Angst: Where is the Photogaphy?

[wayne_eddy]

I've been visiting POTN forum for a few years now after moving on from another one which died (actually it might still be twitching) and am concerned POTN may go a similar way given the quality of the average postings.

Can someone concur that one now days needs to wade through many poor images before seeing something post-worthy? Even in my early days of posting I would not present an image until I had clearly something that was of a reasonable standard.

Is it reasonable to just post an image that is just a picture on a photography forum?

The quality of posts on POTN seems to be not as great as it has been; I'm seeing many more snapshots, unbalanced, poor (or no) PP, poor composition etc etc. (possibly poor grammar on my behalf too! :lol:).

For example: I was just looking at a poor quality snapshot (I will not call this a photo) of a small furry creature on the lawn nibbling grass and there are several follow up posts indicating how cute it is and how good it is. Crikey ... it's far from correctly exposed, the colour and detail are right out .. OMG some one stop me.

Why are we (or is it just me!) tolerating what I shall nominate as the snapshot revolution in this/our Forum?.

[Pete]

I guess if you have a feeling that particular shots can be improved, then the best approach would be to answer honestly and point out how you feel improvements can be made. We only really learn from contructive criticism (when we want to improve, that is).

That being said, you also need to be sensitive to what the posters aspirations are. If they want to improve, then they'll take your words on board and learn from them. If, however, the poster is happy just taking snapshots, then you might be seen as being overly critical.

POTN isn't a fine art forum, it's a community. Many of us strive to be the best we can be at photography, but for others, it's just a hobby.

Also, the "photo sharing" sections are just that, for sharing photos. The real nitty-gritty is in the Critique section.

[BOSS]

....+1......

[Pekka]

Having a bad day? :)

I'd really like it if POTN is moving from perfectly exposed and sharp shots to more content, expression and individual artistry - I really think the photos are improving!

A few picks I like after a 5 minute browsing of share forums:

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=510252
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=511072
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=510602
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=511197
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=510015
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=510812
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=510534
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=510320
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=509778
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=511187
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=511027
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=511098
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=509251
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=510858
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=510720
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=508830
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=510516
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=509430
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=462751
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=505326
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=511146

[Michael_Lambert]

Why are we (or is it just me!) tolerating what I shall nominate as the snapshot revolution in this/our Forum?.


I think many people, yourself included in IMHO are just ignorant. Not everyone is perfect and if boards like POTN where to adapt your train of thought life would really suck for many people.

So instead of wasting our times writting this kind of crap, pull your dam camera out and post what you would consider a worthy thread and leave the people are looking to learn and the people who are willing to take the time to teach alone to do there thing here!

[wayne_eddy]

I think many people, yourself included in IMHO are just ignorant. Not everyone is perfect and if boards like POTN where to adapt your train of thought life would really suck for many people.

So instead of wasting our times writting this kind of crap, pull your dam camera out and post what you would consider a worthy thread and leave the people are looking to learn and the people who are willing to take the time to teach alone to do there thing here!

Gee, thank you (?) Micheal, you've really helped me see the light.

Are you a guidance councillor by any chance?

And life does suck for many people anyway.

[Michael_Lambert]

You want to see the light then pull your head out of your ass. Grow up child life is short.

What you see as a "Snap Shot" the person taking it see's it as a honest attempt at Photography.

[wayne_eddy]

I think many people, yourself included in IMHO are just ignorant. Not everyone is perfect and if boards like POTN where to adapt your train of thought life would really suck for many people.

So instead of wasting our times writting this kind of crap, pull your dam camera out and post what you would consider a worthy thread and leave the people are looking to learn and the people who are willing to take the time to teach alone to do there thing here!

But isn' this forum a Community?

Can't I voice my opinion?

Must I be bullied into your views?

[John_B]

Is it reasonable to just post an image that is just a picture on a photography forum?
wayne_eddy,
Yes I would believe on a photo sharing forum you can post just a picture.

Why are we (or is it just me!) tolerating what I shall nominate as the snapshot revolution in this/our Forum?.
Its just your opinion, that many might not agree with. Some may find a photo excellent and some may not, this applies whether the photo is truly excellent or not.

