Elinchrom D-light questions before purchase..

[Axton]

I've read a lot about these and I think I've decided on the Elinchrom D-Light2.
I love my current strobist-type setup but I need quicker cycle time and more consistency.
I have a couple questions though pertaining to this kit from B&H:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/478440-REG/Elinchrom_EL_20811KIT_D_Lite2_2_Monolight_Kit.html

-Do I need to spend the extra $100 for 2 reflectors? (I will be using umbrellas as well as the included softboxes).

-I've never used softboxes before, so are the ones included in this kit sufficient for full-body shots?

-I've read here that my umbrella shafts are too large for these monolights. What size specifically do I need?

-Also, can't I just attach the monolight to the umbrella stand I already have (just as I do for my hotshoe flash setup) and use my existing umbrella?

Any help is appreciated.

[aia21]

The answers to your questions are (in this order):

- Yes (the kit does not come with reflectors at all).

- I am not sure as I don't have them but as I understand it the answer is no, but you could try putting the two boxes/lights underneath each other thus generating a taller softbox.

- 7mm

- Yes you can but the light will not be centred in the umbrella.

Best regards,

Anton

[dragulaz]

Anton's answers are correct, and to expand on question number 2, the included softboxes are good for head/shoulder shots..maybe slightly more, but that's about it. I have invested in a larger softbox to supplement. I do however, find that the included softboxes have other uses (they make good fill lights, accent lights or hair lights), so I would still recommend the kit.

[hawk911]

I second the above info.

#1- depends on what you want to shoot.
2- softboxes are too small for full body- I have a 32x48 that I bought from backdrop outlet that seems more appropriate for the shots.
3- Wescott umbrellas are 8mm, and the Elinchrom reflector uses a 7mm; either sand down the 8mm, or buy the Elinchrom reflectors and umbrellas. The elinchrom way is not going to be $100 though; maybe double that all said and done.

Lastly, the Dlite has a receiver if you will, that goes over a post not a mount like a speedlight has. You'd have to fabricate something to get it to work with existing umbrellas, or use 2 stands- 1 for the light, and 1 for the umbrella sitting in front of the light. Seems a bit silly to not just buy the kit and reflectors if you like umbrellas.

[silvex]

How about the d-lite 4 (twice the power that d-lite 2) for full body shots ?

[aia21]

It has nothing to do with the power! The D-lite2 is perfectly capable for full body shots. The softboxes that come with the D-lite2 and D-lite4 (both come with the same softboxes) are too small for full body shots...

Best regards,

Anton

[irishman]

I second the above info.

#1- depends on what you want to shoot.
2- softboxes are too small for full body- I have a 32x48 that I bought from backdrop outlet that seems more appropriate for the shots.
3- Wescott umbrellas are 8mm, and the Elinchrom reflector uses a 7mm; either sand down the 8mm, or buy the Elinchrom reflectors and umbrellas. The elinchrom way is not going to be $100 though; maybe double that all said and done.

Lastly, the Dlite has a receiver if you will, that goes over a post not a mount like a speedlight has. You'd have to fabricate something to get it to work with existing umbrellas, or use 2 stands- 1 for the light, and 1 for the umbrella sitting in front of the light. Seems a bit silly to not just buy the kit and reflectors if you like umbrellas.

But if you buy the D-Lites you can always use the infamo!us 53" Octa bank

[silvex]

It has nothing to do with the power! The D-lite2 is perfectly capable for full body shots. The softboxes that come with the D-lite2 and D-lite4 (both come with the same softboxes) are too small for full body shots...

Best regards,

Anton

So if I get larger (strip boxes) I am able to do full body shots w/either d-lite2/4 ?

[tmonatr]

You may want to consider the Calumet genesis 200 kit. I believe they are made by Elinchrom and are considerably cheaper.http://www.calumetphoto.com/item/CF0502K1/

[aia21]

So if I get larger (strip boxes) I am able to do full body shots w/either d-lite2/4 ?

Yes.

