First Photograph Published in Newspaper, Should I Milk It?

[Jonathan Taylor]

Hey all, some of you may have seen my thread up in the people section on my encounter with President Bush: http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=476420

If you see on page 4, one of my images made the front page of a local newspaper that is distributed to approximately 144,000 free subscribers and 25,000 other readers (libraries, schools, restaurants, etc). This was the first time I had ever sent an image into a newspaper before, and it made the cover spread. I was not paid for this image because it is outside of the companies budget to pay first-time outside photographers. Keep in mind that I am not a photojournalist (yet), and I was lucky enough to have my big break on the first try. The editor has promised me a spot on a list of paid freelance photographers that they contact when they need an outside assignment, which they rarely give to first-time submitters.

I know I should be pleased with the credit and the promise of assignments to follow, and dont get me wrong, I am, but should I be milking this for something more than I've already got? Is this an appropriate time to ask the editor for press credentials or a media pass or some sort?

I have also been in contact with the County Sheriff (whom I've photographed multiple times), and now that I've proven myself to be a front-page worthy photographer, I'm considering milking him as well. Maybe asking him for press credentials or the opportunity to join him in a few ride-alongs to help me jump head first into photojournalism.

Give me your opinions, this is all relatively new to me (as I'm a portrait and wedding photographer, not so much a newspaper photojournalist).

Thanks!
~Jonathan

[bildeb0rg]

Go for it, you've got nothing to lose.

[Curtis N]

I was not paid for this image because it is outside of the companies budget to pay first-time outside photographers.Before you can milk them, you need to stop them from milking you! Your picture was good enough for front page, but not good enough to pay for? You're getting screwed.

Does this newspaper have reporters who are working for free? Editors? Advertising Reps? Press operators? I think not. They all get paid, even for their first day on the job.

The promise of future freelance assignments is an all-too-common tactic by newspapers to get people to continue sending them free stuff. Don't buy it.

If you want paid work from them, you may want to continue to attend events and send them an image or two occasionally, to remind them of your skills. But don't give them permission to publish anything without an agreement for cash compensation beforehand.

The world is full of press photog wannabees, and newspapers love to take advantage of them.

[DragonSpeed]

My personal thought:

1) The line about not having budget. BS. If it had been one of their "paid" guys, they'd have paid for the shot.

2) Hell yeah, if they expect you to be out taking photos for them, you don't want to get hung up on getting creds at the last second.

3) I'm with Curtis on this. Businesses aren't exactly the most "charitable" in their handling of "freelancers" They'll bleed you dry if you let 'em :(

[EveryMilesAMemory]

This newspaper is banking on the fact that they dont think you are going to say much because you're excited about getting your first picture published.

I'd ask them to pony up!

[butcha27]

As hard as it is the first time, you do have to try and get something out of them or they will try to take you for a free ride as long as they can. Like any big news photo, no matter who takes it, if it is good enuff they will pay or even if the image is average and the content is important they will pay, even if it's from a mobile phone!

Don't let them tell you they can't aford you, any shot that is on the front of a paper is probably the most relevant shot in the paper, and the shot they are leading with for sales or to catch a readers eye,that has to be worth something!?

[Jonathan Taylor]

Okay, I'll go with y'alls advice and let him know that I feel cheated, and that if my picture was front page worthy, the one image in the whole newspaper that he depended on to attract readers, read the ads, and therefore make him money, why was my picture not compensation worthy?

Next thing, before I begin this fight and run the risk of getting cheated again, plain and simple, how much money should I expect from this? I have no history of professionally photojournalism and I have no idea how to judge the value of an image. There are too many factors for me to try to guess (size of the newspaper, value of the company, number of readers, number of employees, location in the paper, etc).

Thanks for the support guys, this is all gray area for me.
~Jonathan

[neil_r]

Before you can milk them, you need to stop them from milking you! Your picture was good enough for front page, but not good enough to pay for? You're getting screwed.

Have to agree with that, You made his front page for him, he made you a promise that cost him nothing.

Sorry I have just checked out the link at the top of the page and I am still laughing. You deface your low res images with the nastiest watermark I have seen in a long time....... And then YOU GIVE THEM AWAY to a newspaper to use on their front page !

[Super Bee 950]

Why would he pay you in the future if you give him front page work for nothing? Knowing you will work for free will only undercut your worth in the future.

I also find the humor Neil is talking about. People want to publish it and you gave it away for free! WTF??

[Jonathan Taylor]

My main reason for not pushing harder in the beginning was (whether or not it was true) that there was another woman at the scene that had taken several pictures and had submitted them all for free with complete rights to publish. This woman was armed with nothing but a small point-and-shoot and was apparently my only competition. I never saw her images, but I was told that there was a 50/50 chance between my image and her images to be published. He told me 'which ever looks best on the page' (little did I know he was thinking FRONT page!) My first assumption was 'Get my picture in for free, or not get it at all.'

