Advantages of Flash Brackets for portraits?

[FlipsidE]

I think I'm going to be headin out to check out a camera store here in town soon. I hope to come back with a few goodies. But, I'm wondering if a flash bracket should be on my list also. What advantages does a flash bracket offer? Also, are there any types I need to stay away from? or do they all function relatively the same?

Thanks

FlipsidE

[jhankins]

The number one advantage of the flash bracket is to elevate the flash away from the lens plane to drastically reduce or eliminate redeye. Most also allow you to rotate the camera while keeping the flash in the same position.

The downside of course is weight, balance (top heavy) and adding difficulty to use other hand for focus/zoom/adjustments etc.

In my mind it's a necessary evil. I use as it truely does a wonderful job of eliminating redeye in your portraits.

[efontana]

I think I'm going to be headin out to check out a camera store here in town soon. I hope to come back with a few goodies. But, I'm wondering if a flash bracket should be on my list also. What advantages does a flash bracket offer? Also, are there any types I need to stay away from? or do they all function relatively the same?

Thanks

FlipsidE

My understanding is that once you get the flash off the axis of the lens, you eliminate red-eye. The main reason for red-eye is that the reflected light from the flash comes right back thru the lens which causes the red-eye. That is the reason you get red-eye with the builtin flashes, they are simply too close in alignment with the lens, thus, the red-eye.

[efontana]

Wow, we posted the same answer within 1 minute of eachother!

[robertwgross]

The downside of course is weight, balance (top heavy) and adding difficulty to use other hand for focus/zoom/adjustments etc.


This is a little hard to explain, but I figured out how to support the flash bracket with my left shoulder, which allowed me to keep my left hand on the zoom ring. The rest of the support is by my right hand, and the right index finger is in the expected place.

Otherwise, I just mount it on a quick release on the top of my tripod.

---Bob Gross---

[FlipsidE]

Are there any flash brackets I should stay away from? Also, how does the signal to fire get from the camera hotshoe to the bracket shoe?

FlipsidE

[RichardtheSane]

You would also need a canon off shoe cord 2 so you could get the signal from the camer to the flash.

A bracket is good for eliminating red eye, but having a 550ex mounted on top of the camera seperates the light source far enough from the lens to do that.

The real advantages of a bracket is you cam ove the flash of to one side, higher up etc. This will dramatically improve any flash portraits as the light will be falling on the vict... subject at a different angle and will not look so flat.

[jhankins]

Best way to move away from flat lighting is the addition of multiple flashes off camera to get that modeling effect. I agree that the 550EX does help "get the flash up" but I still experience red eye with that set up on occasion. Especially when shooting in low light conditions where subject's pupils are dialated such as a dark wedding reception hall. Using the bracket virtually eliminates the problem, 550EX by itself reduces it considerably but does not eliminate it. An example of a trouble spot would be the wedding party sitting at an elevated table. Depending of course on your level to the subjects (it's not always possible to use your step ladder which I do use quite often) you'll get redeye in these shots unless you really get that flash up or off to the side.

Many of my flash shots use an assistant holding a slave 550 flash with a stofen diffuser and me with a bracket held 550ex on camera (also fitted with a Stofen diffuser). (When I'm doing handheld candid flash photography.)

Robert, perhaps a picture of how you support the camera would be helpful for others as well, I know it would be for me as I'm considering replacing my bracket for the very reason that you appear to have come up with a work around.

Cheers,

Jim

[OviV]

I just ordered a Stroboframe Pro-T which allows you to grip the camera as you do usually so you do not need a hand on the bracket itself.

On a separate note:

Those of you using the Stofen Omni Bouce: Do you use it when there is no ceiling to bounce off of? If you do, what position is your flash head in? Do you tilt it at 45 degrees, 65, etc. I have seen PJs on tv outdoors using an omnibounce pointed up. Is this the correct way to use these tupper ware thingys?

Ovi

[FlipsidE]

That Stroboframe Pro-T looks EXCELLENT! Thanks for the heads up on that one.

FlipsidE

[jhankins]

I've had the best luck just straight on. If I have a ceiling to bounce off of that is white (otherwise you'll have color cast) I'll use it. Most often, straight on. Yes you can use at other angles but I've found I get more under exposed shots this way. The difference with just using the stofen straight on vs no stofen is immediately obvious and in my opinion quite a nice look for such a simple device.

Jim

[Webster]

While getting the flash higher is certainly nice, the real reason I use my bracket is to keep the flash above the camera, even when I rotate the camera 90 degrees. This eliminates those really ugly side shadows.

[FlipsidE]

While getting the flash higher is certainly nice, the real reason I use my bracket is to keep the flash above the camera, even when I rotate the camera 90 degrees. This eliminates those really ugly side shadows.

I hope to do a lot of portrait/studio type work. The ability to keep the keep the flash above the camera even in portrait angle sounds great...if not absolutely necessary!