Best regards,

Anton

[silvex]

You may want to consider the Calumet genesis 200 kit. I believe they are made by Elinchrom and are considerably cheaper.http://www.calumetphoto.com/item/CF0502K1/

That is VERY tempting...VERY VERY tempting...specially if made by elinchrom...:)

[silvex]

VISA I think it is a sponsor of POTN...:shock: ...:)

[jgettis]

I have the Genesis 400's and do not believe that they are made by Elinichrome. I am not at home now but unless I am mistaken they are made in China. They do however use the same mount for the softboxes and reflector. My thought is they work fine now and if for some reason in the future I am able to afford the Elinichrome lights(lottery) the modifiers that I buy now will fit them. John

[tmonatr]

I have the Genesis 400's and do not believe that they are made by Elinichrome. I am not at home now but unless I am mistaken they are made in China. They do however use the same mount for the softboxes and reflector. My thought is they work fine now and if for some reason in the future I am able to afford the Elinichrome lights(lottery) the modifiers that I buy now will fit them. John
I'm not sure if they are made by Elinchrom or not, but in an earlier post, several said they were:http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=437877&highlight=calumet+genesis
Hey, if it's posted on the internet, it must be true, right?;)

[hawk911]

But if you buy the D-Lites you can always use the infamo!us 53" Octa bank

Sorry, meant the kit softboxes are too small for full body. Larger version are available. ;)

[silvex]

I called calumet in santa ana, ca and they are NOT made by elinchrom. They do take their modifiers -- He also would not give me their guide number. They seem good as a learning kit to get you ready to move to the "pro" type. I might buy this kit and get elinchrom mods and later get an elinchrom kit (d-lite4)

[Axton]

Thanks for all of the input...
That Calumet kit does look tempting. Anyone have any experience to compare this and the Elinchrom D-Light2??

If I went with the Calumet kit will I be able to attach my Cactus V2 wireless to one of the heads? The Cactus reciever has a sync port on the side but the actual Calumet head looks like it has a bigger/different type female sync port?

Your help is invaluable to me.

[jgettis]

I checked the instruction book that came with the Genesis lights and the guide number is 160 @ 10 feet for the 400's. This is also on the website in the specs portion of the product information. Checked the box and the are made in China. I also seem to remember reading that the D-lites are not made in the same place as the rest of the Elinchrome lights are. I did a search and came up with an article in a British Photo mag that said that they are made in India John

[bigbaby987]

I have the Dlite 4 kit and love it. I would suggest that if you can squeeze out the extra few dollars or save a little longer, get the extra power. It's better to have it and not need it, than need it and have to sell, take a loss and re-buy. I think we've all been there. I even took my lights to a sweet 16 recently and let them fire from the corners of the room and then did pretty good. One bare bulb, the other with soft box. I really should have had reflectors, but hey....

Have fun, and enjoy.

I will say that they have just about payed for themselves in just a very short period of time.

[dragulaz]

I have the Dlite 4 kit and love it. I would suggest that if you can squeeze out the extra few dollars or save a little longer, get the extra power. It's better to have it and not need it, than need it and have to sell, take a loss and re-buy.

As someone who has made the mistake of buying too much power, I would say it all depends on your needs, size of studio space, etc. Tough to make a blanket statement like that. I have the D-Lite 2's and still am consistently in the lower half of the power band most of the time.

[bigbaby987]

I am too, but I'm glad that if I ever needed that power, I'm not stuck out there. But, I must say that if you're in a definite studio situation and you know the type of power you need, then go for it. I just come from the motto of my previous post.

How many of us actually have more lenses, camera bags, cf cards, ect than we actually need? You're talking less than $200.

[Hermes]

I called calumet in santa ana, ca and they are NOT made by elinchrom. They do take their modifiers -- He also would not give me their guide number. They seem good as a learning kit to get you ready to move to the "pro" type. I might buy this kit and get elinchrom mods and later get an elinchrom kit (d-lite4)

There isn't much point buying one entry-level kit and then saving up to replace it with another - you don't get decent build quality, cooling, modelling lights, ability to use heavy light modifiers e.t.c., until you reach the Elinchrom FX/BX range.

