Switching from Av to M

[iNfEk]

I own a 5D and have decided to shoot almost entirely in Manual Exposure mode (unless this is a bad idea). I am noticing that though I understand how to use that mode to make a proper exposure (well at least i think so ;)) I struggle when it becomes an opportunity shot or something that I have to react pretty quickly.

Is there any tips that anyone could give me to make my time turning dials shorter? I use the * to focus and the shutter button to meter.

I am very comfortable in either the Av or Tv modes though and tend to gravitate back to that mode. I just want to broaden my photography and take more creative and better looking shots.

Thanks for the help.

Jon

[hommedars]

Unless you are using an external exposure meter, what do you consider the benefit of M? If you're using the camera's metering, Av & Tv will give you the same exposure and you can override with EC if needed.

People talk about M like it is the panacea of photography, but it is just another option for use when needed.

[Gatorboy]

Unless you are using an external exposure meter, what do you consider the benefit of M? If you're using the camera's metering, Av & Tv will give you the same exposure and you can override with EC if needed.

Is it safe to assume you believe the camera is always metering correctly in Av? Unfortunately, that is not the case. Take an indoor basketball game for example. The lighting does not change, so set your exposure correctly in manual and you are golden. Now, put your camera in Av, and you'll have shutterspeeds all over the place. Your camera will be fooled by light/dark jersey's, gym walls, the crowd, etc.

[jonnythan]

IMO, if you're using the camera's internal exposure meter to adjust exposure between shots, you might as well be using Av.

M is useful when you're working in consistent lighting and want consistent exposure between shots. The indoor basketball game is a great example of such a situation.

But if you're struggling to keep up with exposure adjustment between shots and using the exposure meter to get it right, you should probably be in Av or Tv.

[hommedars]

Is it safe to assume you believe the camera is always metering correctly in Av?

No meter is always correct in every situation, but given the same metering mode and scene, my camera will give me the exact same exposure (EV) regardless of the shooting mode. If it didn't, it would be back to Canon in a heart beat.

[Hermeto]

No meter is always correct in every situation, but given the same metering mode and scene, my camera will give me the exact same exposure (EV) regardless of the shooting mode. If it didn't, it would be back to Canon in a heart beat.

You quoted the wrong part of Gatorboy’s post.
The important part that explains the difference between shooting Av and M is in bold:

Is it safe to assume you believe the camera is always metering correctly in Av? Unfortunately, that is not the case. Take an indoor basketball game for example. The lighting does not change, so set your exposure correctly in manual and you are golden. Now, put your camera in Av, and you'll have shutterspeeds all over the place. Your camera will be fooled by light/dark jersey's, gym walls, the crowd, etc.

[jonnythan]

Yes, but the key words from the OP are:

"I struggle when it becomes an opportunity shot or something that I have to react pretty quickly."

This type of situation really begs for use of Av or Tv modes instead of M.

[iNfEk]

I really just want to control most of my photography rather than the camera.

this is the only creative out let that I have now since becoming a parent 3 kids ago.

Isn't M the way to go for more creativity in the shot since you can override the in camera metering system?

[iNfEk]

Yes, but the key words from the OP are:

"I struggle when it becomes an opportunity shot or something that I have to react pretty quickly."

This type of situation really begs for use of Av or Tv modes instead of M.
yes this is so and Av or Tv is the mode I've been choosing for this. but wanted to know if there is tricks in M as well

[hommedars]

You quoted the wrong part of Gatorboy’s post.
The important part that explains the difference between shooting Av and M is in bold:

Of course, I did that intentionally to be polite.

[hommedars]

Isn't M the way to go for more creativity in the shot since you can override the in camera metering system?

Only if your camera doesn't allow enough exposure compensation, otherwise light is light.

[jonnythan]

Don't start shooting everything in M because you think you're supposed to be.

Shoot in M when the situation calls for it and you don't want the camera to be making exposure decisions for you. Shoot in other modes when the situation calls for them and you want the camera to help you out a bit deciding exposure.

[nicksan]

Of course, I did that intentionally to be polite.

So which part didn't you get?

