Covering a boxing match with Sigma 4.0

[Ferox13]

Ok last time I tried to take shots of a boxing match it was a disaster; all of them came out blurry. It's a lit ring, but everything else is fairly dark. I tried using my ex500 flash to no avail. I was about 50ft away. The camera was on full auto mode (I had just gotten it and didn't have time yet to learn it). The on-camera flash actually worked better, but that probably means basically there was no flash at all since it only works for a few feet. The camera was probably popping it up since I was in a dark area. The lens was a 70-200 4.0-6.0 lens, an "entry" level lens that was around $150. The pix obviously came out fairly dark. I didn't even keep them.

Another event at this same location is coming Nov 20th. I'll be there and would like to take some good pix. I was really hoping to have the 70-200 2.8/f L by then but I won't.

Could someone offer some suggestions? Is getting good shots with this cheapy lens in these lighting conditions hopeless?

Obviously this time I plan on putting the lens in shutter priority of at least 800, but I'm hoping the aperture will work ok at that rate in these conditions. I'm also definitely getting ringside seats this time and am finding out if I can actually be at the ropes while shooting, I imagine that would help greatly. I also plan on taking some pre-show shots, but they usually have the lights on before it starts.

Thoughts? Thanks

[psychedelic_never]

Hi Ferox, I won't disappoint you but 1/800 is a bit too much to aim. Not to mention that your max flash sync speed is just 1/200. But what u can try doing is bump the ISO to 800. And since you'll be close to the ring next time and the area to cover is not too much try to get a decent fast prime lens, it'll be cheaper than the 70-200 2.8f u have mentioned.

[Persian-Rice]

It does not really matter if the lens is cheap or not, rather a matter of how big of a diaphragm you have.

Chances are that in a pretty dark setting unless you have 2.8, a good noise removal method and a strong flash, you will have a hard time getting great photos.
When shooting motorsports, you get outdoor lighting and you can use a slow shutter speed quite effectively. However, in boxing you need to freeze the action, blurring will not help the image.

The biggest problem is that the most effective camera for something like boxing is a 1 series. Although the 20D performs well under high ISO, its focusing capabilities are still relatively slow compared to a 1 series. This is a sport where things are always moving and moving fast. So the camera can be an issue as well, especially if you are using a 300D or 10D or even 20D.

If you can, get as close to the ring as possible and use a strong flash. The closer you get, the shorter lens you need, hence makinmg it easier to freeze the action with a slower shutter. If you are an experienced photographer and are using a D series camera, you might want to resort to manual focusing.

Cheers

[Ferox13]

[double post, sorry]

[Ferox13]

It does not really matter if the lens is cheap or not,

"All things being equal" it does - the one I plan on getting has far faster focusing and a constant aperture.


Chances are that in a pretty dark setting unless you have 2.8, a good noise removal method and a strong flash, you will have a hard time getting great photos.

Again the max on this lens is 4.0 The flash is an ex550, which I understand is fairly good.

The biggest problem is that the most effective camera for something like boxing is a 1 series.

Obvoiusly waaaay out of the price range. I plan on upgrade to a 20d within several months, but I'm using a 300d at the moment.

Although the 20D performs well under high ISO, its focusing capabilities are still relatively slow compared to a 1 series.

I thought focusing was a function of the lens - ?

This is a sport where things are always moving and moving fast.

Well, not entirely true. There are plenty of times when they're not moving.

If you can, get as close to the ring as possible and use a strong flash.

That I can do...

[psychedelic_never]

I thought focusing was a function of the lens - ?


Yes it is, but its the camera who decides where to focus and tell the lens about it. The series 1 bodies have better algorithms and computing power and hence can tell the lens where to focus faster. So the order is sent out faster but the execution depends on the lens in use. Hope that clears your doubt.

[gmen]

Have a look at this thread - very useful info on boxing photography:

http://www.sportsshooter.com/message_display.html?tid=8445

Check out the post from Robert Hanashiro!