Instead of complaining about it, try to set the example (if you can).

[Michael_Lambert]

But isn' this forum a Community?

Yes it is, Yet you are the one complaining and whinning because the community is not producing what you want to see. It is just that a community.

Can't I voice my opinion?

Sure you can, Voice your opinion. But leave the school yard bitching out of it.

Must I be bullied into your views?

No one is Bullying anyone, like you i cared to share my opnion of many people like yourself. You are not alone ignorance is grand!


I guess unlike you i will leave theg thread alone now, I have much more wading through great work to do on this board. Hopefully one day you wake up and relise the world does not revolve around you.

[wayne_eddy]

I guess unlike you i will leave theg thread alone now, I have much more wading through great work to do on this board. Hopefully one day you wake up and relise the world does not revolve around you.

Thanks for the lack of understanding an Cliches in my troubled times everyone.

You're really helpful.

Look at the empathy you have used and skills of commaradery(sp?) in enlightening me to your viewpoint.

You have bullied and you have ousted someone of a differing opinion just as you have indicated I have.

[Woolburr]

Like Pete said...this forum is a community with people of all levels of experience. Most folks come here with the aspiration of improving their photography, but there are but a few that dream of being the next Adams, Weston, Rowell, Leibovitz, et al.

Many years ago, a young lady posted a horrific snapshot that she was quite proud of. She asked for constructive criticism and said..."tell me straight, I can take it." Several members offered up some very good advice....level your horizon, beware of utility poles and wires, make sure your subject is clearly in focus, learn to use DOF to control your subject and on and on. Contrary to her assertion that she could "take it", her last ever post was "Gee, thanks for killing my joy." She never posted again.

I was one of the people that responded to the thread and offered some advice to her. I wasn't harsh, but I was honest.... There were several other well known names from the forum that participated and none of them were harsh either...just candid. But the bottom line...after just 3 posts, she never returned to POTN. I learned a valuable lesson that day...sometimes it is better to just say nothing or to say "nice duck" and move on.

I'm sorry, but I find this thread nearly as offensive as the one started by the clown a few weeks ago that informed the forum that his work was too good for any of the lowly snapshooters here to comment on. Everyone has a right to be a beginner. Everyone has a right to post their work. If you don't care for the work, you are free to move on to something else....but to suggest that people should only post works that meet your quality standards is totally arrogant and offensive.

[Mike]

I'm sorry, but I find this thread nearly as offensive as the one started by the clown a few weeks ago that informed the forum that his work was too good for any of the lowly snapshooters here to comment on. Everyone has a right to be a beginner. Everyone has a right to post their work. If you don't care for the work, you are free to move on to something else....but to suggest that people should only post works that meet your quality standards is totally arrogant and offensive.

Amen to that!

[wayne_eddy]

but to suggest that people should only post works that meet your quality standards is totally arrogant and offensive.

I haven't asked anyone to post works that meet my quality standards.

I'm asking readers opinion and guidance (the latter has been seldom contributed), the OP is not meant to be offensive, sorry if you read it that way but many of the responses are belligerent.

It appears my opinion is worthless. Either way, I have just gone through a full page (25?) snapshots in one part of the forum ... on to the next lot ...

[Woolburr]

Why are we (or is it just me!) tolerating what I shall nominate as the snapshot revolution in this/our Forum?.

First you say this.

I haven't asked anyone to post works that meet my quality standards.

I'm asking readers opinion and guidance (the latter has been seldom contributed), the OP is not meant to be offensive, sorry if you read it that way but many of the responses are belligerent.

It appears my opinion is worthless. Either way, I have just gone through a full page (25?) snapshots in one part of the forum ... on to the next lot ...

And then you post this. You are clearly advocating that people only post material that meets with your standards. "Why are we tolerating snapshots here?" Sorry...but that comment pretty much says it all. Tolerating is what it is all about. Your opinion isn't worthless, but it is offensive. You are advocating that only material you deem worthy be posted on this forum. People have just as much right to be proud of their snapshots as you have to be proud of your "masterpieces."