[nicksan]

Yep.:cool:
Is it safe to assume you believe the camera is always metering correctly in Av? Unfortunately, that is not the case. Take an indoor basketball game for example. The lighting does not change, so set your exposure correctly in manual and you are golden. Now, put your camera in Av, and you'll have shutterspeeds all over the place. Your camera will be fooled by light/dark jersey's, gym walls, the crowd, etc.

[Hermeto]

Of course, I did that intentionally to be polite.

Okay, you succeeded in being polite, but you failed in drawing the right conclusion.
If you us M the exposure will not depend on the background.
It will be constant and uniform throughout the event.

[Curtis N]

M mode is for thinking photographers who make metering a conscious, deliberate part of the process.

Of course it takes a bit more time to meter this way, which can lead to missed shots when the opportunity is brief.

So thinking photographers also prepare for such moments by adjusting the camera for the lighting conditions they're in, before such opportunities arise.

[hommedars]

So which part didn't you get?

I got it just fine, thank you.

The bolded statement uses one very specific scenario to justify that M is better than Av, and doesn't relate to the OP's question. In fact, it is just a choice--another tool to be used when appropriate.

[jonnythan]

M mode is for thinking photographers who make metering a conscious, deliberate part of the process.

Of course it takes a bit more time to meter this way, which can lead to missed shots when the opportunity is brief.

So thinking photographers also prepare for such moments by adjusting the camera for the lighting conditions they're in, before such opportunities arise.

Of course, the implication here is that you're a nonthinking photographer if you use any mode other than M.

And this type of silly implication leads to people using M where there's no need for it and it impedes their ability to take photographs.

[hommedars]

M mode is for thinking photographers...

OK, now that you put it that way, I will respectfully bow out of the conversation. I'm off to Google a support group for non-thinking photographers.

[Hermeto]

I got it just fine, thank you.

The bolded statement uses one very specific scenario to justify that M is better than Av, and doesn't relate to the OP's question. In fact, it just a choice--another tool to be used when appropriate.

As a matter of fact, that scenario happens very often!
Most of the inside events will bring the subject of exposure being fooled by reflections from clothes and/or the background.

[Curtis N]

Of course, the implication here is that you're a nonthinking photographer if you use any mode other than M. And this type of silly implication leads to people using M where there's no need for it and it impedes their ability to take photographs.OK, now that you put it that way, I will respectfully bow out of the conversation. I'm off to Google a support group for non-thinking photographers.You're both extrapolating more from my post than was there.

I use Av and Tv sometimes, too. M isn't always the best way or the only way. But it does require more thought with regard to exposure than the modes that meter automatically.

All I'm saying is, if you're gonna use M, you gotta think ahead.

[dave kadolph]

A quick question regarding the discussion and the example used.

My home gym is about 1 full stop slower at either goal than center court due to center court being effectively lit by more banks of lights-- reflected light from a bank of lights at the top of the key area and none over the bleachers.

I have been using AV and partial metering with center focal point only.

Is there a better way to approach this?

[OdiN1701]

I shoot in M all the time - but you don't have to. It's personal preference.

Now...if you are shooting outdoors in bright light - M is probably best. Indoors with consistent light Av can be better in some instances.

I'm just used to shooting in M full time, so I don't really use the other modes much.

[Gatorboy]

I got it just fine, thank you.

The bolded statement uses one very specific scenario to justify that M is better than Av, and doesn't relate to the OP's question.

That was just one example. You can take that outdoors as well, and have consistent light. Now, if you are outside, then running into shade, and indoors over a short period, then use Av.

Remember, there is more than one way to skin a cat.

[Gatorboy]

My home gym is about 1 full stop slower at either goal than center court due to center court being effectively lit by more banks of lights ... I have been using AV and partial metering with center focal point only. ... Is there a better way to approach this?

You can still shoot manual, and when the ball is near the center of the court stop down a couple clicks, and open back up as they near the basket.

[rabidcow]

I was an avid M shooter for so long, then I switched to Av for candids shots. But I need to mention that I also switched to linked spot metering. I shoot Av +2/3 on my 1D Classic, and Av +1/3 on my MkII. This will change a bit from event to event, but it is my springboard. Saying that M is "better" that Av or Tv is like saying that a Phillips head screwdriver is better than an Allen wrench. They are tools in your photography toolbox.

