Online sales: Which site to use?

[snyper77]

I've looked at Smugmug, Zenfolio, Printroom, Exposure Manager, and Candid2000 (Weddingimagesonline.com). Doing all that math can be mind boggling. Some charge an annual fee, some have minimums that must be ordered or else you get hit with another fee, some charge 3.1% CC processing, etc. I'm looking for the abosolute best deal (with good service) for a small time operation. I am talking about 10-20 orders per month, maybe. I currently use Candid2000's (weddingimagesonline.com) and they hit me for up to 50% of small orders (in all their fees). Also, I'm looking at Photo Cart software so people can just order directly from my personal website and the order comes to me. Then I'd have to crop, upload, order the prints, and deliver them myself, but I save ALL those fees! Is is worth it? Thank you very much for your help.

[hlcowan]

I've had a Pro account with Smugmug for a year now, and I couldn't be happier. My customers tell me that the site is easy to navigate, the shopping cart is self-explanatory, and their purchases arrive very quickly. They love the ability to crop the images to their preferences, and the variety of photo items that can be ordered. When it was time to renew my account, I never had a single reservation. The customer service from a photographer standpoint is wonderful. They answer my questions quickly, and their forum is another great information asset.

[Mike R]

Exposure Manager has great customer service and they now have their own lab which is excellent, However they still send a few things, like key chains, outside. They charge $99 but discounts are available. They take 10% from the sales and this includes the CC processing. They send out checks in the first week of each month for the previous months sales and they have may sales reports that you can view on line. PM me if you have any other questions

[shima]

I also have a pro account with smugmug and have had nothing bug good feedback from it. Plus the site is very customizable to your needs and if you add your own domain name, people won't even realize they're on some other companys site :)

I've had a Pro account with Smugmug for a year now, and I couldn't be happier. My customers tell me that the site is easy to navigate, the shopping cart is self-explanatory, and their purchases arrive very quickly. They love the ability to crop the images to their preferences, and the variety of photo items that can be ordered. When it was time to renew my account, I never had a single reservation. The customer service from a photographer standpoint is wonderful. They answer my questions quickly, and their forum is another great information asset.

[Chip Andrews]

I use orderpicture.com. There is no fee to use it & they take 12%. I was trying to keep start up costs low for now & so far I have been very happy with their site & quality. I created a website thru Yahoo & linked it to my orderpicture site. Check it out.

[a_kraker99]

http://www.backprint.com

No annual fees and you get your own proofing site. I am satisfied with them so far. They have alot of neat tools to help you manage clients and increase sales too. Great quality prints and fast shipments.

[mminnig]

Is everyone happy with the packaging that their supplier of choice uses? We use exposure manager and have been thrilled with them. Our only reservation has been charging premium prices for premium photography services and then having prints arrive directly from EM in generic wax paper sleeves and cardboard mailers.

I know we could have everything shipped to our studio and re-package it all ourselves but it just seems to create too many extra steps. I've never heard a complaint from a client, but I would love to see these labs offer higher quality / premium packaging options.

[WMDunkin]

I am planning on using www.imagekind.com when I get some photos I feel are worthy

[amfoto1]

I've been using Printroom.com for three years now and am happy with it. I've posted a lot about it before here... A search here will bring back a lot more info, if you wish.

$99 a year flat fee is what I pay now (there's a more premium service, but I don't need any of the features it offers). There's a free trial, too.

And, they take some percentages of whatever I sell. A recent $200 sale netted me $147, so in that case it worked out to about 25%. However, it varies a lot depending upon the exact products ordered. Depends on the prices I have set and my profit margins on each.

[snyper77]

With sites like Printroom, Smugmug, etc., lets say you have 200 photos from a shoot, don't you have to PP every single one of those before uploading??? What if your customer only orders 1 shot. That means you PP'd 199 shots for nothing. Otherwise, you'd have to upload 2 times (once for viewing, once for printing).

[amfoto1]

Snyper77...

I do a quick edit of all my images from a day's shoot. A recent one started out as about 750 images. The next day I edited that down to about 400, organized into four folders/galleries, then ran "Image Processor" in Photoshop while I went and got a snack and watched a little TV.

Next I run the JPEGs that Photoshop made through Printroom's software, to create thumbnails and set up the online galleries. It's just a highlight and click okay operation. Fast. Then I set it to upload, and off I go to Starbucks for a cup of coffee. Later I check that galleries are organized the way I want and that I didn't miss anything.

Only the thumbnails get uploaded, and I have "all orders must be approved" checked. But if I wished and didn't need to conserve space I could choose to upload full size files, or for Printroom to call for and retrieve those from my computer fairly automatically.

However, I don't know what size will be ordered, or if any additional editing may be needed (remember I only did very quick color/exposure balance, no sharpening, guessed at any crop, etc.) So, only when orders start coming in do I open the JPEG and finish tweaking the image. In some cases I end up going back to the RAW to re-crop, when the order doesn't match the JPEG I created very well.

Now, someone shooting weddings might handle it a bit differently, uploading full size files and ordering a proof book straight from Printroom. There are other possibilities, I'm sure.