It is the job of Pekka and his fine group of moderators to decide what content is and isn't appropriate here. Thankfully, none of them are as narrow minded as you appear to be.

[T.D.]

I haven't asked anyone to post works that meet my quality standards.

I'm asking readers opinion and guidance (the latter has been seldom contributed), the OP is not meant to be offensive, sorry if you read it that way but many of the responses are belligerent.

It appears my opinion is worthless. Either way, I have just gone through a full page (25?) snapshots in one part of the forum ... on to the next lot ...

It's not worthless. It just appears to be in the minority. I take it that you're not willing to consider alternates to your currently held belief that most photographers on POTN post crap.

Perhaps there is value to other people's perspectives. Even when it doesn't agree with your own. Isn't that why you started this thread? To hear other perspectives? Or perhaps it was just to help us understand how intransigent your "insights" are.

Either way, this is a great place for learning and community.

[stathunter]

I have to agree with Wayne to some extent. Many of the posters from my very limited view lately seem to be beginners. Nothing wrong with this at all--- everyone has to start somewhere. But I have noticed (maybe I am just hitting it at the wrong time) many new "first" shots ----- but in my (worthless) opinion I think that is a good way to learn.

[wayne_eddy]

You are advocating that only material you deem worthy be posted on this forum.

No I'm not [you're an idiot]. I'm asking consumer/user opinion and clearly it is weighed to favour the majority rule, my opinion being the minority.

People have just as much right to be proud of their snapshots as you have to be proud of your "masterpieces."

They do have a right to be proud of their snapshots ... I don't have masterpieces - and masterpieces is not quotable.

[Michael_Lambert]

Seeing "Snapshots" or what many would consider being and simple first time using the camera shots are not a bad thing, Infact i like to think its great its showing that POTN is growing.

Soon these "Snapshots" with alittle help from the resident pros will be images to go googoo gaga over.

I know i came here from FM because i was sick of the same type of additude that was going on over there the resident pro's where just at a point where they did not even post that your image sucked they would just ignore it. Shots i have taken that have recived 3-4 pages or replies here sit on FM with no replies at all.

POTN is growing, I am sure we can all see it and yes the snapshots are going to come rolling in while these new to photography people have the opertunities to learn. Its fun watching them evolve.

[wayne_eddy]

Many years ago, a young lady posted a horrific snapshot that she was quite proud of. She asked for constructive criticism and said..."tell me straight, I can take it." Several members offered up some very good advice....level your horizon, beware of utility poles and wires, make sure your subject is clearly in focus, learn to use DOF to control your subject and on and on. Contrary to her assertion that she could "take it", her last ever post was "Gee, thanks for killing my joy." She never posted again.

I was one of the people that responded to the thread and offered some advice to her. I wasn't harsh, but I was honest.... There were several other well known names from the forum that participated and none of them were harsh either...just candid. But the bottom line...after just 3 posts, she never returned to POTN. I learned a valuable lesson that day...sometimes it is better to just say nothing or to say "nice duck" and move on.


Though the morals are sound, it reads like a fable to me, or should be.

[stathunter]

Wayne---I totally agree many who post just want superficial info. For the most part I try to stick with the Dale Carnegie philosophy "Never criticize, condemn or complain" --- well for the most part. :)

[Woolburr]

No I'm not [you're an idiot]. I'm asking consumer/user opinion and clearly it is weighed to favour the majority rule, my opinion being the minority.



They do have a right to be proud of their snapshots ... I don't have masterpieces - and masterpieces is not quotable.

One thing we agree on....your "masterpieces" are not quotable.:lol:

[DVan8504]

It is a pretty elitist attitude to think that only "superior" pictures should be posted. This site is not just an art gallery. It is a community for people to share, learn, and grow.

[wayne_eddy]

Wayne---I totally agree many who post just want superficial info. For the most part I try to stick with the Dale Carnegie philosophy "Never criticize, condemn or complain" --- well for the most part. :)

Truly.