[hawk911]

The choice between D2 and D4, IMO, is whether you can modify the light enough to use even the lower settings on the D4. I have to play more, but sometimes I think for my garage studio, the D4 is too much. I shoot in a 22x38 garage with 10' ceilings.

[irishman]

I bought the D-4's on the same thought pattern that its best to have more light and use less if you have to. The D-4's are pretty powerful and I often have to stop down the aperature. No biggie.

[hawk911]

I bought the D-4's on the same thought pattern that its best to have more light and use less if you have to. The D-4's are pretty powerful and I often have to stop down the aperature. No biggie.

no biggie until your OOF BG is now in focus, right?:confused:

[digitaljoe]

I have the 2's but would buy the 4's if I had to do it again. The extra bit of power can be useful particularly when using softboxes.

Photek softlighter make a 7mm shaft umbrella - good quality and cheaper than Elin's. There is one other brand too. Google! Take it easy when tightening the knob which handles the angle of the lights - it can strip! Love the Elin controls. Make sure you buy the D-Lites with fans. There is still some old stock around.

[silvex]

I have the 2's but would buy the 4's if I had to do it again. The extra bit of power can be useful particularly when using softboxes.

Photek softlighter make a 7mm shaft umbrella - good quality and cheaper than Elin's. There is one other brand too. Google! Take it easy when tightening the knob which handles the angle of the lights - it can strip! Love the Elin controls. Make sure you buy the D-Lites with fans. There is still some old stock around.

Hmm...d-lite2/4 do not have fans. Is there an option to add it to them ?

[aia21]

Hmm...d-lite2/4 do not have fans. Is there an option to add it to them ?

Yes they do have fans or to be precise the MK2 version has fans as has now been for sale both in UK and USA for a while. The old MK1 version does not have fans and short of gluing fans to the outside of the case you can't add fans to the MK1 version...

Best regards,

Anton

[aia21]

For example see http://www.studiokitdirect.co.uk/category.php?cat=Lighting&sub=Elinchrom+Lighting for a place that specifically advertises the MK2 version...

[silvex]

For example see http://www.studiokitdirect.co.uk/category.php?cat=Lighting&sub=Elinchrom+Lighting for a place that specifically advertises the MK2 version...

WOW! That is good news! I am leaning towards d-lite4 now...:) That's is why I love these forums...;)

[aia21]

Just be aware that apparently some retailers still have stock of the MK1 version so be prepared to send them back if they turn up in the MK1 version and you wanted the MK2 version or ensure you ask for the MK2 version when ordering... Although some places like B&H do not have a clue which they are selling - as I understand it the only way to tell is to open the box and look inside... Some people on POTN have reported they got the MK2 version from B&H - e.g. Robert aka TMR Design got D-Lite heads and they turned out to be the MK2 version whilst some people reported they got the MK1 version - e.g. Bret aka dragulaz got the D-Lite2 kit which turned out to be MK1 version (I think he got it from B&H - I may be remembering wrong)...

Best regards,

Anton

[irishman]

Crap. Just bought mine--no fan.

[bigbaby987]

no biggie until your OOF BG is now in focus, right?:confused:

I generally end up shooting at F8, 100 ISO, at 1/200.

[bigbaby987]

The fan is a kicker if you shoot with the modeling light on for a long period of time or just shooting continuous for about about an hour or so.

[dragulaz]

Here's what I've found, at least with B&H. If you order the kits you will probably get the mk1 (non-fan) version. If your order the lights individually you will get fans. I ordered the d-lite 2 kit and received the non-fan units. I then ordered 2 individual d-lite 2's a couple months later and they have fans. I'm using softboxes exclusively and have noticed no heat issues whatsoever, so I wouldn't worry too much unless you leave them on with modeling lamps for extremely long periods of time.

[irishman]

What happens when they overheat? Do they just shut down? For how long?

[Hermes]

I have the 2's but would buy the 4's if I had to do it again. The extra bit of power can be useful particularly when using softboxes.

