)


i guess...but then again, i'm only seventeen years old..

[Uhland]

hmm, dont even have a flash?
If you had a flash and no experiance id say do it.
But you cant take proper photos without a strong flash or bouncing.
You can but they wont be as good as they should be.
Onboard flashes are not very strong.

If I were you, id agree to do it and ask for the money up front.
Run to the store and buy a 580EXII (id toss in the 200 and put up the rest myself)
Or just use the 200 to buy a 430ex.

Consider it a trade. You are doing thier show for a new flash.

Get the experiance. Dont be afraid to learn.

[kmmorris1205]

If you don't go out on a limb and do something for the experience and the learning, how are you ever going to gain the confidence to do it in the future? I do agree though, I'd take the $200 and run for an external flash for sure...

[FlyingPhotog]

If you don't go out on a limb and do something for the experience and the learning, how are you ever going to gain the confidence to do it in the future? I do agree though, I'd take the $200 and run for an external flash for sure...

I would agree with you except for one key possiblity: Unless the employer explicitly says (and I'd want it writing, too) that the quality of the shots don't matter one iota and in fact, it doesn't matter if the OP comes back with even one nice image, if the OP totally screws the pooch he possibly damages his relationship with his employer.

Is $200 enough to take that risk?

[agent.media]

Hey, Go with available light. If it is in the morning, and there are lots of windows, just use your 24-70!

Below is a gallery I did of people eating lunch just using available light and a lens at 2.8.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/lamul/97860954/in/set-72057594062128753/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lamul/97860483/in/set-72057594062128753/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lamul/97860460/in/set-72057594062128753/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lamul/97860415/in/set-72057594062128753/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lamul/97860538/in/set-72057594062128753/

Here are some Tips.

Remember to shoot RAW so you can not stress too much about exposure there and then.. Remember to try and get photos of everyone. Move around the room.

Get candids (by moving back at shooting at 70mm). best candids are where you are at the same height as the subject. So if they are sitting down to eat. Kneel from a distance and take shots.

Also dont be afraid to walk up to groups of people, introduce yourself, and get them to stand together (in twos or threes) and shoot away. Be wary of where the available light is coming from, and dont be afraid to ask people to turn around so you get the best angle of light.

Good Luck!

[thoreau]

Just got back from meeting with the event coordinator this morning. Looks like the types of shots theyre looking for are actually right up my alley (well, more so than extensive people shooting). They primarily want shots of the location (pre and post guest arrival) overall shots of the event, etc. They're not really too interested in a lot of posed shots of the guests themselves and just wanna be able to show what the event looks like to the world via their website. So yeah, I'll be there bright and early tomorrow morning =)

I think I'm still gonna go grab a flash gun tho. I was planning on getting one with my tax refund anyway (which will be here in a few days, yay!) and even tho I'll have to buy local, the $200 fee will offset tax/local markup and then some.

Chatting with the head honcho of the museum this morning cleared up all my major fears of shooting something like this after I found out exactly what they're after, and was able to see samples from past events. Let's just say they're quite accustomed to point & shoot snaps, which I know for certain I can do better than.

As for the pro photographer that they had originally hired, it was actually one of my co-workers within the company who is also into photography (albeit more serious/experienced than I am) and who had something come up. So they weren't really pulling in a full-time pro in the first place. As much as this sounds like a major event (which it definitely is) it's child's play compared to many other events that we hold year in and year out. Those are what they save the real pro photogs (and budget) for.

[Village_Idiot]

i guess...but then again, i'm only seventeen years old..

And your point is? I'd rather pay a twelve year old $500 for three hours than a forty year old $200 for three hours when the forty year old has no idea what they're doing.

You're age means nothing. Experience means everything.

[Village_Idiot]

Just got back from meeting with the event coordinator this morning. Looks like the types of shots theyre looking for are actually right up my alley (well, more so than extensive people shooting). They primarily want shots of the location (pre and post guest arrival) overall shots of the event, etc. They're not really too interested in a lot of posed shots of the guests themselves and just wanna be able to show what the event looks like to the world via their website. So yeah, I'll be there bright and early tomorrow morning =)

I think I'm still gonna go grab a flash gun tho. I was planning on getting one with my tax refund anyway (which will be here in a few days, yay!) and even tho I'll have to buy local, the $200 fee will offset tax/local markup and then some.