Constructive critique is certainly the way to go and the method I have used until date.

I have always produced constructive critique (does anyone here have reference otherwise? - seems some have their own empirical opinion).

[stathunter]

It is a pretty elitist attitude to think that only "superior" pictures should be posted. This site is not just an art gallery. It is a community for people to share, learn, and grow.

Who asked for your opinion anyway? *with nose up in the air--driving in my ferrari* (only joking :) )

[wayne_eddy]

It is a pretty elitist attitude to think that only "superior" pictures should be posted.

Yes it would be, if that were the opinion.

But it's not.

[wayne_eddy]

One thing we agree on....your "masterpieces" are not quotable.:lol:

nor are your "choo choos" - beeatch

[Roy Mathers]

I think it would be nice if Wayne could post a picture or two of his that would illustrate to everyone what he considers to be worthy of posting. I'm not criticising the original post - just looking for a yardstick.

And - although Wayne's opinion is clearly in the minority here, I certainly don't think it deserves the ill-mannered verbal abuse that Michael Lambert heaped on him. By the way, I assume (judging by the posts) that English is Michael's second language - or am I wrong?

[mtnphtgrphr]

But in than vein, I do not believe the OP should be weilding his own verbal abuse on others... it's a two way street.

[aussieskier]

The only trend I seem to be noticing around here is more threads similar to this where people complain that the quality of the pictures isn't what they consider to be what they think it should be.

It seems people are forgetting that they were there once and that this forum isn't about having instantly good pictures, it is about fostering a learning environment where people can come to learn about photography. My skills are only where they are now because of the things I have learned the and people I have met and shot with on this forum.

With the increase in the number of Dslrs out there, it is inevitable that more beginners will join this forum. So long as we are there willing to share our photos and help out with advice in a positive and not condescending way, we can help foster skills in those beginners that will help them in the long run (although it may hurt their pocket book ;) ).

And when it comes down to it, who are you, or I, or any single person to say what a good photo is? We can probably point out proper technique etc, but a large aspect of photography is related to creativity and as such there is no brightline upon which we can really judge whether a picture is quality. We can't define why we really like a certain picture because it gives of a certain feeling, despite the fact it isn't necessarily completely sharp or it might be a bit noisy.

In short, if you are so worried about the overall quality of the pictures in this forum. First: get out there and start taking picture and sharing some if you think yours are that much better that they will improve quality to what you see as adequate.

Second, stop wasting your time with threads like these and be more constructive with it all. Go out and help out a beginner learn and advance, that is what this place is really all about.

[Michael_Lambert]

Yes written English is not my primary language. I will be sure to use a editor to ensure my spelling is correct.

I would also be interested in where you feel I was being "Verbally abusive". I might have come across strong and opinionated however I would not call it abusive, and judging that my posts are still here after a couple of the moderators has read it I would assume they feel the same way.

[Pete]

Guys.

If this thread keeps on in this argumentative way, it'll be closed.

It's a valid point that merits discussion, but in a civil manner, please.

[Mike]

The only trend I seem to be noticing around here is more threads similar to this where people complain that the quality of the pictures isn't what they consider to be what they think it should be.

It seems people are forgetting that they were there once and that this forum isn't about having instantly good pictures, it is about fostering a learning environment where people can come to learn about photography. My skills are only where they are now because of the things I have learned the and people I have met and shot with on this forum.

With the increase in the number of Dslrs out there, it is inevitable that more beginners will join this forum. So long as we are there willing to share our photos and help out with advice in a positive and not condescending way, we can help foster skills in those beginners that will help them in the long run (although it may hurt their pocket book ;) ).

And when it comes down to it, who are you, or I, or any single person to say what a good photo is? We can probably point out proper technique etc, but a large aspect of photography is related to creativity and as such there is no brightline upon which we can really judge whether a picture is quality. We can't define why we really like a certain picture because it gives of a certain feeling, despite the fact it isn't necessarily completely sharp or it might be a bit noisy.

