My Soccer Experience sucked (part 2)

[adblink]

unfortunately the last conversation was moved to no mans land, so I wanted to start this one off by sharing the images i took today, trying to take into consideration all the tips I was given from the first thread (found here (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=512006))


First off, I did ask the ref if I could shoot behind the goal line and he said no. He believed me that I wouldn't say a word but the other teams coach may have a problem with me being behind their goal, so I didn't argue.

I shot in portrait the whole time as suggested, as well as I didn't even bring the TC, as much as it was a personal struggle not to. I used the * button for focusing while in af servo as well.

heres three shots





http://www.demelophotography.ca/content/Sports/Bishop%20Ryan%20Soccer%20June1/BRsoccerJune1-06.jpg

http://www.demelophotography.ca/content/Sports/Bishop%20Ryan%20Soccer%20June1/BRsoccerJune1-07.jpg

http://www.demelophotography.ca/content/Sports/Bishop%20Ryan%20Soccer%20June1/BRsoccerJune1-05.jpg



c&C welcome of course

[bobbyz]

Look good. One thing I would suggest is lower shooting position.

[crazyskillz07]

I think you did really good. I like #1. Could you post some pics from your first run for comparison?

[adblink]

i posted three pics from my first attempt in the first thread that was moved. heres the link

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=512006

(images are on the second page)

[pigtailpat]

Out of these, I like #3 best, I DO NOT like #1, and neither will the girl in green. She looks bad in this photo, and I say this from a female perspective, not as a photographer. She looks bad not due to the fault of the photographer, but it just happens that she was caught in a moment that makes her look bad.

I agree with above, shooting from a lower vantage point would have been better. I think these images are much improved from your prior images. Keep shooting!

Pat

[wayovrpar]

+1 on the lower shooting position....and as mentioned above....great improvement...keep shooting. Thanks for sharing.

[davethejnz]

did your % keepers increase by implimenting (sp) the recommended changes in shooting style.

[JohnJ80]

1000% improvement. These are really looking much better. Don't you think so too?

I don't know if you keeper %-age improved, but your posted images sure did. I really like the 1st one.

J

[adblink]

thanks very much guys/gals for the helpful comments :D glad someone thinks their alittle better then the first time.

funny you should mention about the keeper rate. It didn't really improve but its not totally my fault I don't think. The last 2 games i shot, "my" team won by a large margin, this game they lost 0-4. They barely had possesion of the ball, and I didn't want to take shots of them getting schooled out of their shorts. I only shot 49 images, vs 100 at each of the other games.

Also the ones that were not keepers, alot more were just working on timing now, vs before where most of them were ruined because of being OOF.

the only sad thing was I did really miss the range with the extender, i think that may have contributed to my lower total shot count.

[adblink]

Out of these, I like #3 best, I DO NOT like #1, and neither will the girl in green. She looks bad in this photo, and I say this from a female perspective, not as a photographer. She looks bad not due to the fault of the photographer, but it just happens that she was caught in a moment that makes her look bad.

I agree with above, shooting from a lower vantage point would have been better. I think these images are much improved from your prior images. Keep shooting!

Pat

lol i totally understand what your talking about, but for me, I was working on trying to get the faces in the shot like everyone suggested i do, and I was hoping to get as much facial expressions as i could, and this one delivered. This girl is not my sister and the image probably won't make it public anywhere so its ok :)


how low are we talking about here when talking about vantage point? I tried sitting on the ground but my monopod doesn't collapse that far. I found I was swining the camera around alot, even sometimes moving up and down the field a tad, so sitting in a lawn chair wouldn't work either

[bobbyz]

I usually sit on my butt behind the goal lines but I am using 500mm f4. I tried this weekend with Sigma 120-300mm f2.8 and 300m was quite short. With 70-200mm you can decide couple of positions and sit there. With sitting or staying in certain positions you can watch your backgrounds, angle of the sun etc.

Give you an example of low angle. This is with 70-200mm.

http://www.bobbyzphotography.com/img/v1/p442963393-5.jpg

Having longer glass does help. Here is my 2nd game shooting with 500mm and I was using tripod (yes) on very low setting.

http://www.bobbyzphotography.com/img/v3/p239760862-5.jpg

[namasste]

Definitely much better. Once you really feel comfortable that you can produce this quality consistently, you can begin to focus on the details that will make for really good images. For instance, and as Pat mentioned, making sure the athletes look good in the shots. Another thing you'll find is that images like #2 simply aren't keepers imo due to limited face, and action. Basically, you'll be thinking composition and timing as much as exposure. It's at that point that things will really come together. My advice is to consider the pointers given here but focus (no pun intended) first on solid focus and exposure, then composition and timing.

Great improvement and congrats on that. Keep it up and keep posting, you'll learn tons by doing so.

[danaitch]

The more recent shots STILL look a little OOF to me, sorry. Horizon is also a little 'skew-whiff' on the first image.

Also, judging from the backgrounds, I'm finding it hard to believe this was the sort of event where the referee COULD deny you permission to shoot from behind the goal. Are you in some kind of a 'Police-State' where photography is concerned?! ;)

Verrrrry strange. :confused:

[JohnJ80]

The more recent shots STILL look a little OOF to me, sorry. Horizon is also a little 'skew-whiff' on the first image.