Chatting with the head honcho of the museum this morning cleared up all my major fears of shooting something like this after I found out exactly what they're after, and was able to see samples from past events. Let's just say they're quite accustomed to point & shoot snaps, which I know for certain I can do better than.

As for the pro photographer that they had originally hired, it was actually one of my co-workers within the company who is also into photography (albeit more serious/experienced than I am) and who had something come up. So they weren't really pulling in a full-time pro in the first place. As much as this sounds like a major event (which it definitely is) it's child's play compared to many other events that we hold year in and year out. Those are what they save the real pro photogs (and budget) for.

I was going to mention that you should buy a flash. Make sure it's TTL, buy a diffuser for it if you can't bounce it, and practicing using it....not ten minutes prior to the event.

[thoreau]

I was going to mention that you should buy a flash. Make sure it's TTL, buy a diffuser for it if you can't bounce it, and practicing using it....not ten minutes prior to the event.

Desperate times... Just got back from Best Buy (*shudder*, but dont worry, i nailed them pretty decently with coupons and reward zone credits, hehe) with a shiny new 580 EX II. Let the practice session begin!

The first few shots just with the flash bouncing off the ceiling (shooting random objects in my office) have already made me a fan of flash guns, hehe.

[highbarger]

Go get 'em, Thoreau! I hope you enjoy yourself and come out with some shots that you're proud of. The experience will do you a lot of good. Be sure to share some of your successful shots. Craig

[mrerico]

If all else fails. P mode can be help with the 580ex flash. :P

[I Simonius]

hmm, dont even have a flash?
If you had a flash and no experiance id say do it.
But you cant take proper photos without a strong flash or bouncing.
You can but they wont be as good as they should be.
Onboard flashes are not very strong.

If I were you, id agree to do it and ask for the money up front.
Run to the store and buy a 580EXII (id toss in the 200 and put up the rest myself)
Or just use the 200 to buy a 430ex.

Consider it a trade. You are doing thier show for a new flash.

Get the experiance. Dont be afraid to learn.

yeah go for it, but get lots of practice in before hand
Shoot RAW if you have enough CF cards so at least you can sort out the WB and any exposure boo boos more easily afterwards if you need to

yup - get that flash and make like a kangaroo! ( bounce bounce bounce)[ the flash)

[thoreau]

If all else fails. P mode can be help with the 580ex flash. :P

In the testing I've done so far, results with Av/Tv (my usual modes) with the flash on ETTL bounced seems to work some minor miracles. To say the least, I think I'm in love with this flash after a year and a half of insisting on available light.

yeah go for it, but get lots of practice in before hand
Shoot RAW if you have enough CF cards so at least you can sort out the WB and any exposure boo boos more easily afterwards if you need to

yup - get that flash and make like a kangaroo! ( bounce bounce bounce)[ the flash)

RAW for sure. I seem to be a horrible judge at setting the white balance at the time of the shot so I've come to rely pretty heavily on RAW + PP in Lightroom to correct it. Although the 40D seems to get pretty close to correct a lot more often than my 400D did.

I've got three 4 gig cards and an emergency 2 gig card in my bag at all times so hopefully I won't run out. The only time I ever came close to running out of space was at Barrett Jackson this year with the fashion show event that I managed to weasel my way into. Of course, keeping the camera on full-speed 6.5 fps mode will do that I suppose.

Now for the real fun... putting all this gear to use today! T-minus 465 minutes to show time and counting. Here's to praying I don't pooch this up!

[I Simonius]

In the testing I've done so far, results with Av/Tv (my usual modes) with the flash on ETTL bounced seems to work some minor miracles. To say the least, I think I'm in love with this flash after a year and a half of insisting on available light.



RAW for sure. I seem to be a horrible judge at setting the white balance at the time of the shot so I've come to rely pretty heavily on RAW + PP in Lightroom to correct it. Although the 40D seems to get pretty close to correct a lot more often than my 400D did.

I've got three 4 gig cards and an emergency 2 gig card in my bag at all times so hopefully I won't run out. The only time I ever came close to running out of space was at Barrett Jackson this year with the fashion show event that I managed to weasel my way into. Of course, keeping the camera on full-speed 6.5 fps mode will do that I suppose.

Now for the real fun... putting all this gear to use today! T-minus 465 minutes to show time and counting. Here's to praying I don't pooch this up!
good luck - plenty of chimping required I reckon!

[Az2Africa]

I've done two of these customer appreciation events for my employer. Horrible lighing to deal with, so I used an ExpoDisc to get close. The crowd shots get boring fast, so I also shot some portraits of some of the guests, close-ups of the food and a some of the display signs. They liked these types of shots the most. Don't be afraid to get close.
Here's a couple of samples.