In short, if you are so worried about the overall quality of the pictures in this forum. First: get out there and start taking picture and sharing some if you think yours are that much better that they will improve quality to what you see as adequate.

Second, stop wasting your time with threads like these and be more constructive with it all. Go out and help out a beginner learn and advance, that is what this place is really all about.

Well said. I think the trend is like a sliding scale:

The newer we are the better others images seem to be and the worse our own are;
The more experienced we get the more we see faults in others work while our own improves.

Therefore, I think the quality of photos is, and has always been, a constant, a mix of good, bad and indifferent. We're just better at criticizing now.

[Belmondo]

Okay, this is directed to wayne_eddy, but applies to everyone.

If you are unable to make a point without benefit of name-calling, you have no business posting here. The next use of an offensive name or term will buy you a few days off.

Clear?

[DVan8504]

Who asked for your opinion anyway? *with nose up in the air--driving in my ferrari* (only joking :) )

haha you had me for a second. i read the first sentence and was like "wtf? why is this person--ooooh i get it." :D

[DVan8504]

Yes it would be, if that were the opinion.

But it's not.

I'm not sure what the point of the thread was then if not to say less than superior pictures shouldn't be shared.

[Roy Mathers]

You want to see the light then pull your head out of your ass. Grow up child life is short.

.


I would also be interested in where you feel I was being "Verbally abusive". I might have come across strong and opinionated however I would not call it abusive, and judging that my posts are still here after a couple of the moderators has read it I would assume they feel the same way.


Michael - I may be wrong but, in all fairness, I would consider this phrase as verbally abusive. I agree with Pete's post; no matter how much you may disagree with someone, surely it can be done in a civil manner?

[wayne_eddy]

Okay, this is directed to wayne_eddy, but applies to everyone.

If you are unable to make a point without benefit of name-calling, you have no business posting here. The next use of an offensive name or term will buy you a few days off.

Clear?

Belmondo: I think you need to read the whole thread before you respond to the tatter-tales.

Micheal_Lambert:
"yourself included in IMHO are just ignorant".
"instead of wasting our times writting this kind of crap"
"pull your head out of your ass"
"relise the world does not revolve around you"

Woolburr:
"your "masterpieces" are not quotable"

Who is dissing where here?

It is the responding posters to this thread that have taken it in the direction that it has gone.

[Belmondo]

Belmondo: I think you need to read the whole thread before you respond to the tatter-tales.

Micheal_Lambert:
"yourself included in IMHO are just ignorant".
"instead of wasting our times writting this kind of crap"
"pull your head out of your ass"
"relise the world does not revolve around you"

Woolburr:
"your "masterpieces" are not quotable"

Who is dissing where here?

It is the responding posters to this thread that have taken it in the direction that it has gone.

Strikes one and two.
Quit while you're ahead.

I did read the entire thread, and your attacks have been by far the most personal and insulting.

You have a choice to make now. You can move on with this discussion in a reasonable manner, or you can take one more stab at justifying bad behavior.

[Roy Mathers]

Reading Wayne's original post again, it occurs to me that, while the opinions expressed are obviously (judging by the replies) unpopular, they were expressed in a not unreasonable way and I have to agree that it is many of the subsequent posters that have taken it in the unfortunate direction in which it seems to have gone.

By the way, is there such a thing as Forum Rage?:)

[mtnphtgrphr]

Michael - I may be wrong but, in all fairness, I would consider this phrase as verbally abusive. I agree with Pete's post; no matter how much you may disagree with someone, surely it can be done in a civil manner?

Roy, you're on a children's school ground at the moment... There is more than just Michael who is using poor choices in words.... If you're going to point out his name calling... you should point out the name calling that others are doing as well....

No I'm not [you're an idiot]. I'm asking consumer/user opinion and clearly it is weighed to favour the majority rule, my opinion being the minority.



They do have a right to be proud of their snapshots ... I don't have masterpieces - and masterpieces is not quotable.

nor are your "choo choos" - beeatch

[Michael_Lambert]

Roy you are right, what I said was a little uncalled for. Just tired of people in general thinking that if things are not done in a manor they prefer then it’s not done right.