I do wish to continue working with this newspaper in the future, but I refuse to let him undercut me again. What should I do whilst remaining respectful?

[Jonathan Taylor]

Sorry I have just checked out the link at the top of the page and I am still laughing. You deface your low res images with the nastiest watermark I have seen in a long time....... And then YOU GIVE THEM AWAY to a newspaper to use on their front page !

The watermark was a last minute thing that I did to post here on the forums. I always resize my originals in MS Paint to throw on here, so that was the best watermark I could do in that program. Maybe I went a little overboard, but like I said, I'm totally new at this whole 'selling my images to newspapers' thing.

[T2000]

" was not paid for this image because it is outside of the companies budget to pay first-time outside photographers."

Do you realize how funny that line is ?

"I know I should be pleased with the credit and the promise of assignments to follow, and dont get me wrong, I am, "

That's crazy dude.

[amfoto1]

Hi,

It's all water under the proverbial bridge at this point. There's no sense going back and "letting the editor know" that you now realize you got taken to the cleaners by them. Just file it away as experience and don't let them or anyone else do it again.

You're initial response should have been, "Sure, I'll give you one-time, media exclusive rights to publish it for $250"... or something like that. If he says "Sorry", just say thanks and go directly to the competing newspaper or magazine with your photo.

One other important thing, did you sign away too many rights? The newspaper isn't by any chance putting the photo(s) out on the wire services and reselling are they?

Yeah, looking at the images I can see how they knew the minute they saw the photos that you weren't very experienced selling to the media. If it was on what you showed them, too, the watermark is a dead giveaway. Next time post/print smaller, lower rez images and forget the watermark. If your EXIF has proper copyright info in it, you're covered. Heck, actually you're covered even if it doesn't. That watermark just told them "Hey, I'm totally new at this and I really, really don't trust you!".

[JX]

First, a newspaper will milk you before you will ever milk them. Newspapers are cheap. For now enjoy the fact that you have a photo credit and a photo published.


This woman was armed with nothing but a small point-and-shoot and was apparently my only competition. I never saw her images, but I was told that there was a 50/50 chance between my image and her images to be published. He told me 'which ever looks best on the page' (little did I know he was thinking FRONT page!) My first assumption was 'Get my picture in for free, or not get it at all.'



Unfortunately, newspapers are encouraging people to submit photos. Reporters are required to carry point and shot cameras. Most have cut their freelance budgets in half, along with the number of staff photographers.

[RandyMN]

Newspapers are an endangered species. It's time to look elsewhere if you wish to have a future in photography.

[Curtis N]

Newspapers are an endangered species. It's time to look elsewhere if you wish to have a future in photography.The better ones are gradually reinventing themselves as internet-based multi-media news sources, as advertising revenue makes a similar shift from print to website.

There will be a demand for photojournalism for some time to come. But if you go to work for a newspaper, don't be surprised if they send you out with a DSLR in one hand and a camcorder in the other.

[Analog6]

I do not agree newspapers are dead. I'm extremely computer savvy and read my news online but stillbuy a quality newspaper 6 days a week.

Jonathon, pricing from : http://photographersindex.com/stockprice.htm

Stock Photo pricing for Editorial use.

Type of Use:: Editorial
Specific Use:: Newspaper
Press Run:: 100,000 to 250,000
Size:: Full page or Major Illustratio
Low Price:: $225.00
Average Price:: $387.50
High Price:: $550.00
Survey ::919
These prices are presented as a guide for negotiation. All prices assume one time non exclusive reproduction rights. Copyright should NEVER be sold. There is NEVER a legitimate reason to transfer Copyright except to deny the creator of the image. All licensing is dependent upon payment of the licensing fee. Use is not licensed until payment is received. Higher or lower prices will apply depending on use, uniqueness of the image, suitability, prestige of the photographer, credit lines, and other factors that should be negotiated. Disclaimer: If this pricing program causes you distress, financial loss, or marital discord, we take no responsibility - If it increases your income, business success, or educational standing, you are not obligated to pay for its use. Errors and omissions: The program is new and may require some corrections. Please report any bugs to the webmaster. Direct your questions and comments to Photographers index webmaster (webmaster@photographersindex.com)

I'd try sending them an invoice - to the publishers, not the Editor. Make it for the low price quoted, you may not get it but it's much better than a poke in the eye, which is what you've got at the moment!

[narlus]

I'd try sending them an invoice - to the publishers, not the Editor. Make it for the low price quoted, you may not get it but it's much better than a poke in the eye, which is what you've got at the moment!


they will laugh at the invoice before deleting it. they got their photo, and used it.

had the OP charged $250 before sending it, who's to say that they wouldn't have gone to plan B and used the P&S shooter's image?

as far as future opportunities w/ the paper, go...sure, go for it. nothing to lose. but will lightning strike twice? you were in the right place and the right time, and provided usable images. will that happen again? i guess it sorta depends on what this paper already has for freelancers and staff photogs already.