Glass or Studio/Dig Darkroom Gear

[TomC]

Alright folks. Time for some more decision making. I've (actually my wife said ok) 'upped' the budget that I'm allowing myself when I make my purchase in March. I know we have a lot of 'what should I buy' threads, but this might be a little different. That being said, should I go ahead with my list (below) or should I skip the 'extras' (that I dont have) and just buy super glass. If I dont get all of this in March, I'm not sure when I'll be able to (wife restrictions:)) Ive covered this before but FYI, I'll be shooting generally portraits, landscapes, nature, some outdoor events and some indoor events as well (that kinda runs the gambit doesnt it -- not a lot of high action sports or anything.... yet)

Intended Camera Gear:
* 20D
* Tamron 28-75 2.8 di
* Canon 50mm 1.8
* Canon 70-200 f2.8 L (non is) (maybe.. I might have to settle for the f4)
(I noted the WA and macro gap -- I think I can do without for now)
* 550 ex
* 3 - Lexar 1GB 80x CF
* Extra Battery
* Tamrac System 6 Camera Bag

**Now for the extras** (these or better lenses)(Note: I dont have a substitute for any of this -- I dont have a good printer or computer, etc)
* Sekonic L-358 light meter (I used to use an older model for portraits)
* New custom built computer tower (P4, 1gig, 160 mb, blah blah) dedicated to darkroom
* Canon i9900
* Monaco Optix Color Management
* 2 AB 800s
* 1 AB 400
* Stands and accessories for the Bees (umbrellas, softboxes, honeycomb grids, etc)

I'm definately leaning to this "package" as I'm not sure when I'd have this gift offered to me again. Shes already putting me to work 'paying' for this stuff :D
Looking forward to your always valuable input.

[defordphoto]

That's a helluva start! :shock:

The one suggestion I'd make at first peek: Go with at least a 250g hard disk. Drive space goes away real fast in this art.

[TomC]

That's a helluva start! :shock:

The one suggestion I'd make at first peek: Go with at least a 250g hard disk. Drive space goes away real fast in this art.
Thanks for the info on the HD. I'll have to check into that because (without rebates) this is right to the limit.

I've researched this for several months now and well, this is kinda what i'm coming up with. (I almost went film -- another post) I have a good wife.... but like I said, this will prolly be it for a good long while.

[aam1234]

Can't comment on the option you've listed, but have you seen this (http://www.alienbees.com/packages.html). It might save you a buck or two.

[TomC]

Can't comment on the option you've listed, but have you seen this (http://www.alienbees.com/packages.html). It might save you a buck or two.

Yes I've seen that. The package I have in my cart is a mixture of the Digibee and the intergalactic bee. (Sort of) The price falls in between those two as well. Thanks for posting!

[mikesd]

Congrats Tom, looks like a great package. Might I inquire if your wife has any other family members[sisters etc.], mine is very understanding but.............

[TomC]

Congrats Tom, looks like a great package. Might I inquire if your wife has any other family members[sisters etc.], mine is very understanding but.............

LOL. She has one but she is taken as well. Sorry :D
We had set an earlier limit but after all my research and begging :D she let me raise it a bit. I'm sooo excited, I can hardly wait. Guess I'll just have to fill my time here until March.

[aam1234]

TomC, I'll be keeping an eye on you (sort of) because I'm planning to do the same thing as you are doing with the studio setup, but that has to wait until we move to the new house. Please keep us updated as how things work out for you. Good luck.

[TomC]

TomC, I'll be keeping an eye on you (sort of) because I'm planning to do the same thing as you are doing with the studio setup, but that has to wait until we move to the new house. Please keep us updated as how things work out for you. Good luck.

Thank you. And I will. I plan on being here for a long long time :D
I'm so excited!!!!

[Jon]

I'd concur on the larger hard drive; prices are dropping rapidly. If possible, maybe even get two drives, and make sure the optical drive is a DVD burner. If you can swing it, get a video card that supports dual monitors, even if you don't get two monitors up front (the second doesn't have to be very big - a 15 or 17" CRT will do fine). You can keep all your toolbars out of the way of the picture you're working on that way. Consider getting a CF reader built-in. You might want to consider SanDisk Ultra II or Extreme CF cards rather than the Lexars if the price is right (SanDisk has been offering rebates on their 1 GB media recently). Canon's cameras don't support Lexar's Write Acceleration, and the SanDisk cards are at least as fast as the Lexars, if not faster. Check out Rob Galbraith's database (http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_page.asp?cid=6007-7303).

[TomC]

I'd concur on the larger hard drive; prices are dropping rapidly. If possible, maybe even get two drives, and make sure the optical drive is a DVD burner. If you can swing it, get a video card that supports dual monitors, even if you don't get two monitors up front (the second doesn't have to be very big - a 15 or 17" CRT will do fine). You can keep all your toolbars out of the way of the picture you're working on that way. Consider getting a CF reader built-in. You might want to consider SanDisk Ultra II or Extreme CF cards rather than the Lexars if the price is right (SanDisk has been offering rebates on their 1 GB media recently). Canon's cameras don't support Lexar's Write Acceleration, and the SanDisk cards are at least as fast as the Lexars, if not faster. Check out Rob Galbraith's database (http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_page.asp?cid=6007-7303).