241822

241823

[Az2Africa]

A couple more.

241824

241825

[thoreau]

Eek, been so busy since my last post here I almost forgot about making this thread!

Anywho, the shoot went pretty well I'd say. I'll have to gather up some of the good shots to post when I get home. There's nothing in there that I'd call gallery material, but for only having the flash for about 24 hours prior to the event, the shots turned out better than I'd expected. I didn't get into any uber setups or go strobist-style off camera or anything. Just a lotta bouncing off the ceiling (white, and quite low, perhaps 10 feet, thankfully) and definitely a good bit of chimping.

Apparently the shots were good enough though, as the admin assistant who was in charge of that event snagged me in the hall just a few minutes ago and asked me to shoot the upcoming employee rally next week. :D The venue will be a giant Marriott resort nearby (1300+ employees, and mandatory rally attendance, hehe) and I would've had to be there anyway. So I figured heck, why not get moola for it too!

Now to find out if I can get any info on the specific banquet area/ballroom ahead of time to prep. After some reading on the Strobist, I've got a sudden urge to grab a 2nd cheap flash and some pocketwizards and try some creative stuff. That, and maybe pick up a wider angle lens as my widest right now is the 24-70 2.8l.

Thank god for tax refunds!

[Steve Parr]

It sounds like they aren't hurting for money so why would they not hire a pro who who would have the equipment and the knowledge that goes with it.

I work for a very large guitar company, and we exhibit at a trade show every January.

One of the hallmarks of our exhibit is that we have performances throughout the day. In the past, we've had performers such as Everclear, the Goo Goo Dolls, Tommy Shaw and the like.

This year, we hired a professional to shoot the performances. Also shooting various performances were myself and another guy from our company (we had other responsibilities at the show, so couldn't shoot everything).

At one point, I was asked if I had an extra CF card that the hired professional could use. I thought that was kinda' funny. His shots were pretty good, but I'd put mine against his any time. To me, they were just uninspiring.

Well, we also have a quarterly publication with some pretty good circulation (100,000?). The other guy from our company and myself are staff photographers for it. When it came time to pick a cover shot for the upcoming issue, it was one of my shots, not one by "the pro", which got the nod.

In my opinion, hiring a pro isn't always going to guarantee that he'll provide the best results...

[I Simonius]

At one point, I was asked if I had an extra CF card that the hired professional could use. I thought that was kinda' funny. His shots were pretty good, but I'd put mine against his any time. To me, they were just uninspiring.

In my opinion, hiring a pro isn't always going to guarantee that he'll provide the best results...

huh! Some pro eh - ran out of CF cards - what a cheek to ask you for one!:rolleyes:

You shoulda said, no but I'll carry on where he left off!;)

[Adaptive]

#1 MOST IMPORTANT THING BEFORE YOU DECIDE ANYTHING

FIND OUT WHAT THEY WILL USE THE IMAGES FOR!!!!!


- Website: If they just want images for their website the largest they will display is 600x800 pixel image and that is even highly unlikely. Try viewing any photo at 600x800... You can have the crappiest out of focus image and it will look half way decent if you scale it down small enough. And you can crop the crap out of your images! So in my opinion if they just want pics for the website I'd say go for it!

- Fun Pictures/Customer Appreciation: Sometimes people hire photographers for just basic fun photographs, no real talent required to take customer appreciation photos. If they don't hire you to take the pictures they will hire the guy in the next cubical because he also has a camera. $200 is not a whole lot of money, they are not hiring you expecting pro images, they probably just know that your camera is a little bit bigger than the guy in the next cubical with the Nikon S7.

- Publication: Sometimes places like to make company brochures and publications. Depending on how up-scale the publication is you might want to watch out. If it is a weekly publication "newspaper style" then I'd say go for it. But if it is a yearly or quarterly publication that is professionally done with great images and stuff I would stay away because that is COMMERCIAL work. Commercial photographers get paid good money to take pictures at these kinds of events. Because if they are hiring you to take pictures that will be going into a big publication you are going to want to be very careful. Your full size images will have to be sharp, clear, and well lit. You can't do much cropping because the smaller the file you provide to the graphic artists the less happy he will be because of risk of pixelation. You are going to want to provide the highest quality possible to the printers/editors/graphic people. If you can't deliver stay clear!!