Am I nuts or what?

[Randy1213]

Wondering whether anyone else has had this problem. I have a Gitzo G1257 tripod with the leveling column. I'm using a Kirk's BH-1 with an Arca-style quick release on it. I found this problem when trying to shoot pics to stich in a pano.

I first level the center column using the little bubble level attached to it. I then level the camera with a bubble level mounted on the hot shoe. The two levels are perfectly straight for my first pic. Even though the ball is totally locked down to prevent swivel, when I pan, the darn thing is soon no longer level! Unless there's been some major change in the laws of physics, all I can think is that my quick release must've gotten bent or something. Has anyone had a similar problem and, if so, have any suggestions other than waiting an eternity to send it to Kirk and get it back at a no-doubt whopping cost?!?!?

[René Damkot]

My first guess would be that the bubble level of the center column isn't level.
I think that if the QR were bent, the camera would remain level while panning. The only way to alter the camera angle while panning, is if the panning base isn't level...

[Jon]

I'd agree with René; is your bubble level mounted on the center column, or on the head which is on the center column, or on the legs. And if it's on the column, but removeable, does it have clean contact with the mounting point? Can you twist the column and have it remain level?

[Randy1213]

Thanks for the advice, Rene and Jon. Odd problem. And, Jon, there's a bubble level on the column as well as one on the QR clamp. I'll check the connection of the level on the column. I'm also going to borrow a friend's BH and see if there's any difference there.

[blueM]

I'm not familier with your gear so not sure whether this concept will apply. When our suveyor sets up his equipment (I'm talking about old school equipment) he levels the instrument in 1 direction, then swings it 90 degrees & does it again. Last step is to swing it back to the original position to check or re-adjust.

[SkipD]

I have found that bubble levels are very often not precisely calibrated. This applies to all sorts of configurations including even some fairly high priced carpenter's levels. I would be surprised if all the inexpensive hotshoe levels available are truly accurate. MANY of the little circular levels I have purchased have not been accurate until I adjusted them (by grinding their bottoms until they are accurate).

Here's a way to test any level's bubbles for accuracy: Place the level on a reasonably "level" surface. Carefully mark the level's position on the surface (with a marker, tape, or whatever). Allow the bubble to settle, and note the precise position of the bubble (the bubble may not be centered, but the surface the level is on may not be truly level). Now, rotate the level on the surface exactly 180° and be sure it is referenced to the alignment marks you made before. The bubble should now be in precisely the same relative position (the same distance from center and the same direction from center relative to YOUR position, not the level's) that it was before. If, for example, the bubble is 1/16" to the right of center (relative to your viewing position) with the level in both positions, the level is accurate.

You can use this method to check a hotshoe level on a camera. If the camera is an SLR, take the lens off so its weight does not make the camera tip. Mount the hotshoe level. Align the camera on a level surface. Check the bubbles' positions. Rotate the camera 180° and check the bubbles again. The bubbles should have the same relative positions to their centers (again, relative to YOU, not to the camera) with the camera in both positions.

All that said, I have never found a need to have a level on a camera. It is EASY to perfectly align a camera to level in the field (for static shots like "landscape") if you have it on a good tripod with a decently calibrated level on the tripod. First, make sure the center column of your tripod is vertical. This can be done with a built-in level or even a quality pocket level. Once you have the camera roughly aimed at the intended subject, make note of an object near the top (or bottom) edge of the viewfinder's frame. Now (with the tripod's center column vertical), pan the camera left and right. The reference object should stay the same distance from the top (or bottom) edge of the viewfinder as you rotate the camera. If it does, the camera is level. If the object-to-viewfinder-edge distance changes, adjust the tripod's head a little and check it again.

Since you usually have a horizon, building (or building part), utility pole, or other naturally horizontal or vertical reference in your viewfinder, you can usually roughly level the camera extremely easily and then use the method above to prove that it's level.

[Randy1213]

Thanks to Skip and Blue for the excellent suggestions. Unfortunately, the bubble level on the ballhead and the bubble level on the center column don't come off so I can test them. But I'll continue trying. In the meantime, and in hopes someone else may later be able to benefit from this, here's the situation better than I may have described.

Tripod and ballhead -- level column has a bubble level at the bottom and clamp on ballhead has another on its face:

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb149/rwg_bucket/Tripod.jpg

Bubble on level column set to center (it remained dead center throughout this excercise):

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb149/rwg_bucket/Columnbubble.jpg

Bubble on quick-release clamp monted to ballhead dead center after leveling center column:

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb149/rwg_bucket/BHLevel1.jpg

I clamped down the ballhead tight then merely rotated to about 180 degrees and now look at the bubble on the top of the quick release clamp!

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb149/rwg_bucket/BHLevel2.jpg

When I use a hot-shoe mounted level, it too is off by about as much as the level you see in the last pic, so I'm pretty sure the problem is not the hot-shoe mounted level. And the panos are way off, especially when shooting about 100 degrees or more. (Perhaps somehow related to the beating you can see in the scratches? :rolleyes:)

[Lowner]

If the skirting board in your first shot is level, then somethings wonky on the tripod, it seems to be leaning slightly.

Is it the same using a decent builders level? Is there a difference between that and the bubble levels in the kirk clamp and the panning base?

Richard

[Randy1213]

I probably hadn't leveled the center column when I took the first pic of the tripod. But it was definitely level at the leveling column when I did the exercise. But it's a good idea to try a builder's level on the panning base.

I'll try out all the suggestions I've gotten this weekend and post the results so others may benefit if they're having similar problems. Just hoping it's not gonna mean a new set of legs or ballhead. After all, I paid extra for the leveling column specifically to do very wide panos.