The 2's and the 4's both output a fixed 5-stop range, the 4's will allow you to use a narrower aperture but you'll still face the same limitations when using modifiers that waste a lot of light.

[shooterman]

What happens when they overheat? Do they just shut down? For how long?My kit didn't come with fans, so when I first got my kit I tested them for overheating. I set the modeling lights on proportional and set the power level of the strobe to max, which is 5.0 on the digital LED readout for the D-Lite2's. It took over two hours of continuous pops to get the D-Lite to overheat and the thermal protection to kick in. When the light shut down, the modeling light turned off and I couldn't pop the flash, but the strobe was still on, as in the LED's on the back panel were still lit up. After less than a minute the modeling light came back on and I could pop the flash again.
In real world shooting conditions I typically have the power set around the 1.8 to 2.8 and I've popped the flash consistently and they barely get hot. I've ran them for over four hours in real world shooting conditions and they have never overheated on me. This was with the modeling lights on the whole time.
The conclusion is it's really a non issue if they don't have fans. You probably won't ever have a shutdown due to overheating. I love mine and could care less that they don't have fans.

[irishman]

Shooterman---thanks for the reply. That's definately a relief!

[hawk911]

and how long would you shoot the same subject without changing position in the studio, or changing clothes...

I've never had mine shut off yet due to heat.

[shooterman]

Shooterman---thanks for the reply. That's definately a relief!You're welcome!

[bigbaby987]

I've had mine overheat once, but it was only for like 5 min's.. it was a hot heated room in the middle of winter. i'm sure that didn't help. but they're troopers.. i love the quality of light they kick out..

very nice.. very very nice..

you'll absolutely enjoy them..

save a few dollars later for some modifiers down the road.. reflectors, grids, some larger softboxes, maybe a beauty dish..


have fun!!

[silvex]

You're welcome!

Randy, do you use the dl2 at full power most of the times or you 1/2 the power ? I have seen a lot of photos taken with the d-lites2 and they seem dark.

[hawk911]

Randy, do you use the dl2 at full power most of the times or you 1/2 the power ? I have seen a lot of photos taken with the d-lites2 and the seem dark.

I have to get better at chimping because I know mine have been dark and need +exposure adjustments in PP. I don't use a meter, but should.

Randy, your turn.

[dragulaz]

I am really impressed with the Elinchrom modifiers so far. The rotalux softboxes, the reflectors, the grids...all top notch. It wasn't until I started using the Elinchrom gear that I began to understand how cheaply made my previous equipment was.

[shooterman]

Randy, do you use the dl2 at full power most of the times or you 1/2 the power ? I have seen a lot of photos taken with the d-lites2 and the seem dark.Typically at around 1/8 power or a little less, with the 30D set at 1/160, ISO 100, aperture in the f/4 to f/6.3 range. The D-Lite2's have plenty of power so if any pictures you've seen seem to be dark, it's not the D-Lites fault. :)

Edit to add: Ed if you want to come down on a weekend and play around with my lights let me know.

I have to get better at chimping because I know mine have been dark and need +exposure adjustments in PP. I don't use a meter, but should.

Randy, your turn.I don't have a meter yet either. I plan on getting the L-358 Sekonic, but funds don't allow it right now.

[dragulaz]

Randy, do you use the dl2 at full power most of the times or you 1/2 the power ? I have seen a lot of photos taken with the d-lites2 and the seem dark.

I don't think I've ever used mine at full power. If they turn out dark it's the fault of the photographer, not the lights...at least in my situation. This may not be a good example, but here's a recent shot that I took. Sorry so small, I'm at work and this is the only version I have access to.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b222/applegbt/2008Other-359-Edit_4x6-1.jpg

[bigbaby987]

nice capture drag..

hawk and shooterman, a meter is really good to have. i have a few and wouldn't really want to do a shoot without them. however, i'm sure all know that you can get results without them... it's just the confidence you have one you trust your meter...

have fun and be inspired to take amazing photographs..

