Arrrragh Panic!!! (help with Studio shoot)

[Keyser Soze]

Just managed to blag a job doing a brochure for a fashion company!

Only problem is that I've never done anything of the sort before!

I have convinced them to go down the digital route (1ds Mk2) and need advice from anybody on versatile lighting for location and studio that is easy to use and dummy proof / cost is irrelevent as it being billed on to the client.....

If anybody has shot anything resembling a seasonal fashion brochure and has some advice on DO'S AND DONTS pleasssssse let me know as I'm a tad bit nervous at the moment.....

We are doing a combination shoot One day on location and One day in studio all advice gratefully recieved and welcome, advice needed before Thursday.... PLEASE HELP!!!

[cmM]

alienbees.... and get a battery for it while you're putting it on the client's tab. A few 550/580EX flashes could do the job as well, but I, personally would much rather take the strobes, especially for studio work.

[Jesper]

How much experience do you have with studio strobe lighting? If you've never used studio strobes before, I'm afraid I can't do much to calm you down..... :(

I'm not very experienced with studio lighting myself, I've done a course and it was fun, but it was actually harder than I expected - there are so many things you have to think about to set everything up, you have to think what kind of lights you're going to use, where to place them, what output ratios to set the lights at, measure the light, setup your camera, and at the same time make the model feel at ease, get him/her to pose a certain way (and you have to get an idea of what you want him/her to do first), etc...

[neil_r]

Just managed to blag a job doing a brochure for a fashion company!

Only problem is that I've never done anything of the sort before!

This sounds like fun....... Tomorrow I think I will be a brain surgeon, and the day after I will have a go at being a pilot, anyone know any good web sites where I can get some tips?

N

[Longwatcher]

I have convinced them to go down the digital route (1ds Mk2) and need advice from anybody on versatile lighting for location and studio that is easy to use and dummy proof / cost is irrelevent as it being billed on to the client.....

If anybody has shot anything resembling a seasonal fashion brochure and has some advice on DO'S AND DONTS pleasssssse let me know as I'm a tad bit nervous at the moment.....

We are doing a combination shoot One day on location and One day in studio all advice gratefully recieved and welcome, advice needed before Thursday.... PLEASE HELP!!!

My qualification for this answer is I have shot some fashion products for an online and limited distribution catalog. otherwise I just do art/glamour/portrait shots.

Asuming money is no object:
get a
1DsMkII, with another camera for backup (preferably a 1DsMkII)
Spare battery (just in case)
at least two 2GB CF cards and one 1GB SD cards and a portable storage device or laptop.
24-70L, 70-200L, 35/1.4, 50/1.4, 85/1.2 and 135/2 lenses. The zooms are for location, the primes for studio and they back each other up. 16-35L is optional.
a good tripod and head, remote release, angle finder C
a 5-in-1 reflector and a large silver reflector
a busy bee - Alien Bee setup all with AB800's (I think that is the 4 light set)
make sure to get a boom arm as well.
a dual cu-300 vagabond battery to go with them.
Pocket wizard or other remote control setup (to cut down on wires on location)
Throw in a camera bag and equipment bag(s) for good measure.

and then rent a model for a couple of weeks (or years) and practice.

Presto, instant fashion photographer,

Just my opinion,

[Longwatcher]

I forgot do and don'ts. most are duh's but just in case.

Do practice before hand, playing with the lighting get at least two weeks practice in if at all possible before you start shooting for content.

As you should already know make sure you have a model release for all models.
If possible take a picture with them holding the model release in their hand, if under legal age, have parent or gardian in picture as well. This will show knowledge on their part.

Figure on about 40 (or more) shots per outfit to get one good shot.

Remember the focus is to make the product look good, not the model, the model's looks are secondary to the product.

in Studio, plain backgrounds are generally better then complex backgrounds, keep it simple. On location, unless the background is adding to the atmosphere, blur the background, but still make it recognizeable. You don't want to distract from the product.

Keep safety pins and clothes pins handy. The outfits only have to look good on the model while you take their picture. Related to this is to have an assitant that just looks for things out of place.

Keep the sun to your back.

Have fun, if the model is having fun the products will tend to look better (but not always).

Okay I am done now, maybe some will help.

[iwatkins]

Not at all qualified, but I am curently setting up a studio. :)

Don't buy Alien Bees if the client is picking up the tab for studio gear (unlikely), buy some pro gear, e.g. Elinchroms.

For location, I'm assuming outdoors ? You will need some very large diffusers if shooting in bright sun. Lastolite make huge collapsible diffusion panels (called Skylites) that will soften the light nicely. I do have experince of these and you need a couple of people to help, especially if windy. Better still, shoot in the shade and use reflectors to push in light.

Ian

[Longwatcher]

Stupid me, I forgot the client was paying...
By all means go for the more expensive lights, Elinchroms or White Lightnings.

[Citizensmith]

Just come up with a persuasive reason to shoot outdoors, then use a bunch of reflectors.

