So I hear websites really help business

[JAcosta]

The thing is, Im completely clueless about making them. I dont know how to make one, dont know how to register a domain, bandwidth, etc. Basically, I dont know anything about where to start.

Can anyone here recommend some good reading, or maybe websites with an all in one kind of thing with a template that I can just add to? When I leave Japan in a few months Im going to need to have something to fall back on for some extra cash for my new assignment. I have thought about using craigslist, the local paper, etc, but Id rather have somewhere (other than flickr) for people to see my work and pricing.

Thanks.

-John

[tbisaacs]

Before you dive into building (or hopefully hiring a professional to build it for you), I would come up with some goals for your website. Do you want a simple portfolio, to sell prints, or just a virtual business card? Depending on what you want to achieve, there could be vastly different ways to solve you problem.

Many photographers have the "if you build it they will come" impression when putting up a site and are often disappointed. For example, if you make most of your money locally by word-of-mouth and referrals, a website might not do you much good.

Cheers, and good luck!

[JAcosta]

Ive never really thought about what I wanted, per se. I guess Im looking for more of a virtual business card. Something that I can tell people to look up and see what Im about. Im not too much for selling prints online, as I think Im too lazy to work out the logistics of it. I guess something more like an online portfolio with my rates and contact information is what I had in my head.

Thanks for the response.

[sfaust]

You're better off hiring someone to do this for you, than trying to do it yourself. A pro will get the job done faster, better, and it will look far better than what most of us can do ourselves with little experience.

Just as we tell potential clients that hiring a pro photographer will result in better images, we should heed our own advice. When it comes to things we don't have experience in, its best to get outside help. Website, accounting, legal advice, etc.

Secondly, don't except things to happen just because a website is put up on-line. Unless you drive potential clients to the website, no one will know its there. Without the marketing to get people to the website, its just another couple pages among the billions of pages in the ocean. The key will be what marketing you do in order to get people to your site, then turn them into clients.

[sfaust]

Ah, you both beat me to the punch while I was typing!

If its a place to tell people where they can see your work, there are lots of nice ways to do this with apps that build galleries for you that you can upload. Such as simple viewer, porta, bridge, photoshop, etc. Wrap a home page around it with some basic info, and you have an on-line gallery.

[Ralph Merlino]

JA, once again Stephen is right on. I finally after many years had a web site built by
a friend of mine who builds sites for a living. It just went up last week. He is a pro
and knows what he is doing. The site looks good and is easy to navigate. Now what I
do is call photo editors for magazines that I would like to get assignments from and
direct them to my site. Most of the magazines I have worked for in the past however
new editors pop up from time to time. My friend did not charge that much, it was well worth the price. I put up a cross section of my work from the last twenty years. So
far it seems to be working, the editors all seem to like it.

[JAcosta]

Wow thanks for the responses everyone.

Stephen,
Do you know of any tutorials online, or maybe a book I can find that would give me some information on how to use photoshop, bridge, etc? Im also not above paying someone to do it for me, as I agree with you that hiring a professional would yield better results.

Ralph,
Could I see your webpage so I could maybe get a few ideas? Also what would be a fair price to look for when finding someone to build a site for me?

One last thing, how would I go about registering a domain and who would I have host it? Does anyone have any recommendations as to where I should look?

Thanks again, you both have been very helpful thus far.

[Ralph Merlino]

JA,

I sent you a PM

[shane_c]

Many photographers have the "if you build it they will come" impression when putting up a site and are often disappointed. For example, if you make most of your money locally by word-of-mouth and referrals, a website might not do you much good.

Cheers, and good luck!

I agree. I thought the same thing. Set up my site and have gotten a lot of great comments about my photos but it has resulted in ZERO sales.

[tim]

I agree, hire a professional. Even somewhere like www.bludomain.com might be easy enough for you, with hosting by them, so long as you have a technical friend to help you add your images and such. Even then it sounds like you may need a full service place, so local may be your best bet. Just look at lots of photographers site to work out what you want before you hire anyone.