Thanks a ton, Jon!! I'll look into all of that.
Besides keeping the toolbar out of the way, is there any other benefits to a dual monitor system?? I'm not sure what I'd use that for.

[Jon]

If the toolbars are out of the way, you'll be able to preview the whole photo when you test-apply sharpening, contrast and tonal adjustments. You could also have a copy of the original open in a viewer program for comparison purposes. Just having the extra workspace can help compensate for not having as larg a monitor as you might want. BTW, I prefer CRTs (even though they take up more space) to LCDs for photo work; you can generally see a better tonal range, really good quality LCDs are much more expensive than good CRTs, and an LCD display only really looks good at one resolution (usually 1280x1024 for 16-19" displays - 17-21" CRT equivalents) while you can change resolutions on your CRT freely without adversely affecting the on-screen appearance.

[TomC]

Alright thanks

[J Rabin]

Tom.
What a fun message to reply to. I won't comment on lighting, but from my own experience opinions on dig darkroom set up.
1. I assume you already own PhonyShop CS. If not, it is a must have, even to the point of giving up the Canon 70-200L f/2.8 for the f/4 (more on this below).
2. As an adjunct, since you may begin to shoot RAW, the best dig darkroom $99 I ever spent is PhotoKit Sharpener. 20D images need sharpening, which can be frustrating, time consuming, fraught with art, and hot opinions. PK Sharpener has ELIMINATED sharpening as a workflow issue. Amazing. It has separate routines for portraits, etc. Miranda's version is good too.
3. Digital Asset Management. You can use PSCS to manage images, but it's weak. ASee DSee is crude, slow. There are some public domain cheapies that do well. As a digital asset managers go, Extensis Portfolio 7 and iView Media Pro 2.6 are excellent. I went with iView Media Pro for reasons I won't go into, and like it.
4. Yes to built in DVD burner, but most come with this feature anyway.
5. Yes to hard disk space. Minimum internal is 160 to 250 GB. You can use this for a year, and then get an external in the future. More not essential to start. Burn CD/DVD backups.
6. After some comparison, I went with Monaco calibration kit too. Money well spent. But it delivers best only on better monitors, especially CRT's where you can adjust the RGB guns separately. If you go CRT, opinions vary, but which I recommend, get Aperture Grill technology, not Shadow Mask, and with adjustable RGB guns. The LaCie 22" blue is great. I think the Mitsubishi is similar. Sony is good.
LCDs are easier on the eyes, but too expensive. And the contrast was never satisfying to me. I like sharpness and contrast looking at screen images, like looking K-64/Provia slides on a light table. LCDs don't do that, YET. I figure my LaCie CRT is the last one I will ever buy, and in 4-5 years, LCDs will "be there," but not yet.
7. Cheap $16 SanDisk, LaCie, or equal CF card reader. NOT Dazzle, there are some weird compatibility problems with them.

Camera Gear Opinions.
1. Get SanDisk II CF cards over Lexar's. Canon does not recognize their WA speed technology. I've been disappointed with Lexar products.
2. Don't buy a NEW light meter. You will use it, but less than with film because you will start shooting more using the histogram, "the 21st century light meter." Get a used Sekonic or equal from eBay. Everyone is dumping good one's in excellent condition.
3. Your lens choice is your choice, of course. Opinions vary strongly. I will offer: HIGH ISO images are Soo... clean on the 20D, raising ISO and shooting f/4 is not a problem, and still gives nice background blur at distance. A good landscape/vacation travel/event 2-lens kit is the Canon 17-40L f/4 and 70-200L f/4. Or the Tamron and 70-200 f/4. That's it. Because the 20D 8 mpixel images leave so much room for cropping, shooting at 40mm, where you may have used 60mm+ is no problem. You'll need the 17-28mm for landscapes and tight indoors areas. My 17-40L copy was sharper than my Canon 50mm f/1.4, so I sold it. Cropping with a zoom instead of legs at candid events is too addicting to pass up. Shooting a portrait at 75mm is just fine. Unlike many purists on the forum, I'm not a prime lens advocate given how good contemporary zooms are.
I will offer the following experience: I have noticed a BIG difference in portrait/general photo quality, the sense creamy 3-D color fall off, between my lenses with circular apertures and those without. Pictures with circular aperture lenses on my 20D have a hard to define creamier texture fall off to OOF and color. I think the Tamron DOES have a circular aperture, and none of the other lenses you selected or I wrote about does. The Tamron takes sharp pictures. I focuses a bit slower than the 70-200, and does not lock focus as good as Canon's 24-70L in poor light. For studio work, who cares? The 50 f/1.8 focuses disappointing slow unless your in a studio setting. I never read much about circular apertures and picture quality, it's just my anecdotal observation, FWIW.
If you move the background further from subject, why do you need that 50mm lens if you will have duplicated with the Tamron. I think a two lens kit will do-ya to start.
Enjoy your agonizing choices that others only dream of....
J

[TomC]

J Rabin,
Thanks so much for the comprehensive thoughts. I will evaluate all that you said. (I still have a couple of months to tweak this stuff so...)