If you're able to work from the ringside through the ropes your best bet (if your budget isn't huge) might be to pick up a 50mm f/1.8 lens. This is nice and fast, pretty sharp and will enable you to get shots when the fighters are relatively close to you. Ideally a combination of a 24-70mm f/2.8 and a 70-200mm f/2.8 would be used in these circumstances - but the 50mm plus 550ex will get you some shots if you shoot selectively.

If you're away from the ring but low down, the ropes are going to prove problematic anyway. It might not be worth shooting at all if that's the case.

The alternative is to shoot from a higher angle, looking down on the fighters. In those circumstances then you're back to square one I'm afraid - the pros would be using a 300mm or 400mm f/2.8 lens complete with remote strobes hanging from the rafters in the venue if the ambient light wasn't up to it. The 550EX is a superb flash, but just doesn't have enough ooomph to work over those sorts of distances.

Hopefully you can get up close with something like the 50mm and use the 550ex to get some good shots. If you need any advice on working with flash in these circumstances, drop me a line via my website - you won't always be able to rely on the TTL system and it may need a different approach to get reliable exposures.

[GenEOS]

It can be done. Since they seem to allow you to use a flash, you have some options a lot of boxing photogs don't. If you have a off camera cord, use it to get the flash off axis as much as the cord will allow. If you have the remote capability of a 550ex and st-e2, try that to even get the light more off axis. These can be really creative and cool, if you are allowed to use flash. I have never shot a boxing match were flashes were allowed at ringside.

You need higher ISO and higher shutter speeds. 1/320 would be a minimum, the higher the better. Your camera will allow flash firing above 1/200th if you put the flash in high speed sync mode. At ringside, this should be fine. You will just need a good fill flash and not enough to light the whole room.

Your lighting is not ideal and the poor f/stop on your lens are handicapps, but you should be able to get some creative good work from the equipment you have.

[davidwegs]

I thought focusing was a function of the lens - ?


Yes it is, but its the camera who decides where to focus and tell the lens about it. The series 1 bodies have better algorithms and computing power and hence can tell the lens where to focus faster. So the order is sent out faster but the execution depends on the lens in use. Hope that clears your doubt.

FYI, Rob Galbraith did some testing of the 1d2 vs. the 20d. His conclusion was there was barely a difference in ability to focus both quickly and accurately. Check this out.

http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_page.asp?cid=7-6458-7153-7161


In particular this:
"With f/2.8 or faster lenses, the 20D's centre AF sensor still uses both sets of vertically-oriented pixel arrays, but switches from the inner horizontally-oriented pixel array pair to the more widely-spaced outer pair. This puts the centre AF sensor into high-precision mode, which Canon claims is 3x more precise than the 20D's normal precision mode. We're not sure what 3x more precise should feel like, but can attest to the fact that with both wide angle and telephoto lenses whose maximum aperture is f/2.8, the speed with which the 20D acquires focus using the centre AF sensor, even in dim light, is considerably quicker than the 10D (and gives the EOS-1D Mark II a run for its money also)."

[Ferox13]

Have a look at this thread - very useful info on boxing photography:

http://www.sportsshooter.com/message_display.html?tid=8445



Thanks for the info guys.

After reading this, what I'm considering is, buying a 50mm 1.4 lens (which got outstanding reviews, better than the 1.8 from digital-picture.com) and then selling it when I ge the 70-200L next month.

Thoughts?

[gmen]

The way to go I think.

Maybe get some shots with the 50mm f/1.4, sell the pics (not the lens) and use the cash to buy the 70-200mm L - that way you get to keep the 50mm too!

Just a thought. Good luck!

[Ferox13]

The way to go I think.

Maybe get some shots with the 50mm f/1.4, sell the pics (not the lens) and use the cash to buy the 70-200mm L - that way you get to keep the 50mm too!

Just a thought. Good luck!

LOL! Thanks for the flattery, but I highly doubt anyone would buy a pic I took... I'm a complete amateur.

I just bought this lens: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3850953561

Think that will work well on my 300d rebel in the above conditions? Thanks again so much.

[gmen]

That should do the job! Happy shooting!