[sfaust]

Even somewhere like www.bludomain.com (http://www.bludomain.com) might be easy enough for you, with hosting by them, so long as you have a technical friend to help you add your images and such.

The last thing you will need with BluDomain is a technical resource to help you add images. There is a whole back end interface for updating most of the websites text, images, captions, colors, logos, etc. Its trivial for even a novice user.

Here are a few screen shots of the back end. I've suggested to them that they should have an example site on-line that people can try out the back end, or at lest some screen shots. Its one of the most attractive feature so their sites. So easy to maintain.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3023/2602322138_8b4033dd20.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3203/2601527167_233cfa598a.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3022/2602320998_7a17c17620.jpg

[tim]

The last thing you will need with BluDomain is a technical resource to help you add images. There is a whole back end interface for updating most of the websites text, images, captions, colors, logos, etc. Its trivial for even a novice user.

Here are a few screen shots of the back end. I've suggested to them that they should have an example site on-line that people can try out the back end, or at lest some screen shots. Its one of the most attractive feature so their sites. So easy to maintain.

Yep, I have one too, but since the OP asked for Photoshop and Bridge help I made the assumption they didn't have the skills to properly process their images for the web. if they can then a BD site is easy enough to use.

[sfaust]

Good point Tim. I wasn't thinking of the pre-processing aspects, just the uploading and populating of the site.

But I think his question about Photoshop and Bridge was more about how to use those tools to create web galleries as I suggested, and not so much on how to process images for the web. I've never used photoshop to create a web gallery, but I know it can be done. I think I could probably use that tutorial myself :)

[tim]

Photoshop galleries are easy, pretty much follow your nose and you'll work it out in a few minutes. I prefer www.jalbum.net for galleries, and I use a variety of software depending what i'm doing.

[sapearl]

Hi John - been following the thread and enjoying the interesting comments.

Have you considered started out walking first before running? Perhaps you may want to get a blog up and running prior to creation of a full-blown website? Obviously you can't compare a blog to a custom made website with all the features and capability inherent in the latter. But there are some quick advantages.

For some time I'd wanted to create a website, but I had neither the time, expertise or energy after my day job to teach myself what was necessary. I can't code html. I bought books, experimented, messed things up and just frustrated myself. I am a photographer and not a coder. I finally hired a pro to do what I needed, and it was money well spent. Once the site got up and running though, I discovered blogger.

What's nice about many of the blog applications out there is you don't need to code. Oh, it can help but many of these are simple, templated apps that allow you to throw something up pleasant in less than an hour.

You can easily change text, add articles, upload photos etc. I use MY BLOG (http://www.pearlphoto.blogspot.com/)as a supplement to my regular website. It has links to my online galleries as well as pointers back to the main site. I use it for writing articles on photography, generating "buzz" or just to feature some current project in which I've been involved.

Try the concept out John - it won't cost you anything except time and you could have a little fun with it :D. - Stu

[sapearl]

I agree with Travis here....this is very true - many assume that the online gallery is the automatic magnet for new business. It CAN be if you offer something spectacular that nobody else has, and if Google can easily find it, but this generally is not the case.

About a year and a half ago I put up a PBase gallery in addition to my website. The two are linked. In all that time I've sold only ONE fine art print. And that was the result of a local gallery surfing the web, looking for a particular type of photo for specifc office decor. The sales researcher just happened to stumble across my gallery thanks to Google.

I'd started THIS THREAD (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=431055)which talks about gallery sales and printing strategies.

But even if your site or gallery does not generate sales or inquiries, there is a very important "credibility factor" that comes into play if you DON'T have a website. Although there has been a major shift in print advertising in the past few years, web presence is absolutely critical. Prospective clients want something to look at, right away, easily and with no hassle.

If you are a serious business and you DON'T have a website, it's almost as if you are not professional, nor are you really dedicated to the trade. And if your site is slow to load, cumbersome to navigate or has annoying music that can't be silenced, people will quickly go elsewhere. - Stu

.......
Many photographers have the "if you build it they will come" impression when putting up a site and are often disappointed. For example, if you make most of your money locally by word-of-mouth and referrals, a website might not do you much good.

Cheers, and good luck!