Also, get all the kit, find a friend/partner/vagrant and persuade them to stand in one place for a while as you test various combinations so you become aware, as quickly as possible, with the results your new lighting will give you.

If I was a company hiring a professional photographer I'd be suprised/pissed off if the pro then tried to sting me for a load of equipment that I would assume they would already own. You may want to watch how much you sting them for and how you phrase it, unless they really don't care. Whenever I've done work for Federal clients anything I buy with their money becomes their property once I'm done. It'd be suprising if they looked at any of that stuff as an acceptable business expense as that normally only covers expendable items.

[vwpilot]

This sounds like fun....... Tomorrow I think I will be a brain surgeon, and the day after I will have a go at being a pilot, anyone know any good web sites where I can get some tips?

N

This is the best advice in this thread. I hope you can see the advice through the sarcasm.

[DocFrankenstein]

Might want to change your nick to "Yellow Kid" :lol: :lol:

I have about 20 hours of (crappy) studio experience under my belt and that was only enough for me to start appreciating how complicated this stuff is.

I hope they'll give you enough time to practice.

Good luck

[NGrinerPhoto]

just shoot with a bracket and a 580 - get a reflecter too - you will loose your mind if you try and shoot with studio lights

[phili1]

Keyser I have to give you credit. I am not sure I would undertake it and I have experience with studio lighting.

Are you shooting models or are you shooting foods fashion or still life, all are different and are handled different.

You can get away with 2 ligths and refectors. Gold & Silver. You need adjustable stands that will allow tilting. you can use umbrellas or softboxes in the studio. The softboxe will give you more control. A main light and a fill. You can add a blow out light as a third one. Everything depends on the mood you wnt from the pictures. Ok here is the kicker, you better know how to adjust these ligths with them watching, you do not want o fumble so practice the thing they are looking for.

Outside you could get away with refelectors but lights can be better, You need a golod inmcident flash light meter. You do not want your shots to look artificial.

Your lenses, a 29 to 75 is a good lens and a 70 - 200 can be used as well with those 2 you cover all of the spectrum.

If we knew more about the shoot we could help more.

The lighting that you can use for models are basic and are effect lighting. Broad and short lighting. Broad is where the main dominated a percentage of the face and short is where the shadow domonates. that is the easiest way to explain it. All the other lighting set ups need practice.

Good luck, but like everyone has told you practice.

[Keyser Soze]

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[neil_r]

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[Monito]

Perhaps we could tone down some of the animosity.

Keyser Soze mentioned none of his extensive experience or prior relationship with the client in the first post, so it was an easy thing to interpret it as a newbie lucking into a goldmine.

My advice (free, which is what it is worth): get simple equipment and practice, practice. You'll make better pictures knowing how to use simple equipment really well than getting bogged down with too much fancy stuff.

On the other hand, a studio shot can benefit from four lights and reflectors and flats. Main light, fill light, highlight, and background light. For portraits, the highlight would be used for hair, but for fashion it would be used to pick up the clothes and separate them from the background. Get some large foam core panels, tape them into tall V shapes so they stand up easily. Have one side black and the other white so you can use them for gentle fill or to deepen shadows as needed. For certain types of shots a fan to blow hair can be handy (consider power on location) but can be cliched. Consider gels for the lights if you conceive of some bold colored lighting setups.

Clip and study fashion shots from catalogues and magazines. Figure out how the lighting was set and try to emulate it with some practice shots.

For fashion shots, I would get an assistant who can help with equipment, who can run up and pin a fold of cloth or drop a curl alluringly, or move a flat while you observe from the camera position. Makeup / hairstylist on the set / location would be useful.

Please post what equipment you end up getting, and some example pictures. I'm looking to purchase some myself soon, and would like to know how it goes.

[pfogle]

Well, fwiw, I've done some of this stuff so here goes...

first, don't claim any gear purchases on expenses as it will alienate the client, unless agreed beforehand.

next, fashion catalog is not like magazine work; you have to be able to see detail in the clothes. So keep lighting soft; BIG reflectors outside (I used to like backlit with lots of fill, that way you get some contrast, but not too much on the clothes) and strobes with softboxes inside.

last, keep it simple. Also, take some care picking models; good pro models have often helped me in the past with poses, and even with lighting. A good model makes it 100 times easier.

Shoot lots of frames!

You can't go wrong!

cheers
Phil

[pfogle]

ps I also agree with Monito, if you can get a good assistant (who's done fashion!) it will be a huge help.

cheers
Phil

[Monito]

For the studio shots, rather than buying equipment and trying to stick it to the company, rent a fully equipped studio for an extra day or two before the shots. That is truly an expense and will pass muster.

Practice, practice.

[mjordan]

Well, I hope you provided more information to the client before you accepted the job than you did when you asked for help on this forum. Frankly, when I saw your question and how you stated you had never done this before, I saw you as a troll just trying to get the type of responses that you did get. So if you want to get mad, get mad at yourself for opening up yourself to some of the comments you did get.