We are in a public forum that is growing day by day, the only reason we are seeing more "Snap Shot" threads coming up is because we have many more first timers joining our ranks and sharing what they feel are pieces of art!

Its threads like this that are started that steer new people away from posting there "Snapshots" and not getting the guided advice that could have turned that "snapshot" in to a piece of art!

[Roy Mathers]

Roy you are right, what I said was a little uncalled for. Just tired of people in general thinking that if things are not done in a manor they prefer then it’s not done right.

We are in a public forum that is growing day by day, the only reason we are seeing more "Snap Shot" threads coming up is because we have many more first timers joining our ranks and sharing what they feel are pieces of art!

Its threads like this that are started that steer new people away from posting there "Snapshots" and not getting the guided advice that could have turned that "snapshot" in to a piece of art!


I can't argue with that Michael;)

[Belmondo]

What's unfortunate here is that this is a legitimate discussion. It's not unreasonable for wayne_eddy to state his perceptions as he has done in his opening post, nor is it out of bounds for people to disagree with him. What cannot be tolerated are personal attacks against people with opposing points of view.

Debate is not a bad thing when certain ground rules are observed. You all know what they are, so I won't rehash them any further. Let's play nicely now.

[Pete]

Wayne, I sympathise with your point of view, and of the inflammatory responses some of which were uncalled for.

My advise, however, would be to excersise a level of patience and level-headedness about your responses (not matter how attacking you may feel they are).

If you feel yourself being angered by what you're reading, just pause and leave things a few minutes before you read again and reply. This thread has very quickly degenerated into this state because of this schoolyard pushing.

If you feel yourself getting riled, just split for a bit and chill out without responding. You'll come back feeling much better for it.

[Michael_Lambert]

It's threads like this that should get people thinking about what is creative photography or manipulation or not.





But to what Definition do you wish to compare it to? You have made blanket statements which to me I read as your personal opinion something yes you are entitled to yet to me came across as your way or no way.

That’s where the issue lies you feel that something is not creative or art work yet the person who took might feel it is.

Its the people who are producing the "Snapshots" who need to learn by error that there work is not up to the standards of most here and they learn that really fast when they make a post and its ignored for days until they say "What no one likes" then someone like yourself or myself can then post saying why we don't like the image, or why we feel it was ignored.

[wayne_eddy]

But to what Definition do you wish to compare it to? You have made blanket statements which to me I read as your personal opinion something yes you are entitled to yet to me came across as your way or no way.

That’s where the issue lies you feel that something is not creative or art work yet the person who took might feel it is.

Its the people who are producing the "Snapshots" who need to learn by error that there work is not up to the standards of most here and they learn that really fast when they make a post and its ignored for days until they say "What no one likes" then someone like yourself or myself can then post saying why we don't like the image, or why we feel it was ignored.

Some of that sounds fair.

You have my permission to read my opinion in your own way.

I can only share my unqualified opinion (of photography), a short history of recently found knowledge (and limited ability), appreciation of photography and 2D art forms. My perception is regularly still dumbfounded by what is considered quality or fine art in the 2D format.

My personal concern remains that honest critique is not being put upon images of entry level standard within these Forums and thus lowers the general standard of photography (within the Forum).

[condyk]

Why are we (or is it just me!) tolerating what I shall nominate as the snapshot revolution in this/our Forum?.

I think this thread (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?p=5598320#post5598320) illustrates the difficulty involved in policing 'image quality'.

I see why the guy who took it likes it. I see why you like bits of it and not others. I see why another guy critiques your view. It's very old hat here all this stuff, which is essentially about the subjective or objective nature of 'art'. The critique of 'snapshots' assumes a clear and boundaried definition of what 'art' is, because without that there can be not critique of that which supposedly isn't.

I suspect that if you can create a definition of what makes an image worthy of posting then we'd have plenty who would counter it. An alternative is to accept art not as an end product (the image) but rather a process of interaction,via the viewfinder, of self and environment. The relationship is thus subjective ... and no one need care what you, me or Mr Lambert think as onlookers. It's a waste of time to do otherwise.