FlipsidE

[robertwgross]

Are there any flash brackets I should stay away from?

Probably. The very cheapest ones are all in one piece and have virtually no adjustments. The better ones allow several adjustments for the position of the camera body and the position of the flash unit. I had to study mine for quite a while to figure out how to take advantage of all of the bells and whistles.

---Bob Gross---

[Headcase650]

The Custome Brackets CB Junior has the bracket handle on the right side and it out of the way enough to hold the cameta normaly for hand held candids, In the studio we mount it to a tripod and use a remote shutter release.

[DaveG]

I think I'm going to be headin out to check out a camera store here in town soon. I hope to come back with a few goodies. But, I'm wondering if a flash bracket should be on my list also. What advantages does a flash bracket offer? Also, are there any types I need to stay away from? or do they all function relatively the same?

Thanks

FlipsidE

I use a bracket - the Stroboframe Pro-T - and it does indeed get the flash high and reduces the possibility of read eye. But if you are using a relatively short lens, which implies that the subjects are fairly close - then having the 550 flash in the hotshoe should prevent red eye all by itself. With a very long lens (a 70-200 for example) you might still get red eye if the subject is some distance away,in spite of using the flash in a bracket.

This has more to do with the fact that the farther the subject is from the flash the more the flash/lens distance is going to be porportionately closer. To give a stupid example: If the subject was on the moon and someone had a camera in New York - some lens eh? - and the flash was in Boston, you'd probably get red eye since the flash to lens distance will seem very close together from the subject's perspective.

In any case the main reason that I use a bracket is to avoid any side shadow behind the subject. If I use a flash in a hot shoe and flip it all into a vertical shooting position, the subject will have a shadow behind their head, and it'll run all along their body, on the side opposite from the flash. This is completely unacceptable in professional photography, even for things like plaque presentations. As long as you don't let your subjects get to close to a wall, the bracket, with the flash head directly over the lens, will prevent side shadow, and then maybe your editor won't chase you all over the newsroom screaming at you.

Not that that's ever happened to me.

As far as "portraits" go, a one light set up is usually not enough. The main light should come from some place other than the camera position. It's OK for the presentation shots and the like, but you want to be using some lighting ratios to make attractive lighting.

I do use the 550EX in the bracket and it becomes the fill light. The fill light by definition must be between 20 degrees of the camera position. The theory is that from this position the fill flash's light will be equal on both sides of the subject's face.

Then yo need a main light, and that can be anywhere you want to put it. 45 degrees to one side of the camera position tends to be a common placement. You set it up so that the main light is about one stop brighter than the fill. Without going into theory this means that you've achieved a 3:1 lighting ratio. Now slide film, colour neg, black and white, and now digital, will easily handle a one stop latitude. This means that you have a directional light from the non camera position and you have filled in the shadows enough so that there's shadow detail.

For that second flash you could use a Canon 420 and the Canon Wireless TTL system. Now the only problem with the Canon Wireless system is that it will make exposure decisions for each subject based on the relative brightness of their clothing. With E-TTL 2 this might be a lot better but for true consistency from shot to shot you'll need studio strobes of some kind and a flash meter.

[FlipsidE]

I had planned on getting strobes sometime in the near future. As a matter of fact, an entire studio setup would have been preferrable...and, I was actually planning the money to spend on one. But, then my car had $400 worth of problems, I have property taxes coming up on my car very soon, and of course, we have Christmas in less that two months.

Now, I've done a lot of thinkin of what would be the next best step to take to just, at least start taking portrait shots...to stop just reading books and start with some hands on experience.

Better glass is always the best place to start as I only currently have the kit lens. The lens I want is $230. That's just a tad out of my price range at this moment in time (because of my car). So, I figured...my current lens, while not so hot, still can capture photos. And, even if I got better glass, I'd still need a way to light the subject correctly (or at least as well as I can with a 420EX). So, I started thinkin about it. What would help? First off, some lumiquest products. They are cheap, and they can really help with lighting (bouncers as well as a softbox or two). A flash bracket was suggested during a thread of mine sometime early this week or late last week. So, it came to mind today. After hearing what you all say about flash brackets, it would only seem fitting to get one. Reduce red eye, allow for portrait angle, and more.

Of course, I'd prefer the $230 tripod, the $1500 Alien Bees strobe package, the $250 flash meter, and a few backgrounds. But, as of right now, I can't buy them. And, buying only one of them means I'm lacking in other areas. New glass means I'm lacking in lighting and lighting angle. Flash bracket, bouncers, and diffusers means I'm lacking in glass. New tripod only makes my camera sturdier. Strobes are just yet too expensive. And, a flash meter does me little good w/out strobes to meter.