[JAcosta]

I agree with Travis here....this is very true - many assume that the online gallery is the automatic magnet for new business. It CAN be if you offer something spectacular that nobody else has, and if Google can easily find it, but this generally is not the case.

About a year and a half ago I put up a PBase gallery in addition to my website. The two are linked. In all that time I've sold only ONE fine art print. And that was the result of a local gallery surfing the web, looking for a particular type of photo for specifc office decor. The sales researcher just happened to stumble across my gallery thanks to Google.

I'd started THIS THREAD (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=431055)which talks about gallery sales and printing strategies.

But even if your site or gallery does not generate sales or inquiries, there is a very important "credibility factor" that comes into play if you DON'T have a website. Although there has been a major shift in print advertising in the past few years, web presence is absolutely critical. Prospective clients want something to look at, right away, easily and with no hassle.

If you are a serious business and you DON'T have a website, it's almost as if you are not professional, nor are you really dedicated to the trade. And if your site is slow to load, cumbersome to navigate or has annoying music that can't be silenced, people will quickly go elsewhere. - Stu

Thats exactly why I'd want a web gallery. Im not looking to generate sales or bring attention to myself. Its more to project an image of professionalism, and to give my potential clients a reference for my work they can access easily and instantly.

Thank you everyone for your help. I really appreciate al the responses and you have all given me a lot of food for thought. Gotta love POTN

-John

[sfaust]

Stuart, thats a great idea. I also use a blog for the same reasons. Thinking back when I first started and developed my website, if blogs were an option, I think I would take that lane first, then build on that with a website. Blogs are perfectly suited to show off your work, and add some interest. They can also have a couple links to some galleries to showcase the photographers work. And as you mentioned, are easy to setup and maintain.

What's even better, is that it gets people coming back to read more as you enter new posts, unlike a website which is more static and visited less often.

[sapearl]

Hi Stephen - thank you ;).

There's also a way to subscribe to specific blogs. You automatically get notified of updates, new articles, or any sort of changes to the content. It's using some sort of RSS feed or Atom..... don't totally understand it myself, but a few friends subscribe to mine will drop me a line usually after I post something new.

The thing that I really like about blogs is it's something that I'm competent to maintain myself :lol:. I don't have to call somebody or pay anyone if I want to make a change or addition.

I also view a website as something relatively static, more like a brick and mortar establishment. It's typically a more formal, rigid framework. By contrast I consider the blog concept as comparatively fluid and dynamic. It's more like a living breathing organism that can quickly be changed on the fly..... sort of like a travelling roadshow presented from the back of your RV, as opposed to the permanent (website) storefront that sits on a particular street corner.

......What's even better, is that it gets people coming back to read more as you enter new posts, unlike a website which is more static and visited less often.

[hommedars]

It should be noted that there is a downside to having a web site/gallery, and that is image theft. Putting images online in public galleries is a bit like leaving a stack of $100 bills on the bar while you go to the bathroom, and expecting them to all be there when you return.

After three image theft incidents, I now only use private galleries (password protected) for image display. BTW, those are three incidents that I know of. Who knows how many more images are being used illegally?

If you do wedding or portrait photography, this may not be such an issue and the exposure of a web site is probably worth the limited risk, but for editorial, commercial, fine art, and stock, my clients would just as soon receive preview images via email or FTP upload.

In the 6 years I had a public site, I never made a sale or got a job from it, but I did have the frustration and lost time of tracking down photo thieves.

Just my 2 cents.

[JAcosta]

Well I took everyone's advice, and made a blog. I threw it together over a little over an hour, and Im content with it for now. Would you guys let me know what you think?

http://avphotoonline.blogspot.com/

Thanks!