[mattchase]

I too agree about Sandisk Ultra II cards instead of Lexar. They are about equal for performance, and the Sandisks are usually less expensive, and often have rebates.

The 50mm 1.8 lens is a sweet, inexpensive, small and lightweight, super sharp lens. That said, since you have the range already covered with the Tamron (which is also a sharp lens) I think you would better off passing on the 50mm, and putting that money towards the new 580ex flash. I don't think the 550ex supports the newer TTL II, while the 20D does, and from my experience with a D60, 10D, and 1D cameras using the 550, the exposures are very hit and miss. A coworker has a Mark II and 580ex flash, and his flash exposures are much more accurate now.

Another option for a telephoto lens is the Sigma 70-200 2.8 HSM, which those who have used it will tell you it compares very well to the Canon version (non-IS). The price for the Sigma is about half that of the Canon 2.8, about the same as getting the Canon 70-200 F4. If you really want the Canon lens, and don't plan on shooting sports or concerts, then the 70-200 F4 would suit you fine, and save a you a lot of money.

I also agree about a used light meter. I rarely ever use mine anymore, defering to the histogram on the LCD or loading up the shot on my computer to see if the ratio is where I want it. Light meters still have their place, and are great when you know you need f16 here and f8 there, but there's nothing like looking at the real image and how the lighting falls in it right away at full size on the computer screen.

The Canon 17-40 F4 L is a nice answer to wide angle, when you are ready to go there. It is half the price of the 16-35mm 2.8, and very similar in all other respects. I haven't had any problems with mine, it is nice and sharp, and the F4 for landscape work isn't an issue. I have used it at some indoor events as well, and being that it is wide angle you can use a longer exposure time and not worry about camera shake, to make up for the lack of F2.8.

You don't have the vertical grip listed, is that not something you were going to get? It really helps to balance out the camera, plus gives you the vertical controls. And since you plan on getting an extra battery, it will allow you to have both batteries in the camera at one time. Maybe you can save this for a birthday present, I don't remember the exact cost but it wasn't too much.

And a final thought on the CF card sizes. I do have a 1gb card, but my other cards are all 512mb. I am in the camp that I don't want to have too many images on a single card, and risk that card going down. With the 10D, I get something like 140 RAW images on my 1gb card, so you would get a bit less with the 20D. I would guess you will still get somewhere around 80-100 shots when shooting RAW. If you were shooting JPGs, you would be getting.......a lot! So even though it would probably cost a few bucks more, think about getting a couple of smaller cards to supplement your 1 or 2 - 1gb cards. Or get in the habit of not filling the entire card, which can sometimes be hard to do in the heat of shooting.

[TomC]

Matt,
Thanks alot. I have considered the grip but like I said earlier, I did have to make some concessions to try an get a solid setup started. (within the limits of my alotted monies)

I havent looked at the Sigma lens yet but I will. I was hoping someone would tell me that the low noise of the 20D would allow the 70-200 f4 L to be sufficient for concerts etc. (JRabin). I'll have to look at that.

[GPR1]

I'll add a couple thoughts:

To disagree with others, I wouldn't spend the computer money on hard drive if you're tight on budget. I work off a laptop with 40 gig, choosing to spend my current money on photo equipment. I have to regularly burn images to CDs, but it's good backup practice anyway. I'd put my computer money in memory (you have a gig, a good start), a good video card, and an excellent monitor. If your monitor is not good you'll be forever frustrated trying to output images you like.

I have the i9900, and it's a great printer. You could save hundreds, however, by choosing the i960 or one of the new Pixma printers if you generally don't want anything over 8 1/2 x 11. If 5 prints a year will be larger, have those done at a lab. I bought the larger machine because I wanted to print a portfolio and the immediate cost of 40 larger images "paid" for much of the printer's cost.

Good luck and have fun shopping!

Greg

[J Rabin]

Tom C.
Thanks for your response to other opinions. While I am a Canon 24-70L and 70-200L IS user, and believe the 17-40L f/4 and 70-200L f/4 makes an ideal 2 lens travel outfit, here is another thought in favor of the Tamron 28-75 f/2.8 and Canon 70-200 f/4 two-lens combination: they both share the uncommon 67mm filter size. Buying that two-lens combo means saving $80+ by only owning one circular polarizer and any other filters, and another $500 not buying the f/2.8.
J

[TomC]

Tom C.
Thanks for your response to other opinions.
Didn't mean to ignore you. I was responding to these from work. Your input is very much appreciated.I do like the idea of the f4 but I just want to made sure it will work in some of the darker indoor venues (with the high iso performance of the 20D.)