Again, if you have done as much photography as you said you have done, then you should know just how much you are opening yourself up to looking bad and dissapointing this customer. I have done a LOT of event photography too, but that doesn't make me a fashion photographer... and I know it. I have also done a LOT of studio and portrait photography, including wedding, sport and photojournalisum, but that doesn't make me a brochure and catalog photographer... and I know it. Actually, I have done brochure work for a theater group, but then I was working with trained actors that made me look good because they knew how to pose in front of a camera.

There is nothing wrong in trying to expand your experience and taking on jobs that you don't have a lot or any experience in. We have all done it. Some times we get away with it and sometimes we look very very bad. You have not looked your best with this message. I hope you do better with your shoot.

Had you started your message saying that you are an experienced photographer and given the experience that you listed above and then said that you have the chance to shoot the brochure model shoot and you need some advice, I bet you would have gotten a whole lot better response from more people. But not only is this not really the forum to ask your question, you alienated a lot of people in the process. I wish you luck.

Mike

[paulbuceta]

I'm in the exact same boat - My shoot is in two days.

You beat me to the post. <GRIN>

Best luck to you.

[lkorell]

First of all the "money's no object" idea isn't a smart one. The idea is to get what you need but provide value to the client by sticking to a realistic budget. If you are an economical resource and do great work, you will be called back time and time again.

Second, Alien Bees are professional lights. Many top pros use them. They are a great bargain and won't break the bank. If you are worried about them, go with the White Lightning, as they are made by the same people and are a bit more industrial in construction. If you can add more gear, get the Vagabond Batteries for your lights (if you choose White Lightning or Alien Bees). You don't want a bunch of cords all over the place.

If you use softboxes, go with either Photoflex, Chimera, or Larson. All good and simple to use. The diffusion panels from Lighting Magic are nice too.

That's just my $02

[mvonditter]

You might have gotten yourself in a bit deep here, however we should all help each other here (Neil). I am not a PRO, (don’t usually get paid) but I have been doing this for years because I like it. The best thing I can think of , is simple to remember, to think of light as water. It gets everywhere you least expect it to go. It will flow over the subject you are shooting. Think of a wave hitting a rock and how the water reacts to that. Start with dramatic one sided lighting and then adjust as needed to get the effect you want to see. Remember, it’s your eye for things that they like, not some ones ideal of the perfect shot. Keep taking risks as this is the only way you will ever rise to the occasion and learn new things, to say nothing of to the top. Nay Sayers tend to be the ones that keep asking themselves why they haven’t gotten to where others are.

Good luck
PS. Other calories of wisdom can be had at ‘mvonditter@splyce.com’ :-)

[phili1]

I Have been using Excaliburs for four years with no problems but if I could do it over the Aliens Bees are the way to go, they give you more latitude. If you we going to be shooting every day 365 days a year then you have to go with the real good lights.

[chtgrubbs]

If you are going to be shooting fashion in the studio you are going to need something better than Alien Bees or even White Litening strobes when using soft boxes. The WL strobes are what I use for location lighting, and they will overheat and shut down if you push them too hard. If you want to use monolights go with a heavy duty unit such as ProFoto, Speedotron, Broncolor, Elinchrom, or high end Bowens. Nothing is more frustrating to be getting good shots and then having to stop for ten minutes while the main light cools down.

[Longwatcher]

I have never had my alien bees shut down and I have taken over 400 pictures per hour for 6 hours. Maybe the WL aren't able to handle heat as well. The ABs were designed later.

Or do you take pictures in Death Valley in the summer?

My main is also sitting right next to a work light (about 4-6 inches) (I otherwise don't have enough light to autofocus) which means it should be getting even hotter and it is in a softbox, which should also add to the heat. No problems with my ABs so far. At least that were not operator error related from lack of experience. Never had one shut down so far in the year I have operated them.

Just my experience,

[Mark_Cohran]

I use White Lightening Ultra's all the time in the studio, and I've never had one shut down due to overhearting, and I've taken several hundred shots in an hour. It would be frustrating to have a light shutdown for over-heating, but that's not likely to happen with White Lightenings.

I do seriously doubt that a client is going to spring for over a grand (perhaps twice that), in studio lighting which would be an expected part of your equipment set. There's no valid business model out there that makes sense for client to buy you equipment that you would normally need to provide the service your are offering.

[mjordan]

I've used Excalibur's for a number of years now too and have never had any problems with them over heating, even when shooting in almost 90 degree inside temps (I did keep the modeling lights off as much as possible though). I was melting, but the Excalibur's kept on flashing. The Excalibur gives you more flash for the buck than the Alien Bees do... especially for those that are buying studio lights for the first time. And I have heard of the Alien Bees over heating. The company is quick to fix any problems or replace them, but there are some complaints about them.

Mike