[SplashPublishing]

Through my own business and the business of my clients, I have learned that the most important factor when building a website is the ease of accessing your content, both on the front and back end. Here is a sampling of factors play into the effectiveness of the site:

Navigation - Without clean and simple navigation you will quickly frustrate and loose customers.
Current Information - Websites that are out of date give your business an unprofessional look. This problem can be solved though the use of content management systems (CMS). With one simple internet login you gain access to all your text and images.
How quickly does the page load? CSS stylized websites dramatically decrease loading times and are considerably faster than flash sites. Also CSS stylized sites are much more friendly with search engines (which can equate to greater web traffic). I just redesigned my company's website for those exact reasons.
Professionalism - In today's world potential customers simply expect you to have a website in order to establish your professional presence.I am a student at the University of Pennsylvania, photographer for the local newspaper and a web designer. If you're interested please check out my company's website at www.SplashDigitalPublishing.com (http://www.SplashDigitalPublishing.com). Our full service packages start at a fraction of the competition (much thanks to student financial aid and scholarships). If nothing else the site can educate you on the many features you might want to build into your site. Please use the contact page on the site if you have any questions!

[sapearl]

Image theft is certainly a concern and something to be considered. I really don't know what the answer is here hommedars but you raise some very valid points.

Some of my wedding/social event galleries are PW protected if requested by the client. Typically those files measure 800x600 and run around 50-90K each. I suppose people can print them but they will look pretty lousy.

I don't PW my "fine art" material which tends to be urban and rural landscape work. These files are also 800x600 but a little larger at 100-150k. Again, folks could print them but I can't imagine them being good images. Everything is saved for screen resolution, 72 DPI.

I honestly don't know if I've been ripped off or not. I wouldn't consider my pictures "hot property" like sports, glamor or hot rod material, but who knows?

It should be noted that there is a downside to having a web site/gallery, and that is image theft. Putting images online in public galleries is a bit like leaving a stack of $100 bills on the bar while you go to the bathroom, and expecting them to all be there when you return.

After three image theft incidents, I now only use private galleries (password protected) for image display. BTW, those are three incidents that I know of. Who knows how many more images are being used illegally?

If you do wedding or portrait photography, this may not be such an issue and the exposure of a web site is probably worth the limited risk, but for editorial, commercial, fine art, and stock, my clients would just as soon receive preview images via email or FTP upload.

In the 6 years I had a public site, I never made a sale or got a job from it, but I did have the frustration and lost time of tracking down photo thieves.

Just my 2 cents.

[sapearl]

See how easy that was JA? Glad you didn't make a liar out of me :lol:. That's a pretty decent first attempt for less than an hour's work..... and that's one of the things that I found so attractive about it.

Btw, interesting Asian pictures you have there.

Well I took everyone's advice, and made a blog. I threw it together over a little over an hour, and Im content with it for now. Would you guys let me know what you think?

http://avphotoonline.blogspot.com/

Thanks!

[hommedars]

...I honestly don't know if I've been ripped off or not...

IMHO, that is the problem.

I was never concerned until it happened and a friend said he thought he saw an image similar to mine on a web site.

Then, when an agency wanted to buy exclusive rights to some of my images I go very concerned. How can I ethically sell exclusive rights unless I am positive those images do not exist anywhere else.

And while 800x600 images may be poor printing candidates, they work just fine all types of web design.

I just hope that people consider the implications before publicly displaying pictures that may have real intrinsic value.

[hommedars]

Just take a look at what happened to one of members today:

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=525059

[tim]

I rarely even update my main website any more, I just have a link to my blog from my gallery and tell people the new work goes on the blog.

[sfaust]

There is very little you can do regarding image theft except not post.

But the downside or not posting is more hurtful to your business. The internet has become a place for commerce. If you don't have a web presence, its really hurts your business. Having a web presence without images, will also hurt your business. potential clients aren't going to mail the website owner asking for permission to see their gallery. They will just move to the next photographer. Sale lost. So you really need a site and a gallery.

What I recommend is pretty easy. Setup your gallery with low resolution images. Just enough to make a good screen representation. If you sell retail, then a watermark isn't a bad idea on proofs, but not a great one on the 'photographers gallery' or portfolio.

Second, disable right clicking and saving the image. That will stop the casual theft if they don't know the workarounds.

Thirdly, REGISTER YOUR IMAGES! Nothing that works better as a collection letter or point for negotiation for a fair usage fee than a form letter drafted from an attorney, with their contact information right there on it, asking for your fair payment and noting the images are registered, copyrighted, and listing the penalties hat can be imposed with pointers to the copyright law and relevant sections so they can go read for themselves.