[SlowBlink]

Maybe todays snapshot is a little better than yesterdays. Tomorrow it could improve even more. In a couple years I could be copying that persons work. Life is funny that way.

[JWright]

I think it would be nice if Wayne could post a picture or two of his that would illustrate to everyone what he considers to be worthy of posting. I'm not criticising the original post - just looking for a yardstick.

Ever notice how the ones that yell the loudest never seem to have a link to a gallery in their signature?

[sevillafox]

I think part of the problem is how people DEFINE photography. I'm of the ilk that enjoys snapshots. I take them. I use the green box on my camera to take pics of my little one. Heck, I've even posted some crappy snapshots a time or two. I think a lot of the problem is that some people think EVERY shot needs to be technically correct or perfect.

That's not true. What a photograph should be is something that evokes a feeling or emotion. True, really great photos will evoke a feeling from a wider audience, but that "crappy" snapshot you see means something to the person that took it. They've invested something of themselves in it. It means something to them.

Sure, some people get tired of looking at snapshots of cute kids but that's life. If they don't like it, they don't look. Complaining about it gets you no where. I think most people here try and be open minded and realize that not everything is the way they want it.

But, it's Pekka's playground and he lets us play here without charge so we really need to stop bitching about the way he has things set up, get over ourselves, and enjoy what we do see.

Sure, slogging through all those snapshots might make you crazy but they can still teach you something. Learning from the mistakes of others is valuable as well. So, let's stop whining, get over ourselves, and get out and shoot!

[Natalie]

I agree! I'm no prof photog or anything. But I like looking at pictures and taking some with my little p&s. Besides putting up with another photog (my husband) I think I do ok :).

[CyberDyneSystems]

POTN started as a "snapshot" forum (non pros posting P&S images)

We encourage and embrace the beginning photographers. Sharing and discussion begets growth and learning and with luck skill and perseverance, advanced technique and artistry.

A single person's judgment of what constitutes a good photo will always be just that, a single individuals point of view. This is a forum of many many thousands. No one individual's judgment will reflect the feelings of all.

At the same time we see growth in membership of beginning photographers, we also see new members that are seasoned professionals.

POTN is in no danger of "twitching" out of existence by allowing it's new members to post their images and encourage them to post more. To the contrary, we will continue to grow from it.

[tiktaalik]

There's a long running cat pictures thread that got hit by a poster who just had to tell everyone what horrible snapshots we had all posted. While I disagree and think there are many extremely good shots there (not mine, though :lol: ) I nevertheless enjoy looking at all of them. I like seeing much loved cats who have people who like to share pictures of their treasured pets.

Not surprisingly, the trollster in the cat thread offered absolutely no helpful comments or suggestions for improvement. My advice to him, the OP in this thread, and others who are looking down at the snapshots are twofold:

Offer gentle and helpful comments and suggestions for improvement. Always find something nice to say. The more snapshot-like the photo is the more gentle and sensitive you need to be. We were all beginners once and it would be a shame to scare off a newcomer.

Secondly, if you wish to improve the level of photography here then go out, shoot some stunning images, and post them. Lead by example, not by negativity.

[Stocky]

Its not to hard to learn to do one thing really well yourself, but its much harder to teach it. If you think that the the quality is low here then I recommend getting good enough to help some other people out. Then everyone will be happier and you will have some better pictures to look at.

[SlowBlink]

I'm often inspired by something someone else has criticized as being unworthy in some way. The complaints usually come with a preamble: "I have nothing against __insert style here. Then they tell you it's wrong according to their rules as if they're a universal truth.

I consider it a pleasure to watch people progress creatively with their gear. I don't shoot cats or kids but have laughed out loud at some great "snapshots" people have posted.

[Moppie]

I blame the nice people, they are the ones who let all these snap shots get posted, and say nice things about them, and encourage the snap shooters to keep shooting, and offer advice on how to get better.

It's all the nice peoples fault.

And its the reason I consider POTN to be one of the finest forums on the internet.


Be nice people.