Also, judging from the backgrounds, I'm finding it hard to believe this was the sort of event where the referee COULD deny you permission to shoot from behind the goal. Are you in some kind of a 'Police-State' where photography is concerned?! ;)

Verrrrry strange. :confused:

LOL, I agree. If I asked, I've never had a ref refuse me. They tell me what they expect and that's that.

J.

[pigtailpat]

lhow low are we talking about here when talking about vantage point? I tried sitting on the ground but my monopod doesn't collapse that far. I found I was swining the camera around alot, even sometimes moving up and down the field a tad, so sitting in a lawn chair wouldn't work either

Like Bobby who posted below, I sit on my still-47 (birthday is coming in like 6 weeks) rear.

You have to be careful though, at one field, I saw a big bug crawling all-ver my white baby. Boy did I act fast!

Pat

[prime80]

Also, judging from the backgrounds, I'm finding it hard to believe this was the sort of event where the referee COULD deny you permission to shoot from behind the goal. Are you in some kind of a 'Police-State' where photography is concerned?! ;)

Verrrrry strange. :confused:

Unfortunately, I live in one of those police states. Our city soccer officials have instituted a "no parent past the goal line" rule to rightfully limit parent-coaching from behind the goal. However, they've used that rule to try to prevent photographers from working back there as well. I've been told several times to move from behind the line. I just play dumb and act like it's the first time I've heard that rule each time. ;)

[gmen]

adblink... I think you've made a solid start (assuming this is one of the first matches you've ever shot).

I'm sure I've bored the pants off of many folk in these parts with my thoughts on football photography, so I won't waffle on too much. In a nutshell (and assuming you've got the basics of exposure and focusing pretty much nailed on)...

Stay low... If you can shift the 'pitch-horizon' level below the players' waist level, you'll notice an instant improvement in the impact of the image.

Backgrounds... A nice clean background can improve an image dramatically. You can control this (to some extent) through your pitchside positioning and by controlling your DOF. Shoot at the longest focal length you have available (although you may need to take into account the size of the pitch) and try to shoot tight in camera.

Faces... The strongest images come about when you can see the players' faces (as well as increasing the 'saleability' of the image). The faces convey the emotion of the sport. Wait for those faces and try not to shoot backs.

Ball... Having the ball in the image is generally a good thing for a football 'action' pic.

Anticipation... With more experience, you'll be able to read the game better and, as a result, you'll feel you have more time to settle and compose your images.

Here's a recent example showing the low horizon, ball and faces against a reasonably clean background. Not too exciting in itself but I'd call this a bread-and-butter action shot...

http://www.tgsphoto.co.uk/forum_images/low.jpg

A useful thread for some more thoughts on this subject can be found here: http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=129659&highlight=soccer+shooting+strategies

Football does present a range of challenges and I could fill many pages with my thoughts on how to get good images... but (you'll be pleased to hear) I won't :lol:

---- Gavin

[danaitch]

Unfortunately, I live in one of those police states. Our city soccer officials have instituted a "no parent past the goal line" rule to rightfully limit parent-coaching from behind the goal. However, they've used that rule to try to prevent photographers from working back there as well. I've been told several times to move from behind the line. I just play dumb and act like it's the first time I've heard that rule each time. ;)

Could you not speak to your local soccer officials and let them know the impact their rule is having on your work? They might issue you with some form of credential that you can wave at the referee.

I still imagine it'd be a pretty hard rule to enforce upon you, especially if you're in a public area.

Bloody referees. Give them a uniform and they think we ALL listen for their whistle. ;)

[bobbyz]

I thought most photogs shoot from behind the goal lines. Maybe you need to take a picture or tow of the refree and give it to them to make them happy.

[prime80]

Football does present a range of challenges and I could fill many pages with my thoughts on how to get good images... but (you'll be pleased to hear) I won't :lol:

---- Gavin

Gavin, as an avid football "shooter", and a fan of your work, anything you wish to contribute is ALWAYS welcome.

Could you not speak to your local soccer officials and let them know the impact their rule is having on your work? They might issue you with some form of credential that you can wave at the referee.

I still imagine it'd be a pretty hard rule to enforce upon you, especially if you're in a public area.

Bloody referees. Give them a uniform and they think we ALL listen for their whistle. ;)

Unfortunately, it's not the referees that are the problem. I've never had any of them say a word to me. It IS the local officials roaming the fields that have told me to move, so there's not a lot of hope in getting them to do anything about it. They don't care one bit how it impacts my business.

I thought most photogs shoot from behind the goal lines. Maybe you need to take a picture or tow of the refree and give it to them to make them happy.

They've had the rule in our city for a couple of seasons, but just really started enforcing it this past year. I understand why they have the rule, as we have some psycho parents that get way out of control, but it's pretty obvious after watching me shoot for a few minutes that I'm not the intended focus of that rule. Some of the officials are just scared to make exceptions since it opens the door for others to cry "Why is he over there when I can't be??" The worst time was when the official was over telling me to move and I looked around and there were parents actively yelling and coaching behind the goals of the 3 bordering fields.