Ben

[silvex]

I have to get better at chimping because I know mine have been dark and need +exposure adjustments in PP. I don't use a meter, but should.

Randy, your turn.

What are you d-lite4 setting for power ?

[silvex]

I don't think I've ever used mine at full power. If they turn out dark it's the fault of the photographer, not the lights...at least in my situation. This may not be a good example, but here's a recent shot that I took. Sorry so small, I'm at work and this is the only version I have access to.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b222/applegbt/2008Other-359-Edit_4x6-1.jpg

it is nice but seems a bit dark.

[shooterman]

The main light for this was a little less than 1/2 power. Does this seem too dark? If it is it's not the lights, it's the operator.

Edit: Oops, what was I thinking. Usually my LED readout is on 2.0 so that would be 1/8 power. Must of had a brain fart when I said half power. The D-Lite 2's scale goes from 1.0 to 5.0 with 5.0 = 1/1 power, 4.0 = 1/2 power, 3.0 = 1/4 power, and so on. So this shot was at 1/8 power NOT 1/2 power.

http://members.cox.net/sinbad/IMG_7490-Edit.jpg

[dragulaz]

it is nice but seems a bit dark.

I suppose it may seem dark, but on my calibrated monitor it appears exactly as I intended. Again, as has already been stated several times. If it's too dark it has nothing to do with the lights. For this shot I had the main light set to about 40% power.

[hawk911]

What are you d-lite4 setting for power ?

my scale runs 2.0-6.0, and my main has been no higher than 3.0. According to Randy, that makes me 1/8 power. fill is always less, and typically at 1/16 power (2.0 + .5 on occasion)

[irishman]

I've never had my key higher than a 3.0 (D4's). I cold havegotten by with the D2's, but Tim "Tool Time" Taylor says, "More Power!"

[hawk911]

I think most of my shots are f5.6 at 3.0 on the Dlight scale and I could open to f8 but I try to keep the BG OOF.

[silvex]

The main light for this was a little less than 1/2 power. Does this seem too dark? If it is it's not the lights, it's the operator.

Edit: Oops, what was I thinking. Usually my LED readout is on 2.0 so that would be 1/8 power. Must of had a brain fart when I said half power. The D-Lite 2's scale goes from 1.0 to 5.0 with 5.0 = 1/1 power, 4.0 = 1/2 power, 3.0 = 1/4 power, and so on. So this shot was at 1/8 power NOT 1/2 power.

http://members.cox.net/sinbad/IMG_7490-Edit.jpg

It is not the strobes that lit this photo...it was the model... :shock: :) NICE! This is what I was talking. This photo is nice and alive. How far were the strobes ? better yet can you whip a diagram also showing your exif? so the d-lite2 scale is at 1m (3ft) iso100
5.0 = f45?
4.0 = f22
3.0 = f11
2.0 = f8
1.0 = f4

Give and take ?

Thanks Randy!

[shooterman]

It is not the strobes that lit this photo...it was the model... :shock: :) NICE! This is what I was talking. This photo is nice and alive. How far were the strobes ? better yet can you whip a diagram also showing your exif? so the d-lite2 scale is at 1m (3ft) iso100
5.0 = f45?
4.0 = f22
3.0 = f11
2.0 = f8
1.0 = f4

Give and take ?

Thanks Randy!
Haha, thanks!
Your calculations sounds about right. According to the Elinchrom spec on their website the f-stop is 45.3 at 5.0 for the D-Lite2's. They just don't say(or I didn't see it) at what distance it was measured at. I think Robert(TMR) has done the actual measurement, I'll see if I can find that thread. I'm pretty sure I have the lighting diagram on my home computer so I'll post it when I get home. And I'll post the EXIF also.
Memory tells me the lights were about 3 ft from the wife. I usually keep them pretty close to get nice soft wrap around light.