So, I took a step back and asked myself...what is the least expensive thing I can do to take my current Dreb w/ kit lens + 420EX and set them up so that I can start trying my hand at true portrait photography? The flash bracket, off camera shoe, and lumiquest package just seems to be the correct way to go right now. All of that is less expensive than the portrait lens I want. And, IMO, that will allow me to at least start taking a few decent shots to get used to things until I can actually afford a basic studio setup.

I've thought about this whole situation to a fault...just too much thinking. And, this is the best conclusion I can come to with my current budget. I've felt very restricted so far. There's only so much I can take pictures of landscape-wise around my apt complex. And, my kit lens won't do macro well at all. Haven't been able to travel much because of my car (which is still having a bit of a problem). And, the weather around here has been HORRIBLE for photography as of late (dark overcast, mist and rain for the past three weeks (since I bought my camera) w/ only a few days of sunlight). I want to start doing something, and taking photographs of people is where I'd like to focus my efforts. IMO, this is the best way to start.

Honestly, any other suggestions would be very welcome.

Thanks

FlipsidE

[Headcase650]

You dont have to spend a fortune to get great portraits. you have a rebel, you have the kit lense and you have a flash.. Right now we shoot in our dining room, its aprox 16'x12'. We have a $130 background stand, a white muslin, black velvet, brown muslin and a white vinel,. We didnt have to buy the backgrounds (Free, old ones from my girlfriends day job at a national portrait studio) but you can find some great deals on ebay. We use a cheap set of smith vector hot lights ( 2-500w photo floods with 36" umbrellas less than $220 aprox) one is set fairly close at a 45 on the right side of the camera for a main light, the other is on the left side but placed further away as a fill. Oh and there is a 100w light on the cealing directly above the subject. We set a custome white balance for the lighting in the room. With a total of 1100w in the room it isnt super bright like strobes so we set the ISO to 400 and get a shutter of 125/second at f2.8, this is great for adults but not quite fast enough for moving kids so we bumb up the shutter (underexpose about 1 1/2 stop) on the kids and bring it back up in photoshop. Tripod is a manfroto 728B with intigrated pan head ($120). Lenses, if you dont have a lot of room between the subject and background you will need a faster lense for a shallow depth-of-field to seperate the subject from the background. We use the 50/1.8($80) and since the room is only 16 food long we use the 28/2.8($160) for full body shots and groups up to four or five people. Our flash is used for location work and for outdoor fill flash portraits. We plan on getting some monolights in the future but dont plan on spending a whole bunch, Im realy interested in the Flashpoint II's that Adorama sells, they have great features at a great price, you can read a review in this months popular photo. (note: if you buy hotlights dont use your flash with them the light temps dont mix at all) Im sure someone else can add to this.

[FlipsidE]

I'm sure that there are more inexpensive ways to come up with a quality studio lighting setup. I'm not denying that at all. I have my eyes set on the AB's, so that's probably what I'll get. The point right now, though, is that I cannot afford an inexpensive studio setup. The point is that I'm trying to find some way to start taking decent portrait shots (even if I don't have any backgrounds). Be it outside with just some fill-in flash or inside where my 420EX is my main light source, I want to find a way to get started.

These are my thoughts on it. Please correct me if I'm wrong. If you're lucky enough to have a low white ceiling, you're good to go. But, I'm not always going to be gauranteed that. So, flash bouncers are pobably somewhat necessary to take decent portait shots. A good diffuser as well as some colored inserts for the bouncer would really add some better effect (esp for glamour photography...which, in the end, is what I'm shooting for). So, that's $65 there. Add a $90 flash bracket and a $50 off camera shoe, and that equals out to about $205 (give or take).

So the 18-55 EF-S isn't so great, but it is a lens that can take photos. $205 is still less than the 28-105/3.5-4.5 that is on my wish list. And, that would give me a decent lighting setup to start shooting a few portrait type shots.

What do you think? Good/bad/mediocre?

Thanks

FlipsidE

[CanonUser]

Beside avoiding red eyes, a flash bracket keeps the flash ABOVE the subject for a more natural looking shadow cast in all camera shooting position. Nothing screams "AMATEUR" louder than a face lit from one side in a portrait oriented photo.

[scottbergerphoto]

I have been doing alot of on location portraits lately for practice. I have found the following kit to be very portable and functional:
1. (2) 550EX's and (1) 420EX
2. (1) lightstand, umbrella and multibracket to attach a flash.
3. (24) AA Nimh Batteries
4. Canon 10D or 1 D Mark II with 24-70 f/2.8

I put one 550EX as Master(A) on the camera for fill, one 550EX as a slave(B) on the lightstand/umbrella(this is the Key Light), and the 420EX as slave (C) as the background light. I set the Wireless ETTL Ratios as (A:B):C as (1:3):-1 to 1 depending on the distance to the background.
This works very well. It beats carrying around my case of monlights. The flashes and camera fit in a LowePro Stealth Reporter AW.
Here is an example:
http://www.pbase.com/scottbergerphoto/image/35701558.jpg
Scott