M has it's place with me in situations where I use artificial lighting, but for natural light I choose to use Av. I am not a Tv guy at all. Does this make me right? NO!!! It makes it right for ME. I get a 92% keeper rate (yes, i figured it out) with Av, in regards to exposure. The ones that got away are because I did not utilize my focus point correctly on the subject. (half background half face covered in the spot meter for example).

No one is RIGHT or WRONG in their exposure mode choice, it is a matter of what works for your shooting style.

[Mike R]

I shoot sports in M, I can keep my shutter speed and aperture constant and quickly change my ISO if I need to such as when I'm at a HS baseball game and each base is in a different light. But when shooting some landscape shots and the camera is on a tripod, I have no problem in using AV because shutter speed is less of an issue.

I have to agree with rabidcow when he says: No one is RIGHT or WRONG in their exposure mode choice, it is a matter of what works for your shooting style._

[PhotosGuy]

I shoot sports in M, I can keep my shutter speed and aperture constant and quickly change my ISO if I need to I suggest that in this thread: Need an exposure crutch? (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=89123)

"FIRST: Set your ISO one stop higher. Remembering how you did that, put the camera up to your eye & change it back again.
Do this 5 or 6 times. When you get used to it, it's pretty fast, isn't it?

SECOND: Holding your camera at your waist as if you're looking at a possible shot & the sun goes behind a cloud, start raising the cam to your eye & still without taking your eye off the subject, change to a 2X higher ISO. That's pretty fast too, isn't it?"

It's nice to that someone else is doing it. ;)

[Mike R]

I suggest that in this thread: Need an exposure crutch? (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=89123)

"FIRST: Set your ISO one stop higher. Remembering how you did that, put the camera up to your eye & change it back again.
Do this 5 or 6 times. When you get used to it, it's pretty fast, isn't it?

SECOND: Holding your camera at your waist as if you're looking at a possible shot & the sun goes behind a cloud, start raising the cam to your eye & still without taking your eye off the subject, change to a 2X higher ISO. That's pretty fast too, isn't it?"

It's nice to that someone else is doing it. ;)

I probably learned about it from the great folks here at POTN, all I really remember is that one day I was here and then all of a sudden, my camera was set to M for most of my shooting, and my bank account was getting quite small.

[iNfEk]

I suggest that in this thread: Need an exposure crutch? (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=89123)

"FIRST: Set your ISO one stop higher. Remembering how you did that, put the camera up to your eye & change it back again.
Do this 5 or 6 times. When you get used to it, it's pretty fast, isn't it?

SECOND: Holding your camera at your waist as if you're looking at a possible shot & the sun goes behind a cloud, start raising the cam to your eye & still without taking your eye off the subject, change to a 2X higher ISO. That's pretty fast too, isn't it?"

It's nice to that someone else is doing it. ;)
I'll revisit this post again.. it does have some useful information for me.

Thank you.

Mike R is right that POTN makes things easier to learn. I'm wanting to better my photography because of this place. Also the learning curve for me in the technical sense is pretty steep on some things but many different examples makes it easier to digest

[BillMarks]

I own a 5D and have decided to shoot almost entirely in Manual Exposure mode (unless this is a bad idea). I am noticing that though I understand how to use that mode to make a proper exposure (well at least i think so ;)) I struggle when it becomes an opportunity shot or something that I have to react pretty quickly.

Is there any tips that anyone could give me to make my time turning dials shorter? I use the * to focus and the shutter button to meter.

I am very comfortable in either the Av or Tv modes though and tend to gravitate back to that mode. I just want to broaden my photography and take more creative and better looking shots.

Thanks for the help.

Jon

That's exactly the beauty of having a camera with exposure options! When you are in a situation that will likely have a lot of "opportunity" shots and changing lighting characteristics, shoot in a mode other than M and you are covered.

I have a 5D and use all the options. I even use full auto when I'm at a family event and am just taking snaps for the in-laws and such. Then They are already in jpeg format (I usually shoot in RAW) so I can quickly pop them on a disc and give them out without converting.