When they find out they are on the wrong side of the law, ignorance is no excuse, and penalties that discuss damages, statutory damages up to $150K per image, and reimbursement of your attorneys fees, it seems to break the back of their argument, and want to settle. It also works for collecting from clients that have used the images already, but haven't paid the final invoice.

I've used it more than once, and its worked like a charm. You can't stop it, but you can be prepared to deal with it wen it does.

[hommedars]

But the downside or not posting is more hurtful to your business. The internet has become a place for commerce. If you don't have a web presence, its really hurts your business. Having a web presence without images, will also hurt your business. potential clients aren't going to mail the website owner asking for permission to see their gallery. They will just move to the next photographer. Sale lost. So you really need a site and a gallery.

This is a myth unless you generate leads from the general public, and then only if they know how to find your web site.

Commercial clients, editors, stock houses, etc. are not trolling the web looking for photographers and photographs--you have to approach them, and even then it is unlikely you will land the account based upon web images.

My only point here is that you should know your (prospective) client before knowing if there is any value in a web site because the image theft risk is there regardless.

[sapearl]

Hommedars, with all due respect do you really believe this? And it's possibly I'm confusing two different markets here: wedding and social event clients and their associated galleries vs. another set of galleries in which I keep what I consider to be "fine art."

My only fine art sale so far was to a respected art gallery, which in fact was trolling the web looking for a specific type of work. That being said, I will concede the possibility that they were the exception rather than the rule.

But I still FIRMLY believe that in this day of assumed web commerce, it is EXPECTED that you have some sort of web/image presence. If you don't, then you are something less than the next person. You could in fact be an excellent photographer. But if nobody can instantly get a peak at your work in this day of instant gratification and expectation then they will just move on to a website that does display the talents of its owner.

As a wedding and event photographer I would stand very little chance in the marketplace without a website that had sample galleries. I concede the exception would be those great photographers who have already established themselves in the marketplace, and whose name alone is sufficient advertisement. Unfortunately I do not fall into that category so I need the help of my sample images ;).

This is a myth unless you generate leads from the general public, and then only if they know how to find your web site.

Commercial clients, editors, stock houses, etc. are not trolling the web looking for photographers and photographs--you have to approach them, and even then it is unlikely you will land the account based upon web images.

My only point here is that you should know your (prospective) client before knowing if there is any value in a web site because the image theft risk is there regardless.

[tim]

I agree with Stu - an online portfolio is essential if you want to get new business, whether it's wedding, portrait or commercial. Fine art I wouldn't think is quite as critical, i'd expect to see that in galleries, but great photographers could probably gain more sales that way.

Put it this way - no matter what I buy I expect to at least have information online, if not online ordering. This is especially true of people in their 20s and younger - if something's not in google it don't exist. Recently looking for houses for a weekend away I didn't even consider the ones that didn't have websites.

[hommedars]

Hommedars, with all due respect do you really believe this?

Yes I do, but let's keep in mind that we (you and I) are talking about two different markets. I conceded that web sites are important to anyone dealing with the general public, and perhaps for some other specialties--I am not an expert on all types of photo markets.

BUT, for markets such as editorial, stock (which is huge for many of us), and fine art, my experience shows that it is all done with personal contacts and submissions. In fact, many times I've asked agencies and editors to review my work via my web site, and each time they declined because they want real hi-res samples that reflect true image quality.

Of course, I am sure there are exceptions in all cases, but it is my experience and simply submitted for what it is worth.

[sfaust]

This is a myth unless you generate leads from the general public, and then only if they know how to find your web site.

Commercial clients, editors, stock houses, etc. are not trolling the web looking for photographers and photographs--you have to approach them, and even then it is unlikely you will land the account based upon web images.

I stated that point quite clearly in my earlier post. You absolutely have to drive clients to your website. But what good does it do to drive them to your website, only to find your website gallery all locked up. If you don't make it easy for your customers, they will just pass you by. Requiring a password before people can access your website portfolio is just plain bad marketing. I doubt you will find anyone in marketing that would suggest locking up a portfolio behind a password (other than client job galleries).