Edit: I found the lighting diagram on my webspace server. Looks like I used f/9.0 aperture for this. This was also a clam shell lighting setup, as you can see from the catchlights in her eyes.

http://members.cox.net/sinbad/Clamshell.jpg

[disneydork06]

this is such a helpful thread. thinking about getting the 4's while I still have my student discount :-) thanks guys

[silvex]

Haha, thanks!
Your calculations sounds about right. According to the Elinchrom spec on their website the f-stop is 45.3 at 5.0 for the D-Lite2's. They just don't say(or I didn't see it) at what distance it was measured at. I think Robert(TMR) has done the actual measurement, I'll see if I can find that thread. I'm pretty sure I have the lighting diagram on my home computer so I'll post it when I get home. And I'll post the EXIF also.
Memory tells me the lights were about 3 ft from the wife. I usually keep them pretty close to get nice soft wrap around light.

Edit: I found the lighting diagram on my webspace server. Looks like I used f/9.0 aperture for this. This was also a clam shell lighting setup, as you can see from the catchlights in her eyes.



Excellent work randy. I might go for the d4 to allow more distance to the model. They are rated at f64. So at 6ft they should do f32 plus a softbox 3/4 (or diffuser panel) of f-stop loss and I am at around f16. Then dial it to 4.0 and I am in the f8 area.

This I think is the setup/technique that was used during samy's intense lighting seminar last weekend. He was using profoto 500w strobes.

[shooterman]

I don't think you could go wrong with either set Ed. You'll enjoy either one, that's for sure.

[Aszental]

whats the difference between the D-Lite series and the RX series?

[aia21]

RX units have over the D-Lites:

- a bit faster recycle time: at max power: RX300 <0.6s, RX600 <1.0s, D-Lite2 <0.7s, D-Lite4 <1.3s)

- much faster flash duration needed to freeze action: RX300 1/2850s, RX600 1/2050s, D-Lite2 1/1200s, D-Lite4 1/800s)

- 6 f-stop range versus D-Lites which have 5 f-stop range, thus power range is: RX300 9-300Ws, RX600 18-600Ws, D-Lite2 12-200Ws, D-Lite4 25-400Ws)

- stronger modelling light (RX300 and RX600 have 250W, D-Lite2 and D-Lite4 have 100W)

- fully remote controllable via cable remote or the SkyPort RX transceivers whilst D-Lites cannot be remote controlled (obviously you can trigger them remotely but with the RX units you have full control over all their settings when using a computer with the USB transceiver and the free RX control software)

- on the downside the RX units weigh a ton: RX300 2.3kg, RX600 2.6kg, D-Lite2 1.1kg, D-Lite4 1.3kg

But you do pay for what you get for with the RX 300 set costing about three times as much as the D-Lite2 set and the RX600 set costing three times as much as the D-Lite4 set (of course the RX 300 is actually 1.5 times more powerful than the D-Lite2 and the same for the RX 600 versus the D-Lite4).

And of course with the RX you also have the option of the RX1200 which has a heck of a lot more power than a D-Lite4 with a power range of 37-1200Ws, flash duration 1/1450s, recycle time at max power <1.8s, 300W modelling light, a whopping 3.45kg weight and 2 fans to keep it cool and a crazy price to match. :)

Best regards,

Anton

[dragulaz]

Excellent work randy. I might go for the d4 to allow more distance to the model. They are rated at f64. So at 6ft they should do f32 plus a softbox 3/4 (or diffuser panel) of f-stop loss and I am at around f16. Then dial it to 4.0 and I am in the f8 area.

This I think is the setup/technique that was used during samy's intense lighting seminar last weekend. He was using profoto 500w strobes.

Just remember that more distance between light and model will change the effective size of the light source (unless you're using a diffusion panel). To get that good wrap-around effect you have to get in close with a softbox, or get a larger softbox.

[silvex]

Just remember that more distance between light and model will change the effective size of the light source (unless you're using a diffusion panel). To get that good wrap-around effect you have to get in close with a softbox, or get a larger softbox.

Yeah, I agree. He was using a 6'x8' scrim jim for the main light and a strip box for the fill light. When he used the beauty dish. It was placed about 4 feet from the model up hight (about 8-9 feet ? ). BTW excellent seminar.