Yes, I do go through every image from a shoot. That's been as many as 3000 images that took me a couple days to get through. I use Adobe Bridge and Adobe Camera Raw for nearly all renaming, sorting, choosing, trashing of files and "quick edit" changes. I usually don't open the JPEG at all until a print is ordered.

I'm considering using Lightroom, which might even be faster.

Hope this helps.

[Gatorboy]

Photo Cart (http://www.picturespro.com)

[cdifoto]

With sites like Printroom, Smugmug, etc., lets say you have 200 photos from a shoot, don't you have to PP every single one of those before uploading??? What if your customer only orders 1 shot. That means you PP'd 199 shots for nothing. Otherwise, you'd have to upload 2 times (once for viewing, once for printing).
Pretty much why I hacked oscommerce instead. I handle my own print orders (via WHCC & ROES) but only have to process the necessary images and save time & storage by uploading only 435px webbies.

[Ham1]

With sites like Printroom, Smugmug, etc., lets say you have 200 photos from a shoot, don't you have to PP every single one of those before uploading??? What if your customer only orders 1 shot. That means you PP'd 199 shots for nothing. Otherwise, you'd have to upload 2 times (once for viewing, once for printing).

SmugMug allows you to set a specific amount of days before the order gets processed at one of our labs. So in your case, you can upload all of your un-edited shots and then put a 3 day or thereabouts lag.

We will email you directly when someone places an order and then you get 3 days to edit the photos that were purchased and reupload that shot only!

Check here: http://www.smugmug.com/help/proof-retouch-replace

Markham

[MJPhotos24]

I've looked at them all and don't think any compare to Exposure Manager.

They have a fee (month or year) and it's lower than the others. They take less percentage wise than the others so more money in your pocket. If you really want to save some more you can set your account to self-fulfill and then do the printing say through Richmond Pro who drop ships as well for cheaper. You can full customize the site to fit into your site seamless. I upload small unedited or slightly cropped and only upload the full res when an order is placed. There's no time limit, you just upload and hit "display only" when creating the gallery, they will email you what's needed and you get to work. If you forget about them they send a reminder email as well I do believe.

Is everyone happy with the packaging that their supplier of choice uses? We use exposure manager and have been thrilled with them. Our only reservation has been charging premium prices for premium photography services and then having prints arrive directly from EM in generic wax paper sleeves and cardboard mailers.

I know we could have everything shipped to our studio and re-package it all ourselves but it just seems to create too many extra steps. I've never heard a complaint from a client, but I would love to see these labs offer higher quality / premium packaging options.
Don't really mind that packaging but I'm doing sports pics, not weddings or anything like that so no "high-end" needed as it ends up in the recycle bin anyways. Often times they package too much and why the costs are high, over protecting. The wax paper is the recommended paper for photos though isn't it? Remember seeing that somewhere but might be way off (archival paper).

[Dan-o]

Another vote for Exposure Manager. I've never had a problem with there packaging and at least my name and logo is on it. Some of the other photo sites plaster there name all over the packaging as if they shot them.

[brippeon]

Anyone directly use bay photo (http://www.bayphoto.com) They are one of smugmug's printers. I think i might go directly through them. They have a nice ROES. Prices look good too.

[mutau052]

i've been using instaproofs.com, then i do printing with proDPI.com and they do drop shipping on my simple orders or i review my more expensive orders and send them myself.

[torvaterra]

I use Zenfolio and Ive been pleased so far with the service. They offer many types of prints as well as other items (tshirts and mugs and stuff). Whenever I get a sale, I can watch the progress via their tracking which is neat. Another nice thing is that they have integration so you can upload your pictures right from Lightroom. I dont use it but I see how that might be appealing to ppl that use LR. I think they have some kind of integration with Flickr too.

As far as how much they charge, I paid a yearly subscription which was about $90, then they charge a 12% service fee + the base cost of what is purchased. "Zenfolio will take orders, collect payments, fulfill orders, and provide customer service." In the background of it, I also like that I can choose my mark up and it calculates it for me. Im not the best at math so I need something idiot proof :P

Here's the link to where they list the cost of Zenfolio: http://www.zenfolio.com/zf/selling.aspx#payment

Here's my site if you want to take a look: http://torvaterra.zenfolio.com/

Its a work in progress. I will say though that no matter which site you use, its going to be the marketing and word of mouth that gets you the sales. I know people with some really hideous sites that get great sales and some with the most slick sites that sell nothing. Make sure people see your site and that it is easy to use.

[damonb]

I work at a site called Fotomoto.com.

Other services I've seen used by Photogs include:
Redbubble.com
Imagekind.com
Smugmug.com
Photocart.com

I think you have to base your decision on if you want to do self-fulfillment, if you want to have fulfillment handled for you, if you want to handle credit card orders on your own, if you want to pay commission or subscription fees, if you want to sell directly from your own website or photoblog, etc. Nearly every service mentioned is going to have some potential value proposition & probably some things you won't like.

I've actually seen a number of photographers use all.

[RobNYC]

+1 for Zenfolio.
I have been very happy with their service so far. They use 2 or 3 labs but manily MPIX. My customers have been very happy so far.