Commercial clients and editors are indeed trolling looking for talent. A very quick count of people that found me on the web, without my marketing to them, accounts for about $30K last year. Some have turned into repeat clients accounting for even more future business. And many of these were decent projects in the $3K to $5K range. If its really a myth, I'll take it ;) And its worth the trade off of the possible theft of a few low res images. There are other ways to deal with that, rather than risk loosing new business, or locking potential clients out of your portfolio.

[hommedars]

A very quick count of people that found me on the web, without my marketing to them, accounts for about $30K last year.

So, with all due respect, we have nothing more to discuss, because our experiences, and probably our markets, are miles apart. You make $30K per year via the web, and I can say with certainty that in 10 years of professional work I have never made one cent via my web site.

[sfaust]

So, with all due respect, we have nothing more to discuss, because our experiences, and probably our markets, are miles apart. You make $30K per year via the web, and I can say with certainty that in 10 years of professional work I have never made one cent via my web site.

I believe we are talking about the same markets, as you mention commercial and editorial specifically, which accounts for about 75% of my business. The remaining is from multimedia and video work.

Perhaps its the definition of 'making money via the web', and not the markets that's at issue. I'll at least clarify where that figure came from.

I don't sell prints, merchandise, etc, direct to anyone via my website. I just sell myself and my services. The money I mentioned was made by clients finding me via their own sources on the internet. Be it search engines, photographer listings, trolling through Flickr, etc. These are usually inquiries made through my website on the contact page, or calling me directly.

So while I am not really making money off my website per se, it is a direct result of having that website accessible, displaying my work, such that the potential client feels there is a match and I am worth contacting to discuss the project further.

I also think you are dead wrong, based on my own experience, with regard to the editorial market. Even more so than commercial work. An editor in Chicago doesn't have personal contacts in cities all over the nation. The internet has been a great problem solver for them in that regard. The editor in Chicago who needs a photographer in Boston can do a quick search and be presented with a couple dozen candidates. A quick peek at their portfolios and they can narrow it down to a couple that they feel have the experience, skills, and style for their project. A few phone calls, and they have their photographer.

I have 3 or 4 editorial clients I work with regularly. They are all from out of state (1 out of the country), and they all found me through my website. I also get about a 7-10 additional jobs from other editorial clients that have an occasional need in my area. They also find me via the web.

How they find me varies. Search engines, on-line photographer listings, my blog, I've even gotten a job or two from someone finding me through my Flickr account. Weird, but it happens.

My point is, based on my own experience, there IS a lot of people using the internet to find talent, and for decent sized projects. Easy access to seeing a photographers work is crucial to getting to the next step, which is a phone call or e-mail asking for more information, pricing, bid, etc. If you make it hard for them to take that step, there are a dozen other photographers in their short list and they will just move on.

The risk of theft of a low resolution image is insignificant in the big picture.

With that said, if your business model is selling low resolution images via the internet, then ignore everything I just said. That is a totally different market for which I have no experience at all.

[Adaptive]

See analogy below.

Websites are to Businesses, as Wheels are to Automobiles

Makes sense?

[sfaust]

See analogy below.

Websites are to Businesses, as Wheels are to Automobiles

Makes sense?

Love it......

And a website with a password protected portfolio...
is like a Ferrari wearing a Denver boot!

Even the car thieves will pass it up ;)

[Adaptive]

Love it......

And a website with a password protected portfolio...
is like a Ferrari wearing a Denver boot!

Even the car thieves will pass it up ;)


hehe I just made that up :)

I better add © at the end :lol:


But yeah there are exceptions to my analogy when it comes to businesses.
If a business is already booming it doesn't really need to have a great website.
For example, how many popular Chinese takeout stores have great websites? better yet... How many Chinese takeout stores have websites period?? hehe

If all your business relies on local traffic and word of mouth a website will probably do you no good at the begining, but it will help spread the word and eventually you will start getting a more diverse clientèle.